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Turbo19

2 Mich. McDonald's drop halal food after suit

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DETROIT (AP) — The only two McDonald's restaurants in the United States that were serving food prepared according to Islamic law have stopped several weeks after a $700,000 settlement over a lawsuit that alleged the items weren't consistently halal.

 

The fast-food giant said in a statement Monday that the locations in the Detroit suburb of Dearborn, which has a large Muslim population, are no longer offering a halal McChicken sandwich or Chicken McNuggets in order "to focus on our national core menu."

 

The corporation added it takes into account "local and dietary preferences," and supports its franchisees in Dearborn. Neither the statement nor a spokeswoman said whether McDonald's decision was related to the lawsuit.

 

The lawsuit, brought by customer Ahmed Ahmed in 2011, technically covered anyone who bought the halal-advertised products between September 2005 and January from the two restaurants.

 

A letter sent to McDonald's and restaurant franchisee Finley's Management, by attorney Kassem Dakhlallah's firm Jaafar and Mahdi Law Group, said Ahmed had "confirmed from a source familiar with the inventory" that the restaurant had sold non-halal food "on many occasions."

 

Read More: Source

 



My first thought was "McDonalds should have taken precaution when serving halal food."

 

My second thought "there are McDonalds serving halal?"

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I don't see the point of doing that in the first place no matter what area they're in... do the Mickey D's in Flatbush or the 5 Towns serve Kosher food? No. Do they still get plenty of business? Yes.

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I don't see the point of doing that in the first place no matter what area they're in... do the Mickey D's in Flatbush or the 5 Towns serve Kosher food? No. Do they still get plenty of business? Yes.

That's a pretty foolish statement.  If you want to attract different types of people to your establishment then you offer foods that will draw in those types of people.   If you're just serving the same people, you don't expand sales. Sure you still make money but you need to serve NEW people in order to grow.  Ostracizing an entire new market just makes you seem out of touch and disinterested in other groups.  They obviously felt that there was an untapped market there and they were right. Unfortunately, it's hard to serve certain things when you have airheads working behind the counter.  In short, McDonald's would be know globally if it just served the same old people.

 

I won't completely fault the workers because they have to be trained, but I'm always amazed at how ignorant workers are.  When I'm in Whole Foods, the people serving the food often times don't have a clue of what they're serving.  What are they doing working in a Natural/Organic supermarket if they don't know anything about the products? It's the same thing here. If you're serving halal food, you should know the ins and outs. Sometimes I really wonder what in the hell people eat because if you're working in a food place you have to eat something so if you're selling the same products every day how do you not know anything about them??  <_<

 

It's like the idiots behind the counter. I buy something cold like say a tartine that has egg salad on it, and then I'm asked if I want it heated up? Who in the hell would heat up egg salad? Like seriously, I have to wonder if these people even think about what they're saying.  The other one that pisses me is, do you need a bag with that? Like what am I going to do, carry 20 items in my hands?  <_<

Edited by Via Garibaldi 8
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McDonald's did the Muslim community a favor.One less group will be contributing to those casualty statistics…

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I don't see the point of doing that in the first place no matter what area they're in... do the Mickey D's in Flatbush or the 5 Towns serve Kosher food? No. Do they still get plenty of business? Yes.

That's a good point, but when dealing with a fast food entity such as McDonald's it is usually up to the franchisee to oversee the main operation of the restaurant. If they decide that it would be in their benefit to cater to a specific community they have every right to do so, as long as they have an approved supplier.

 

I'm with no doubt it is a major liability to do just that, but if done right it can be beneficial to many.

 

 

That's a pretty foolish statement.  If you want to attract different types of people to your establishment then you offer foods that will draw in those types of people.   If you're just serving the same people, you don't expand sales. Sure you still make money but you need to serve NEW people in order to grow.  Ostracizing an entire new market just makes you seem out of touch and disinterested in other groups.  They obviously felt that there was an untapped market there and they were right. Unfortunately, it's hard to serve certain things when you have airheads working behind the counter.  In short, McDonald's would be know globally if it just served the same old people.

 

I won't completely fault the workers because they have to be trained, but I'm always amazed at how ignorant workers are.  When I'm in Whole Foods, the people serving the food often times don't have a clue of what they're serving.  What are they doing working in a Natural/Organic supermarket if they don't know anything about the products? It's the same thing here. If you're serving halal food, you should know the ins and outs. Sometimes I really wonder what in the hell people eat because if you're working in a food place you have to eat something so if you're selling the same products every day how do you not know anything about them??  <_<

 

(Hilarious personal experience at Whole Foods omitted for clarity, by Turbo19).

Like I said it was a huge liability to engage in this business, but at the same time it must have been beneficial enough to begin serving the food in the first place.

 

And in retrospect it probably was the fault of the workers as you said, who likely didn't differentiate the two products, crossed served both products or were just never educated on how to properly handle and serve halal product.

 

And you reminded me of the incompetence of McDonald's workers as I haven't been there for so long. I still pick up a bite as fast food place now and then, but I haven't been in a McDonald's for over a year now this year as I was consistently encountering poor guest service.

 

 

McDonald's did the Muslim community a favor.One less group will be contributing to those casualty statistics…

They have as much right to kill themselves eating as much as any other group.

 

 

That second though had me thinkin' what McDonald's tried serving Halal food?!

Two locations within Dearborn, MI of all places.

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Like I said it was a huge liability to engage in this business, but at the same time it must have been beneficial enough to begin serving the food in the first place.

 

And in retrospect it probably was the fault of the workers as you said, who likely didn't differentiate the two products, crossed served both products or were just never educated on how to properly handle and serve halal product.

 

And you reminded me of the incompetence of McDonald's workers as I haven't been there for so long. I still pick up a bite as fast food place now and then, but I haven't been in a McDonald's for over a year now this year as I was consistently encountering poor guest service.

It is risky, but a lot of these companies rely on the consumer to be oblivious and idiotic enough not to realize when there's a problem. A place like McDonald's wouldn't expect people to make a fuss. I mean the thinking is you're coming to a cheap fast-food joint, so you can't expect much (which is true to a degree), but for someone who believes in eating halal food try telling them that.  The real problem is that you have so many people that go into the food industry that don't have a clue on how to properly run a business or train their employees properly.

 

I will say that I find that the more upscale the place is, the pickier you can be.

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It is risky, but a lot of these companies rely on the consumer to be oblivious and idiotic enough not to realize when there's a problem. A place like McDonald's wouldn't expect people to make a fuss. I mean the thinking is you're coming to a cheap fast-food joint, so you can't expect much (which is true to a degree), but for someone who believes in eating halal food try telling them that.  The real problem is that you have so many people that go into the food industry that don't have a clue on how to properly run a business or train their employees properly.

 

I will say that I find that the more upscale the place is, the pickier you can be.

Yes, agreed with all points.

 

Interesting you bring up "people that have no clue properly run a business or train their employees properly" because after that Wingstop stunt I did, I experienced that first hand, after the franchisee was dealing with issues with staff at a second store. It makes you feel bad for the workers under a mismanaged management (explain that if you can) but ultimately every worker should exercise personal responsibility on the job.

 

I'll admit to being nitpicky at times, but on the same token if they complete the service without attitude I'll give a nice gratuity.

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Yes, agreed with all points.

 

Interesting you bring up "people that have no clue properly run a business or train their employees properly" because after that Wingstop stunt I did, I experienced that first hand, after the franchisee was dealing with issues with staff at a second store. It makes you feel bad for the workers under a mismanaged management (explain that if you can) but ultimately every worker should exercise personal responsibility on the job.

 

I'll admit to being nitpicky at times, but on the same token if they complete the service without attitude I'll give a nice gratuity.

Oh it's easy to explain.  Someone wants to open a business but doesn't have a clue about how the industry works.  They hire workers without training them, expect people to patronize their place without a clue about hospitality and then wonder why they're shut down 3 - 4 months later.  We have a lot of places like that here in Riverdale.  They think because we're an upscale community that they can just open up be snobby and we'll come running because they're a new place in the neighborhood.

 

The key thing to any business is a good product, good customer service, training employees properly to carry out the mission of the business and ensuring that you have someone who knows the economics of the industry, because if any of those are out of whack the whole business can go down.

 

The biggest mistake owners make is opening up shop and never being around to oversee things.  Businesses don't run themselves. They need someone to be hands on who understands how things work and can be dedicated because it takes long hours to ensure that things run properly.

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Oh it's easy to explain.  Someone wants to open a business but doesn't have a clue about how the industry works.  They hire workers without training them, expect people to patronize their place without a clue about hospitality and then wonder why they're shut down 3 - 4 months later.  We have a lot of places like that here in Riverdale.  They think because we're an upscale community that they can just open up be snobby and we'll come running because they're a new place in the neighborhood.

 

The key thing to any business is a good product, good customer service, training employees properly to carry out the mission of the business and ensuring that you have someone who knows the economics of the industry, because if any of those are out of whack the whole business can go down.

 

The biggest mistake owners make is opening up shop and never being around to oversee things.  Businesses don't run themselves. They need someone to be hands on who understands how things work and can be dedicated because it takes long hours to ensure that things run properly.

Well there any many challenges and risks that are associated with operating a new business. General oversight is one factor that continues to be overlooked and ultimately that leads to failure.

 

Luckily many business owners have realized this, and as such are taking other cost cutting measures* to take care of the business directly.

 

 

 

*Like laying off 10 team members including myself from an original store staff of 35. Sill waiting for a call back...

 

 

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Well there any many challenges and risks that are associated with operating a new business. General oversight is one factor that continues to be overlooked and ultimately that leads to failure.

 

Luckily many business owners have realized this, and as such are taking other cost cutting measures* to take care of the business directly.

 

 

 

*Like laying off 10 team members including myself from an original store staff of 35. Sill waiting for a call back...

 

 

That company wasn't smart to begin with.  They clearly hired too many people from the start and then realized it when they started having cash flow problems.  If you need more people you can always hire more, this way you aren't pissing away money.  Most businesses have very slim profit margins and everything must be looked at when running a business because any overlook can eat right into those profits.

 

I know first hand since I run a department.  I have to be very careful about keeping costs in line and making sure that my department has enough cash flow coming in to offset what is paid out each month. A lot of owners don't understand this simple concept.  

 

Thinking about this whole halal thing, McDonald's would've been foolish not to tap into this new market, esp. if that is the majority population.  At the same time, they should've set realistic goals with this and made sure that this challenge was something that employees could handle. Educating and training is important but you can't make the set up so ridiculous for them either.

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I guess I'll ask the obvious question - What were they (McDonalds) serving Halal food for in the first place.....

 

I don't care what group of people live in a particular location.... If you're a large corporation like McDonalds, either you prop up an establishment in that location if you think it'll rake in the big bucks or you don't - One thing you don't do is change or add foods to the menu to cater to a group of people living in said location..... You open yourself up to lawsuits like this....

 

Let the Arab community tap into McDonalds like they've done w/ subway & dunkin donuts & it's a fu**in wrap....

Although 700k is small fries to the corporation, (reading) this story just rubbed me the wrong way.... OTOH, I guess I gotta tip my cap to Mr. Ahmed Ahmed.... 

Edited by B35 via Church

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I guess I'll ask the obvious question - What were they (McDonalds) serving Halal food for in the first place.....

 

I don't care what group of people live in a particular location.... If you're a large corporation like McDonalds, either you prop up an establishment in that location if you think it'll rake in the big bucks or you don't - One thing you don't do is change or add foods to the menu to cater to a group of people living in said location..... You open yourself up to lawsuits like this....

 

Let the Arab community tap into McDonalds like they've done w/ subway & dunkin donuts & it's a fu**in wrap....

Although 700k is small fries to the corporation, (reading) this story just rubbed me the wrong way.... OTOH, I guess I gotta tip my cap to Mr. Ahmed Ahmed.... 

Yeah but McDonald's does this around the world.  They most certainly don't serve the same food in say China as they do in a McDonald's out West.  In fact a lot of multinational corporations do this.  

 

Even in Italy, the McDonald's there don't serve the same food as here in the States.  Funny enough I found the food in McDonald's in Italy much better than the McDonald's here.  Surely they look at the population's food preferences, tastes and so on when creating a menu because what may work in one location may not work in another, otherwise you can't expand globally and get a new customer base.

 

When I lived in Midwood, there was a Dunkin' Donuts that had kosher items on the menu due to the large Jewish population.

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Yeah but McDonald's does this around the world.  They most certainly don't serve the same food in say China as they do in a McDonald's out West.  In fact a lot of multinational corporations do this.  

 

Even in Italy, the McDonald's there don't serve the same food as here in the States.  Funny enough I found the food in McDonald's in Italy much better than the McDonald's here.  Surely they look at the population's food preferences, tastes and so on when creating a menu because what may work in one location may not work in another, otherwise you can't expand globally and get a new customer base.

 

When I lived in Midwood, there was a Dunkin' Donuts that had kosher items on the menu due to the large Jewish population.

I know food chains do this... and it's a poor practice AFAIC.

 

McDonald's have already expanded globally; how much more "global" can you get.....

Just being "McDonald's" is all McDonald's needs to expand & have a growth in customer base.....

 

If I'm from the states & I take a vacation to, I don't know, somewhere in central america, I'm not gonna want an apple pie or a god damn hamburger... I can get that shit here in America... LOL !

 

Anyway, You use Italy as an example... Let's go with that.

So what Italian foods in the McDonalds' in Italy have that McDonalds' here in America don't?

Or better yet, what from the McDonald's menu here in America did they expunge from the McDonalds' in Italy, to make room for whatever foods they have on a McDonald's menu in Italy (that we here in america don't have)?

 

Honest question(s), because I've never been to Italy.

 

 

Too many "McDonald's" in this one post... makes me not wanna see a McDonald's for the rest of the day......

Edited by B35 via Church

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I know food chains do this... and it's a poor practice AFAIC.

 

McDonalds have already expanded globally; how much more "global" can you get.....

Just being "McDonald's" is all McDonald's need to expand & have a growth in customer base.....

 

If I'm from the states & I take a vacation to, I don't know, somewhere in central america, I'm not gonna want an apple pie or a god damn hamburger... I can get that shit here in America... LOL !

 

Anyway, You use Italy as an example... Let's go with that.

So what Italian foods in the McDonalds' in Italy have that McDonalds here in America don't?

Or better yet, what from the McDonalds' menu here in America did they expunge from the McDonalds' in Italy, to make room for whatever foods they have on a McDonald's menu in Italy (that we here in america don't have)?

 

Honest question(s), because I've never been to Italy.

 

Too many "McDonald's" in this one post... makes me not wanna look at a McDonald's for the rest of the day......

Well the Italians tend to mock us about constantly eating hamburgers and putting sh*t loads of ketchup on it.  I realized this when I went to a soccer match in Florence.  I saw they had hamburgers in this one spot out by the parking area, so I bought one and the guy drowned the damn thing in so much ketchup that it was disgusting.

 

In speaking with other Italians here in the States some of the ignorant ones from Italy seem to think that that's all we eat here are burgers and fries.  :lol: I was chatting with this Italian dude at a gathering and he asks me in Italian, so what is there to eat around the area? Hamburgers? In other words the usual "garbage"? I had to chuckle because I knew exactly what he was getting at.

 

You should hear them in Whole Foods.  I have to chuckle to myself because they're always complaining about the quality of the food, even at Whole Foods, albeit in Italian.  I've heard things like "What the f*ck is this?" in Italian and then they pick up the item and inspect it with a look of bewilderment.   :lol: One of my Italian friends shops there but even that isn't good enough for her.  She tells me in Italian that the food is just different here, which I have to say I agree with. Quality wise, even Whole Foods is just "okay" compared to the fresh stuff you get there, but it's a different way of thinking and lifestyle. It comes off as snobbish but until you've eaten there it's hard to explain in terms of the difference in quality. There you go shopping daily, hence why the refrigerators are so small because you buy your food fresh everyday and there is an emphasis on showing the customer how fresh the product is because fresh implies that it's of quality.  Here you get food for a week or more hence why so many things are probably made with preservatives here and the fridges are much better.

 

Now back to McDonald's.... When I wanted a hamburger in Italy or rather something "American", I would go to McDonald's because that isn't something that's common in Italy.  I found that they carried most of what you would find here, which wasn't too shocking because there are a sizable amount of Americans in Florence (particularly in the Downtown area) so that may have had a factor in the menu.  However, I don't recall seeing chicken nuggets on the menu at the time and I believe that while they had shakes or something similar to a shake, they were more limited in terms of options.  

 

I always felt like when I ate McDonald's there it was a different kind of "fast food" because to an Italian, their version of fast food is much different than ours.  There you can find fast food, but it is basically food that's done quickly, but healthy, simple food.

 

The difference to me was I just noticed a difference in the quality of the McDonald's there. In fact that's how I got back into McDonald's there.  When I came back to the States here and went to eat McDonald's I became sick and immediately noticed the difference in the taste of the food.  Something was just strange about the taste. Could've been the preservatives I suppose.

 

Thinking about it further, I'm almost certain that they use different quality ingredients there as opposed to here because Italians really care about the quality of the food and prefer things that are just organic or natural as opposed to things with preservatives.

 

A perfect example would be Nutella.  I was talking with an Italian colleague of mine, and we both remarked in Italian at how different the Nutella is here that is sold in the States versus the one sold in Italy.  I looked at the ingredients of the one sold here in most stores and it has all sorts of crap in it.  The one made in Italy I am almost certain is not made with the same ingredients and costs about double what the regular one costs here as it is imported directly from Italy.  I noticed this with other brands as well. In other words sometimes, what is "exported" here is different, and sometimes not for the better. The Nutella for the American market is Made in Canada.

 

Here is something that is definitely different now with McDonald's in Italy:

 

http://www.nbcnews.com/business/stirring-pot-mcdonalds-serving-pasta-italy-6C10066307

 

LOL... They were definitely not serving pasta in McDonald's back when I was living there, but I can see why they're trying to now because pasta there is seen as "fast food".  It cooks quickly and makes for a quick healthy side or even a snack, but it would never be served as a "main" dish like you see here.

 

It's funny how much controversy the menu created, but I can understand why.  They don't want their food made a mockery of.  Barilla is like the #1 pasta company in Italy and not surprising, the Barilla there (particulary the pasta sauces) were much better than the Barilla here that they ship to the States.  <_<

Edited by Via Garibaldi 8

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Pardon my ignorance here, but I thought Halal food was similar to kosher food, in that no pork products could be used. McDonald's certainly uses lots of pig products. Am I mistaken?

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Pardon my ignorance here, but I thought Halal food was similar to kosher food, in that no pork products could be used. McDonald's certainly uses lots of pig products. Am I mistaken?

LOL... What pig products does McDonald's use?? I don't recall any of their burgers having bacon...

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LOL... What pig products does McDonald's use?? I don't recall any of their burgers having bacon...

They use bacon...you can order a burger with bacon on it, and one of their new McDoubles comes with bacon IIRC

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Pardon my ignorance here, but I thought Halal food was similar to kosher food, in that no pork products could be used. McDonald's certainly uses lots of pig products. Am I mistaken?

While it is true that pork products are not Halal (permissible) which makes it haraam (non permissible), there are other criteria for different meats to make it halal. The criteria for non-pork items include its source, the cause of the animal's death, and how it was processed.

 

The food must come from a supplier that uses halal practices. Specifically, the slaughter must be performed by a Muslim, who must precede the slaughter by invoking the name of Allah. Then, the animal must be slaughtered with a sharp knife (so the animal does not feel pain, as it quickens the death) by cutting the throat, windpipe and the blood vessels in the neck, causing the animal’s death without cutting the spinal cord. Lastly, the blood from the veins must be drained. This final step is performed because blood can harbor harmful bacteria, and also to ensure that there are no blood clots, thus keeping the entire body safe and clean to be eaten.

 

So in short no you are not mistaken, but there is more to halal than just restrictions.

 

 

LOL... What pig products does McDonald's use?? I don't recall any of their burgers having bacon...

Well pork products have been served during breakfast hours for the longest, in the way of bacon, Canadian bacon, ham, and pork sausage in select regions.

 

And there has always been the seasonal McRib, as well as a chicken BLT, some "wraps" with bacon, and to my knowledge their recently discontinued Angus burgers had a variant which was served with bacon. As Fresh Pond elaborated above, as of recently a McDouble can be specified with bacon, and to my knowledge so can a Quarter Pounder.

 

On a side note, I don't even eat there much and yet I can remember all this crap off of my head. Some effective advertising or what?

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While it is true that pork products are not Halal (permissible) which makes it haraam (non permissible), there are other criteria for different meats to make it halal. The criteria for non-pork items include its source, the cause of the animal's death, and how it was processed.

 

The food must come from a supplier that uses halal practices. Specifically, the slaughter must be performed by a Muslim, who must precede the slaughter by invoking the name of Allah. Then, the animal must be slaughtered with a sharp knife (so the animal does not feel pain, as it quickens the death) by cutting the throat, windpipe and the blood vessels in the neck, causing the animal’s death without cutting the spinal cord. Lastly, the blood from the veins must be drained. This final step is performed because blood can harbor harmful bacteria, and also to ensure that there are no blood clots, thus keeping the entire body safe and clean to be eaten.

 

So in short no you are not mistaken, but there is more to halal than just restrictions.

 

 

Well pork products have been served during breakfast hours for the longest, in the way of bacon, Canadian bacon, ham, and pork sausage in select regions.

 

And there has always been the seasonal McRib, as well as a chicken BLT, some "wraps" with bacon, and to my knowledge their recently discontinued Angus burgers had a variant which was served with bacon. As Fresh Pond elaborated above, as of recently a McDouble can be specified with bacon, and to my knowledge so can a Quarter Pounder.

 

On a side note, I don't even eat there much and yet I can remember all this crap off of my head. Some effective advertising or what?

thanks for the cultural lesson!

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They use bacon...you can order a burger with bacon on it, and one of their new McDoubles comes with bacon IIRC

 

 

While it is true that pork products are not Halal (permissible) which makes it haraam (non permissible), there are other criteria for different meats to make it halal. The criteria for non-pork items include its source, the cause of the animal's death, and how it was processed.

 

The food must come from a supplier that uses halal practices. Specifically, the slaughter must be performed by a Muslim, who must precede the slaughter by invoking the name of Allah. Then, the animal must be slaughtered with a sharp knife (so the animal does not feel pain, as it quickens the death) by cutting the throat, windpipe and the blood vessels in the neck, causing the animal’s death without cutting the spinal cord. Lastly, the blood from the veins must be drained. This final step is performed because blood can harbor harmful bacteria, and also to ensure that there are no blood clots, thus keeping the entire body safe and clean to be eaten.

 

So in short no you are not mistaken, but there is more to halal than just restrictions.

 

 

Well pork products have been served during breakfast hours for the longest, in the way of bacon, Canadian bacon, ham, and pork sausage in select regions.

 

And there has always been the seasonal McRib, as well as a chicken BLT, some "wraps" with bacon, and to my knowledge their recently discontinued Angus burgers had a variant which was served with bacon. As Fresh Pond elaborated above, as of recently a McDouble can be specified with bacon, and to my knowledge so can a Quarter Pounder.

 

On a side note, I don't even eat there much and yet I can remember all this crap off of my head. Some effective advertising or what?

lol... That shows you how long ago and how often I ate at McDonald's... Circa 2003 I think? I have been in one since but I refused to eat anything. The smell of the "food" just grossed me out. So artificial smelling when you have real food.

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