Outer boro transit dreams: A wishlist of service improvements

[Union Tpke]

A question, which candidate for governor would be better for the MTA.

[bobtehpanda]

Yeah well the governor is running a tight ship.  It's not as if the state has TONS of money just laying around.  The State has to make do with what it has and so does the .  New Yorkers pay some of the highest taxes in the country, and Cuomo certainly understands that you can't keep asking taxpayers to pay more and more via taxes.  It's bad for business and bad for the economy, and as far as taxpayers and the goes, we are taxed multiple times for the same services.  A surcharge for the on our cell phone bills, a surcharge when we ride taxis that goes to the . Then there's the money that goes to the from the bridges and tolls.  For what it's worth, taxpayers in New York subsidize the system considerably, far more than most other cities.  Asking Albany to provide more to the would simply mean higher taxes for New Yokers, one way or another.

 

That's not actually true. In most cities, farebox recovery ratios of 30-40% are common. For the MTA, that figure hovers around 60-70%, and is even higher for just subway and bus services.

 

The State has slashed funding for the MTA since the '80s, stolen from the MTA budget to massage state pension deficits, and refused to allocate money to Capital Plans. And that's before we have things like the City not paying nearly enough for student Metrocards and other ways the MTA gets shortchanged by the various levels of government.

The biggest problem here is the fact that the federal goverment isnt investing into the MTA enough because of deadbeat White House administrations and a divided US Congress that doesnt know their heads from their asses. Pretty much. The federal goverment is known to be incredibly biased where it pertains to specifically New York City transortation needs.

 

However the Albany assemblymen also are known to be just as biased to the needs of public transportation. Its becoming a broken system.

 

If it wasnt for this then the MTA would really be 'going your way'.

 

To be fairly honest, it's not entirely unreasonable for feds to not want to give the region money, particularly when a certain Republican governor killed decades worth of planning for what was the largest federally funded rail project in the nation's history.

[CenSin]

For what it's worth, taxpayers in New York subsidize the system considerably, far more than most other cities.

Quoting from Second Avenue Sagas:

As Business Week explored recently, the Port Authority’s PATH system is woefully inefficient. PATH, noted the magazine, is more expensive than any comparable system and shouldn’t even be compared to Transit’s subway network. According to recent studies, the per-passenger cost of a PATH ride to Port Authority is $8.45, and the average fare of just under $2 doesn’t even cover a quarter of these costs. The New York City subway on the other hand relies on subsidies of around $1.11.

 

And particularly damning is another quote (which is itself quoted from CAPITAL):

when you look at the numbers, New York State actually ranks last in the country in the subsidy-per-rider that they provide. You can look at what they do in Massachusetts for the T or what they do for Metro in Washington or MARTA in Atlanta. Those states give more money per rider than in New York State. New York State shouldn’t be last in anything. It should be first.

So not only are we the least subsidized in this nation, but right in our own back yard is a subway system that gets nearly 7 to 8 times more in subsidies! That should show you where we stand.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Quoting from Second Avenue Sagas:

 

And particularly damning is another quote (which is itself quoted from CAPITAL):

 

So not only are we the least subsidized in this nation, but right in our own back yard is a subway system that gets nearly 7 to 8 times more in subsidies! That should show you where we stand.

 

 

That's not actually true. In most cities, farebox recovery ratios of 30-40% are common. For the MTA, that figure hovers around 60-70%, and is even higher for just subway and bus services.

 

The State has slashed funding for the MTA since the '80s, stolen from the MTA budget to massage state pension deficits, and refused to allocate money to Capital Plans. And that's before we have things like the City not paying nearly enough for student Metrocards and other ways the MTA gets shortchanged by the various levels of government.

 

 

To be fairly honest, it's not entirely unreasonable for feds to not want to give the region money, particularly when a certain Republican governor killed decades worth of planning for what was the largest federally funded rail project in the nation's history.

I'll have to do some digging but I'm pretty sure I read what I stated.

[bobtehpanda]

I'll have to do some digging but I'm pretty sure I read what I stated.

 

This is from the State budgetary watchdog:

 

 

Note: San Francisco doesn't have bus or light rail figures because its transportation system is ridiculously fragmented; every town and county in the Bay Area runs its own service and the system is poorly integrated. The SF figures should be ridiculously lower, especially since BART is more akin to a commuter rail service than a metro service.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

This is from the State budgetary watchdog:

 

 

Note: San Francisco doesn't have bus or light rail figures because its transportation system is ridiculously fragmented; every town and county in the Bay Area runs its own service and the system is poorly integrated. The SF figures should be ridiculously lower, especially since BART is more akin to a commuter rail service than a metro service.

Why do you keep showing fare box recovery?  What I'm talking about is how much New Yorkers are taxed and how much of those taxes go to the  and not what the State gives the either.  I think we're discussing two different things.

[bobtehpanda]

Why do you keep showing fare box recovery?  What I'm talking about is how much New Yorkers are taxed and how much of those taxes go to the  and not what the State gives the either.  I think we're discussing two different things.

 

For what it's worth, taxpayers in New York subsidize the system considerably, far more than most other cities.

 

 

New Yorkers get taxed a lot, but compared to other cities their transportation tax burden is significantly lower. (Also, if you include transportation into housing costs, New York is actually cheaper than cities like Dallas, Houston, or Phoenix where a lot of household income goes to things like gas.) It's not exactly unreasonable to say that the state could do more for the MTA, but that doesn't mean that the rest of the state government doesn't need to clean house (and it certainly does, but we have yet to see any action on that front other than a property tax cap which has so far just equated to less maintenance and replacement of infrastructure).

[Via Garibaldi 8]

New Yorkers get taxed a lot, but compared to other cities their transportation tax burden is significantly lower. (Also, if you include transportation into housing costs, New York is actually cheaper than cities like Dallas, Houston, or Phoenix where a lot of household income goes to things like gas.) It's not exactly unreasonable to say that the state could do more for the MTA, but that doesn't mean that the rest of the state government doesn't need to clean house (and it certainly does, but we have yet to see any action on that front other than a property tax cap which has so far just equated to less maintenance and replacement of infrastructure).

I'm sorry but we have the largest transportation system in the country, with millions of people using the system.  It should be CHEAP!  For what it's worth, I am not going to blame the State for the 's problems because the gets a sizable amount of money from the bridges and tolls it collects, along with the tax surcharges that New Yorkers pay when they ride a cab and when they get their monthly cell phone bill.  My point was that New Yorkers certainly pay their fair share to the , as we are taxed numerous times for the same thing! Given how many times we're taxed for the , I'm not sure that the State should be giving the more and more money.  I would like to know what happens with the taxes that is collected from taxi rides, bridges and tolls and the taxes on my cell phone bill, all of which is supposedly for the ? My understanding is that those taxes are separate from what the State gives the . There are other taxes too that I've left out that the collects on, so where does that go? Doesn't that go directly to them?

 

The one thing that keeps being left out is how much employee costs keep going up for the . That's the real problem and this article sums it up quite nicely:

 

http://www.newsday.com/opinion/columnists/william-f-b-o-reilly/there-s-nothing-fair-about-another-mta-fare-hike-william-f-b-o-reilly-1.6932322

[bobtehpanda]

I'm sorry but we have the largest transportation system in the country, with millions of people using the system.  It should be CHEAP!  For what it's worth, I am not going to blame the State for the 's problems because the gets a sizable amount of money from the bridges and tolls it collects, along with the tax surcharges that New Yorkers pay when they ride a cab and when they get their monthly cell phone bill.  My point was that New Yorkers certainly pay their fair share to the , as we are taxed numerous times for the same thing! Given how many times we're taxed for the , I'm not sure that the State should be giving the more and more money.  I would like to know what happens with the taxes that is collected from taxi rides, bridges and tolls and the taxes on my cell phone bill, all of which is supposedly for the ? My understanding is that those taxes are separate from what the State gives the . There are other taxes too that I've left out that the collects on, so where does that go? Doesn't that go directly to them?

 

The one thing that keeps being left out is how much employee costs keep going up for the . That's the real problem and this article sums it up quite nicely:

 

http://www.newsday.com/opinion/columnists/william-f-b-o-reilly/there-s-nothing-fair-about-another-mta-fare-hike-william-f-b-o-reilly-1.6932322

 

Those taxes and fares go to actually running the system every day. They don't pay for big ticket expansions (like the Second Avenue Subway), buying new trains, or doing comprehensive rehabs of stations, which are funded separately, and which is the main thing the State gets involved in.

 

You can either have low fares and fund capital projects out of the State budget, or raise fares across the board. New York's subway+bus flat fare is cheap compared to, say, London, where a zone 1 monthly ticket will cost nearly $200 and only get you around central London.

[Roadcruiser1]

Maybe it's high time for New York City to break away from New York State. From judging on what I have read I don't think Upstate New York understands the issues facing the City, and the City doesn't understand Upstate New York. It did be beneficial for us to split!

[Sparen of Iria]

Maybe it's high time for New York City to break away from New York State. From judging on what I have read I don't think Upstate New York understands the issues facing the City, and the City doesn't understand Upstate New York. It did be beneficial for us to split

We'd want to take Long Island and counties such as Westchester and Putnam then. XD

 

And all other New York State counties where the majority of the population works in New York City. That will make things easier, since we will have their tax dollars to spend on capital projects and station rehab. (And it goes back to them)

[Union Tpke]

We'd want to take Long Island and counties such as Westchester and Putnam then. XD

 

And all other New York State counties where the majority of the population works in New York City. That will make things easier, since we will have their tax dollars to spend on capital projects and station rehab. (And it goes back to them)

Count me in! What would they name the State?

[qjtransitmaster]

The biggest problem here is the fact that the federal goverment isnt investing into the MTA enough because of deadbeat White House administrations and a divided US Congress that doesnt know their heads from their asses. Pretty much. The federal goverment is known to be incredibly biased where it pertains to specifically New York City transortation needs.

 

However the Albany assemblymen also are known to be just as biased to the needs of public transportation. Its becoming a broken system.

 

If it wasnt for this then the MTA would really be 'going your way'.

How do you explain the constant service increases in Albany? the CDTA today isalmost nothing like it was a few years ago.

[bobtehpanda]

How do you explain the constant service increases in Albany? the CDTA today isalmost nothing like it was a few years ago.

 

Because don't you know that the City steals water and crushes Upstate under its heel every chance it gets? 

[Fresh Pond]

Count me in! What would they name the State?

It was actually proposed numerous times for NYC and Long Island to break off from the mainland and become its own state (Long Island)

 

...and for Long Island itself to break off from NYC to form a new state

 

Basically NY state itself to be broken apart

[CenSin]

Count me in! What would they name the State?

New New York

[N6 Limited]

A question, which candidate for governor would be better for the MTA.

Christie

[Union Tpke]

New New York

I would like it take in Hudson, part of or all of bergen county from nj, all or part of fairfield from conn, westchester, putnam, rockland, suffolk and nassau and the 5 boroughs called Greater New York, with the capital as NYC.

 

PART OF OR ALL OF THIS