M42 and M50 win Pokey Awards as city's slowest bus routes M42, M50 city's slowest bus routes

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Oh, no one's doubting Manhattan's crosstowns are slow, that isn't the problem w/ the "award"

 

Andrew has a point - It's misleading (and underhanded, if you ask me).... It's based from a biased sample.

The "award" is supposed to be representative of the "city's slowest bus routes" - That's implicating the other 4 boroughs as well.... 

AFAIK, the "pokey" has always went to a manhattan crosstown.... Let me put it in the form of a question - When didn't the "pokey" go to a manhattan crosstown? (rhetorical, and a tint of sarcasm, but anyone can go head & answer if they know it)....

 

But yeah, more to your point, I walk if I'm heading east-west within manhattan (south of central park, I mean) also..... Within the confines (and north of) central park (meaning, anything north of 59th), I have no reason to get from one side to the other, so it isn't an issue.... Anyway, gotten to the point where I got used to walking from Canal st to Canal st/Bowery....

lol... Yeah I suppose you could argue that they are biased but then again when you think of slow buses, I think most folks automatically think of Manhattan before any other borough.  

[Q43LTD]

What about Bronx crosstowns? Brooklyn crosstowns? Didn't they used to do it by borough?

[Via Garibaldi 8]

What about Bronx crosstowns? Brooklyn crosstowns? Didn't they used to do it by borough?

The Bronx doesn't really have "crosstown" buses and neither does Brooklyn.  You could call the Bx12 a Bronx crosstown and that's an SBS service.  The B1 could be considered a "crosstown"...  The B1 could use a limited stop or SBS variant though...

[Fresh Pond]

The Bronx doesn't really have "crosstown" buses and neither does Brooklyn. You could call the Bx12 a Bronx crosstown and that's an SBS service. The B1 could be considered a "crosstown"... The B1 could use a limited stop or SBS variant though...

B1, 3, 6, 7, 8, 9, 11, 12, 14, 25, 26, 35, 36, 38, 45, 52, 54, 57, 60, 62, 65, 82 and 103 could all count as crosstown routes...

 

Limited stop or SBS service won't help the B1 problem at all

[Via Garibaldi 8]

B1, 3, 6, 7, 8, 9, 11, 12, 14, 25, 26, 35, 36, 38, 45, 52, 54, 57, 60, 62, 65, 82 and 103 could all count as crosstown routes...

 

Limited stop or SBS service won't help the B1 problem at all

I suppose but none of these buses are true crosstowns... You could throw a few more buses in there as well such as the B4 if you wanted... I disagree about the B1... Boarding is a major problem on the line and perhaps the RTS's are another issue.  New low floor buses would help too.

[AndrewJC]

I actually think it's fairly accurate.

 

I'm questioning the methodology, not the results. Not only did they limit the survey to 34 bus routes, but their sample size for each was one single round trip in the summer.

 

How about using BusTime data (where available) to evaluate every bus, with hundreds if not thousands of samples readily available without even setting foot on a bus?

[Fresh Pond]

I suppose but none of these buses are true crosstowns... You could throw a few more buses in there as well such as the B4 if you wanted... I disagree about the B1... Boarding is a major problem on the line and perhaps the RTS's are another issue. New low floor buses would help too.

It don't matter what kind of bus you use on that B1. Even with low floor buses, the B1 still suffers, sometimes even worse because people don't step up to the back level and everyone crowds around the front

[Q43LTD]

B1, 3, 6, 7, 8, 9, 11, 12, 14, 25, 26, 35, 36, 38, 45, 52, 54, 57, 60, 62, 65, 82 and 103 could all count as crosstown routes...

 

Limited stop or SBS service won't help the B1 problem at all

You could throw in the B15 and the 100 as crosstowns...

[B35 via Church]

What does the term crosstown mean to some of you?

 

To me, it's not a route that simply travels in an east-west direction......

[B35 via Church]

Too late to edit the above post... ah well....

 

 

lol... Yeah I suppose you could argue that they are biased but then again when you think of slow buses, I think most folks automatically think of Manhattan before any other borough.  

....Like QJT

 

Anyway, What you mention (while it's a convenient excuse they could use) doesn't give them a pass though....

 

What about Bronx crosstowns? Brooklyn crosstowns? Didn't they used to do it by borough?

They did? I don't remember that at all....

5 different pokey winners for a given year? Nah.....

[bobtehpanda]

What does the term crosstown mean to some of you?

 

To me, it's not a route that simply travels in an east-west direction......

 

A good definition of a cross-town would be something traveling perpendicular to the "primary" commute direction (which would be towards Manhattan).

Too late to edit the above post... ah well....

 

 

....Like QJT

 

Anyway, What you mention (while it's a convenient excuse they could use) doesn't give them a pass though....

 

They did? I don't remember that at all....

5 different pokey winners for a given year? Nah.....

 

I do remember last year (or two years ago) that the Q58 won a Pokey with an average speed of 7.0MPH.

[JubaionBx12+SBS]

A good definition of a cross-town would be something traveling perpendicular to the "primary" commute direction (which would be towards Manhattan).

 

 

I do remember last year (or two years ago) that the Q58 won a Pokey with an average speed of 7.0MPH.

The way i've understood the Pokey is that the slowest route wins and others (like the runner-up Manhattan crosstowns and slowest route for each outer borough) are listed as honorable mention basically. Not all routes listed in the full table of speeds are said "honorable mentions" as many are placed in for comparison. 

 

The north-south Manhattan buses seem to have a different issue from the crosstowns. They're always on the Schleppie list (especially the M101/102/103). At some point those routes should not be given schedules rather riders should be given approximate headways at the stop and be told to consult BusTime for accurate location data. This year is the first year of my knowledge that a Queens route made the Schleppie honorable mention. To my surprise the Q85 is said route (now I see why Astoria Line would always talk trash about it). I personally would like to hear from someone who frequently uses or fans buses in Jamaica about why the Q85 has issues with reliability. On a side note, why on earth are any Staten Island routes on the list? The routes out there tend to have low ridership and high headways which are factors favorable for reliable service. What mess is going on with the S78 and S74? 

[Via Garibaldi 8]

I'm questioning the methodology, not the results. Not only did they limit the survey to 34 bus routes, but their sample size for each was one single round trip in the summer. How about using BusTime data (where available) to evaluate every bus, with hundreds if not thousands of samples readily available without even setting foot on a bus?

Well yeah they've got an agenda and that's to get something done for the M42.  I don't have a problem with it quite frankly.  The M42 should have SBS service just like the M34 does.  

 

It don't matter what kind of bus you use on that B1. Even with low floor buses, the B1 still suffers, sometimes even worse because people don't step up to the back level and everyone crowds around the front

I beg to differ.  For those who need the B1 for longer distances, SBS service would help tremendously as would artics to allow people to get on and off faster.  The thing is you couldn't skimp on local bus service too much because there are so many damn stops along 86th with a few people getting on or off.

 

What does the term crosstown mean to some of you?

 

To me, it's not a route that simply travels in an east-west direction......

That's what I think of when I hear "Crosstown" but even the ones in Manhattan aren't true Crosstowns since most of them have to travel north or south at some point to make the "Crosstown" commute.

[B35 via Church]

That's what I think of when I hear "Crosstown" but even the ones in Manhattan aren't true Crosstowns since most of them have to travel north or south at some point to make the "Crosstown" commute.

When I hear the term "crosstown", I think along along the lines of, clear across town (or in our [NYC's] case, across the borough).... So to me, the manhattan east-west routes suffice (you can argue Manhattan isn't all that wide going east to west, but it is what it is - from the FDR to West st, however many miles it is).... It's immaterial to me if the manhattan crosstowns travel north/south at some point; it doesn't exactly have to travel east-west for 100% of the trip, way I see it.....

 

But certainly, any ole route traveling easterly or westerly in the middle of a borough (like the B100, for example), nah.....

 

A good definition of a cross-town would be something traveling perpendicular to the "primary" commute direction (which would be towards Manhattan).

 

 

I do remember last year (or two years ago) that the Q58 won a Pokey with an average speed of 7.0MPH.

1) Interesting.... You could look at it like that.....

 

2) For Queens, yeah....

The year they mentioned the Q58 was the year that the M34 won the "award" for being the slowest route in the city........

 

It's like saying the B46 is the highest utilized route (#1) in Brooklyn, but it's not the highest utilized route in the city (going by the "official" numbers, that is).....

[qjtransitmaster]

A good definition of a cross-town would be something traveling perpendicular to the "primary" commute direction (which would be towards Manhattan).

 

I do remember last year (or two years ago) that the Q58 won a Pokey with an average speed of 7.0MPH.

Do you always beat me to the punch like that man ? Just kidding but yes that is one way of looking at it. Another definition of crosstown would be bus routes perpendicular to higher capacity transit modes like in Nassau county you can call all North to south routes crosstowns like N80 Broadway crosstown N40/41 Greenwich crosstown or N73/74 Levittown crosstown. Or in Westchester county W13 Westchester ave crosstown and 66 ardsley scarsdale crosstown or W7 Yonkers ave crosstown. In Newark the 90 series are crosstowns. And so on.

[S79 Select bus servi]

The only "mess" going on with the S74/S78 is that their routes are ridiculously long (lenth-based, not time-travel-based) 

The S74/S78 get pretty ugly during the rush hours. The only routes that are unreliable to me during middays are S62, S48.

Even the S53 is excellent at sticking to its schedule.

 

On SI, if buses are within 5 minutes apart according to schedule, the later bus may easliy cacth up to it

Example: S54 to WNB comes to great kills at 7:32am. The S54 to Brielle-Gansevoort (skips hosp) comes at 7:37 but usually wins the race to wagner HS

 

 

And we all know the fastest "crosstown" is the S40 (east-west) 

If you define it as paralell to the common direction, you can say the S59, 54, or 57