What needs to be done in the NYC mass transit world

[BrooklynIRT]

err you do realize that the elevated busway will have stations so passengers can reach the businesses below right?

actually my proposal had no stations on the busway if you read it carefully. the SBS will not make any stops b/w Flatbush and "D" (northbound) or b/w Newkirk and "H" (southbound). it is very important that there be no stations except at the very edge of the busway because then you would have to build a lot of stairs and possibly elevators (to make accommodations for disabled persons using the SBS).

 

a station at the very edge of the busway is fine if you have no choice but to end the busway like halfway into an SBS stop. then you just put a short staircase on the busway in the area next to where the rear 50 feet of the Artic usually stops (for the middle and back doors) and the front 10 feet of the Artic would just be level with the surface road/curb so those who do not want to use the stairs can just use the front door of the bus to avoid the stairs.

 

 

peacmaker, I hope you can expound on the points you made in posts #38 and 43, which I questioned in posts #40 and 45, because you made several statements that I do not understand and might better understand if you explained them.

[peacemak3r]

I feel like I'm talking to a wall.

 

First things first, to put a little of insight from qjtransitmaster's question/remark.  When I took the B44LTD in the past during rush hour, it was fairly good.  It was probably only bad whenever that supermarket was getting a new shipment because the truck literally blocks the entire street.  But most of the time when that happens my 44LTD would diverge from Nostrand and just make a detour, plain and simple.  Probably 5 minutes delayed on commute.

 

Present time, I've driven around Junction often to drop off and pick up cousins from Midwood, the traffic isn't as exaggerated as it seems.

 

I'm not even going to input any more thought because it seems nothing is getting to you anyway on this.  You want to know where the real traffic is in the morning?  Around that junior high school with all the parents double parking and kids acting fools on the street at times.  Same goes for when they get out of school.

 

And 15 hours of traffic in that area?  In what world are you in?  Traffic builds up there only during school hours and rush hours.  I've driven there many times at evenings and nights and it's not as bad as you perceive it to be.

 

Maybe my explantions are coming from a past bus passenger and current driver's point of view.  Plus I've lived in the area for about a year.

 

I'm done.

[BrooklynIRT]

talking to a wall? all I did was ask you questions specifically relating to the points you brought up. you avoided answering most of them and you brought up things such as the large amount of pedestrians in the Junction area and whatever goes on at whatever JHS you were talking about (which one? where?) in attempts to divert the conversation.

[realizm]

He's not diverting the discussion or the arguement, debate whatever. He's simply speaking from the view of an owner of an automobile who needs it to get around as alternative points to your arguement. That's his preference as well as mine as a car owner as well. I read all his posts. He is absolutely correct on almost all points what he is saying is true. I've lived in SBK for years I know what he is talking about in terms of traffic patterns.

[BrooklynIRT]

I still do not understand many of his points, as I stated in post #51. some parts of your post are also unclear to me, realizm. and I never said that people who drive should stop doing it. I do not know how an elevated busway would force people to stop driving or make it harder for them to drive. during construction only they could just eliminate some parking spaces so people can still drive there..I think.

 

this is what peacemaker said in post #38:

 

It's still impractical, I still think that'll cause more traffic than it already has.

 

in response to that point, I asked the following question in post #40:

 

how?

 

peacemaker never responded to that question or any of the other questions I have asked since post #40. he never stated how a one lane elevated busway, whose supports would not eliminate any surface lanes (let us assume we only have a southbound one), beginning just south of Farragut and ending just north of "H" would cause more traffic issues around JCT than there already are. then there is still the question of preventing the induced demand that bob was talking about in post #46, and to which I responded in posts #47 and 48.

 

alternative points to my argument..what does that mean? peacemaker avoided answering most of my questions and brought up things such as the large amount of pedestrians in the Junction area and whatever goes on at whatever JHS he was talking about (which one? where?). what was the point of mentioning that? it did nothing to refute any of the points I have been making since post #36.

 

he has even stated in the past, including within this thread, that traffic around JCT is bad and as the thread progressed he made more of an attempt to minimize the severity of the traffic problems around JCT. since post #36, I have not made any statement in this thread placing any blame on any individual or group for any of the traffic issues around JCT. that does not matter for the purposes of this conversation, so why did peacemaker mention the large amount of pedestrians in the Junction area?

 

and he brought up some JHS in the area where he claims there are traffic problems and whatnot without indicating which JHS it was or where it was, or solutions he may have had in mind for the traffic problems near that JHS. never mind the fact that it had nothing to do with his claim that an elevated busway will worsen traffic conditions around JCT.

 

would you care to explain and clarify any of this, realizm? or anybody else?

[BrooklynIRT]

I meant "then there is still the question of how to prevent the induced demand...", not "then there is still the question of preventing the induced demand..."

[Jdog14]

I believe the school peacemaker mentioned in question is the one on Foster Ave and Nostrand Ave (which is Public School 269).

[BrooklynIRT]

if there are no JHSs closer to JCT, then I suppose you are right. as I mentioned earlier they could alleviate the problem of people double parking there after school and on other problem sections of Nostrand and Rogers by physically separating the right travel lane (and allowing buses, vehicles going to Nostrand south of Farragut, and vehicles turning right from Nostrand north of Farragut to use that lane) from the left travel lane(s) using concrete strips or plastic bollards.

 

something that just occurred to me was that perhaps vines, bushes, and/r other forms of greenery could be used to make the el look more attractive (and remove any potential graffiti canvasses, which would be the bare concrete of the support columns). vines around the support columns, vines along the outside walls and underside of the el, maybe some planters, stuff like that. that seems like a good way to introduce greenery to the area, especially since Nostrand is not getting any trees (or anything done to it at all) in the JCT streetscape project. all of the improvements are for FB, Glenwood, and Hillel Pl only.

[bobtehpanda]

if there are no JHSs closer to JCT, then I suppose you are right. as I mentioned earlier they could alleviate the problem of people double parking there after school and on other problem sections of Nostrand and Rogers by physically separating the right travel lane (and allowing buses, vehicles going to Nostrand south of Farragut, and vehicles turning right from Nostrand north of Farragut to use that lane) from the left travel lane(s) using concrete strips or plastic bollards.

 

something that just occurred to me was that perhaps vines, bushes, and/r other forms of greenery could be used to make the el look more attractive (and remove any potential graffiti canvasses, which would be the bare concrete of the support columns). vines around the support columns, vines along the outside walls and underside of the el, maybe some planters, stuff like that. that seems like a good way to introduce greenery to the area, especially since Nostrand is not getting any trees (or anything done to it at all) in the JCT streetscape project. all of the improvements are for FB, Glenwood, and Hillel Pl only.

 

The thing is, if plastic bollards will work for the area around the JHS, what's wrong with bollards and paint immediately around the Junction?

 

I'm not following as to why we need to build a small, expensive, disruptive piece of infrastructure for such a short distance, that'll only be used from 5 or 6AM to 11PM at night, and sit idle for 25% of the day.

 

As for the congestion comment, a general rule of thumb is that the more complex you make a intersection, the more time it'll take to go through it. The "two driving lanes" comment is under the assumption that you're not removing a lane from Nostrand to balance out the new elevated lane, since that intersection is very busy, and DOT is not going to stripe a bus lane for the sole use of a single local bus line.

[BrooklynIRT]

I wish you had specified whether you meant remove the rush hour travel lane (which usually is not a rush hour travel lane since people disobey regulations and are always parked there during rush anyway) or remove the parking lane, but I do not want to continue with that argument anyway.

 

the plastic bollards would not do much to accomplish what un-violated curbside bus lanes or banning parking or an elevated bus lane would. the s/b B44's problems around JCT are not caused by any double parking (the n/b B44 has that problem, but after SBS begins there will be much less n/b bus traffic on Nostrand north of FB, and the SBS will not have to deal with any of that double parking).

 

the plastic bollards are for areas where double parking is an issue and, unless they ban parking on Nostrand around JCT, they cannot physically separate the curb lane from the 24/7 driving lane there. they should be on most of the unidirectional section of Nostrand b/c double parking is an issue there and separating the right travel lane from the left travel lane(s) still allows people to park on either curb.

 

I used to think bollards should also go in the Plaza Auto Mall area but on the double yellow line so people could still park on the curbs but nobody would want to double park b/c it would make the side on which the double parked vehicle(s) is/are located literally impassable.

 

they need to congestion price the Junction area. FB b/w Farragut and Nostrand s/b and b/w "I" or "H" and Nostrand n/b, and Nostrand b/w Farragut and FB s/b and b/w "I" and FB n/b. use sensors to toll.

[peacemak3r]

I said I was done, but to prove my point that he doesn't know the area too well, there is a JHS on Ave M and Nostrand Ave that produces many traffic jams during the start of school hours and the closing of school hours.  I believe the name of the school is HUDDE or something like that.

 

But of course a guy proposing new traffic patterns and overhead passes near that JHS would know about that JHS but of course I believe not.

 

Clearly you haven't lived in that area nor driven in that area long enough to know my points thoroughly, so I'll take the advice of other members here and decease from this thread and leave the pipe dreams to you.  Enjoy.

[BrooklynIRT]

good grief.

 

I am no longer interested in any overhead busway in the area; I have other ideas. I do know the area quite well and I know Andries Hudde JHS at Nostrand & "K".

 

in order to prove your point that I do not know the area too well, you would have to ask more questions about the area. you have not proven that I do not know the area too well and you started denying that the Junction has serious issues with congestion, for which private vehicles, not the large amount of pedestrians around there, are chiefly responsible.

 

Clearly you have not responded to any of the other questions I have asked since post #40, so I suppose I will take my own advice and decease desist from this thread and leave the denial to you.  Enjoy.

[qjtransitmaster]

How you gonna put an underground bus tunnel there when the train is already there...

err simple YOU WON'T DING DING.

 

good grief.

 

I am no longer interested in any overhead busway in the area; I have other ideas. I do know the area quite well and I know Andries Hudde JHS at Nostrand & "K".

 

in order to prove your point that I do not know the area too well, you would have to ask more questions about the area. you have not proven that I do not know the area too well and you started denying that the Junction has serious issues with congestion, for which private vehicles, not the large amount of pedestrians around there, are chiefly responsible.

 

Clearly you have not responded to any of the other questions I have asked since post #40, so I suppose I will take my own advice and decease desist from this thread and leave the denial to you.  Enjoy.

Me thinks you should look at the really congested corridors like the LIE and speeding up express bus service and BQE sort of.