How the MTA is wasting money that could be used to improve bus service

[BrooklynBus]

Damn. One of the buses carried 0 people.

 

That was the 25th Avenue Bus following the 4th Avenue bus. And if he stays on his tail the entire trip rather than passing him, he will pick up no one for his entire trip. Because it is needed on Monday through Thursdays, it isn't sent directly back to the depot on Fridays. However there are other times when there are 50 people waiting at Coney Island and Brighton Beach Avenue, and buses are sent directly from the depot to the College who do not pick them up. This is why the MTA is so inefficient and can't afford to provide service where it is needed.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

That was the 25th Avenue Bus following the 4th Avenue bus. And if he stays on his tail the entire trip rather than passing him, he will pick up no one for his entire trip. Because it is needed on Monday through Thursdays, it isn't sent directly back to the depot on Fridays. However there are other times when there are 50 people waiting at Coney Island and Brighton Beach Avenue, and buses are sent directly from the depot to the College who do not pick them up. This is why the MTA is so inefficient and can't afford to provide service where it is needed.

 

Sometimes they are forced to add additional buses to avoid beyond packed situations. Take the X17 for example. That bus gets excessive service at times, or at least it seems that way because they usually run in packs. My question is why can't they do a better job of spacing buses? They run in packs coming from 57th st and there's two or three of them in a matter of a few minutes. I'll see two or three X17Js or two X17Js and an X17C.

[BrooklynBus]

Sometimes they are forced to add additional buses to avoid beyond packed situations. Take the X17 for example. That bus gets excessive service at times, or at least it seems that way because they usually run in packs. My question is why can't they do a better job of spacing buses? They run in packs coming from 57th st and there's two or three of them in a matter of a few minutes. I'll see two or three X17Js or two X17Js and an X17C.

 

I'm not sure how to prevent that with express buses, but they definitely could do more to prevent it on locals. It just isn't a priority with them. You are correct. In a perfect world without bus bunching, much service could be reduced. The problem gets serious when you have to wait 30 to 45 minutes on a route with scheduled 15 minute service. It is a prime reason why people try to avoid those routes. But this article is about something else.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

I'm not sure how to prevent that with express buses, but they definitely could do more to prevent it on locals. It just isn't a priority with them. You are correct. In a perfect world without bus bunching, much service could be reduced. The problem gets serious when you have to wait 30 to 45 minutes on a route with scheduled 15 minute service. It is a prime reason why people try to avoid those routes. But this article is about something else.

 

Bunching could also equal waste and if they could do better with that across the system, tons of savings could be had meaning restoration of service or expansion of service where needed, so it was very well related to your article about restoring the (B4).

 

On that note, could you give some insight as to why the has such a problem solving bunching issues?? I think I know the answer, but I could be wrong. Also what would you do specifically to help reduce bunching throughout the system??

[BrooklynBus]

On that note, could you give some insight as to why the has such a problem solving bunching issues?? I think I know the answer, but I could be wrong. Also what would you do specifically to help reduce bunching throughout the system??

 

First of all, I don't think they even realize how extensive the problem is. It affects every single bus route to some extent. I think they feel it is limited to midtown Manhattan, Downtown Brooklyn and other dense areas. I doubt it they realize it happens in places like Staten Island or on routes with 20 minute headways. So they blame traffic and feel there is nothing they can do about it. But that's not true.

 

They can turn buses short, have buses skip the beginning of a route when enough buses are available, etc, but that depends on knowing where your buses are on the entire route. I've seen dispatchers take action trying to help but actually make the situation worse. It also doesn't help that there are hardly any dispatchers out there any more. Used to be a time when every route had at least two dispatchers, and major routes had at least six. Now they all seem to be floating and only are located at major terminals (Kings Plaza, Kingsborough, etc.)

 

The key is to get a GPS or similar tracking system so that someone can look at a central board to see where all the buses are all at once like they do with the subways. Together with a functioning radio, they can begin to make inquiries of the bus drivers asking them how many people they estimate to be on their bus. If they find two buses right next to each other and one of the buses has one or two passengers and there is a big gap elsewhere on the route, they can instruct the driver to ask his passenger to board the other bus and send the bus to where the gap is. This, however, could totally screw up the operator by putting him on a part of the route where he shouldn't be and possibly require that he work overtime. But some times drastic measures need to be taken if the passengers are your first priority. But if you first priority is to reduce overtime, not only wouldn't you never do this, you also would let runs go vacant when an operator calls in sick. So when you start with a gap in service, that will only cause buses to bunch further.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

The 5th Avenue buses seem to bunch the least (particularly the ((M1), (M2), (M3) buses). They have that coordinated quite well. I mention them because they hit a lot of traffic on 5th & Madison Avenues. Occasionally I'll see two (M2)s together or two (M3)s, but overall they are quite good and really stick to the schedule very well. Now a line like the (B4) which I used back in the day reminds me of a poorly run Staten Island bus. That line was horrendous out of Ulmer Park. You'd have two (B4)s coming together when they're scheduled either 15 or 10 minutes apart, buses MIA, etc. It's easy to see how ridership wasn't so great at times. Now when it was run under Jackie Gleason, the service seemed to be better. Now I believe it went back to Ulmer Park and since then I haven't used it that much but the service seemed to be iffy at best. My question is have you studied lines like the (M16), (M34) or (B63) which have tracking systems in place?? Now I've used the (B63) here and there and while the service is good, it also suffered from bunching. Not sure about now though. The question is does the tracking systems help reduce bunching at all? I used the (M16) (M34) and it was a joke. Kept saying that a bus was due and almost 10 minutes later when two buses were due we were still waiting. Finally one bus showed up.

[BrooklynBus]

[quote name= Now a line like the (B4) which I used back in the day reminds me of a poorly run Staten Island bus. That line was horrendous out of Ulmer Park. ... Now I believe it went back to Ulmer Park ... My question is have you studied lines like the (M16), (M34) or (B63) which have tracking systems in place?? ... The question is does the tracking systems help reduce bunching at all?

 

The B4 is at Gleason. A driver whom I'm friendly with told me that the other day. I have not studied the buses you mention. Actually I hardly ride any buses these days anymore. I don't believe they are using the GPS to track buses. They're just using them to tell people how long they will have to wait as far as I know.

[B35 via Church]

speaking of the B63...

buses don't bunch much on that route anymore... the main thing w/ that route was, and still is, timeliness...

 

I was gonna say though, since when did they change the NB destination sign....

during my walk along atlantic av yesterday, I noticed they got rid of the one that read:

 

"Cobble Hill || Columbia st"

 

and now it reads:

 

"Pier 6 || Brooklyn Bridge Park"

 

That was the first thing I saw, and at first I was like, I thought the MTA was broke... when the hell did they create a new route...

[Via Garibaldi 8]

speaking of the B63...

buses don't bunch much on that route anymore... the main thing w/ that route was, and still is, timeliness...

 

I was gonna say though, since when did they change the NB destination sign....

during my walk along atlantic av yesterday, I noticed they got rid of the one that read:

 

"Cobble Hill || Columbia st"

 

and now it reads:

 

"Pier 6 || Brooklyn Bridge Park"

 

That was the first thing I saw, and at first I was like, I thought the MTA was broke... when the hell did they create a new route...

 

 

I used to like to hang out down there every now and then. From the map it looks like the same destination... :confused:

[LRG]

speaking of the B63...

buses don't bunch much on that route anymore... the main thing w/ that route was, and still is, timeliness...

 

I was gonna say though, since when did they change the NB destination sign....

during my walk along atlantic av yesterday, I noticed they got rid of the one that read:

 

"Cobble Hill || Columbia st"

 

and now it reads:

 

"Pier 6 || Brooklyn Bridge Park"

 

That was the first thing I saw, and at first I was like, I thought the MTA was broke... when the hell did they create a new route...

 

I'm glad you brought that up...it doesn't look like the route or even the north terminal hasn't even changed physically so why change the destination sign reading?

[B35 via Church]

I used to like to hang out down there every now and then. From the map it looks like the same destination... :confused:

 

I'm glad you brought that up...it doesn't look like the route or even the north terminal hasn't even changed physically so why change the destination sign reading?

 

It hasn't... it's the same exact terminal location....

 

As I looked up at the signage, I waited to see if it would (still) read Cobble hill/columbia...

 

Nope... all it had was the:

B63 via 5th av... then after the transitition, "Pier 6" centered on the top line, and below it, 'Brooklyn bridge park' (forgot how it was abbreviated); but it's shown in the same way/"font" (lol) as the Jamaica bound Q25/65 reading...

 

there's no mention of cobble hill at all... which lets me know that all it is, is advertising at the MTA's expense....

 

way I see it, funny thing is, you're still gonna get people traveling to Prospect park, regardless... so they wasted their time programming new coding, etc. for the B63 on that end.... the people you will see frequenting that park, are w/e tourists coming off tour buses just to "check it out" (same ones emanating from dumbo & brooklyn hgts), and residents of cobble hill.... The park itself is located in a pocket of Brooklyn that no other Brooklynites (care to/want to) commute to....

 

In plain english, you won't see an influx of ppl. taking the 63 to get to that park....

 

ehh, there are some routes that, I guess, could benefit somewhat from having the destination sign on a particular end changed (not the masses read them anyway, so this is all moot)... I don't feel the B63 was one of em.... talk about a time waste....

[qjtransitmaster]

speaking of the B63...

buses don't bunch much on that route anymore... the main thing w/ that route was, and still is, timeliness...

 

I was gonna say though, since when did they change the NB destination sign....

during my walk along atlantic av yesterday, I noticed they got rid of the one that read:

 

"Cobble Hill || Columbia st"

 

and now it reads:

 

"Pier 6 || Brooklyn Bridge Park"

 

That was the first thing I saw, and at first I was like, I thought the MTA was broke... when the hell did they create a new route...

that line is so late I walked from 60th to 86th still no bus b63 needs a LTD or remove some stops. the R train it too infrequent and unreliable

[Q43LTD]

speaking of the B63...

buses don't bunch much on that route anymore... the main thing w/ that route was, and still is, timeliness...

 

I was gonna say though, since when did they change the NB destination sign....

during my walk along atlantic av yesterday, I noticed they got rid of the one that read:

 

"Cobble Hill || Columbia st"

 

and now it reads:

 

"Pier 6 || Brooklyn Bridge Park"

 

That was the first thing I saw, and at first I was like, I thought the MTA was broke... when the hell did they create a new route...

I have one word for that: facepalm

[B35 via Church]

I have one word for that: facepalm

hah....

 

I was *smh*-ing the entire time I paralleled that B63.....

 

 

that line is so late I walked from 60th to 86th still no bus b63 needs a LTD or remove some stops. the R train it too infrequent and unreliable

 

yeah, that is another reason I stopped the SI fans I used to do after work... headin back home, my options are the & a short walk to the B35, the B16 & a 20-25 min. walk from Ocean/Caton, and the B63 to the B35.... The B8 & a 20-25 min walk from Brooklyn av/Av D was another option, but buses got cutback to the VA Hosp (except for late nights, which does nothin for me).... the 70 to the 35 I only did, if the 70 was "right there".....

 

this is how I come to realize that the B63 has a problem w/ timeliness....

 

far as walking along 5th av due to a (seemingly) MIA B63..... both of those times, I simply did not wanna be bothered w/ the ... On 2 occasions I trekked it out from 86th to 39th (the windier/cooler the weather, the faster I tend to walk).... first time I did it, I didn't mind.... 2nd time I did it, I was pissed... I got up to 50-something street before a bus came roaring by... jampacked... by that time, I was well in a groove & said eff' it & walked the rest of the way....

[Q43LTD]

that line is so late I walked from 60th to 86th still no bus b63 needs a LTD or remove some stops. the R train it too infrequent and unreliable

Trust me the (B63) doesn't need a LTD

[Q43LTD]

hah....

 

I was *smh*-ing the entire time I paralleled that B63.....

 

 

I could understand the (Q42), (Q88), all the ex-PBL routes and the LIB's, but that signage was ridiculous. Brooklyn Bridge Park? Really?

[BrooklynBus]

I could understand the (Q42), (Q88), all the ex-PBL routes and the LIB's, but that signage was ridiculous. Brooklyn Bridge Park? Really?

 

It may make sense when the park gets developed. Now it's just confusing.