Far Rockaway Ticket and City Ticket

[TDL]

The Far Rockaway ticket is modeled after the CityTicket. While providing a great discount for Rockaway riders, it seems that the vending machines will only allow Zone 1 stations to be selected. I don't believe even Jamaica comes up as an option.

City Ticket does not allow passengers to change at Jamaica for trains going in the opposite direction (e.g. you cannot transfer from the Hempstead Branch to the Babylon Branch for a Queens Village-St. Albans trip, or from the Hempstead to Far Rockaway for a Rosedale-Queens Village trip.)

As Queens does not have adequate crosstown connections, it would be nice if these reverse trips were added to the CityTicket.

In the past, it could be argued that that might make you end up on a peak train paying a non-peak price. But now that CityTicket has a peak option, this is no longer valid reasoning.

 

Thoughts?

[IAlam]

On 8/23/2023 at 10:46 AM, TDL said:

The Far Rockaway ticket is modeled after the CityTicket. While providing a great discount for Rockaway riders, it seems that the vending machines will only allow Zone 1 stations to be selected. I don't believe even Jamaica comes up as an option.

City Ticket does not allow passengers to change at Jamaica for trains going in the opposite direction (e.g. you cannot transfer from the Hempstead Branch to the Babylon Branch for a Queens Village-St. Albans trip, or from the Hempstead to Far Rockaway for a Rosedale-Queens Village trip.)

As Queens does not have adequate crosstown connections, it would be nice if these reverse trips were added to the CityTicket.

In the past, it could be argued that that might make you end up on a peak train paying a non-peak price. But now that CityTicket has a peak option, this is no longer valid reasoning.

 

Thoughts?

It never did the problem with changing directions is it opens the doors for abuse, that's why those tickets are sold with their own pricing structure.

[Lawrence St]

13 minutes ago, IAlam said:

It never did the problem with changing directions is it opens the doors for abuse, that's why those tickets are sold with their own pricing structure.

Which is disappointing that it even has to be like that.

[NewFlyer 230]

I’m not a fan of the LIRR’s fare system because I find it flawed and it doesn’t benefit the riders at all.

There has been this idea with the LIRR that most people who use it are traveling between Long Island & Manhattan and as a result all other travel is discouraged and the flawed fare system backs that up. The amount of people traveling within NYC on the LIRR has increased as well as those traveling within Nassau but the LIRR has not fixed up service to promote this customer base. 

The fare system is flawed because how is it that I have to pay $6.50 (off peak) to go from the Laurelton and even Rosedale station to Valley Stream which in the case of the latter is one station apart but I also have to pay that same price to go from Jamaica to Valley Stream. However going from Jamaica to Laurelton for example is only $4.50 yet triple the distance of going from Valley Stream to Rosedale. If I needed to travel between Laurelton & Valley Stream for example why can’t the fare be $2.50 or $3.
The City ticket is useless if you brought a ticket but no one checks because they only last for that day. City ticket as you stated does not work if you want to go from a Port Washington Station in Queens to any other Station via a line that passes through Jamaica even though you are still in Queens. 
IMO even though the LIRR has been creating discounts for city residents, they still cater primarily to LI residents and that will always be their main focus before making service more accessible to those in Queens. 

[IAlam]

On 8/24/2023 at 10:56 PM, Lawrence St said:

Which is disappointing that it even has to be like that.

Yeah, I suspect there will be changes once OMNY eventually rolls out since you need to tap on and off. Since you will need to be physically present at both endpoints it closes the door for abuse and might allow for a pricing structure in line with everything else. 

On 8/25/2023 at 11:50 AM, NewFlyer 230 said:

I’m not a fan of the LIRR’s fare system because I find it flawed and it doesn’t benefit the riders at all.

There has been this idea with the LIRR that most people who use it are traveling between Long Island & Manhattan and as a result all other travel is discouraged and the flawed fare system backs that up. The amount of people traveling within NYC on the LIRR has increased as well as those traveling within Nassau but the LIRR has not fixed up service to promote this customer base. 

The fare system is flawed because how is it that I have to pay $6.50 (off peak) to go from the Laurelton and even Rosedale station to Valley Stream which in the case of the latter is one station apart but I also have to pay that same price to go from Jamaica to Valley Stream. However going from Jamaica to Laurelton for example is only $4.50 yet triple the distance of going from Valley Stream to Rosedale. If I needed to travel between Laurelton & Valley Stream for example why can’t the fare be $2.50 or $3.
The City ticket is useless if you brought a ticket but no one checks because they only last for that day. City ticket as you stated does not work if you want to go from a Port Washington Station in Queens to any other Station via a line that passes through Jamaica even though you are still in Queens. 
IMO even though the LIRR has been creating discounts for city residents, they still cater primarily to LI residents and that will always be their main focus before making service more accessible to those in Queens. 

Yeah, having exceptions for short-distance trips would be ideal. The zone system in general is pretty antiquated, but it was invented to make ticketing easier, Charging by distance is fairer but it's also more confusing for passengers, it offers less flexibility and generally makes service less attractive for further stations as those stations end up being far more expensive to ride to/from. (Why pay more at your station when you can take a bus/bike/car etc... partway down the line for cheaper service. I've ridden in the WMATA system a lot and I've seen often people take longer bus rides to further stations where they can pay less and then on weekends when they have flat fares ridership feels a bit more spread out. There are pros and cons for both the current zoned system and the pay-by-distance systems. There could be a compromise between the 2 but doubt the MTA would ever get it right.   

[TDL]

 

On 8/24/2023 at 10:42 PM, IAlam said:

It never did the problem with changing directions is it opens the doors for abuse, that's why those tickets are sold with their own pricing structure.

Which is ludicrous. Jamaica to Bayside is $12.50 peak, and youre staying in Queens. 

 

Honestly, City Ticket should be accepted on all Port Washington Branch local trains from ANY city station, there's literally only 4 stops in Nassau County. Conductors just have to do a sweep after Little Neck.

Same with say, Atlantic Terminal to Forest Hills or Far Rockaway to QV (all the trains do a sweep after Jamaica anyway so there shouldn't be any abuse here).

 

[Amtrak41]

Valley Stream - Inwood should be Zone 3. Zone 4 is priced out of the market as proven by Far Rockaway Branch ridership that has been falling since 1970. While they are at it, put Centre Avenue - Oceanside in Zone 4.  

[IAlam]

On 3/29/2024 at 1:52 PM, Amtrak41 said:

Valley Stream - Inwood should be Zone 3. Zone 4 is priced out of the market as proven by Far Rockaway Branch ridership that has been falling since 1970. While they are at it, put Centre Avenue - Oceanside in Zone 4.  

They are in zone 4 because they are in Nassau County, the same goes for stations on the main line at Elmont, Bellerose, and Floral Park. Even though these stops are just across the border since they fall within Nassau County limits, they pay Nassau County fares. If the people in Nassau believe that they're paying too much for the train they should advocate to their local government like the residents in the city did. Nassau is notorious for not funding transit in the region, so you end up with higher fares and poorer service.