DOT Mobility Report highlights NYC's bus problem

[JubaionBx12+SBS]

http://secondavenuesagas.com/2016/06/10/dot-mobility-report-highlights-nycs-bus-problem/

[R10 2952]

Valid points in the report, but as long as Vision Zero is in place, little can be done to speed things up. 

[MHV9218]

Valid points in the report, but as long as Vision Zero is in place, little can be done to speed things up. 

 

That has absolutely nothing to do with anything. Drivers running people over does not speed up bus service, nor does a 30mph limit on streets where traffic limits you to 15mph. Don't repeat these ridiculous talking points.

[R10 2952]

That has absolutely nothing to do with anything. Drivers running people over does not speed up bus service, nor does a 30mph limit on streets where traffic limits you to 15mph. Don't repeat these ridiculous talking points.

1.  Pedestrian plazas (yes, Bloomberg started them, but deBlasio chose to expand them) create chokepoints, exacerbating traffic as it floods into other parts of the streetgrid.  And lower speed limits result in slower speeds, that's simple math.  As for your supposed concern regarding safety, I'm out in the street everyday- it's not exactly Grand Theft Auto.  Keep in mind that a distracted pedestrian crossing on red is as likely to cause an accident as a distracted driver.

 

2.  You could be a bit more respectful than call my perspective ridiculous and telling me to not speak.  I've been on these boards longer than you and as far as I'm concerned, only the moderators have the authority to order me about.

[MHV9218]

1.  Pedestrian plazas (yes, Bloomberg started them, but deBlasio chose to expand them) create chokepoints, exacerbating traffic as it floods into other parts of the streetgrid.  And lower speed limits result in slower speeds, that's simple math.  As for your supposed concern regarding safety, I'm out in the street everyday- it's not exactly Grand Theft Auto.  Keep in mind that a distracted pedestrian crossing on red is as likely to cause an accident as a distracted driver.

 

2.  You could be a bit more respectful than call my perspective ridiculous and telling me to not speak.  I've been on these boards longer than you and as far as I'm concerned, only the moderators have the authority to order me about.

 

1. Pedestrian plazas are only a small part of Vision Zero, and traffic calming is not the reason for bus delays. It just isn't. The goal of curb extensions and the like is to make certain intersections safer for crossing pedestrians, not to stop traffic from moving. I'm out in the street every day too and it is, actually, incredible how many drivers disregard traffic laws and fail to yield. I bike, drive, and walk in this city, and it appalls me how little regard drivers have for pedestrian right of way--which has always been a law, and Vision Zero is enforcing, not creating as policy. It's also not simple math with speed limits: almost nowhere in Manhattan are drivers going 30mph in the first place, so changing it to 25mph only affects those who gun it then minute there's an open block. Buses are almost never getting to 30mph on streets, either. 

 

2. Your perspective is not ridiculous, and I didn't tell you not to speak. But these erroneous recycled talking points are ridiculous, and you shouldn't repeat them! You also totally ignored the actual report. Lots can be done to speed things up, as the article lists: 

 

Generally, three issues create slow buses. First, the boarding process where riders dip their MetroCards (and often struggle with it) is slow and clunky, creating very long dwell times at stations. Second, buses are subject to the whims of the street. Without dedicated infrastructure, buses get stuck in traffic, and even in places where dedicated lanes do exist, enforcement is spotty. Queue-jumping technology, or signal prioritization, was supposed to be a part of the city’s Select Bus Service offerings, but it still hasn’t been rolled out. Add it all up, and you get slow buses.

 

Here are the actual numbers on the impact of the biggest plaza in Times Square. You'll find that as a whole, travel times improved, and bus travel times were among them. It's lazy anecdotal evidence of people going through Times Square that leads to the claim the plaza showed things--as a whole, vehicles were redirected in a way that sped up travel for everybody.

 

"DOT collected and analyzed extensive data from GPS units in taxis to understand the impacts on this project for travel in and around midtown. Findings show:

• Travel speeds for northbound trips throughout West Midtown improved 17% from fall 2008-2009, compared with 8% in East Midtown.
• Travel speeds for southbound trips in West Midtown fell by 2% while East Midtown showed an increase of 3%.
• The speed of eastbound trips increased by 5% and westbound trips by 9% over the same time period.
• Bus travel speeds increased by 13% on Sixth Avenue and fell by 2% on Seventh Avenue.

Safety has also been vastly improved as a result of this project.

• Injuries to motorists and passengers in the project area are down 63%.
• Pedestrian injuries are down 35%.
• 80% fewer pedestrians are walking in the roadway in Times Square.

And the project has had additional benefits as well.

• 74% of New Yorkers surveyed by the Times Square Alliance agree that Times Square has improved dramatically over the last year.
• The number of people walking along Broadway and 7th Avenue in Times Square is up 11% and pedestrian volume is up 6% in Herald Square."

[checkmatechamp13]

That has absolutely nothing to do with anything. Drivers running people over does not speed up bus service, nor does a 30mph limit on streets where traffic limits you to 15mph. Don't repeat these ridiculous talking points.

 

That 30 mph speed limit doesn't just apply to congested streets. It applies on a lot of free-flowing streets too. Yes, it's only a little bit slower, but it can make the difference between making and missing a traffic light (which arguably, could be another case for TSP, but still)

 

I'll give you an example of a ridiculous implementation of Vision Zero: Along Goethals Road North, there's a school and the speed limit is 15 mph near the school (with a speed camera to enforce it).....even though there is literally nothing across the street from the school except the grassy area between Goethals Road North and the Staten Island Expressway, and no reason for the kids to be crossing the street. On top of that, it's in effect at all times, so when my dad takes the X17J at 5AM, the B/O has to crawl through that area even though school doesn't start for another 2-3 hours. It easily costs drivers (both bus and car) one traffic light cycle right there.

 

1.  Pedestrian plazas (yes, Bloomberg started them, but deBlasio chose to expand them) create chokepoints, exacerbating traffic as it floods into other parts of the streetgrid.  And lower speed limits result in slower speeds, that's simple math.  As for your supposed concern regarding safety, I'm out in the street everyday- it's not exactly Grand Theft Auto.  Keep in mind that a distracted pedestrian crossing on red is as likely to cause an accident as a distracted driver.

 

Actually, the fact that streets like Broadway cut through the street grid means that more signal time needs to be allocated to them, which means that less signal time can be allocated to the other streets, which actually means that those pedestrian plazas improve travel times in most cases.

[QM1to6Ave]

Not to go too off-topic, but my issue with those damn pedestrian plazas is that they created the whole costumed character panhandling industry. Rant complete, now back to bus related discussions...

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Not to go too off-topic, but my issue with those damn pedestrian plazas is that they created the whole costumed character panhandling industry. Rant complete, now back to bus related discussions...

Agreed, and they're filthy on top of it. The only benefit they provide is a place for the homeless to congregate.  When they first came out, I would sit in them and relax, but not anymore.  

 

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Back to the topic at hand... If they want to have Vision Zero in place, then do something about the amount of cars driving into the city to curb congestion.  I'd also like to add that the focus should be CITYWIDE on reducing congestion. There are too many cars on the road, not just in Manhattan, but all over, and it needs to be curbed.  I'll take my building as an example.  I think everyone in my building with maybe two or so people either drive or are picked up in a car.  On my floor, everyone has a car.  On the floor below me, I'm not sure who has a car, but I've seen only person use mass transit, and that was a lady on the express bus.  Everyone else either has a car or is picked up and dropped off daily in one (be it a taxi or a friend picking them up), and that's with me living in a walkable part of Riverdale close to mass transit.  It's actually surprising because parking isn't great and getting to a garage here can be a pain as well.   It is clear that they turn their nose up to transit, save perhaps the express bus or Metro-North, which I've heard a neighbor mention, but NONE of them use the subway or local bus.  

[TeeLow]

That has absolutely nothing to do with anything. Drivers running people over does not speed up bus service, nor does a 30mph limit on streets where traffic limits you to 15mph. Don't repeat these ridiculous talking points.

I didn't mean to laugh but at first read it had me rolling! No disrespect intended.