GreatOne2k

I'm questioning having a super express variant of an express route that's being extended to an area where we don't really know the usage levels with which it'll obtain..... In other words, the issue I'm raising, is the necessity of a "BxM5" of sorts, period - It's enough that the BxM4 would run up to yonkers raceway....

 

Your plan entails having a:

- BxM4 extension to yonkers raceway (which you, I, and BM5 agree should happen)....

- BxM5, which would resemble an extended (old) BxM4b super express to yonkers raceway (or cross county)....

 

I'm not concerned about any alternatives for a BxM5 of sorts.... My concern is garnering a consistent, large enough, steady riderbase for an extended BxM4 that would terminate by the raceway.... If that would exceed expectations & current BxM4 Woodlawn riders continue to utilize their route during the rush the way they do, then I'll start considering the plausibility of a BxM5 (which would be a super express version of the extended BxM4).....

 

Your plan is too ambitious; you seem to be putting the cart before the horse here....

The BxM5 is also a way for buses to avoid using McLean (which is what a BxM4 extension would have to do)

There are several options here

Option 1

BxM4 to Yonkers Raceway via Woodlawn

Option 2

BxM4 to Woodlawn

BxM5 to Yonkers Raceway (using the straight W20 route and avoiding McLean)

Option 3 (could be implemented later on depending upon ridership)

BxM4 to Yonkers Raceway via Woodlawn

BxM5 to Yonkers Raceway (or Cross County) via Woodlawn (Super Express)

The question becomes would it be better to extend the BxM4 (using McLean), or splitting the route up with a BxM5? The BxM5 is supposed to make the ride a bit more attractive to Yonkers rather than going through the whole BxM4 route. The BxM5 (either version) would also give reverse commuters to the casino a quicker ride as well.

Rob Astorino was in discussions with Jay Walder at one time to extend the BxM4(B) to Westchester, problem was, riders wanted the route extended to Greenburgh..

http://www.nyctransitforums.com/forums/topic/18219-express-bus-bxm4b-extension-to-yonkers-discussed/

http://www.subchat.com/buschat/read.asp?Id=193490

Cross county I don't agree with; that's pushing it too far....

 

I'll only speak on Yonkers Raceway..... Although I (still) don't agree that such an extension should utilize McLean av (for reasons I already explained to BM5 Woodhaven), we can't talk seriously talk about a super express (running b/w Yonkers & Woodlawn, then straight to Manhattan) because it's not that apparent that a BxM4 extension to Yonkers would get that much ridership..... We have to focus on getting (well, discerning) the Westchester usage b/w Katonah/242nd & the raceway first....

 

* Lol @ "Woodlawn Heights" btw; that was a real estate ploy to try to get more people to move to the area.... That whole area is just Woodlawn.

The only other alternative for a BxM5 would be for it to skip Katonah Avenue and go straight up Jerome via the W20 route to get to Yonkers. MTA would have to first extend the BxM4 via McLean, then "split" the route in two be making the Yonkers extension a straight BxM5, while the BxM4 would revert back to its current route. Whether or not the BxM5 should skip lower Grand Concourse stops (or make any at all) is another issue.

Why not make a BxM5 (at least rush hours) that starts at Yonkers Raceway (or Cross County as Park and Ride), then McLean Av, then Woodlawn Heights, then via the old BxM4B Super Express routing to Manhattan. The BxM4 will run from Yonkers Raceway into it's current routing via the Grand Concourse.

Would the BxM8 be better off eliminating the Crosby Avenue stop in favor of staying on Bruckner Boulevard until Pelham Bay? This would speed up the ride and allow for more City Island ridership. City Island service could be expanded on weekdays and on summer weekends at least, maybe later becoming a full time extension.

I don't see what one has to do with the other...?!??? Let Westchester take that on. The Bx7 would only become more delayed and bunch even more than it already does. There is a reason that the M100 was cut back from serving Riverdale...

Bx7 or Bx10 to Yonkers would be "serving new markets" (and would give that area bus service on Sundays, Thanksgiving, and Christmas). A Bx10 extension would give Yonkers 24/7 service immediately. A Bx9 extension to Yonkers would only help Yonkers late nights and certain holidays where Bee Line doesn't operate. Bx20 to Yonkers would be a good test case though since it is only rush hours only (still doesn't help during Sundays, Thanksgiving, and Christmas though).

Some Bx7 buses can short turn. Either run from Yonkers to 231 St, or from 168 St to 263 St

A W8 extension to 231 St is also something that could be looked at, along with Sunday service.

Instead of running the Bx7 overnight, just extend it to Ludlow MNR (MTA's original plan), or Getty Square.

The Bx23 or Q50 should run overnight before the Bx7 does.

The Bx5 could be rerouted this way

1. N/B

 Right on Brush Avenue, left on Lafayette Avenue, left on East Tremont Avenue, right on Bruckner Boulevard (would have a stop right next to the Lafayette Avenue entrance)

or

Right on Hutchinson River Parkway (Q44 routing), left on Lafayette Avenue, left on East Tremont Avenue, right on Bruckner Boulevard

S/B

Left on East Tremont Avenue, right on Lafayette Avenue, right on Brush Avenue, left on Bruckner Boulevard.

2. Extend daytime White Plains Road trips to the mall and create a Bx5A which will do follow the Q44 until Lafayette Avenue and terminate there, it will then make a right turn and start service by Monsignor Scanlan to go back to Hunts Point. The Q50 will connect the Bx5A passengers to/from Pelham Bay with a three legged transfer.

Bx5 to Pelham Bay will remain the same.

3. Reroute Bx5 one of the ways shown in #1, but also extend the White Plains Road short turns as shown in #2. All short turns would service the mall (until around 11pm at least), Q50 can be used to transfer to the Bx5 at Pelham Bay, or the Throggs Neck Shopping Center

The Bx5 (White Plains Road) and Bx39 (full route) should run overnight. Bx5 (Pelham Bay) should run at least until 11pm-12am

MTA should either add another Bx12 SBS leaving Bay Plaza at 10:12pm, or have an extended local Bx12 start at Bay Plaza at 10:09pm, the 24 minute gap in service between the last SBS and first local on weekdays (at Bay Plaza) is longer than the 15 minute waits that happen later on.

The 10:18pm bus starting at Pelham Bay Park goes to Inwood 207 St, so that bus could start from Bay Plaza to plug the 24 minute gap. Even on Sundays there is a local shortly after the last SBS leaves Bay Plaza.

And no on extending the onto the Queens Blvd Line, bringing back the and reverting the back to its pre-July 2010 route. The current route is more popular than the old one was and is going to be extended to Essex St on weekends, eliminating the need to transfer to the at Myrtle for Manhattan service. If it was still running the old route, you'd never see this happen. Why would you want to mess with that?

 

 

The weekend was going to be extended to Chambers before budget problems

did at one point run 7 days on CPW even running later than the , even after midnight. Full West End shuttle service (in both directions) didn't happen until after 2am.

They should resend the B to 21st St sometimes or at least have it run on weekends again

That would cause problems with the which runs through there

Eh, no point in extending the night to/from Bowling Green. The already runs local entirely at night anyway. That single one seat ride to/from Fulton Street, Wall Street and Bowling Green still exists.

Not for those north of 125 St, also it reduces the waiting time for those using the transfer at Fulton and the Staten Island Ferry.

service extended until 9:10pm from Brooklyn Bridge City Hall

service extended :

Weekdays from Dyre to Bowling Green until 10:26pm, from Bowling Green until 11:35pm,

Saturdays from Dyre to Bowling Green until 10:21pm, from Bowling Green until 11:30pm,

Sundays from Dyre to Bowling Green until 9:57pm, from Bowling Green until 11:05pm

Well this is going somewhere unpleasant.

 

Anyway, to BPK all day is a decent enough and implementable idea, the real issue would be expense.

Some expenses offset by the running express all day.

Midday and evening could run to 167 St, Tremont Av, or Fordham Rd as well

Trains between 3 Av - 149 St and E 180 St N/B weekday mornings, trains in bold run express

2 241ST ST-WAKEFIELD          09:12 AM     09:24 AM
5 DYRE AV-EASTCHESTER     09:13 AM     09:26 AM
5 E 180TH ST                           09:17 AM     09:26 AM
2 241ST ST-WAKEFIELD          09:19 AM     09:31 AM
5 DYRE AV-EASTCHESTER     09:22 AM     09:34 AM
2 241ST ST-WAKEFIELD          09:25 AM     09:37 AM
5 DYRE AV-EASTCHESTER     09:28 AM     09:41 AM
5 E 180TH ST                           09:33 AM     09:42 AM
2 241ST ST-WAKEFIELD          09:36 AM     09:48 AM
5 DYRE AV-EASTCHESTER     09:37 AM     09:50 AM
2 241ST ST-WAKEFIELD          09:39 AM     09:52 AM
5 E 180TH ST                            09:42 AM     09:51 AM
2 241ST ST-WAKEFIELD          09:44 AM     09:57 AM
5 DYRE AV-EASTCHESTER     09:46 AM     09:58 AM
5 DYRE AV-EASTCHESTER     09:48 AM     10:01 AM
2 241ST ST-WAKEFIELD          09:53 AM     10:05 AM
5 DYRE AV-EASTCHESTER     09:54 AM     10:07 AM
2 238TH ST-NEREID AV            09:56 AM     10:11 AM
5 241ST ST-WAKEFIELD         09:58 AM     10:09 AM
5 DYRE AV-EASTCHESTER     10:00 AM     10:12 AM
2 241ST ST-WAKEFIELD         10:02 AM     10:14 AM
2 241ST ST-WAKEFIELD         10:08 AM     10:20 AM
5 DYRE AV-EASTCHESTER     10:09 AM     10:22 AM
5 E 180TH ST                           10:11 AM     10:20 AM
5 DYRE AV-EASTCHESTER     10:15 AM     10:28 AM
2 241ST ST-WAKEFIELD          10:17 AM     10:30 AM
5 241ST ST-WAKEFIELD          10:20 AM    10:29 AM

It's not that surprising to see a running to 241 St, especially if something's holding up the trains somewhere along the line.

 

If you mean via White Plains Rd, then no, all AAS options to 241 St are local in the Bronx.

The to 241 St is regularly scheduled, there are 2 trips leaving Bowling Green at 9:27am, and 9:50am, they run express in the Bronx, then local north of E 180 St

There used to be a reverse peak to 238 in the morning. The 241 St trains seem to run express along with the E 180 St trains. Is there a program for express to 241 St?

When the Bx15 LTD schedule was created, they didn't initially have those short turns, MTA added those buses in later, so they didn't change the buses which were originally local to LIMITED southbound.

The northbound schedule at one point had LTD service ending even earlier, MTA added in those short turn local trips and extended northbound LIMITED stop service. 

Suggested changes

Bx15 S/B
weekdays

Change 4:15am Bx15 to 4:20am Bx15 to keep an even 20 minute headway

Change 6:56pm Bx15 to 6:56pm Bx15 LTD two Bx15 buses are scheduled to leave at this time

Change 7:06pm Bx15 to 7:06pm Bx15 LTD two Bx15 buses are scheduled to leave at this time

Change 7:16pm Bx15 to 7:16pm Bx15 LTD another Bx15 bus is scheduled to leave at 7:18pm

Change 7:26pm Bx15 to 7:26pm Bx15 LTD another Bx15 bus is scheduled to leave at 7:30pm

Saturday

Add 4:20am bus to 149 St to maintain the 20 minute headway to replace the Bx55 and the (8) train

Add 4:40am bus to 149 St to maintain the 20 minute headway to replace the Bx55 and the (8) train

Change 5:30am bus to 5:20am bus to maintain 20 minute headway

Change 5:45am bus to 5:40am bus to maintain 20 minute headway

Sunday

Change 4:25am bus to 4:20am bus to maintain 20 minute headway

Add 4:40am bus to maintain the 20 minute headway to replace the Bx55 and the (8) train

Add 5:20am bus to maintain the 20 minute headway to replace the Bx55 and the (8) train

Change 5:30am bus to 5:35am bus to begin a 15 minute headway

Bx15 N/B

weekdays

Add 4:53am bus from 149 St to Fordham Plaza to maintain the average 20 minute headway to replace the Bx55 and the (8) train

Change 7:47pm Bx15 bus from 12 Av to Fordham Plaza to Bx15 LTD

Saturday

Add 4:53am bus from 149 St to Fordham Plaza to maintain the average 20 minute headway to replace the Bx55 and the (8) train

Add 5:13am bus from 149 St to Fordham Plaza to maintain the average 20 minute headway to replace the Bx55 and the (8) train

Sunday

Change 4:02am bus from 149 St to Fordham Plaza to 4:12am bus to maintain a 20 minute headway

Add 4:52am bus from 149 St to Fordham Plaza to maintain the 20 minute headway to replace the Bx55 and the (8) train

Add 5:12am bus from 149 St to Fordham Plaza, eliminate 5:35am bus from 149 St to Fordham Plaza

Change 4:57am bus from 12 Av to Fordham Plaza 5:07am bus, this will maintain a continuous 20 minute headway north of 149 St

Bx39 S/B

Sunday

Add 11:20pm trip from 241 St to Clason Point (Sunday S/B service currently ends too early), next trips would be shuttles to Gun Hill Road at 30-35 minute headways 11:50pm, 12:25am, 1:00am

Bx31 to Castle Hill Park would be a good way to fill in a gap on Zerega Avenue (and Commerce Avenue). It would also relieve crowding on the Bx22.

Q44 (Bronx section): There are significant problems with bus bunching on this route. 

It will get worse in the next few years

Target, TJ Maxx, Applebee's, Petco, MetroOptics, Bev Max, Famous Footwear, Paragon Outlet Mall (2015), Ferry Point Golf Course (2015).

http://www.bxtimes.com/stories/2013/26/26_traff_2013_06_28_bx.html

http://www.ripcony.com/services/property-managers

The proposed shuttle bus connecting the malls would be a great idea though.

Run the BX16 overnight on 50-60 minute headways. Do not run the BX39 overnight (it almost exactly mirrors the #2 train overnight and thus serves no real purpose).

 

Fewer stops on the BX31, particularly the Edenwald area and immediately north of Pelham Parkway on Eastchester Rd.

Bx39 overnight is interlined with Bx41 service. The late night Bx41 could be extended to 241 St in place of the Bx39.

Bx39 should run overnight between Clason Pt and Pelham Pkwy (or the full Bx39 should run until 12:00am s/b and 1:05am n/b 7 days a week)

BxM8 should be extended to City Island summer weekends to promote tourism. In the same way the BxM4 extension to Empire City can help tourism (though it may not reduce W20 ridership much since many of those people may want a cheaper option). BxM4 may attract a different crowd (and some of the former off peak 4C riders).

Connections with MNRR would not do a single thing for demand.

 

Besides the Bronx Zoo and maybe Yankee Stadium, there is literally nothing in the Bronx for Eastern Queens residents that aren't already available in Queens or Brooklyn. Heck, why would they go to the Bronx when it's so much easier to go to Manhattan, which has basically everything?

Other possible places: Orchard Beach, New York Botanical Garden, City Island

Example of Queens to Orchard Beach travel

http://www.tripadvisor.com/ShowTopic-g60763-i5-k2067382-Jackson_Hts_to_Orchard_Beach_sans_Manhattan-New_York_City_New_York.html

SubwayTime somehow never shows New Lots, always Utica (or in some cases Bowling Green service starts earlier)

Unless the  < 1 > runs limited service like the running every 15 minutes