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Trainmaster5

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Trainmaster5 last won the day on December 21 2018

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About Trainmaster5

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  1. CBTC failures are network communication errors. They would like to downplay the problem by throwing a little word salad into the mix.
  2. Let me add my two cents to the discussion. This past January marked 50 years that my friend and I entered the Utica Avenue Second System station as provisional RR Porters. Our tour guide that day was a Station Supervisor who, as a longtime Brooklynite, was depressed because that shell had lain unfinished for so long. He's probably passed on by now but my friend and I have taken his place. We passed by a few months ago and after the station rehab we had to figure out how to even gain entry to the shell. Whether it's an IRT or an IND line being proposed our guess is it won't happen in the next 30 years or so. I'm not disputing the need for a line but whether the City of New York or the MTA would ever prioritize or be able to fund such a project. Look at the SAS,the Archer Avenue debacle, or the vanished Third Avenue El and I'd say that anyone optimistic about this project happening is a good candidate for a drug test. Just my opinion. Carry on.
  3. AKA " flashing your motors ". Loved to do this in a yard next to an apartment building or complex. Nothing like setting off sparks in the nighttime when the kids were supposedly asleep.😊
  4. Finally a voice of reason is heard from. The bondholders and the bookkeepers are the powers behind the throne and always have been. Go back to the Board of Transportation, the NYCTA, and now the MTA and its apparent that any improvements only come about when the financial institutions say so. The Governor, or Mayor, is only the public face. Same thing applies to the PANY&NJ. I remember walking around Livonia Yard and , IIRC, the R62a cars were stamped " purchased by the PA " or words to that effect. That agency had the financial resources to make the purchase. I'm old enough to remember when Governor Rockefeller went to war with Robert Moses about the TBTA and the toll money the Governor pulled out the biggest weapon in his arsenal, his brother David, who ran the Chase Manhattan Bank. Moses was permanently neutered from that day forward. Look no further than the bs curve at the north end of SAS phase 2. It was put there to get the northern MTA board members something so they would buy into the SAS picture. I'd bet that Stevie Wonder could see the obvious need for the SAS to continue due north straight into the Bronx Like you rightly pointed out decisions made by people who might as well live in Topeka, Kansas as far as their knowledge of local transportation issues go. The Governor is the public face but the money folk run the show. He's an easy target but that's why the agency was created in the first place. Follow the money trail the bondholders and real estate interests are looking at and then you'll find who runs the MTA. Carry on.
  5. I don't think that the IRT would have traveled very far directly up Lafayette considering that the BMT Myrtle and Lexington Els surround Lafayette up to Broadway. Just my opinion. Carry on.
  6. I must be missing something with your proposal to extend the B59LTD to Utica-Eastern Parkway. Empire and Flatbush is the , stop, right? Empire and Nostrand gives you the , Sterling St. stop. There’s no reason for you to send a bus to the Crown Heights Utica station for a connection AFAIC. Carry on.
  7. They were located at the south end of station and closed probably around the early seventies IIRC. Security probably played a part as well as maintenance. The next station north on the WPR line at Third Avenue had an underpass connecting both sides that was sealed after the Third Avenue El ceased service. I’m gonna guess security was one of the reasons given at that time also. BTW security and maintenance was the excuse for closing the overpass downstairs at Grand Concourse.
  8. Look at today’s train route from Downtown Brooklyn for a general idea about Lafayette service.
  9. @RR503 At 142nd St Junction trains were scheduled as N/B and S/B trains passing each other at the same time and the same thing for service. When we ran the shuttle train it would arrive at 135th St. before the , relay south of the station and proceed north back into 135 middle. We would wait for a N/B to leave , then proceed north and make a reverse move back into the northbound platform and pick up passengers and head back to Lenox Terminal. There was a time when the s/b was delayed at Allerton Avenue in the Bronx by a skating rink crowd and we operated the shuttle down to 96th St so riders could catch the . At the time the shuttle train was only 4 cars and we only opened up one car for service so you could imagine the load. I heard that the four car shuttle actually went down to Times Square one Saturday night. What I’m trying to point out is that there are schedules but good dispatching can overcome the unforeseen circumstances. Carry on.
  10. Happened to touch base with some real old timers recently and brought up the problems that still plague the subway system to this day. I'm relaying this as the rookie of the group. I was wrong about the 10 car trains coming out of New Lots in the morning back in the prehistoric era of the 1980's. We seem to agree that the 10 car trains leaving the terminal were not equipment but rather a combination of , , and trains, yard put ins that Operations and Planning added to the schedule to smooth over the complaints of short trains when the and swapped Brooklyn terminals. The first interval was a which left at 5:50 or so, Two number trains, plus two trains which ran light ( not in service ) to Flatbush Avenue and represented the first two Flatbush-Lex trains daily. They would relay at Nostrand Junction and wrong-rail into President St and cross over to the s/b track south of President. There were two or three put ins and that 7:48 train I mentioned which was scheduled to arrive at East 180th St at 9:02 and terminate. When I worked that particular interval I'd usually continue up to Dyre in service, depending on their service needs up there or if we'd have a G.O. scheduled up there. The folks I talked to were working road jobs in the early '80's but by the middle of the decade they were working yard jobs at Livonia, Lenox, or relay jobs at Utica Avenue IRT. They, like myself, were taught by instructors with a different mind-set, which is why most of us aren't impressed with the so-called NTT. We come from the school where signals, track, and power distribution were held in higher regard than anything Car Equipment could provide. We IRT guys were tasked with operating cars dating back to R12s while the other guys were pushing R10s and some of both groups were qualified on Lo-Vs but never operated them in regular passenger service. I was also reminded that Lenox did run 10 car equipment, albeit for one day. The day was July 4, 1986 and the ran 9 car R62A equipment supplemented by 10 car R62 equipment transferred from Mosholu Yard for that day. I was working OT on the that day and remembered the radio chatter from different train crews. Let's just say it's dangerous when you make a 9 car stop with a 10 car train. They had to call in motor instructors from all over to warn the crews at Lenox to check the consist before leaving the terminal. It was a celebration of the Statue of Liberty's centennial with Tall Ships on display in New York Harbor. I don't know how the operated that day but the operated from VC to Rector in service, light around the ferry, and back in service n/b at Rector. I recall that there was a supplementary schedule for the but when the festivities were coming to a halt there were supervisors at Rector St n/b who told us when to pull into the station, when to open the doors and when to depart. When my C/R and I got the go ahead to head north we were already supposed to be at VC and off the clock. He was on the extra list but I was working an RDO that started at 5 pm. When I got to VC at 4:30 or so I was told by the union that I, being a Utility list guy and not an extra list person, was erroneously forced to work on my day off. I had the option to go home but at 5pm, and living in Brooklyn and traveling by train I'd missed every BBQ I could have attended. That was the only time I worked my day off in my whole career and I've never forgotten it. Those old timers still laugh at what happened to me that day. To make matters worse when I got back to VC the midnight dispatcher was calling for a M/M to make his scheduled last trip when I got to the office to turn in my OT slip. I knew who he was looking for and I informed him that M/M B was probably approaching Dyckman St. The crew office and O&P had taken all of the station switchmen and given them road jobs for that one day so there was nobody available to lay up trains and he had two trains in the station. Dude asked me to make an extra trip and it took every bit of patience I had to avoid cursing him out. I told him I'd do him a favor and lay up a train to the yard to avoid killing him. I did so and when I got back and turned in my OT slip the dispatcher started blubbering out an apology when he saw how much I made for the day. To this day my buddies and I, RTO, Surface, and CED, profess our love for our co-workers, hourly and local supervision, but look upon the monolith that claims to run the agency with utter contempt. We ask ourselves how a Brooklyn IRT crew or a BMT South can traverse Nostrand Junction or Dekalb relatively on time back then compared to today's trains which are routinely late on both corridors while having newer equipment. We, too, had days where everything went wrong but it seems to happen more now than when us IRT guys had trains that couldn't climb the Joralemon tubes or smoked or caught fire somewhere enroute. Of course the conditions for riders and workers were much different back then. Most people wanted to get where they were going in a safe and timely manner. Didn't matter what type of subway car or bus showed up either. I, personally, don't care what type of train shows up if I have to be at my destination at a particular time. I talk with my friends and family and I'm wondering what's going on in all of the departments. Seems to be a bunch of incompetent people throughout the who outnumber those who do know how to provide service. From the Prince on down. What are the odds on the Prince straightening out the Brooklyn IRT, DeKalb, or speeding up service on CPW ? Sorry for the long rant. Maybe this belongs in Random Thoughts ? Carry on.
  11. I think the /s was obvious, at least to me. That’s my take anyway.
  12. You're probably correct on the dates. I still think the R62A cars were joined in 5 car link bar consists before 2000 because that's when Livonia yard had to be reset to allow only 10 car trains to be laid up. The tracks at Livonia stored 10 car ,and , trains overnights prior to that while the line was primarily housed at Lenox Yard. Thanks for the correction. Carry on.
  13. Think you're mistaken about the train consists. When the and swapped Brooklyn terminals the New Lots line ended up with the newer R62A cars but within a year the consist length was increased. The AM ridership noticed that their trains were standing room only leaving Saratoga heading toward Utica so two changes were made. The trains became 10 cars and a few extra Lexington Avenue trains were added to the AM Livonia line at the same time. That started around the time MK was rehabbing our fleet and turning out Redbirds. That 7:48/ 7:50 New Lots to East 180th St was a favorite of my neighbors and my bank account !!!. We used to call trips like that " specials " and guys would complain when they couldn't work those jobs. The trains were originally graffiti covered consists running between New Lots and Grand Concourse and returning to Brooklyn to lay up on the Eastern Parkway line between Atlantic and Utica Avenues on the n/b express tracks. It was rare to see a Redbird enter New Lots station from the yard in the morning and the riders recognized the train when they saw it on the yard lead while walking to the station. It's things like that type of service which make it hard for me to compare service levels in different eras with those who didn't either live there or work in RTO back then. Just trying to clarify things somewhat. Carry on.
  14. T@RR503, @Lex, I get both sides of the dilemma but let me throw some of my observations into the pot. Lex accurately described the function of the line from the time the WPR was connected to the existing IRT West Side subway. The went from being the Seventh Avenue local to South Ferry to become a full fledged Brooklyn service. I don’t remember when the became the New Lots mainstay because when I was a child in Brownsville the to Dyre was the Livonia line. When I moved to Flatbush in ‘61 the was the Nostrand line mainstay with a variety of different equipment in a 9 car consist. When I became a C/R and when I moved to M/M I broke in on 9 car trains on the .That’s why I take issue with some of the numbers quoted, especially if they come from the itself. I remember correcting a young RTO supervisor when he gave a critique at East 180th one day when he constantly spoke about the Dyre Avenue line and terminal. Young man didn’t realize that East 180th or 239th-241st was where line crews signed on daily with the dispatchers and Dyre only had an ATD part time. Those were the terminal stations. Crew changes were made at East 180. I’d like to know where those 10 car numbers for Seventh Avenue service came from when 9 car Seventh Avenue service was originating at Flatbush for at least part of that time. Maybe that’s including the older Broadway-Seventh Avenue service from VC ? My other question concerns Shuttle service in Brooklyn if we build a Utica line . 3 trunks with different demographics.. People clustered above the Nostrand line all the way to Flatbush. Large developments surrounding the Livonia line. Utica Avenue with a lower density immediately along the street, especially south of Tilden- Avenue D, but a much greater potential catchment area the further south you go after factoring in the transfer opportunities. Anyone care to take a stab at my observations? No harm intended and I can take criticism. Carry on.
  15. It never ceases to amaze me when I read these doomsday scenarios about the Brooklyn IRT. Some posters are much younger than myself so I can excuse them. I must correct a misconception about service levels. The Seventh Avenue trains were the Brooklyn locals when my generation and the one before that grew up. There were more riders back then, 1940- 1980 or so and they ran more trains. The Lexington WPR terminated at Utica M-F rush hours while the Lexington-Jerome went to Flatbush during the rush hours and both terminated at Atlantic midday. No ATS, no CBTC, just tower operators manually throwing switches at Nostrand Junction and the towers located at Utica. You're probably wondering why I said " more " trains. Simple. Two five car trains had the same capacity as today's ten car consists and the operating practices were very different than they are today. Woodlawn trains only served Utica Saturday and Sunday midday when the Lenox locals ran to Flatbush. If any variant of this so-called proposal comes to pass I've only seen one poster in this thread that clearly sees the likely outcome. Less service in total. Does anyone believe that the MTA will run 3 services 24/7 across the Junction? For those who say rebuild the Junction I can only say your idea may be 100% correct but it will never happen because of the impact it would have on the immediate Crown Heights neighborhood and those neighborhoods south and east of Eastern Parkway. Just my opinion. Carry on.

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