Inside the Forgotten SAS: Under Chinatown NYC

[realizm]

 

 

 

 

 

 

Credits to LTV Squad : http://ltvsquad.com/Locations/urbanexploration.php?ID=40

 

 

This is a looker. Photographer Steve Duncan takes a walk through the abandoned section of the original SAS construction  circa 1970 in Chinatown near Hester Street between Elizabeth and Bowery.

 

More pics can be found at the LTV Exploration site: http://ltvsquad.com/Locations/urbanexploration.php?ID=40

 

Video (requires Adobe Flash): http://www.myblocknyc.com/#/video/id/2487

 

 For those not in the know:

 

Back in 1964, the United States Congress passed what is called Urban Mass Transportation Act to allocate mass transit projects in America's cities via the Urban Mass Transportation Administration

 

Moving forward in 1967, the Transportation Bond Issue was approved , which resultantly provided millions upon millions of dollars for New York City mass transit projects. The then new MTA had the SAS on target. It would had stretched from 34th Street to The Bronx. Construction October 27, 1972. Construction began shortly thereafter at Second Avenue and 103rd Street.

 

However, the city soon experienced its most dire fiscal crisis in our history of this great city. As a result, Construction of the subway was halted. Only three sections of tunnel having been completed. These sections are at these locations: Between Pell and Canal Street, between 99th and 105th Streets, and between 110th and 120th Streets.

 

Today as of 2013, there are 4 sections of the Second Avenue Subway that have been completed aside from the unused tunnels of the original SAS construction of the 70's and are in revenue service: The Chrystie Street Connection, the express tunnels of the 6th Ave IND, and the BMT/IND 63rd Street Line track connection from the BMT Broadway Line to the Second Avenue Subway as well as the connection from the IND 6th Ave line, later connected to the IND Queens Blvd. Line in the 1990's which I have witnesses in the entirety of it's construction.

 

This is a first for many, I have always wondered myself what that segment of the former SAS construction in proximity of the Christie St Connection actually looked like.

 

Many thanks to Ben Kabek of Second Ave Sagas for the breakdown of this side point from a recent blog post.

 

Thoughts?

[Roadcruiser1]

I wonder if the Second Avenue Subway will ever actually use this tunnel section.

[realizm]

That's a good question. Because two plans (that we will probably never see) is in the works, at least on paper. The complete drillout of new tunnel from scratch with TBMs and/or cut and cover with Phase 3 and 4 to the Seaport and Hanover Square or the possible utilization of the BMT Nassau Street line in it's construction to downtown Manhattan and beyond to Brooklyn even (If the Montague St Tunnel in it's current state of saltwater damage deterioration, doesn't cave in by then.)

 

But it seems current plans scrapped the use of these tunnels under the vicinity of Christie Street Park. 

 

Now there is talk about a provision at Grand Street for it to be reconfigured into a 4 track station as part of the original SAS construction back in the days, but that is unconfirmed. To this day in my life I still wonder about that one.

Sorry for sounding cynical about it, we know how NYS politics go in terms of funding for mass transit projects.

[bobtehpanda]

I wonder if the Second Avenue Subway will ever actually use this tunnel section.

 

It will not - the planned routing (subject to change) takes it under Chrystie St to the Grand St station, before it swings to Chatham Sq, probably via East Broadway.

 

That's a good question. Because two plans (that we will probably never see) is in the works, at least on paper. The complete drillout of new tunnel from scratch with TBMs and/or cut and cover with Phase 3 and 4 to the Seaport and Hanover Square or the possible utilization of the BMT Nassau Street line in it's construction to downtown Manhattan and beyond to Brooklyn even (If the Montague St Tunnel in it's current state of saltwater damage deterioration, doesn't cave in by then.)

 

But it seems current plans scrapped the use of these tunnels under the vicinity of Christie Street Park. 

 

Now there is talk about a provision at Grand Street for it to be reconfigured into a 4 track station as part of the original SAS construction back in the days, but that is unconfirmed. To this day in my life I still wonder about that one.

 

 

Sorry for sounding cynical about it, we know how NYS politics go in terms of funding for mass transit projects.

 

I believe the station at Grand St was part of the 2004 study, and in any case I believe the Grand St station was built with false walls to allow for this (similar to Lexington-63rd.) Time will tell.

 

(It is also completely possible for the city to go it alone LA-style and fund it all through a penny or nickel sales tax, but that requires someone with guts.)

[Turbo19]

Damn, these are some nice shots. Great to see a piece of history!

 

Sorry to say I ran out of my reps. I'll pay up later.

[Fan Railer]

Hmmmmmmm this place looks kind of familiar *COUGH*party*COUGH lol

[Turbo19]

Hmmmmmmm this place looks kind of familiar *COUGH*party*COUGH lol

Quiet you. You'll spoil the fun.

 

On the other hand, what wouldn't I give to go down there and leave my mark.

[Fresh Pond]

It will not - the planned routing (subject to change) takes it under Chrystie St to the Grand St station, before it swings to Chatham Sq, probably via East Broadway.

 

 

I believe the station at Grand St was part of the 2004 study, and in any case I believe the Grand St station was built with false walls to allow for this (similar to Lexington-63rd.) Time will tell.

 

(It is also completely possible for the city to go it alone LA-style and fund it all through a penny or nickel sales tax, but that requires someone with guts.)

Grand St was built like that but current plans call for the SAS to go under it. The 2 Av stop on the was also built with the provisions above it but once again, the SAS will go under instead.

 

The only sections that will be used are the ones in Harlem

[realizm]

Deleted: You are correct Fresh Pond.

[bobtehpanda]

Grand St was built like that but current plans call for the SAS to go under it. The 2 Av stop on the was also built with the provisions above it but once again, the SAS will go under instead.

 

The only sections that will be used are the ones in Harlem

 

That's a bit silly, since the stations were already engineered with that in mind (and probably have sections that can be used on the cheap.) It might have to do with the fact that neither of these stations are ADA compatible.

 

All I know is that upon the completion of Phase IV, they better add some exits to Grand St, because the current station is an absolute crowding nightmare.

[realizm]

Well remember that not only the 2nd Ave station is not only provisioned for IND Second System SAS upstairs but also for the South 4th St Line to Brooklyn via the middle tracks. Citations are there on various sites from past MTA studies and diagrams to confirm this. And that construction during the building of this station was in the early 20th century even before the conception of the MTA circa 1965-1967 before construction in the 70's before the fiscal crisis halted it, let alone finalization of the current SAS construction in 2007.

 

You are both correct on both your posts Bob and Fresh Pond. No sense arguing on points where you are both right. On post 4 and 8.

[Fresh Pond]

That's a bit silly, since the stations were already engineered with that in mind (and probably have sections that can be used on the cheap.) It might have to do with the fact that neither of these stations are ADA compatible.

 

All I know is that upon the completion of Phase IV, they better add some exits to Grand St, because the current station is an absolute crowding nightmare.

More than likely, Grand will be renovated and get the ADA treatment