Queens Division Bus Proposals/Ideas

[BM5 via Woodhaven]

Why are you having the X63 use the Queensboro Bridge? Van Dam Street and Queens Blvd around the bridge are usually congested at certain hours.

Queens bound buses (expresses) also utilize that routing in the outbound direction to Queens. Furthermore, the X63/64/68 buses are routed via all of Queens Blvd (not the LIE), unlike some of the QM's.

Trying to serve the industry with an express route again?

 

This diversion sticks out to me more than the addition of midday service....

Nope, not at all (in fact, I wasn't even thinking of that at all). The X63 runs nonstop in LIC. The reasoning for the new routing in LIC was so that the bus avoids 3rd Avenue completely, and in order to get to the bridge, X63 service not be susceptible to traffic from the LIE coming off Van Dam to Manhattan, and a slightly faster way to get to the bridge.

Why does the X63 need midday service when ridership continues to decrease on the line?

Those are stats from last year, you never knew if ridership increased this year. Besides, the MTA added an extra outbound X63 trip in the summer, and some of these people actually complained about that (not previously having that bus). Their commutes are also long, so you never know if this would help increase ridership. The QM21 operates pretty late, but for some of those folks, it does them no good.

Edited January 2, 2015 by BM5 via Woodhaven

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Queens bound buses (expresses) also utilize that routing in the outbound direction to Queens. Furthermore, the X63/64/68 buses are routed via all of Queens Blvd (not the LIE), unlike some of the QM's.

 

Nope, not at all (in fact, I wasn't even thinking of that at all). The X63 runs nonstop in LIC. The reasoning for the new routing in LIC was so that the bus avoids 3rd Avenue completely, and in order to get to the bridge, X63 service not be susceptible to traffic from the LIE coming off Van Dam to Manhattan, and a slightly faster way to get to the bridge.

 

Those are stats from last year, you never knew if ridership increased this year. Besides, the MTA added an extra outbound X63 trip in the summer, and some of these people actually complained about that (not previously having that bus). Their commutes are also long, so you never know if this would help increase ridership. The QM21 operates pretty late, but for some of those folks, it does them no good.

I don't mind adding a few trips, but you're calling for midday service on one line while the X64 and X68 customers face the same commute. I don't see the difference.  Then you complain about QM1 service and call for having its service slashed.  Doesn't make any sense to me.

[BxM4Woodlawn]

new ideas.

Extend the Q19 to 125th St/Lexington Ave via the RFK Bridge

Truncate the Q60 to Queens Plaza and replace with the Q66 going to Manhattan

reroute the Q50 in Co-Op City to follow the BxM7 and terminate at Dreiser Loop

Truncate the Q32 to Grand Central Terminal.

extend the Q34 further into Whitestone via the former Q14 route.

eliminate the Q15A

create 3 new express routes

QM9-Wall Street variant of the QM2

QM13-Wall Street variant of the QM3

QM19-Wall Street variant of the QM20

also extend the hours of QM3 service. 6-9 to Manhattan, 4-7 from Manhattan

[qjtransitmaster]

new ideas.

Extend the Q19 to 125th St/Lexington Ave via the RFK Bridge

Truncate the Q60 to Queens Plaza and replace with the Q66 going to Manhattan

reroute the Q50 in Co-Op City to follow the BxM7 and terminate at Dreiser Loop

Truncate the Q32 to Grand Central Terminal.

extend the Q34 further into Whitestone via the former Q14 route.

eliminate the Q15A

create 3 new express routes

QM9-Wall Street variant of the QM2

QM13-Wall Street variant of the QM3

QM19-Wall Street variant of the QM20

also extend the hours of QM3 service. 6-9 to Manhattan, 4-7 from Manhattan

all but the first 2 make sense. Qm13 not needed. No comment on qm3.

[Gotham Bus Co.]

Truncate the Q32 to Grand Central Terminal.

 

 

 

I've thought of truncating the Q32 myself (as I indicated earlier in this thread).  

 

Remember that the former M32 ended at Madison Square (5th Ave & 26th Street).  As part of the renumbering to Q32, it was rerouted to Penn Station as a way to get rid of the M4 shuttle trips that ran between Penn Station and Madison/59th (AM rush, northbound only and deadhead back).  The real question is whether the Q32 is still needed at Penn, or if the M4 can once again go it alone.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

I've thought of truncating the Q32 myself (as I indicated earlier in this thread).  

 

Remember that the former M32 ended at Madison Square (5th Ave & 26th Street).  As part of the renumbering to Q32, it was rerouted to Penn Station as a way to get rid of the M4 shuttle trips that ran between Penn Station and Madison/59th (AM rush, northbound only and deadhead back).  The real question is whether the Q32 is still needed at Penn, or if the M4 can once again go it alone.

I would say no.  The M4 bunches too much.  The Q32 can help pick up the slack for those going between Penn Station and 59th street and Madison.  What would be the point of it going to Grand Central anyway? It would get backed up in the traffic along 42nd.

Edited January 2, 2015 by Via Garibaldi 8

[Gotham Bus Co.]

I would say no.  The M4 bunches too much.  The Q32 can help pick up the slack for those going between Penn Station and 59th street and Madison.  What would be the point of it going to Grand Central anyway? It would get backed up in the traffic along 42nd.

 

If the M4's problem is high ridership concentrated between Penn Station and 59th Street, then the Q32 is truly needed as back-up.  If the M4's real problem is merely bunching, then the real solution might be to split the M4 into two shorter routes and leave the Q32 out of that equation.

 

As for the Q32, it wouldn't have to end at Grand Central itself, just in the general area.  The last stop and layover could be on 40th just east of 5th (which used to be a stop on the M1), then left on Madison to return to Queens.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

If the M4's problem is high ridership concentrated between Penn Station and 59th Street, then the Q32 is truly needed as back-up.  If the M4's real problem is merely bunching, then the real solution might be to split the M4 into two shorter routes and leave the Q32 out of that equation.

 

As for the Q32, it wouldn't have to end at Grand Central itself, just in the general area.  The last stop and layover could be on 40th just east of 5th (which used to be a stop on the M1), then left on Madison to return to Queens.

The M4 bunches like all buses on 5th Avenue, which includes the Q32. I don't support shortening routes because it discourages ridership and forces the passengers who rely on the routes to engage in more transfers, which lengthens the commutes overall. I would rather support finding ways to improve traffic flow which is what needs to be done and has been discussed now for years.  IMO, there needs to be some sort of congestion pricing or regulations that only taxis, express buses, and local buses travel along 5th and deliveries can be made at night. They should also decrease the amount of medallions being given out.  Too many taxis running around clogging up traffic unnecessarily.  You have two or three taxis fighting for each passenger.  That's just ridiculous. They stop any old way, block traffic, and engage in reckless driving just to pick up a fare.

Edited January 2, 2015 by Via Garibaldi 8

[BM5 via Woodhaven]

Some of the Q32's already do that (end at 41st) if they're really behind of schedule

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Some of the Q32's already do that (end at 41st) if they're really behind of schedule

Which is quite often, esp. during the rush. They come down 5th in packs or 2s and 3s...

[BM5 via Woodhaven]

I don't mind adding a few trips, but you're calling for midday service on one line while the X64 and X68 customers face the same commute. I don't see the difference.  Then you complain about QM1 service and call for having its service slashed.  Doesn't make any sense to me.

The difference is that the ridership is significantly lower on the 64 to warrant it, and the 63 has the highest ridership of the three, so I thought it would best start there. Plus, the X63 serves portions of Rosedale that isn't served by a local bus route (or close), and Linden Blvd proper, which has no local bus service (besides the intersecting routes to Jamaica), and I think it could work, if they give it a long enough span. The 63 would already get to Manhattan within a 30-40 minute span from that area, so if enough is done to mention that the 63 would run middays, it could see ridership.

Which is quite often, esp. during the rush. They come down 5th in packs or 2s and 3s...

Yeah, so most of the time, one gets sent down to Penn, and the other shortturns at 42.

 

I take the Q32 to Queens from Manhattan on a (not as frequent basis as the QM15), but those short-turns are really nice, one time I had a chance to ride one at 42 Street. I look at bustime, and there wasn't a bus for miles (after getting off at 74 Street).

Edited January 2, 2015 by BM5 via Woodhaven

[Via Garibaldi 8]

The difference is that the ridership is significantly lower on the 64 to warrant it, and the 63 has the highest ridership of the three, so I thought it would best start there. Plus, the X63 serves portions of Rosedale that isn't served by a local bus route (or close), and Linden Blvd proper, which has no local bus service (besides the intersecting routes to Jamaica), and I think it could work, if they give it a long enough span. The 63 would already get to Manhattan within a 30-40 minute span from that area, so if enough is done to mention that the 63 would run middays, it could see ridership.

 

Yeah, so most of the time, one gets sent down to Penn, and the other shortturns at 42.

 

I take the Q32 to Queens from Manhattan on a (not as frequent basis as the QM15), but those short-turns are really nice, one time I had a chance to ride one at 42 Street. I look at bustime, and there wasn't a bus for miles (after getting off at 74 Street).

That doesn't seem like a good enough reason to give midday service to one area when the other two areas have similar lengthy

commutes.

 

As for the Q32 given how many old buses they have I would take what you saw on BusTime with a grain of a salt.  Pathetic that they have such old buses parading around on 5th and Madison Avenues.

[BM5 via Woodhaven]

That doesn't seem like a good enough reason to give midday service to one area when the other two areas have similar lengthy

commutes.

 

As for the Q32 given how many old buses they have I would take what you saw on BusTime with a grain of a salt. Pathetic that they have such old buses parading around on 5th and Madison Avenues.

See, the X68 at the farthest point from the city (towards the end ofthe outbound routing/beginning of the inbound routing), it is close to the QM6 line. So any riders could also opt for the QM6. The last outbound stop, the X68 shares with the X63? and the stop following up to 188, the bus has a similar runtime with the train (so I dont think it would recieve the midday service, unfortunately).

 

The X64 is the least utilized of the three, so for now, it wouldnt be given an increase, unless there was a specific complaint addressed by those riders.

 

The X63 riders have the longest commutes of the three, significantly longer.

 

 

As for the Q32, I was on an Orion V, and that appeared. I get what youre trying to say though, however given how traffic conditions are before Queens Plaza, Queens Plaza itself, and the boulevard, I woldnt be surprised either.

Quite frankly, I dont care how old the bus is, as long as its in good condition, doesnt brake into pieces, and doesnt brake down.

Edited January 2, 2015 by BM5 via Woodhaven

[qjtransitmaster]

Or truncate M4 @ Columbia university allowing for more service.

[Q43LTD]

new ideas.

Extend the Q19 to 125th St/Lexington Ave via the RFK Bridge How about no, since the 19 was extended to 2 St in June

Truncate the Q60 to Queens Plaza and replace with the Q66 going to Manhattan Robbing Peter to pay Paul in a way. The 66 would still be too long. No demand for it

reroute the Q50 in Co-Op City to follow the BxM7 and terminate at Dreiser Loop How about no? That's what the Bx23 is for

Truncate the Q32 to Grand Central Terminal. No. The M4 needs all the help it can get from the Q32 and others

extend the Q34 further into Whitestone via the former Q14 route. As much as I would like for that to happen, it's not since the will not allow BC routes to replace TA routes. There have been safety issues regarding the last stop of the 34

eliminate the Q15A Read above comment

create 3 new express routes

QM9-Wall Street variant of the QM2 There has been some kind of demand for a Bay Terrace-Downtown route

QM13-Wall Street variant of the QM3 I don't think there's demand for Little Neck-Downtown service. Let's not give every area Downtown service for the sake of it

QM19-Wall Street variant of the QM20 Look at my comments for your proposed QM9. I think 2 routes are overkill IMO

also extend the hours of QM3 service. 6-9 to Manhattan, 4-7 from Manhattan I can definitely agree with this one

Replies in red

[B35 via Church]

TBH, I thought the Q50 should have ended at Dreiser to begin with.... That's what I thought the MTA was gonna have it do when they came out w/ this Bx23 from having split the old QBx1.... Instead, they ended up having the Q50 bypassing it, running along the outskirts/edge of Co-op (baychester av, co-op city blvd), to end in section 5...

 

If only there were more space to end it with the BxM7.....

 

 

 

 

The QM21 operates pretty late, but for some of those folks, it does them no good.

Those QV expresses man, it's the same with all of them; (but in this particular case/side discussion, I'll particularly mention) folks have long gotten into the mode of making sure they catch the x63... The Qm21 as a standalone route doesn't flourish partly because of this..... Worse than that, I find that the Qm21 operates against the x63; don't really know how to put it, so I'll explain.... When the masses are all on x63's already, this is when you'll see QM21's operating within minutes behind it, not picking up much of anyone (besides the few that are going directly to Rochdale)....

 

They can run Qm21's as late as they want... When the hustle mentality exists to catch those last x63 trips, it renders those trips that get to Rochdale around a quarter after 9 & 10 pm just about useless....

 

The more trips they add to the x63, the more useless the Qm21 will become... Book it.

 

Those are reasons why I say the Qm21 should just be relegated to being a short turn of the x63 (Rochdale express; no stops on linden blvd)....

Edited January 3, 2015 by B35 via Church

[Q43LTD]

Didn't they add a stop @ Dreiser? 

[B35 via Church]

Didn't they add a stop @ Dreiser? 

Inside the loop? Not that I know of.....

[Q43LTD]

Inside the loop? Not that I know of.....

No, outside the loop. And it doesn't have a stop @ Asch for some reason...

[B35 via Church]

No, outside the loop. And it doesn't have a stop @ Asch for some reason...

Yes, there's a stop on co-op city blvd/dreiser, but I'm talking about inside the loop....

Edited January 3, 2015 by B35 via Church

[BM5 via Woodhaven]

Those QV expresses man, it's the same with all of them; (but in this particular case/side discussion, I'll particularly mention) folks have long gotten into the mode of making sure they catch the x63... The Qm21 as a standalone route doesn't flourish partly because of this..... Worse than that, I find that the Qm21 operates against the x63; don't really know how to put it, so I'll explain.... When the masses are all on x63's already, this is when you'll see QM21's operating within minutes behind it, not picking up much of anyone (besides the few that are going directly to Rochdale)....

 

They can run Qm21's as late as they want... When the hustle mentality exists to catch those last x63 trips, it renders those trips that get to Rochdale around a quarter after 9 & 10 pm just about useless....

 

The more trips they add to the x63, the more useless the Qm21 will become... Book it.

 

Those are reasons why I say the Qm21 should just be relegated to being a short turn of the x63 (Rochdale express; no stops on linden blvd)....

That could work. Because of that, then the X63 should have two added stops at 142 and Supthin Blvd (which shouldn't really increase runtime). I would do that setup (you mentioned) in the PM, since the X63 runs have similar runtimes to the QM21 (so the 21 would run non-stop on Linden like you mentioned, but make all the same X63 stops in Briarwood with the X63). The AM routing on the X63 winds too much through Manhattan to compare to the QM21 (but the 21 comes less frequently).

 

Those last two depatures from Manhattan can be the all stops X63A, making all stops up to Guy R Brewer, then on to Rochdale Village.

 

So, as far as notation it would be an X63/X63A  (X63: Rosedale Express/ X63A Rochdale Express) or some other notation, to make it seem as if the QM21 has some relation to the X63.

 

There would also need to make the QM21 stop with the X63 as well. For the most part, that can be done, however, the 38/44 Street QM21 and the 40/48 Street X63 stop are kinda scattered around, and the 23 Street stops would have to be relocated slightly (on the QM21).

Edited January 3, 2015 by BM5 via Woodhaven

[Gotham Bus Co.]

 

QM9-Wall Street variant of the QM2

QM13-Wall Street variant of the QM3

QM19-Wall Street variant of the QM20

also extend the hours of QM3 service. 6-9 to Manhattan, 4-7 from Manhattan

 

Instead of two Bayside-Wall Street routes, maybe have one route that combines elements of the QM2 and QM20 (call it QM22?)— for example, from Bell & 212th via Bell, 23rd Avenue, Corporal Kennedy, 26th Avenue, Utopia Parkway, then follow the QM2 Saturday/Sunday routing.

 

As for the QM3/13, a Wall Street variant might be even more useful than the Midtown service (which duplicates the LIRR). 

Edited January 3, 2015 by Gotham Bus Co.

[qjtransitmaster]

TBH, I thought the Q50 should have ended at Dreiser to begin with.... That's what I thought the MTA was gonna have it do when they came out w/ this Bx23 from having split the old QBx1.... Instead, they ended up having the Q50 bypassing it, running along the outskirts/edge of Co-op (baychester av, co-op city blvd), to end in section 5...

 

If only there were more space to end it with the BxM7.....

 

 

 

 

Those QV expresses man, it's the same with all of them; (but in this particular case/side discussion, I'll particularly mention) folks have long gotten into the mode of making sure they catch the x63... The Qm21 as a standalone route doesn't flourish partly because of this..... Worse than that, I find that the Qm21 operates against the x63; don't really know how to put it, so I'll explain.... When the masses are all on x63's already, this is when you'll see QM21's operating within minutes behind it, not picking up much of anyone (besides the few that are going directly to Rochdale)....

 

They can run Qm21's as late as they want... When the hustle mentality exists to catch those last x63 trips, it renders those trips that get to Rochdale around a quarter after 9 & 10 pm just about useless....

 

The more trips they add to the x63, the more useless the Qm21 will become... Book it.

 

Those are reasons why I say the Qm21 should just be relegated to being a short turn of the x63 (Rochdale express; no stops on linden blvd)....

qm21 is a short turn of the x63 basically TA just won't admit it.

[Q43LTD]

That could work. Because of that, then the X63 should have two added stops at 142 and Supthin Blvd (which shouldn't really increase runtime). I would do that setup (you mentioned) in the PM, since the X63 runs have similar runtimes to the QM21 (so the 21 would run non-stop on Linden like you mentioned, but make all the same X63 stops in Briarwood with the X63). The AM routing on the X63 winds too much through Manhattan to compare to the QM21 (but the 21 comes less frequently).

 

Those last two depatures from Manhattan can be the all stops X63A, making all stops up to Guy R Brewer, then on to Rochdale Village.

 

So, as far as notation it would be an X63/X63A  (X63: Rosedale Express/ X63A Rochdale Express) or some other notation, to make it seem as if the QM21 has some relation to the X63.

 

There would also need to make the QM21 stop with the X63 as well. For the most part, that can be done, however, the 38/44 Street QM21 and the 40/48 Street X63 stop are kinda scattered around, and the 23 Street stops would have to be relocated slightly (on the QM21).

The X63 already has a stop at Linden and Sutphin. What I would do is add a stop at 142 for the X63, and Brewer for the QM21

[qjtransitmaster]

That doesn't seem like a good enough reason to give midday service to one area when the other two areas have similar lengthy

commutes.

 

As for the Q32 given how many old buses they have I would take what you saw on BusTime with a grain of a salt. Pathetic that they have such old buses parading around on 5th and Madison Avenues.

you do realize Q32 duplicates the right? Hence the lack of newer buses it just isn't a priority for the MTA.