2022 Bus Ridership Statistics

[NoHacksJustKhaks]

It's been this trend I've noticed as of late where there is a lot more law-enforcement out, considerably more than I saw years ago, but it seems increasingly so they are just standing there... even when fare avoiders do it right nearby. If that trend is mainly confined to the subway, it's no surprise that buses (which get enforced even less) have it worse.

This the kinda pattern that's hard to reverse once you began it, so AFAIK, the bus system gonna remain in taxpayers hands for a looooong time  

[MysteriousBtrain]

34 minutes ago, NoHacksJustKhaks said:

It's been this trend I've noticed as of late where there is a lot more law-enforcement out, considerably more than I saw years ago, but it seems increasingly so they are just standing there... even when fare avoiders do it right nearby. If that trend is mainly confined to the subway, it's no surprise that buses (which get enforced even less) have it worse.

This the kinda pattern that's hard to reverse once you began it, so AFAIK, the bus system gonna remain in taxpayers hands for a looooong time  

You talking about the new MTA security? Everyone knows they a big waste of tax $$ as well. Unless it's someone like NYPD and Eagle Team (and even then you still see some of them bsing around) nobody going anywhere.

[B35 via Church]

3 hours ago, JAzumah said:

You are correct, but those are the ones that usually end up doing something criminal in or outside of the subway. It's one thing for people who can't ski to wear ski masks. It is another thing to see ski masks and/or hoodies in the summer. 

You're making it sound like those that farebeat that don't have criminal intentions after beating the fare, are coming up with some elaborate scheme (like wearing winter apparel in the summertime) in order to farebeat.... That may be some one-off, but that's simply not what's going on, by far & large....

These people casually walking through the emergency exit door, jumping turnstiles, or ducking under turnstiles in their regular apparel to beat the fare, be regular commuters (that aren't looking to do something criminal after they beat the fare) more often than not.... It's second-nature at this point; farebeating is a culture in this city...

1 hour ago, NoHacksJustKhaks said:

It's been this trend I've noticed as of late where there is a lot more law-enforcement out, considerably more than I saw years ago, but it seems increasingly so they are just standing there... even when fare avoiders do it right nearby. If that trend is mainly confined to the subway, it's no surprise that buses (which get enforced even less) have it worse.

This the kinda pattern that's hard to reverse once you began it, so AFAIK, the bus system gonna remain in taxpayers hands for a looooong time  

Yeah, and that why I either chuckle or scoff (depending on my mood) whenever I hear that announcement on the train, informing pax. that there are police on the platform (or whatever it says, verbatim)....

Edited August 17, 2023 by B35 via Church

[NewFlyer 230]

4 hours ago, JAzumah said:

They should put two teams at Flushing-Main Street and check every bus in both directions for two or three days straight and see what happens.

They should with NYPD parked up over there to take anybody who wants to act up two blocks down to the police precinct. 

4 hours ago, B35 via Church said:

Didn't even notice that (about the Q44)...

Not that it makes any real difference at this point (not that this should even be questioned), but I wonder which SBS route has the highest percentage of paying customers...

I wonder that myself. If I had to take a guess I would say the M79 & M86. I used to work on the upper west side and when I used to take those routes I never observed a crazy amount of farebeating on the line. We would get held up sometimes just waiting for people to get their sbs tickets lol. I see more people on the Q44 just hopping on especially if the bus is already at the stop. 

[hounddriver]

They should check out the farebeating at Fordham Plaza on the 12,Flatbush Jct on the 41 & 103,149th St(The Hub)-all routes just to name a few.

[B35 via Church]

On 8/17/2023 at 11:50 AM, hounddriver said:

They should check out the farebeating at Fordham Plaza on the 12,Flatbush Jct on the 41 & 103,149th St(The Hub)-all routes just to name a few.

...and the entire borough of Staten Island.

[Robert Spire]

On 8/16/2023 at 10:09 PM, B35 via Church said:

farebeating is a culture in this city...

Eventually what is eventually going to happen IMO is that the entire local bus system will officially be made free. Look at the fare free promotions in Westchester, look at the 5 free pilot bus routes, look at how express buses are cashless and how pre pandemic MTA was going to evaluate local buses being cashless. If you think about it, most people who use MetroCards eventually use the subway system anyway and the MTA gets their money there. With free bus to subway transfers, the actual fare paid per ride has gone down considerably. If the MTA is going to switch everyone over to OMNY and have fare capping, which may even replace an unlimited ride option, while keeping free bus to subway transfers, and possibly not accepting coins on the local buses, might as well make the local system free at that point. 

 

The moment all local buses become free, IMO that's the moment NYPD will crack down hard on subway fare evasion. 

[B35 via Church]

47 minutes ago, Robert Spire said:

Eventually what is eventually going to happen IMO is that the entire local bus system will officially be made free. Look at the fare free promotions in Westchester, look at the 5 free pilot bus routes, look at how express buses are cashless and how pre pandemic MTA was going to evaluate local buses being cashless. If you think about it, most people who use MetroCards eventually use the subway system anyway and the MTA gets their money there. With free bus to subway transfers, the actual fare paid per ride has gone down considerably. If the MTA is going to switch everyone over to OMNY and have fare capping, which may even replace an unlimited ride option, while keeping free bus to subway transfers, and possibly not accepting coins on the local buses, might as well make the local system free at that point.

The moment all local buses become free, IMO that's the moment NYPD will crack down hard on subway fare evasion. 

By that logic, the buses & the subways will be made free.... The MTA gets your money, the second you successfully purchase a metrocard.... At that point, what difference does it make if you take a subway or a bus....

[Robert Spire]

34 minutes ago, B35 via Church said:

By that logic, the buses & the subways will be made free.... The MTA gets your money, the second you successfully purchase a metrocard.... At that point, what difference does it make if you take a subway or a bus....

If you tap with OMNY in the subway, you pay $2.90, you transfer to a bus, it's a free transfer. You purchase an unlimited ride because you have to use the subway anyways, bus transfers are included. Subways will have to have fare payment infrastructure no matter what, this is something recognized with how they've reimagined station agents. Fare evasion is also tied to crime in the subway system and a lot of anxiety about using transit stems from the subway system. OTOH with buses, we had several months of fare free local buses in 2020 and that glass ceiling has been broken, especially now with 5 free local routes and the Q70 being free. I mean, fare free local buses means less staff needed to deal with money and fares and less dwell time at bus stops. I can see how MTA decides trying to have fares on local buses is worth more trouble than they get in fares on local buses. 

[B35 via Church]

9 minutes ago, Robert Spire said:

If you tap with OMNY in the subway, you pay $2.90, you transfer to a bus, it's a free transfer. You purchase an unlimited ride because you have to use the subway anyways, bus transfers are included. Subways will have to have fare payment infrastructure no matter what, this is something recognized with how they've reimagined station agents. Fare evasion is also tied to crime in the subway system and a lot of anxiety about using transit stems from the subway system. OTOH with buses, we had several months of fare free local buses in 2020 and that glass ceiling has been broken, especially now with 5 free local routes and the Q70 being free. I mean, fare free local buses means less staff needed to deal with money and fares and less dwell time at bus stops. I can see how MTA decides trying to have fares on local buses is worth more trouble than they get in fares on local buses. 

These fare free stints that some of these other transit agencies are/have undergone, isn't/wasn't much more than a political move.... In any event, your sentiment would perhaps have more bearing if the subway was the only mode of public transit in this city.... Quiet is as kept, even if it represents a minority, there are commuters in this city that doesn't sniff the subway (figuratively.... and literally speaking... lol) to get around....

I get the point you're making & I'm all for a good conspiracy theory... I just don't see the MTA making all the buses free, to ultimately use the subway as some sort of fortified bear trap to catch farebeaters.... If anything, that'll slowly have more people using buses (since they'd all be free in such a scenario)....

[Robert Spire]

30 minutes ago, B35 via Church said:

These fare free stints that some of these other transit agencies are/have undergone, isn't/wasn't much more than a political move.... In any event, your sentiment would perhaps have more bearing if the subway was the only mode of public transit in this city.... Quiet is as kept, even if it represents a minority, there are commuters in this city that doesn't sniff the subway (figuratively.... and literally speaking... lol) to get around....

I get the point you're making & I'm all for a good conspiracy theory... I just don't see the MTA making all the buses free, to ultimately use the subway as some sort of fortified bear trap to catch farebeaters.... If anything, that'll slowly have more people using buses (since they'd all be free in such a scenario)....

I actually never thought the subway is a fortified bear trap to catch farebeaters. If anything the subways are the "marquee" mode of public transit the MTA operates. Notice how when the NYCT president is mentioned in the media, they're called "the subway chief" or "head of the subways" or "train daddy" in the case of Byford. Buses have always been second fiddle and it seems as if MTA is forced to have a bus network that they don't want to have. I mean much of the history of buses in NYC is NYCTA or MTA being forced to pick up bus operations that failed or the city didn't want to oversee or have any responsibility for.

[Nitro]

1 hour ago, B35 via Church said:

These fare free stints that some of these other transit agencies are/have undergone, isn't/wasn't much more than a political move.... In any event, your sentiment would perhaps have more bearing if the subway was the only mode of public transit in this city.... Quiet is as kept, even if it represents a minority, there are commuters in this city that doesn't sniff the subway (figuratively.... and literally speaking... lol) to get around....

I get the point you're making & I'm all for a good conspiracy theory... I just don't see the MTA making all the buses free, to ultimately use the subway as some sort of fortified bear trap to catch farebeaters.... If anything, that'll slowly have more people using buses (since they'd all be free in such a scenario)....

Nothing is free bro. Taxpayers's dollars go to maintenance and the driver's salary. not some petty bs

[B35 via Church]

1 hour ago, Robert Spire said:

I actually never thought the subway is a fortified bear trap to catch farebeaters. If anything the subways are the "marquee" mode of public transit the MTA operates. Notice how when the NYCT president is mentioned in the media, they're called "the subway chief" or "head of the subways" or "train daddy" in the case of Byford. Buses have always been second fiddle and it seems as if MTA is forced to have a bus network that they don't want to have. I mean much of the history of buses in NYC is NYCTA or MTA being forced to pick up bus operations that failed or the city didn't want to oversee or have any responsibility for.

The bear trap reference was an analogy to this theory/belief you're conveying, not that I think you think the subway is one.

I understand that this city is subway-centric... If it's anything I ultimately believe will happen in the future with the buses/network, is the dwindling number of bus routes (and the prolonging/extending of whatever ones will be left standing), over having buses be free & having cops go extra hard on catching farebeaters on the subway.... Basically, feeding more into the "frequency" model in the whole frequency vs. coverage concept...

 

15 minutes ago, Nitro said:

Nothing is free bro. Taxpayers's dollars go to maintenance and the driver's salary. not some petty bs

You're directing this at the wrong person... I'm not the person saying the buses would be free; that would be this gentleman:

3 hours ago, Robert Spire said:

Eventually what is eventually going to happen IMO is that the entire local bus system will officially be made free. Look at the fare free promotions in Westchester, look at the 5 free pilot bus routes, look at how express buses are cashless and how pre pandemic MTA was going to evaluate local buses being cashless. If you think about it, most people who use MetroCards eventually use the subway system anyway and the MTA gets their money there. With free bus to subway transfers, the actual fare paid per ride has gone down considerably. If the MTA is going to switch everyone over to OMNY and have fare capping, which may even replace an unlimited ride option, while keeping free bus to subway transfers, and possibly not accepting coins on the local buses, might as well make the local system free at that point.

 

The moment all local buses become free, IMO that's the moment NYPD will crack down hard on subway fare evasion. 

 

Edited August 22, 2023 by B35 via Church

[Nitro]

6 minutes ago, B35 via Church said:

You're directing this at the wrong person... I'm not the person saying the buses would be free.... that would be this gentleman:

 

What about a B7 extension to Caesar's Bay Mall that wouldn't be too bad if it can run from Eastern Parkway

[Nitro]

2 hours ago, Robert Spire said:

If you tap with OMNY in the subway, you pay $2.90, you transfer to a bus, it's a free transfer. You purchase an unlimited ride because you have to use the subway anyways, bus transfers are included. Subways will have to have fare payment infrastructure no matter what, this is something recognized with how they've reimagined station agents. Fare evasion is also tied to crime in the subway system and a lot of anxiety about using transit stems from the subway system. OTOH with buses, we had several months of fare free local buses in 2020 and that glass ceiling has been broken, especially now with 5 free local routes and the Q70 being free. I mean, fare free local buses means less staff needed to deal with money and fares and less dwell time at bus stops. I can see how MTA decides trying to have fares on local buses is worth more trouble than they get in fares on local buses. 

Nothing is free bro. Taxpayers's dollars go to maintenance and the driver's salary. not some petty bs