RR503

to chambers via F from W4 to Roosevelt to 71 via local

You do realize that your track map has the RBB connecting to the LIRR, while your other map shows it as a subway? Seeing this is the subway forum, and given your comments in other threads, I assume you mean the latter, but felt like checking.

The market for a one seat ride between centre street and the Manhattan Bridge Lines is where? People want to go to midtown these days. That's what the Manhattan bridge is good for. If you're going downtown, use the , make a transfer at Canal, or at Atlantic Barclays. Remember that Dekalb is at capacity, so any service of this type that you add will be one less N/Q to points north.

I'm all for RBB reactivation for the reasons you mention, but a small part of me wants to argue (sorry!) We only have one line we can add off of the QB local tracks. Seeing as the RBB has at least part of its catchement area covered by the J/Z and A, why don't we use that capacity to build a line along the LIE to, say, Bell Boulevard, a la AirTrain. Just food for thought...

The largest piece of the puzzle is missing: market. Dyre doesn't need service. Instead of expensively redoing service that already functions, why don't we use SAS's 30tph to serve the 3rd ave corridor, and 125th st. MUCH better resource allocation IMO.

Okay, but you still haven't convinced me that SAS dyre is better than what they have now. trains during rush hours make Dyre Ave stops, then go to E180, and express from there all the way to Brooklyn Bridge (save for a short stretch in the lower BX). Additionally, riders get more centrally located stations in manhattan, access to brooklyn, and (relatively, compared to the long passages that will be required for SAS xfers) transfers to the (180, 149), , (125th) , , , (59th) , , (42nd) , , (14th), , (BBCH), , , , (Fulton). SAS will most certainly provide some of these connections, but for the most part, they will not be acheived with the same facility that they are off of the . And SAS will not give riders express service or Brooklyn access. Finally, sending the up White Plains Road would be difficult. The termini at Wakefield and Nereid Ave. are close to capacity, and the addition of more trains there would only serve to delay.

WOWZA I mean at that point, why don't we just shut the b div to fix all those things... Lemme take a stab at this Assuming the derailed isn't blocking the crossover to 2nd ave, and the struck passenger is at 59 NRW.... normal route with the above-mentioned local section Bedford Park-34th st. normal Norwood-2nd ave (local south of 42nd) , Coney Island to Atlantic Ave. suspended 96th street-Jay st, using the crossover at York to turn, Church Ave (or 4th ave-9th sts if you'll let me) - Coney Island. Shuttle buses between Jay and Church. Court Square-Bergen st, using the switch just beyond the station to lay up. Jamaica Center to Broadway Junction, Marcy avenue to Broad st w/ shuttle buses to fill the gap normal suspended Ditmars-Queensboro plaza, Coney Island-Atlantic Ave. Coney Island-Prospect Park, 96th st-Whitehall/Jay sts. 95th st to 59th st single track shuttles + supplimentary bus service. Jay st-57th st via local. Additional bus service runs from 59th st (bk) up fourth ave to Court St. , or over Manhattan Bridge to Canal St / Broadway Lafayette . HOARDES of buses up/down queens boulevard, all trains local, LIRR cross honoring.

Okay, back to basics. A division lines (numbered line) are physically incapable of sharing track with B division (lettered) lines. The car widths are different. So unless you plan to replace trains entirely on Dyre (something I object to because a. Second Avenue track capacity is better used elsewhere, and b. service is demonstrably better than anything that 2av can offer (more transfers further south on the line, direct access to GCT, etc)), your second avenue trains will be confined to the express tracks...where there are no stations, and none can be built because the ROW isn't wide enough. The line doesn't have high enough ridership to justify express service, and anyway, it's physically impossible to do so. Send 2nd avenue across 125 and up 3rd ave in the bx as y'all suggested. MUCH better plan.

Why would you replace the on Dyre with a SAS line? You're cutting a ton of transfer options for them (no more 149th st, no more lex transfers). The reason ppl suggest the QB Bypass is because there is a ton of demand for it. Not so much for an expensive rebuild of a functioning service that has a good amount of capacity to spare... (also IDK who's suggesting a line under park ave. -- it wouldn't work -- MNR is under it). Oh for the love of god. Your plan for s on Queens Boulevard via 63rd simply moves the / merge from 34th to 63rd. You are still restricting capacity. What should be done is this 96th-CI, via Sea Beach (replaced by nights/weekends) 96th-CI, via Brighton runs as now, but with more tph and a few trains extended to 179 during the rush to help with the conga line at 71st. full time line Astoria-Whitehall, replacing the 's TPH in Astoria, with any train that can't be turned at Whitehall being sent to South Brooklyn via 4th ave local. Nights/weekends to Coney Island. ^^^ Gets rid of the 34th St merge and doesn't add one in its place. It also increases service on 4th ave, which has been lacking since the brown ended.

Eh? I'm saying leave the alone -- its current route is optimal... Also, aside from the fact that your claim that the is fine is false, your alternative is to increase loads on the lex, the VERY THING THAT SAS WAS BUILT TO REDUCE. Also dekalb...

I get that there will be no merging at 34th -- what I'm trying to communicate is that you're effectively moving the source of delays to 63rd/36th sts. 60th street is currently below capacity. The limiting factor on more trains is that merge at 34th, so once you get rid of it, you can run more trains through there. I'd use that route. As I said earlier, Queens Boulevard Passengers find services that have transfers (Queens Plaza, Lex-59) useful, not ones that go off by themselves (63rd st). Second Avenue also is in need of more trains -- as has thoroughly been documented -- so why not?

Yuh huh, and eminent domaining one of the most important pieces of our grid's infrastructure is smart how? ConEd needs that space as a staging area for repairs, and as a location for vital electrical infrastructure (transformers, rectifiers, etc). Also, I love how y'all thing that "rescheduling trains" will solve merge delays. By that token, there should never be merge delays, because trains are technically scheduled not to conflict. As we can all see, that doesn't hold water. Finally, by making one of the QB local services go via 63rd st, you are cutting of vital transfers for those passengers at Queens Plaza, which will increase crowding on trains. And just in general, 63rd st is a much lower demand corridor than 60th and 53rd. There are no transfers to the 4/5/6, and it is just a tad bit too far north to serve offices directly. Also, your claim that there will be no added merges is very clearly false. If you send s via 63rd, you're adding a merge with the at 36th street, and the at 63rd street. That is x more delayed trains every day. What's more, the Queens Boulevard express tracks are at capacity, so an cutting in front of an at 36th will cause delays that will cascade down the line.

Que? No, the benefit of this proposal is more terminal capacity in Astoria... Then you can send the (or as has been suggested elsewhere becomes and becomes ) up Second Avenue and make the a primary service for Astoria. That eliminates all merging on Broadway. Not only does swapping the not accomplish this, but then you're leaving the without a yard. This has been hashed and rehashed ad infinitum. Move on?

Is there any underground station worse than chambers? OTOH, I can't think of any...

Yeah, or more transit museum space (which would be nice because then you could take a the subway to it).

Nothing. They're redundant now. And for whoever asked how we make the Nassau line more attractive, you'd have move offices to Lower Manhattan. Which, seeing as we're neither socialist nor Washington DC, won't happen. Things change. Yeah it's sad that there's abandoned trackage, but such is the nature of progress. Deal.

Shoot me. We. Don't. Need. . Service. On. Queens. Boulevard. If the bypass is built, it will likely be after phase 3 of SAS, so that's where the trains will come from. I'd say via bypass, (second ave-179) via QB exp, as now, to rockaways, as now (cause riders need those QP xfers, unlike riders...).

*sigh*

I say no. 1. Too long -- Jamaica Center to [somewhere in South BK] all local is quite a trip. 2. It adds a merge to a pair of notoriously unreliable lines. 3. It doesn't provide useful service. People these days want to go to midtown. ESPECIALLY given that the is literally pointing down the tubes and would give supplementary service without adding merges, I really can't see the argument for this.

I wouldn't be so sure...

Wait why are running a Sea Beach Express service? Seems.... useless -- it's already express on 4th Ave.

We heard you the 7th time, Wally Seriously thiugh, if we must have an express, don't you think it makes more sense for it to be via 6th Ave express? I feel like we discussed that at some point... It wasn't optimal but better than a once-every-12-mins local...

The replaces the nights/weekends. The and run local as now. Nights you have 96-CI (Brighton), Astoria-CI (SB, via tunnel), Whitehall-95. Weekends, same deal just to 71. I don't see how this is confusing. Express to 96/125, and local to Queens. Express via Bridge, local via tunnel. Seems simple enough to me... The most important benefit of all this is the capacity bump. The local tracks will carry 30 through their whole length, and express will have >20. That's a significant increase over the restricted reality of now.

What's the use of that GO?