What if the Polo Grounds Shuttle/Culver Av Shuttle never closed and still survived today?

[Javier]

I see...

 

Btw, isn't the tunnel between Sedgwick and Yankee Stadium sealed off or was the seal broken last year?

[MysteriousBtrain]

Just a general statement the 148th St terminal didn't even open until the late 1960s. It probably wouldn't even exist today if the extension occurred, and maybe even have 145th st extend its platform to fit 10 car trains.

If the polos were unable for expansion or the Yankees station relocation had to tear down the polo shuttle tracks, a bridge that would run be running from 145th to 167th Street (the tracks would make an upper level and the connection would be made at where the polo tracks originally were) is a possible way the extension could of worked. 148th street would not operate and close under this plan.

I'd probably work the sea level problem out with the northbound track rising up sightly on the side of the yard, then the southbound track traveling underneath the track when it gets the chance.

[Javier]

Because I remember last year I read somewhere that some teens threw a party in the Sedgwick Av tunnels, but I thought those tunnels were sealed off after 9/11.

[Wallyhorse]

Because I remember last year I read somewhere that some teens threw a party in the Sedgwick Av tunnels, but I thought those tunnels were sealed off after 9/11.

The plan I have does NOT use those tunnels, especially since you have to take any such line further south due to where Yankee Stadium now is.

 

You would have to have this version go via East 157th Street next to Heritage Park and swing north there, as noted most likely allowing this version to stop at 161-Yankee Stadium.

[MysteriousBtrain]

The plan I have does NOT use those tunnels, especially since you have to take any such line further south due to where Yankee Stadium now is.

 

You would have to have this version go via East 157th Street next to Heritage Park and swing north there, as noted most likely allowing this version to stop at 161-Yankee Stadium.

I'd rather have 153rd Street be used, as 153rd is a more "direct route" than 157th Street.

[Fresh Pond]

Once again...

 

How is the line gonna get to the Bronx with that entire area at sea level, and the Harlem River Drive being right in the way impeding any bridge?

[Javier]

Not to mention the houses and residents complaining about their "privacy".

[Wallyhorse]

Once again...

 

How is the line gonna get to the Bronx with that entire area at sea level, and the Harlem River Drive being right in the way impeding any bridge?

Right!

Like I said as well, this would be next-to if not impossible.  Too many engineering obstacles to overcome in this case.

[MysteriousBtrain]

Once again...

 

How is the line gonna get to the Bronx with that entire area at sea level, and the Harlem River Drive being right in the way impeding any bridge?

Can't the line go shift through the columns under the FDR and slowly rise up via 153/157 St and river to meet the Jerome line? Not that this would happen, but can't it be a possibility?

[Fresh Pond]

Can't the line go shift through the columns under the FDR and slowly rise up via 153/157 St and river to meet the Jerome line? Not that this would happen, but can't it be a possibility?

It would be a very steep grade for a bridge, and boats and whatnot would only have clearance on one side of this hypothetical (Bronx side) side of the bridge

[Javier]

What do you guys think if the Culver Shuttle remained, the spur would have been demolished and rebuilt facing towards Manhattan, so the can be exetended down to 9th AV

[NewFlyer 230]

I don't see it happening. Plus ridership would still be light since the doesn't touch Manhattan. I'm sure people would have used it back in the day and transfer to the but that wasn't really the case for the shuttle.

[bobtehpanda]

If clearance is a problem, couldn't you just dive under the Harlem River and then transition to an elevated line in the Bronx, merging with the before 161 St?

[NewFlyer 230]

If clearance is a problem, couldn't you just dive under the Harlem River and then transition to an elevated line in the Bronx, merging with the before 161 St?

The question is how deep is that River. If it is deep it won't be that easy to structure a tunnel being so close to the water as it is.

[Javier]

So using the old original tunnels are out, making an elevated line is out, so the only way is to make a underground line first then transition to a elevated line.

[Kamen Rider]

or you just accept it's never going to happen and move on.

[MysteriousBtrain]

So using the old original tunnels are out, making an elevated line is out, so the only way is to make a underground line first then transition to a elevated line.

How do we make the go underground to meet the without harming the way the Harlem residents live.

[Xfer2Nowhere]

If the Culver Shuttle was still around, it would make an alternate routing via 4th Avenue for either a prospective Culver Express service separate from the  (one that could possibly run via Broadway or Nassau Street) or an alternate for the  itself in case of GOs. There would be no need for a shuttle in that case during the week at least.

[Wallyhorse]

If the Culver Shuttle was still around, it would make an alternate routing via 4th Avenue for either a prospective Culver Express service separate from the  (one that could possibly run via Broadway or Nassau Street) or an alternate for the  itself in case of GOs. There would be no need for a shuttle in that case during the week at least.

My plan would be for an actual route.  This perhaps could even down the road be a potential 24/7 route for the where it goes to Coney Island via 4th Avenue, a rebuilt Culver Shuttle (now full-time El) though slightly off the old route and the existing Culver route while allowing the outside of rush hours and late nights to terminate mostly at Kings Highway.  Such would also give CPW a 6th Avenue local line at all times (the could be extended to Brighton Beach to replace the if that happened).  

 

Another option would be for this to bring access to the Broadway line via Culver by having the run to Coney Island or Kings Highway this way.

[bobtehpanda]

The question is how deep is that River. If it is deep it won't be that easy to structure a tunnel being so close to the water as it is.

 

It's 22 feet deep, which is about a two story building. It wouldn't be particularly hard to do for the , especially since there are already other river crossings as tunnels in the area (Lex, the )

How do we make the go underground to meet the without harming the way the Harlem residents live.

 

Underground to the Bronx, and going aboveground somewhere near Yankee Stadium would be the least disruptive route.

[RailRunRob]

It's 22 feet deep, which is about a two story building. It wouldn't be particularly hard to do for the , especially since there are already other river crossings as tunnels in the area (Lex, the )

 

 

Underground to the Bronx, and going aboveground somewhere near Yankee Stadium would be the least disruptive route.

Yeah that's not bad at all that's about 800"-1000" of track should be able to clear 22-24 feet @ a 3% grade some of the steepest grades on the subway are upwards of 5% so if they really had to dig they could..1600" of track @ 2% would be smooth as ice could clear an additional 30+ feet easy.. What type of sediment for the bed of The harlem river? and How were the other tunnels built Boring and pressurized or just dropped into place and sank which would have been clock work for minor depths like that?

[NewFlyer 230]

or you just accept it's never going to happen and move on.

Damn it Im sorry I accidentally gave you a thumbs down and I don't know how to reverse it.

But I agree if it can't ever happen then there is no use thinking of a way to get the to the Bronx.

[RailRunRob]

Damn it Im sorry I accidentally gave you a thumbs down and I don't know how to reverse it.

But I agree if it can't ever happen then there is no use thinking of a way to get the to the Bronx.

How do you know it can't happen? 

[Fresh Pond]

How do you know it can't happen?

The portal that the comes out is about 200' away from the water's edge. Any tunnel to the Bronx would have it looping clockwise around the yard (and 148 St station) just to get the necessary grade clearance for a tunnel.

 

You would have to completely redesign the whole station and yard area (which sits under a building) just for some hypothetical extension

[Wallyhorse]

The portal that the comes out is about 200' away from the water's edge. Any tunnel to the Bronx would have it looping clockwise around the yard (and 148 St station) just to get the necessary grade clearance for a tunnel.

 

You would have to completely redesign the whole station and yard area (which sits under a building) just for some hypothetical extension

Right!

 

I doubt anyone thought of the idea to extend the by having it run to The Bronx when they were building the station at 148th back in the 1960's or even before that.