R68ACTrain

1 hour ago, Stormxx said:

 

I think the base order should go to Pitkin, stay there for 1 year, and then move the base order to C.I when the R211T's come in

After R211 order is complete: [(doing all lines) if all options are purchased and the remainder of the order would be R211T]

 Rock - will be 100% R211. (475 cars) The 40 R179' s currently on the  would go to the .

- most current R68's in Coney would operate on the  Frank  and  lines.

- will be 50 50. (120 R179's and 120 Alstoms) The reason I do not think the Siemens should go onto the  is because the  would not need all 260 cars.

- 80 20. (Retire some R68's and bring 100 R160's from Jamaica in) The R211 order would finally be a chance for the  to get NTT's

-70 30. (400 R211T's and 200 R160's) The  really need open gangways, and once they get them, they will bump out some R160's to Concourse and Coney.

- R143, R160A-1, R179

- R143, R160A-1, R211A (32)

- 35 65 (75 R211A's, 175 R160's) In my books, all Broadway lines will be 100% NTT after the R46's are retired. When Astoria CBTC commences, the situation that is Astoria Blvd will be no more.

- 90 10 (150 R211's 20 R160's). 2nd Avenue subway will be 100% NTT after the 46's are retired. The 46's are a pain on the .

- 100% R160 (290 cars) The  would stay NTT because of QBL.

I rest my case.

 

 

 

This is lowkey good but there’s a few things I’d like to change. In my opinion, here’s the plan I have in mind

: R179, R160, R211A, have both lines from 600 feet, while the 8 Car R179s transfer to

: R211A, R211T, R160A/B Alstoms, all 260 R160B Siemens’ transfer to Coney Island, for  and  service, and have all OTT’s on the .
 

As for what you said with , there’ no need to retire perfectly great performing cars, instead just have those 100 R160s go to Pitkin or Coney Island.

 have extra R179s from the  , could potentially see R179  more.

 retire R46, receive R160B Siemens, maybe the extra 100 cars you said as well, and receive the R211As for  and  service,

17 hours ago, Stormxx said:

I think:

 would get 450 cars

 would get 200 cars. (Saying that C.I gets all Siemens back). If not, C.I should get 460 cars.

 would get some leftover R160's from Jamaica

 would get 32 cars (for the  but if they end up on the  I really don't care)

 would get 400 cars

 would get 200 Alstoms

 would get 100 R211's.

Now for number predictions.

These are if all options are exercised (at this point we are begging  to exercise). But now that Biden's in, Public Transport will get more money. So thats good.

R211A 4060-4499 (440)

R211T 3350-3369 (20) 

R211S 670-744 (75)

R211 option 1: 3370-4009 (640)

R211 Option 2: 4010-4059 (50), 4500-4854 (355), 4855-4886 (32)

Tell me which cars should go where!

For what? The  and  use the same cars, but what does the Shuttle need 100 for? It just needs about 15 cars

3 minutes ago, subwaycommuter1983 said:

My predictions are not based on preference and don't include the option orders. They are based on QBL and 8th Avenue CBTC, which will be completed before any other segments get CBTC and will require the A, C, E, F, M, R, to become 100% NTT'S. Therefore, Pitkin won't be able to keep the r46's.

The MTA spent a lot of money refurbishing the r160's with CBTC equipment. It doesn't make any sense for the r160's to be sent to Jamaica, just to be sent back to the NQW, where work on CBTC hasn't even begun and most likely be delayed due to budget issues. 

I am aware that many railfans are not happy with the NQW getting SMEE's, but where do you leave the AC riders who always been stuck with the oldest fleet in the system and it is not until recent years that NTT'S cover a portion of the AC fleet. Yes, thanks to 8th Avenue CBTC, the AC will finally be 100% NTT. Also, let's keep in mind that 10 years from now, the only be SMEE's left will be the garbage trains.

There wasn't any plan for the  and  to even get the R211s, because ridership isn't as high as QBL, which  is why the  and  get the base order, and displace the R160s. I'm personally not happy with it either, but it is what it is. It could be a indirect replacement by just putting those trains on the lines with higher ridership, and lines planned to get CBTC. Which are 8th Avenue, and progress on QBL has started. Which is why the 4-car R211s are only for the because CBTC is already on the line. This is why I'm saying just put the R160s that came from Coney Islad back to Coney Island because why have CBTC built cars o a line with no CBTC? It's pointless.

Another thing I've been wondering, it is likely R211s would run on the . What yard would the  be assigned to? Maybe Coney Island since it's gonna run with the ?

54 minutes ago, Stormxx said:

In the end, all R46's will be replaced. Why would the  waste money (when they are already suffering a financial crisis)? I think that the C.I R46's should stay where they are. When it is time, they will get replace by NTT's.

Waste money on what? On a new fleet they're trying to order for a fleet to replace approaching 50 years? And just like you said they're gonna have to go. But they definitely should be the first ones to go.

10 minutes ago, subwaycommuter1983 said:

If Pitkin can't transfer the r46's to CI, then those r46's will retire first.

The base order of r211's will be enough to make the A/C 100% NTT's and make the C and G full length, since the MTA is already working on 8th Avenue CBTC. Therefore, it is a huge priority for the A, C, E, F, M, R to be 100% NTT since QBL, Culver and 8th Avenue CBTC will be completed before any other segments gets CBTC.

These are 2 possible predictions for the base order of r211's:

1) A: r211A's, r179's

.  C : r211A's

    E: r160's, r211T's

    F: r160's

    G: r179's (8 car)

    M: r160's

    R: r160's

2) A: r211A's, r179's

    C : r160's (Siemens)

   E: r211's ( A's and T's)

   F: r160's

   G: r179's (8 car)

   M: r160's

   R: r160's

The option orders of r211's and the installation of CBTC on other segments of the subway are currently up in the air due to budget issues.

I don't like neither of those. It makes sense to have  the first R211s delivered to Jamaica especially the 211T's but that won't be for another 1.5-2.5 years.  Again here's my agenda.

: R211A, R160 > R46 (Supplemental to the R179s)

: R211A/T> R160B Siemens, (Supplemental to the R160A's, and B Alstoms)

: R160B Siemens, R211A> R46 (Supplemental to the R68/As)

: R68/A  + R160 

 After this happens, or if it does,

Rolling Stcok goes as follows:

Rock  : R160, R211A, R179 (Fully NTT in preparation for 8 Av CBTC.(

 : R160, R68/A

 : R160A/B Alstom, R211A/T (T for )

Frank : R68/A, R160B Siemens/Alstom, R211A ( for R68)

: R160A-1, R179, R143, R211A (R211 designated for )

34 minutes ago, JeremiahC99 said:

So there’s no extra capacity for 100 extra cars? Can’t some of the  fleet be stored at Jamaica Yard and some of the  fleet be stored at Coney Island Yard?

If you read carefully, "Yeah, but there must be a capacity." Where in this 7-word sentence said anything about there not being a capacity? And what the hell does any of the Eastern Division fleet need to be in the Southern Division for? That's like storing Jerome Av's R142/A/S', at Corona.

9 minutes ago, subwaycommuter1983 said:

I agree 100%. It doesn't make an sense to put the base order of r211A's on subway lines that won't get CBTC any time soon. If Pitkin's r46's are in better shape, then they can easily be transferred to CI and retire CI r46's.

Keep in mind that the base order of r211T's consists of 2 10 car trains, so most likely the E will get it, since it has huge ridership and it runs on both 8th Avenue and QBL.

As for the option orders, I won't make any predictions until it's 100% guaranteed that the MTA will purchase all option orders and work on installing CBTC on other segments of the subway have begun.

They technically are, but there's no need for them to go to CI because that yard most likely has last call for receiving these, and they will turn  out like Coney Island's in poor shape. It is seriously better for the R211s to go to Jamaica first. That way, the R160s are CBTC equipped, and ready for CBTC on Brighton, Sea Beach, Second Avenue, Broadway, etc, and could be displaced by the R211s going to Jamaica. Like I said above

1 hour ago, JeremiahC99 said:

It wouldn’t hurt adding an extra 96-100 cars to Fresh Pond/East New York’s roster as whole. After all, we could prop up the spare factor and do some increase in service.

Yeah, but there must be a capacity.

10 minutes ago, SimplyMyself said:

I actually agree with the R211s going to the  as long as it’s full length, although we’ll see if the  actually does that. As for the , why can’t it just be 100% full length. It’s already at 50% with the R46. When the R211s come, they should displace any four-car sets that are on the .

It's because I said that 207th should keep their 179s. And when they do come, where are the 4-car sets gonna go? ENY, and Fresh Pond yard combined have more than enough trains, beside the fact they have all R160A-1s which are 372, plus 212 R143s, and 96 R179s. They'll be fine without 207th's 179s, and ridership isn't as high as it was in January  2020, and least important thing to do is run the  full length when it has been running a mix of 480' and 600' feet trains since R44s were around.

25 minutes ago, Stormxx said:

Wherever the R46's are, the R211's will directly replace them. (aka ).

Anyways, my idea was they'd transfer all of the R179's on the  for  service. The Siemens from Jamaica will go to the . 260 R211T type cars would go to Jamaica to fill in. The 40 R179 cars on the  would go to coney. IF BOTH OPTIONS ARE EXERCISED, I think that the  should get ALL of the base order, and 60 more R211 extra cars. This is because the base order is mostly R211A. If the option order will be 100% R211T, the  should get first dibs. The  would get 450 cars, wiping out all of the R46's. So that leaves 772 extra cars. The 32 4 car variants would go to the  for extra service. That leaves 740 cars. If Jamaica would get 260 cars to replace the Siemens, we'd have 480 cars left. The rest of these cars would go to Jamaica, scattering around some leftover R160's. My first bet for these R160's would be  service. Maybe 250 cars to add extra service and to put some R68's to bed. That leaves 230 R160's. I think 40 cars should go to C.I. (in total that would be 470 NTT's for the . The last 190 R160's would go to the  to put the 's 68's to bed.

Not a fan of this. The R211s are better off to indirectly replace the R46s of the  and . Since August 17, 2006, Coney Island has been operating R160s since they debuted on the . It's better to keep the trains as is, but give R211s to the  because of the high ridership on those lines. If more 4 car sets are exercised, they're more than welcome to run the . Instead of doing all that R179 goes here this and that, how about we keep the train assignments as is, give CI  440 R211s, and give Coney Island  all Siemens'  and 180 Alstoms, or in that case 90 because Coney has 90 Alstoms. 

{FLEET}>{DISPLACEDFLEET}

Here's my agenda:

Rock   R211, R160 >R46, R179

 R160, R68/A

 R160, R211>R46, R68/A,  

: Share R211, R143, 160

 : R211>R160B Siemens, R160A/B Alstom

It is better off for 207th Street to keep their R179s, and have the  run full length with every fleet at Coney Island. No need to have R179s go to Coney Island foamers.

I’ve heard on some subway related discord servers that, the R211s are going to test on the ... and that half of them are delivered??? I pretty sure they’re due in April, so I’m confused as to how they’re allegedly two months early. 🤔 

14 hours ago, Maxwell179 said:

does anyone have an pictures of the R211 ?

They aren't allowed on this website, I had to change my pfp because I had a R211  as it. 

On 1/24/2021 at 2:28 PM, R32 3838 said:

we getting a total of 1,612 cars, with 1,537 of them being for the subway.

 

I do agree that we need to replace just about everything. No one understands the mental gymnastics that has to go through with car assignments to keep older subway cars off CBTC active areas. with them wanting to make Astoria CBTC with it ending at 57th/7th is only gonna make things more complicated.

 

this means the will be the only lines that would have to keep R68's (since 6th ave CBTC is put on hold) while the as well as the has to be 100% tech trains. and even then if something goes down on 6th ave, the is screwed or it has to go up broadway to 96th st now.

 

right now I think the priority is to to make the 100% tech. The 53rd st tube has its signals covered up. So if anything happens now, the or can't use 53rd st since their cars aren't cbtc active on top of using R46's.

 

 

I've always wondered, what happens if a SMEE goes on a CBTC activated signal?

1 hour ago, Stormxx said:

Here was my original plan: 

If both options are exercised and the R211T test goes well, the order would be mostly open gangway. We could see C.I getting the all of the R211A's and their siemens and some alstom units coming back. If C.I were to get 70% of their r160's back, then we could see about 1,200/1,662 cars returning. That would be enough for the . 

Now for the  , i think they should get about 400 cars of open gangway, and the r179's would be swapped out of Pitkin&207th st yard for service on the .

The  should get a lot of the r211T's. I'd say about 500 to be split. Plus, they'd also have 462 additional r160's to help out with service. Ridership is growing, and they REALLY need open gangways.

Ok, but the thing is that we're in a middle of a pandemic, and ridership isn't even half of what it used to be. 2022 is going to be the year the gangway tests will come aboard, but who knows how ridership is gonna be. Plus, Coney Island is seriously not a priority to get these, the  should just get their R160's back, if not all, most R160s Jamaica took, and give them the R211s. As for the  and , the R179 4-car should be swapped out, and receive alot of R211s, and only 5-car 211s because the  should be 600 feet, and operating R160A-2's, R160B's, 5-Car R179's, and 5 Car R211s. So basically, if Jamaica could afford to without having a shortage, they can give up some more R160s, or Coney Island could get a fair share, and send some R160s to 207th, and Pitkin for  and .

On 1/21/2021 at 11:30 AM, Stormxx said:

well, I mean, maybe. The the R160b's from Coney could go onto the  for service, while retiring the SMEE's on the . Any base order cars would be split between Pitkin and C.I, because the primary goal of the r211 order is to replace all remaining r46's. I agree with you that only 260 cars from Jamaica are enough to run the , so if we were to take that into consideration, i think 39% of the Siemens should go to service on the , and the remaining siemens should go to C.I for service on the . Any base order cars coming to coney should go directly to the , because the whole fleet is r46. Now, Jamaica should keep about 80% of its alstoms, and the other 20% should go to Coney. So, in total, the  would have 440 siemens and 200 alstom to run on the , plus some r68/a's. Now for the . If this were to happen, they would have let go about 60% of their r160s.  I think they should get all of option order 1, and a little of option 2. Any additional 4 car units or 5 car units, could go to ENY for the  or concourse for the . This is a prediction, not the truth.

Retiring the R46's, off the  R68's are doing really good right now, and they can stay another decade. Maybe 2. The R68's are just gonna be displaced off to another line.

On 1/20/2021 at 3:52 PM, Stormxx said:

We need 1K cars to replace the r46's. The r46's run on the .  If the mta doesnt have the funds to replace all the r46's, then why are the  saying that the base order will replace all R46's. If that's the case, the  will stick with their 160's and the  will get the new cars.

Honestly I said the same thing you said with Coney Island getting the R211s too, but I changed my mind, It make sense for the  to get their R160s back because they've been using them since they came out in 2006. When the R211s go to Jamaica, they could give up all Siemens' and some Alstoms, and send them to the  and Rockaway .  Now that the Democrats are in office, they can  definitely fund the MTA so therefore, all R46s could be retired

2 minutes ago, NBTA said:

I agree, I don't see the 68s leaving the  until it's time for them to retire, but...this is the MTA we talking about here.

The  is a Concourse, and West End Local, Sixth Avenue/Central Park West/Fourth Avenue express service operated by the MTA. The R68 is a 1986-88 subway car built  partly by Morrison-Knudsen, and Westinghouse operated by the MTA on the  Line. Concourse Yard is a subway yard used by  and  trains to store R68s, and R68As, also operated by MTA. I didn't say anything regarding any other transit agencies.

On 1/19/2021 at 8:49 PM, Vulturious said:

That is if there is enough for  trains to get R160's in the first place and if Concourse is willing to have a swap or not. The only way for  trains and also  trains to get NTTs is if 6 Av is getting CBTC right after 8 Av. The  has been changing their minds so often so we don't truly know which line is getting CBTC after or at least I do not know because of how often. As much as I would love for  trains to get some NTT's, their chances of getting them are much lower than the .

Concourse loves their 68s, I don't see any swaps between anyone and Concourse happening.

16 hours ago, Around the Horn said:

In my personal opinion I see 3400-4886 for the R211s when all is said and done with the R262s using 5201-6300 and then the 1000s vacated by the R62s they would be replacing. I could then see a R68/A replacement contract using the 2000s.

They might do the same thing with how they did the R62 order, R62 >> R262, R62A >> R262A, with few differences train system wise 🤷‍♂️. But the R211s should use the R32, R38, R40A/S/M, R42, and R44 numbers. 3348-4949. That is 1,501 cars. Which is close to the number of R211s if all options are exercised, just by 111 cars. But also in my opinion the R262s should use 1251-2495. The R62/A order combined was a total of 1,150, and the total for my 262 numbers, are 1,245 cars, which is the entire R62/A fleet, plus 75 extra cars.

5 hours ago, R32 3838 said:

option 1 is likely to be 4500-4999, 5201-5340 (These Numbers are open)

Also the open gangway cars could be different numbers all together.

Again, only 20 cars.

28 minutes ago, TheNewYorkElevated said:

My prediction for the B Division fleet once the R211s hit the property: 

-The Base Order will be reserved for the , , , ,  and  lines to retire the R46s for good. The ,  and  will also use some of the 211s as well alongside the R160s they have on hand at Jamaica, making them completely NTT lines. There could be a chance that the  and  might get the R211s to retire some R68s if the  wants to have the B Division fully modernized by the end of this decade, although the 68s will likely by retired by a new train car contract. The R32s currently on reserve are completely done for good. The , , ,  and  will receive the open gangway sets due to these lines having high ridership. 

-If the Option order is exercised, the ,  and even  lines will receive the four car sets. 

-R160s will be bumped out to service on the  and  trains more often. 

-R179s will more or less stay as is. 

As I said above, the R211T's will only be 20 cars. They mine as well run on different lines on different days because it's either that, or there's gonna be alot of fleet swaps when the R211s come in. No matter what, the R211s will have to be configured into 4 car sets.  What I think should happen is lists as follows:

The first 535 cars should go to Coney Island because the R46s over there are not doing as well as the R46s at 207th and Pitkin. Pretty much every line over there is gonna use them.

Though the  and  need them because they operate R46s. After those R46s are gone, the next lines to receive the R211s are the  and Rockaway . After CBTC is completely installed on QBL, or when all R46s are retired, then the  and those few 's stored there. Jamaica is not a priority for the R211s because all 3 lines are full NTT. 

And when the 4-car 211s start to arrive, if the  doesn't operate 600ft trains, then that, the  and  could use the 4-car 211s, depending on how many are being built. But, again ENY is not a priority because no R32s are there, and they have all R160A-1s which is 372 cars. Plus 200 R143s, AND 100  R179s. ENY's fleet in total is 672 cars. Then again, depending on how many extra's are available is the  still operates 480ft's, then the rest can go to ENY. 

Regarding your R160 comment for the  and , I disagree with that because why give them more trains when the old ones are being phased out, and new ones are coming in. But I'm pretty sure the R211s, and R179's would be fine by themselves, or transfer all R179's to 207, and the 4-car R211s could all go ENY.

I just need everyone to be aware that the R211T's will only be 20 cars, because the Kawasaki website only says 20, and that is that. It just make sense for both trainsets to be assigned to one yard, for one line. And imo, that should be assigned to the Jamaica Yard. The  is the IND's most busiest line, and is on the top 4 busiest lines systemwide. It would be conveinent to put the R211T's on the busiest line of the system. But we never know, they might assign to Pitkin, 207, Coney Island, or maybe even Concourse. 

On 1/19/2021 at 3:18 PM, R32 3838 said:

This Was said by that's why the B end of the cars are configured the way they are. Just look at how they there no seats and a hump on both sides.

 

A good chunk of those r160's are going back. And it wouldn't be a waste of time, CBTC Training isn't a waste of time. by the time the option order cars come in, it'll be time to swap those r160's back to ether CI or somewhere else.

 

From the way it looks like, Pitkin, Jamaica and Coney Island will get these cars ENY will get the 8 car units for the

 

5001-5480 is open as well, I could see them use 5001-5480 as well

they can use 5481-5664 once all the r46's are completely gone

 

I keep telling you guys, Jamaica will get a piece of this order.

 

open gangways is the obvious reason, are two lines that they're focused on getting those cars to. this is why I think Jamaica would get the r211T while the r211A's would be split between pitkin and coney (Base order) The could see the open gangway cars as well.

 

Also it's smart to make the 100% tech first vs. the CI lines because of upcoming CBTC plus if anything goes down on 8th ave, they can use 53rd st, (currently they can't now since its CBTC active now)

Wait hold up, why would 5001-5200 be open? I feel that the R211s would use R32-R42 numbers only. And be aware that only 20 R211T's would be made, and that's only 4 5-car sets, I see comments about them running on the , now I see this one about the now. They mine as well make the R211Ts maybe like 400 cars or sum like that. But the R211s aren't even designated to replace the R68/As so 5001-5200 is not open. If anything, they could use the NYCT R44 numbers.

On 10/7/2020 at 9:56 PM, LaGuardia Link N Tra said:

This may sound a bit silly, but would it be ideal to swap the and  route designations to keep some sort of familiaraity amongst riders?

To get an idea of what I'm saying is to have the following:

- ,  and  serve 4th Avenue

- Yellow  and  aling Brighton

 

What is the point of the having the  on Brighton? There's already a service on Brighton to Broadway, while there's going to need one on 4th Avenue.