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Everything posted by Lance

  1. Superstorm Sandy In the aftermath of Superstorm Sandy in 2012, vital components and infrastructure was severely damaged when the tunnels were inundated with over 7 million gallons of salt water. As a result, the 14th Street tunnels were among the last tunnels to open following the gradual restoration of subway service in November 2012. While service continues mostly as normal, the stopgap measures used to allow trains to run normally, the severity of the damage incurred will require a more thorough approach and another long-term closure, much as was required with the Montague St tunnels a few years ago. The Options Ever since the 14th Street tunnels were reopened and it was determined more work was required to get the tunnels back into a state of good repair, the MTA mulled over two options in regards to the tunnel closure. The first option was a full closure of the tunnels and the Canarsie line in Manhattan. The second was a partial shutdown, where one tunnel would remain in service throughout the duration of the repairs. This option would allow for limited service between Manhattan and Brooklyn. However, the cost of having one tunnel open would be that the overall project would take twice as long. Under option 1, the repairs are slated to take around 18 months to completion, as opposed to the three year duration under option 2. After a lengthy process that involved more community outreach than is usually seen from the MTA, the agency decided to go with the 18-month option. While neither option was ideal for riders in the affected communities in Williamsburg and along the 14th Street corridor, the majority of those asked felt that a shorter construction period outweighed the benefits of limited service between 8 Avenue and Brooklyn. That means, starting in 2019 and lasting for approximately 18 months, there will be no train service between Bedford Av, Brooklyn and 8 Avenue, Manhattan. Last year, it was determined which firm would receive the contract for the work. Two firms (Judlau Contracting and TC Electric) are expected to be awarded the work contract for a total of $492 million. Included in that sum is a $15 million incentive to finish the work faster. Alternative Service Subway The 14th Street tunnel shutdown affects many riders not just in the aforementioned areas, but various others as well because of the line's location. As such, riders will need alternatives to get around. In recent months, the agency has released service adjustment details to accommodate the detoured Canarsie-line riders. Additional service will be provided along several lines, including the and lines. As one of the main pillars of alternate service throughout the closure, the service hours of the will be expanded to 24/7 with off-hours service running to 96 Street on the Second Ave line. To facilitate better connections between services, there will be several new out-of-system transfers provided throughout the closure. Riders will be able to transfer between trains at Broadway and Hewes St/Lorimer St , 21 Street and Hunters Point Av and Livonia Av and Junius St . The latter of which will eventually be converted into an in-system transfer as part of an unrelated accessibility project. On the subject of stations, to reduce the levels of overcrowding on platforms expected to see large increases in ridership, the MTA plans to improve capacity at several stations, including Marcy Av, Broadway Junction and Court Sq. The agency also plans to reopen a few formerly closed entrances at Flushing Av, Hewes St and Metropolitan Av . As the agency anticipates many more riders on these alternate routes, they are expanding the length of both the and trains to better handle the crowds. Surface Since many riders will be forced to use buses to travel across the river due to reduced subway access, the MTA and the NYC DOT are rolling out a robust surface plan. This includes shutting down a section of 14th Street to all non-essential vehicular traffic, creating a BRT version of the M14 route and instituting HOV restrictions along the Williamsburg Bridge during peak hours. Anticipating more foot and bike traffic, the city DOT is expected to expanding cycling connections, starting with a new bike link along Delancey St between Allen St and the Williamsburg Bridge. Additional bike paths and better pedestrian areas are in the works including along Grand St in Manhattan and at several key subway stops. Ferry In order to mitigate some of the effects of the tunnel closure, the MTA is working with the city to provide cross-river ferry service between North Williamsburg and Stuyvesant Cove in Manhattan. Preliminary plans call for service to run at all times except late nights with expanded Friday and Saturday service during the late night hours. This ferry route will be fare-integrated with both the M14 and M23 select bus service routes. Planned Station Improvements As there will be no service between Bedford Av and 8 Avenue, the MTA will use this rare opportunity to not only fix the ailing tunnels, but to complete some much needed station improvements as well. Elevators will be installed at the 1 Avenue stop, making that station fully ADA accessible. On the subject of accessibility, both Union Square and Bedford Av will receive access upgrades. All five Manhattan stations will receive component repairs, as will several others in Brooklyn. The MTA will also use this time to test out platform screen doors at the 3 Avenue station. If successful, we may see the setup expanded to the rest of the line. Some of these plans are still in the preliminary stages. As more details emerge, this thread will be updated with the latest information. While I will not limit what is posted here, this thread will be moderated with more scrutiny than usual. Please do not flood this thread with your proposals of what should run wherever. Once is plenty.
  2. This will be my thread to post recreations of various sign curtains seen on the trains over the years. For now, I'm going to stick to post-Chrystie Street signs on the B-Division. With that out of the way, here's the first of what should be many sign rolls. I picked this one to start with since we've had a few conversations about this particular roll here on the forums. Dated:1984/10/01 Created by: Trainsign Used On: R27, R30, R32, R38 Notes: last of the R16-38 signs to include "Avenue of the Americas" on the rolls, last signs in this format of "local/express" designation, last signs used prior to GOH of R32s and R38s P.S. Yes, I watermarked the curtain. All of the ones I post here will be watermarked as well. I spend a lot of time making these and I don't want them being claimed by someone else as their own.
  3. Lance

    Full 14th St Shutdown Cancelled

    Even if Byford et al were to resign en masse, what's to stop Cuomo from placing more yes-men in charge of the sub-agencies and the board? We all know that's what Cuomo wants, so why should they give him that satisfaction? It's a much better counter-argument if these guys were fired for not going along with this plan rather than them just quit due to differences in opinion.
  4. Lance

    Full Shutdown of L Train to Be Halted by Cuomo

    People are supporting this plan not due to cost savings, well not entirely, but rather because it allows the to continue to run when they need it. Sure, it won't run on nights and weekends, but for the past few years off and on, that's been the case either way, so nothing is really lost here. This entire closure was painted as the worst thing to happen to the city and its transportation network ever. And with good reason too. Anything to avoid that massive headache is going to be seen as a boon to riders across the board. The way Cuomo announced the change in plans was nothing short of genius. Do a little PR walkthrough the tunnel and talk about reworking the plans to prevent a full closure, bring in a couple of experts to support the claim and make an announcement that sidesteps the big, bad MTA, stating that the repairs can be done without sacrificing peak-period service, contrary to earlier MTA reports. Anyone stating otherwise that a full closure is necessary, including the MTA's rank and file and the agency's board members, are going to be seen as the opposition here. Cuomo and his supporters get to paint these naysayers as pro-shutdown and against the wishes of the people who just want to get from A to B without a roundabout trip. This is likely the reason we haven't seen much if any pushback from city officials on this. Do I believe this modified plan is the way to go? Absolutely not. Are we sparing riders of pain now, only to deal with it later? Probably. We've seen what half-assed, incomplete work leads to around here way too often to be ignorant of this fact. On the other hand, am I surprised by how well-received the new plan is? Nope. People want things and they want them now. Tomorrow's problems can be faced at a later date, preferably when we're not around to be inconvenienced. That's the ideology for most people regarding most things these days.
  5. Not a light bulb, but this perfectly captures the essence of the argument: From the partial wall collapse in Bay Ridge back in 2017. Feel free to explain why there are likely 30 people on hand to remove the debris as my interest in quite piqued. As for the actual article in the OP, it took a long time to get to this state and it will take a while to get out.
  6. Is anyone really surprised? That meeting was a complete farce and only served to paint the full-closure supporters as the opposition. As soon as it was announced earlier this month, the modified plan was always going to be the one that went forward. The only way it will not is if there is some significant structural deficiency found that completely prevents its use, like how the was kicked off the Manhattan Bridge in late 1990 after it was determined that continued use of the south tracks would further damage the structure.
  7. So he wants full control of the MTA, including presumably the agency's finances, but still also wants NYC to pay for half of it, all without any say whatsoever? Yeah, that sounds like a worthwhile plan not destined for failure at all. I do wish Andy Boy would stop acting like he's mankind's New York's savior with his harebrained schemes that don't amount to anything. It does get quite tiring after a while, doesn't it? While he does not presently hold full control of the agency, he does have the ability to be the driving force behind the MTA with who he places as chairman. He's been in office for eight years now and watched as the city's transit network collapsed at the seams all the while maintaining the position that he cannot do anything since he does not control the MTA and feuding with DeBlasio over said ownership. He's punted the issue for nearly a decade, and now that he's realized he has a chance to be president (I don't know who told him that by the way), he wants to swoop in and save the day. Forgive me if I'm skeptical here.
  8. Lance

    Rockaway Beach Branch

    I can't give you a cost/benefit analysis, but a conservative estimate of the entire combined project could be somewhere around $3bn. Restoring the Rockaway Beach line itself would be a massive expense as everything along the ROW would have to be replaced to current standards that meet ADA requirements. Nothing along that ROW can be salvaged as it's been left to rot since the early '50s. The second expense would be extending the Fulton St tunnels from Court St to the East River. Comparing it to similar expenses like the Flushing extension, which cost about $2bn for a mile-long extension from Times Square, it's not outside the realm of possibility that a half-mile stretch of new tunneling would be around a billion. Of course, that does not account for land acquisition that would be necessary as the entire area is full of very narrow streets that don't meet up with Court and Schermerhorn Sts. The final and largest expense would be the cross-river tunnel itself. Digging around both the Montague and Joralemon tunnels and any other obstructions can will likely drive up costs. In order for this to actually be beneficial, especially the Rockaway Beach portion, that line would have to pick up a ton of riders from that section alone. The actual Rockaways line has a direct connection to Manhattan with the , despite the low frequency there. Anything that ran via Rockaway Beach and Queens Blvd would take about the same amount of time to reach Manhattan as its Fulton St counterpart. Without a bypass (another large expense), Rockaway Beach does not have the draw required to offset the high costs unfortunately.
  9. Lance

    Rollsign Gallery

    While we wait for @Ilia to release his reproduction of the original R40 slant sign curtains, we can take a look at another set of replacements for the front signs of their straight-end cousins: Date: Sept. 16, 1987 Printed by: Transign Used on: R42 When these signs were placed in use on the trains, the cars in question were scattered across the system to provide necessary service during the delivery process of the R68 series of cars and the GOH of various car classes at the time, including the R40 slants. With the exception of the A and C, it was not outside the realm of possibility to see the 42s in service on any of the routes shown above on a semi-regular basis, at least according to the car assignments at the time. While the Manhattan Bridge south tracks closure was in effect at the time, that major service change seems to have had little impact on the sign order as the options are essentially from 1985, especially in regards to the Q, which was converted to a normal hours route in 1986, losing its rush hour diamond route designation. This is the last sign curtain produced for the R40-42 series of cars before their overhauls. Subsequent sign curtains produced would be horizontal in nature as the sign curtain mechanism was changed across all of the R40s-R46s during their respective overhauls. This curtain would also be the last in the R40-42 series to omit routes that were not travelled often on these particular cars, as the post-overhaul signs would include every possible route that existed at the time. Next time, we'll finally wrap up the R68s' original signs.
  10. Lance

    Rollsign Gallery

    Ooh, the original '68 slant curtains. Can't wait.
  11. Lance

    SUBWAY - Random Thoughts Topic

    To answer the actual question, the post-overhaul signs had several extraneous options that wouldn't be possible without reversing or clogging up the line. Along with Astoria Blvd, there's both City Hall and Canal St on the 32s' north sign curtains and Kew Gardens-Union Tpke and Rockefeller Center on the south destination signs. I think their inclusion was to make up for the lack of adequate destination options on some of the older pre-overhaul signs (some of which dated back to Chrystie St). I guess if there was some incident that closed off the platforms at Ditmars Blvd, but left the tracks open to continue Astoria line operations, they would be able to correctly display the terminals for such an occasion. Oddly enough, this situation actually happened back in 2001, where trains terminated at Canal St, but relayed at the closed World Trade Center station due to the cleanup of the WTC site.
  12. Lance

    Full Shutdown of L Train to Be Halted by Cuomo

    I like how you can clearly read and comprehend what everyone's saying in response to your comments, but still ignore it and regurgitate the same stale talking points that have been debunked time and again. Perhaps you have a career in politics.
  13. Hillary Clinton's loss in Pennsylvania or any other state back in the 2016 election has absolutely nothing to do with the Canarsie repairs project. Please keep this to the actual topic at hand.
  14. Lance

    Full Shutdown of L Train to Be Halted by Cuomo

    Honestly, give it a rest. We all get it; you believe every little thing has to be done to curry some political favor from those well outside the impact bubble. For the last few days, you've done nothing but post this exact same thought almost verbatim in every thread semi-related to this change in the plans. Quite frankly, it's getting old.
  15. Yay, more grandstanding and posturing from the Prince himself. We should just start playing royal fanfare every time he speaks; something that befits his status of course. In all seriousness, will we see anything concrete from this or will we simply get another press conference that doesn't give a hint of the actual process involved? Forgive me if I'm not convinced he's all that serious on this. If this is all to get him votes for a potential presidential bid next year like everyone believes, wouldn't it make more sense to actually make some progress with all these goals rather than just talk about them all the damn time? While Cuomo does not have full control of the MTA, he does hold an important position in that he's the guy who appoints the chief in charge of the agency. If his end goal is purely to rein in spending, reduce redundancies and get the MTA back to where it needs to be, he can easily put someone in charge who can get all the sub-agencies to fall in line. Of course, he'll need to reach out to another group of experts first, so we might be waiting a while for that.
  16. Lance

    R179 Discussion Thread

    That would delay the order even further. Adding a couple of cars to the order and converting some A cars to B cars are a much easier process than changing the order to make them into the 211-lites.
  17. Lance

    R179 Discussion Thread

    Well, it's a good thing that shutdown isn't happening, now is it? We are no strangers to teething issues here. The 142s were infamous for being in and out of service during the first few years in operation for one reason or another and despite those issues, they would later go on to become some of the best workhorses in the system. With that said, however, it has gotten extremely annoying that a car class delayed by several years due to builder issues can arrive on site and still be defective after such a extended length of time. It's going to look really bad if the test train of 211s arrives before this order is complete. If there's any consolation, I guess it's a good thing these issues are cropping up now while they're under warranty and not several years later when the costs of repairs would fall solely on us.
  18. Lance

    Full Shutdown of L Train to Be Halted by Cuomo

    Probably because he knows he'll be the face of this if it falls apart. Unless this idea fails fairly early while it's still in the news cycle, people will forget that Cuomo made the change in the first place and lay blame on the person in charge of the (sub-)agency, which unfortunately is Byford.
  19. Nope. After the attacks, the line was closed for just under a year, reopening on Sept. 8th, 2002. Post-Sandy, the South Ferry station was closed for nearly five years due to severe water damage, but aside from that, the line remained in service. I don't know why you're bothering. It's "pols" this, "donors" that and "potential presidential run" every time something like this comes up.
  20. I believe the Fix and Fortify closures were done in their present order based on the potential ridership impact and not just damage. It's just coincidence that the worst damage Montague tunnel was the least impactful in terms of ridership, hence why that was closed first. The had a bunch of nearby alternatives when that tunnel was taken out of service in 2013. That isn't the case for the , hence the extended wait while contingencies were drawn up to mitigate a closure of that magnitude. Sure, it would've been better from an operations standpoint to get the Canarsie tunnel back to pre-Sandy conditions earlier than it currently is planned for, but getting several different agencies to come up with a beneficial plan to minimize the impact of the loss of the Canarsie line is not an easy process, especially when dealing with the great bureaucracy. As for the comparisons to restoring service after Sept. 11th, that was all about bouncing back from the tragedy of the attacks. It would've been the equivalent of leaving that empty pit where the Twin Towers stood. Also, a better comparison would've been to the initial restoration of service on Nov. 8th, 2012 and a more apt comparison to the planned closure would be to the long-delayed restoration of service at Cortlandt St.
  21. Lance

    R211 Discussion Thread

    In my opinion, it's just another instance of this belief that if we didn't build, create or invent it here in New York, it'll never be viable here. Gotta love that "Can't Do" attitude.
  22. Lance

    SUBWAY - Random Thoughts Topic

    The trains are announced as [borough]-bound until they reach the borough of their destination because most riders are not that familiar with the final stops of the route in question. Nor are they riding the train for that much where it would really be necessary. Even on the split or the rush hours split , unless the rider is in Queens or the Bronx respectively and are riding past the point of divergence, they are going to hop on the first train to arrive. This was really just a demonstration of the technology to be offered on the new trains. I imagine once the trains are actually built and the finishes are added, the information will be much more visible than was shown in the clip. Besides, that tiny font would probably run afoul against ADA regulations regarding legible text from a certain distance.
  23. …Or possibly a case for continuous closures rather than the standard method of construction work. With 2018 behind us, we can take a look at how good (or how bad depending on who you ask) weekend service last year. Using the weekly maps created for the planned service changes, we can see which lines were the worst to use in the effort to get around in 2018. As the Fix and Fortify closures of Clark St and the structure rehabilitation projects on the Culver and Sea Beach lines will skew the calculations against these lines, such long-term projects are not included in the ranking. Read more: Source (also includes the full raw data breakout for those interested)
  24. Nah, I just run that blog. Harry owns this site. We'd all be in trouble if I ran this forum. If I had to wager a guess, along with the signal recalibration work, they also wanted to get the line in the best shape possible during the closure. It would really add insult to injury if they had to close off another part of the Canarsie line during the tunnel outage. Of course, with the changes to the plan, the whole thing is moot.


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