Jump to content
Attention: In order to reply to messages, create topics, have access to other features of the community you must sign up for an account.
Sign in to follow this  
'89 Liberty MCI

Questions: Route Selector Boards, NTT Announcements, NTT Train Signage, Procedures at Terminals

Recommended Posts

Route selector boards: Does anybody happen to know how many stations have them, which stations have them, and whether they are wall-mounted or on the platform side at these stations?

 

NTT announcements: Do they work the same on all NTTs? The only thing I know about them, based on reading some old posts on this forum, is that on the R142/142A, it works as follows. I am using a (2) train to Flatbush Avenue, arriving at Times Square, as the example. Questions/uncertainties are in bold. If it is not in bold, it is a fact/certainty:

 

1. "This is, Times Square-42 Street. Transfer is available to the (1)(7)(A)(C)(E)(N)(Q) and (R) trains. Transfer is available to the shuttle to Grand Central. Connection is available to the PABT," with this announcement being activated by a sensor that senses the number of revolutions the train wheels have spun through.

 

2. Conductor opens doors. "This is, a Brooklyn-bound (2) express train. The next stop is, 34 Street-Penn Station." Does the conductor have to press a button for this announcement him/herself? Or does this announcement automatically play, after the conductor presses the two buttons to open the doors (one button for rear section, one button for front section as on all cars)?

 

3. Conductor waits until nearly all passengers have boarded the rear set of cars. Conductor presses a button that plays the announcement, "stand clear of the closing doors, please (SCCDP)."

 

4. Conductor presses a button (different from SCCDP button, correct?) to close rear doors after seeing that it is all clear in the rear. Then s/he presses button to close front doors after seeing that it is all clear up front. Does the train operator's indicator light turn on automatically?

 

5. Train operator begins to move train after s/he sees indicator light turned on, while conductor observes platform in both directions for 75 feet of train movement.

 

Another question I have about NTT announcements: How are public relations announcements (such as those about suspicious packages) made? Does the conductor press buttons for those or do they come in over the speakers automatically?

 

NTT train signage and programming: Is the conductor or train operator responsible for this? On cars with strip maps (R142, R142A, R143), I know a crew member (or both?) punches in the route/destination sign code and then the signs display the route/destination. But what about the current location of the train? For example on the (2)(5) at Flatbush Avenue, the trains generally have so little time to arrive and then depart for the next trip, that the announcements and strip maps are generally nonfunctional until Church Avenue. It seems like it takes a while to program the train, or the crew has to do several things before programming the train, and this only gets exposed on the (2)(5) at Flatbush due to the setup with that [overloaded] terminal and the lack of sufficient turnaround time.

 

So the train will often continue to display "2 LAST STOP" and the strip maps will be completely dark until we reach Church Avenue. Then the strip map lights up. First every stop lights up, then I guess the conductor changes it so that stops south of Church Avenue are dark (indicating that we already passed them). How does the conductor change this? Does the train change this by itself?

 

On the R160/R160A/R160B, which have FIND, does the train crew have to do anything different when programming the train?

 

Procedures at terminals: Lastly, why do the train doors seem to take a long time to open at the terminals on just about every line?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Not sure but all response but heres all i know

 

Q2 The announcements are played automatically when the door opens. Sometimes it may start way early before the door opens, likely due to not inputting the announcements at right time.

 

Q3. Yes he presses a button

 

Q4. Yes, when all doors are closed they will automatically light up, that way it tells the T/O that all doors are closed.

 

Q5. The C/R goes thru a list of announcements in the computer and plays it over the PA.

 

Q6. T/O or C/R can program it, but the C/R pretty much is the one who does it.

 

Last one idk.

 

This is all i know.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

On a side note those R160's charge up pretty fast..saw an E train come into Roosevelt, dumped for some reason, but t/o charged it back up and within 30 seconds c/r closed the doors and it was gone like nothing ever happened lol

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Route selector boards: Does anybody happen to know how many stations have them, which stations have them, and whether they are wall-mounted or on the platform side at these stations?

 

NTT announcements: Do they work the same on all NTTs? The only thing I know about them, based on reading some old posts on this forum, is that on the R142/142A, it works as follows. I am using a (2) train to Flatbush Avenue, arriving at Times Square, as the example. Questions/uncertainties are in bold. If it is not in bold, it is a fact/certainty:

 

1. "This is, Times Square-42 Street. Transfer is available to the (1)(7)(A)(C)(E)(N)(Q) and (R) trains. Transfer is available to the shuttle to Grand Central. Connection is available to the PABT," with this announcement being activated by a sensor that senses the number of revolutions the train wheels have spun through.

 

2. Conductor opens doors. "This is, a Brooklyn-bound (2) express train. The next stop is, 34 Street-Penn Station." Does the conductor have to press a button for this announcement him/herself? Or does this announcement automatically play, after the conductor presses the two buttons to open the doors (one button for rear section, one button for front section as on all cars)?

 

3. Conductor waits until nearly all passengers have boarded the rear set of cars. Conductor presses a button that plays the announcement, "stand clear of the closing doors, please (SCCDP)."

 

4. Conductor presses a button (different from SCCDP button, correct?) to close rear doors after seeing that it is all clear in the rear. Then s/he presses button to close front doors after seeing that it is all clear up front. Does the train operator's indicator light turn on automatically?

 

5. Train operator begins to move train after s/he sees indicator light turned on, while conductor observes platform in both directions for 75 feet of train movement.

 

Another question I have about NTT announcements: How are public relations announcements (such as those about suspicious packages) made? Does the conductor press buttons for those or do they come in over the speakers automatically?

 

NTT train signage and programming: Is the conductor or train operator responsible for this? On cars with strip maps (R142, R142A, R143), I know a crew member (or both?) punches in the route/destination sign code and then the signs display the route/destination. But what about the current location of the train? For example on the (2)(5) at Flatbush Avenue, the trains generally have so little time to arrive and then depart for the next trip, that the announcements and strip maps are generally nonfunctional until Church Avenue. It seems like it takes a while to program the train, or the crew has to do several things before programming the train, and this only gets exposed on the (2)(5) at Flatbush due to the setup with that [overloaded] terminal and the lack of sufficient turnaround time.

 

So the train will often continue to display "2 LAST STOP" and the strip maps will be completely dark until we reach Church Avenue. Then the strip map lights up. First every stop lights up, then I guess the conductor changes it so that stops south of Church Avenue are dark (indicating that we already passed them). How does the conductor change this? Does the train change this by itself?

 

On the R160/R160A/R160B, which have FIND, does the train crew have to do anything different when programming the train?

 

Procedures at terminals: Lastly, why do the train doors seem to take a long time to open at the terminals on just about every line?

 

Answer to 2: pretty sure it's automatic.

Answer to 3:yes they press a button

Answer to 4: probobaly yes.

 

The conducted probobaly has to change the stops if it's not done automatically done at the beginning.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The T/O moves as soon as the doors close, or does the C/R have to give two buzzes like the commuter railroads?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
The T/O moves as soon as the doors close, or does the C/R have to give two buzzes like the commuter railroads?

 

The buzzes would be used if the train is starting fresh at a terminal or when its held OR if the T/O wants the C/R to open up the doors.

 

Other then that then its not used.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
The buzzes would be used if the train is starting fresh at a terminal or when its held OR if the T/O wants the C/R to open up the doors.

 

Other then that then its not used.

 

actually the buzzer is used more than that...

 

-if said train is at a station and the train can't move cuz of red signals (granted theres no holding lights at the station), the T/O gives 1 buzz and the C/R keeps the doors open until he gets 2 buzzes (green light)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The announcement about "this is..., the next stop is..." is not automatic. Especially at night, the conductor can choose to not play it. The chime when the door closes is automatic, and always plays when the close door button is pushed.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The announcement about "this is..., the next stop is..." is not automatic. Especially at night, the conductor can choose to not play it (but is obviously always supposed to play it). The chime when the door closes is automatic, and always plays when the close door button is pushed.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
actually the buzzer is used more than that...

 

-if said train is at a station and the train can't move cuz of red signals (granted theres no holding lights at the station), the T/O gives 1 buzz and the C/R keeps the doors open until he gets 2 buzzes (green light)

 

Thats why I said when it gets held.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
The announcement about "this is..., the next stop is..." is not automatic. Especially at night, the conductor can choose to not play it (but is obviously always supposed to play it). The chime when the door closes is automatic, and always plays when the close door button is pushed.

 

So is this the way the C/R has to do it:

 

1. Press the two buttons (for rear section and front section) to open the doors. Doors now open.

 

2. Press a separate button so that the announcement "this is..., the next stop is..." gets played.

 

Or when you said the C/R can choose not to play it, did you mean that there is a switch s/he can flip to mute this? Otherwise I gather that you meant they can just not press the separate button described above, at each station (or whenever they do not want to play it, at particular stations and such).

 

Do the buttons that play announcements have to be held down for the duration of the announcement? Or do you just press the button (like the one for SCCDP) once and let it play? Does the button that enables C/Rs to make manual announcements have to be held down while the C/R is making the manual announcement?

 

+10 for all responses so far. Thank y'all.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest lance25

What QM1 was witnessing was either a failure to actually program the trains or the C/R was interrupting them by hitting the PA button before they play. If the interior displays are functioning properly (showing the correct route, next stop, etc.), then the conductor is pressing the PA button so the automated announcements won't play. If the displays are off or are flashing last stop, the route hasn't been programmed.

 

If I'm not mistaken, the conductor shouldn't have to press anything to play normal station announcements unless something happens with the on-board computers. PSA announcements? Yes.

 

As to your inquiry about signage and programming, I'm pretty sure either person can program the route. It's likely just a matter of who gets in the car and gets situated first. Secondly, the trains are programmed in terms of point A to point B. (That of course depends on whether the desired route is in the computer.) Using your (2) line example, the C/R (or T/O) would program the train for Flatbush Av to Wakefield-241 St. If either of them fails to do so before the train leaves the terminal or the train is rerouted mid-route, they usually restart the announcements with the now-correct routing and knock off the stations they already past. If they program the train and knock off the stops fast enough, you won't hear something like "this is a Manhattan-bound (2) train, the next stop is Newkirk Av" when you're leaving Church Av.

 

For your last question, it takes so long to open the doors at the terminals (especially the non-loop ones) because the conductor is switching cars so the train can leave said terminal as quickly as possible (or something like that).

 

Hope that helps a bit.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Question 2: Its automatic but on certain lines on the B div. the computer will forget to say the announcment for the next stop while the doors are open. so either you re-sync the computer or make the announcment yourself.

 

Question 4: the t/o will get indication when c/r gives it to t/o.

 

The last question about the public relations announcments, there condcutor or the t/o chooses wich one to play.

 

This is what I know as far as ooperating a 143 or a 160. Never did a 142 but I'm sure its the same.

 

As far as the FIND on the 160's, its all done by the computer.

 

Why the doors take a minute to open at terminals, cuz the c/r is setting up the new position for the next crew.

 

Hope this helps.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
What QM1 was witnessing was either a failure to actually program the trains or the C/R was interrupting them by hitting the PA button before they play. If the interior displays are functioning properly (showing the correct route, next stop, etc.), then the conductor is pressing the PA button so the automated announcements won't play. If the displays are off or are flashing last stop, the route hasn't been programmed.

 

Correct, the C/R would open the doors, then immediately turn on the PA (so you would hear the "ding"), which would kill the announcement before it started, then close the doors, and we were on our way. It shaved a good 5 or 6 seconds off at each stop.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest lance25

And of course, that's frowned upon by the suits. But I do agree that it does save a few seconds, especially at dead stations or in the middle of the night. Which sounds faster to you: "This is a Manhattan-bound (6) train. The NEXT stop is...Westchester Sq-East Tremont Av. Stand clear of the closing doors." or "Manhattan-bound (6). Next stop, Westchester Sq. Watch the doors." The answer should be obvious.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The suits pride themselves and want consistency, no matter what time or day, with no consideration to station ridership or rider knowledge. I've seen system safety (which checks everything from train speed to announcement quality) out there at 2AM by Bway Jnct over on the Fulton lines..... really. Everyone on that train knows what stop they going to, or is going to 207 (homeless).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
And of course, that's frowned upon by the suits. But I do agree that it does save a few seconds, especially at dead stations or in the middle of the night. Which sounds faster to you: "This is a Manhattan-bound (6) train. The NEXT stop is...Westchester Sq-East Tremont Av. Stand clear of the closing doors." or "Manhattan-bound (6). Next stop, Westchester Sq. Watch the doors." The answer should be obvious.

 

That's one of the dumbest things the suits don't get is the whole obsession with "Manhattan bound" etc. This can be misleading to those who don't bother with reading signage on a (4) train in the Bronx which is "Manhattan bound" even though it's going to Brooklyn (and it changes in Manhattan). It also doesn't announce WHERE it's going in Brooklyn, which can confuse people who don't read signs and get on the (5) thinking it's going to Flatbush (it's Brooklyn bound!), when in reality it's going to Utica.

 

It would make much more sense to just state the terminal destination and eliminate some of the excess wording and replace it with more relevant wording.

 

Arriving in Station: "42nd Street - Grand Central. Transfers available to the 6 local, and the 7 train. Transfer available to the Shuttle to Times Square. Connection available to Metro North."

 

Doors Open: "4 Express Train to Utica Avenue. Next Stop: 14th Street - Union Square"

 

"Stand Clear of the Closing Doors Please"

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

A question on this announcement: why is it that some times on the (6) it correctly announces "this is a Brooklyn Bridge-bound (6) train" after 125 street southbound, while others it continues to say "this is a Manhattan-bound (6) train" even if it's in Manhattan? I've noticed that on the (4) too. Does it have to do with programing, or is it a glitch?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest lance25

On the (6)s, it's a very old glitch that really should've been fixed a while ago. I haven't heard this problem on the (4) trains but if it's doing the same thing, it's probably the same glitch as well. According to a couple of employees, if the announcement doesn't play at 125 St, you can be pretty certain that you'll be hearing "Manhattan-bound" for the rest of the trip unless they reset the computers.

 

With that said however, there are several (4) and (5) train sets that will announce they're Woodlawn- and Eastchester-Dyre Av-bound trains respectively at 125 St instead of the usual Bronx-bound so as to not confuse the passengers. Of course, some sets have it and others don't. Consistency, what is that? :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On the (6)s, it's a very old glitch that really should've been fixed a while ago. I haven't heard this problem on the (4) trains but if it's doing the same thing, it's probably the same glitch as well. According to a couple of employees, if the announcement doesn't play at 125 St, you can be pretty certain that you'll be hearing "Manhattan-bound" for the rest of the trip unless they reset the computers.

 

With that said however, there are several (4) and (5) train sets that will announce they're Woodlawn- and Eastchester-Dyre Av-bound trains respectively at 125 St instead of the usual Bronx-bound so as to not confuse the passengers. Of course, some sets have it and others don't. Consistency, what is that? :)

 

From what I noticed, the (4) train sets usually announce "Bronx-bound" at 125th street, while the (5) trains usually announce Eastchester-Dyre Avenue-bound". As for the <6>, it announces "this is a Pelham Bay Park-bound <6> express train", as soon as it reaches 125th street.

Consistency at its finest!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Before the (6) used to announce "Bronx" bound at 125 and only differentiated between express and local services at 3Av. It was changed to 125th, as that's the station customers make the distinction and prefer to wait for their train (even though I've actually made connections to the express in front of me several times at 3Av). 125th has more people at it, more police presence, and even though it is just as HOOD as 3Av, a safer place to wait.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

R160s have more options than R142/As. Not sure about the R143s.

 

R160s have a whole bunch of exotic ones. One for a flood condition that announces a train out of service, for example.

 

The ones on the R142/A's are fairly straightforward, I think I posted them in another thread somewhere although some of the language was changed recently due to MTA bigwig meetings about verbiage.

 

I'd be curious to see the complete list of R160 special messages though.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Restore formatting

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Sign in to follow this  

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Terms of Use.