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Joe

Holding down the deadmans

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Throughout the entire run, does the T/O have to keep the deadmans held down the entire way, or can they let it go during a station stop? The few times i've peeked at a T/O operating they seem to keep it down the entire way...will the train dump if it's not moving?

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The T/o can release the deadman but only when the train is stopped and a full service brake application is made. Anything else, and he will dump the train.

 

On AMUE equipment, the T/O should have a solid bite of brake on to prevent the car from rolling, but he can only release the deadman if he centers the reverser.

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Throughout the entire run, does the T/O have to keep the deadmans held down the entire way, or can they let it go during a station stop? The few times i've peeked at a T/O operating they seem to keep it down the entire way...will the train dump if it's not moving?

 

You can let go if you put the brakes in "full service". Most T/O's will still hold the deadman down during station stops because they only hold a small brake so once they get indication from the C/R they can release and go.

 

If you take a full service brake and let go during every station stop you will lose alot of time and get your C/R very mad because this gives him extra time to get abused by the riding public that generally have no respect for him.

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That makes sense, is full service the strongest brake application short of emergency?

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but with the new high tech cars i read you only have to push a button every 20 seconds to prove you're alive. and by the time exam 8098 pushes out some new employees, i think all the new trains will be rolled out by then

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Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 2_2_1 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/525.18.1 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/3.1.1 Mobile/5H11 Safari/525.20)

 

but with the new high tech cars i read you only have to push a button every 20 seconds to prove you're alive. and by the time exam 8098 pushes out some new employees, i think all the new trains will be rolled out by then

That is called ATO and the only line that is set up for it is the L. The L runs it ONLY for a few hours during the middle of the night. This after they have been equipping the line for over 7 years.

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Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 2_2_1 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/525.18.1 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/3.1.1 Mobile/5H11 Safari/525.20)

 

 

That is called ATO and the only line that is set up for it is the L. The L runs it ONLY for a few hours during the middle of the night. This after they have been equipping the line for over 7 years.

 

I could be wrong but from what I've seen lately, the R143s run ATO all day long now. Today this morning around 9:15 AM I saw 3 R143s heading towards Manhattan running automatically. Last week I've ridden on a few R143s running in ATO during morning rush hour.

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I could be wrong but from what I've seen lately, the R143s run ATO all day long now. Today this morning around 9:15 AM I saw 3 R143s heading towards Manhattan running automatically. Last week I've ridden on a few R143s running in ATO during morning rush hour.

 

You may be right I don't work that line and never will again. I haven't noticed any new notices saying they run it all day now though.

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Throughout the entire run, does the T/O have to keep the deadmans held down the entire way, or can they let it go during a station stop? The few times i've peeked at a T/O operating they seem to keep it down the entire way...will the train dump if it's not moving?

 

 

Since I am in the mood to be a technical pr!ck right now, you hold down the master controller on the older equipment (keep it twisted on NTT trains). The deadman is a feature, that is activated when the master controller (aka MC), is let go, when the train isn't in full service. Doesn't matter whether you are moving or not. Not in full service, chow!!!! They now call it testing the pilot valve (guess deadmen complained they didn't like that name, since it is discriminatory against deadmen, lol)..........

Edited by DOB2RTO

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I could be wrong but from what I've seen lately, the R143s run ATO all day long now. Today this morning around 9:15 AM I saw 3 R143s heading towards Manhattan running automatically. Last week I've ridden on a few R143s running in ATO during morning rush hour.

 

How is that possble? During the day the (L) line uses some R160s which don't ATO installed in them yet IIRC. If thats true then they must be running ATO R143s with R160s that still have to be operated manually on the (L) at the same time. I always thought that since ATO started on the midnights all the 160s get layed up and the line is 100% R143.

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How is that possble? During the day the (L) line uses some R160s which don't ATO installed in them yet IIRC. If thats true then they must be running ATO R143s with R160s that still have to be operated manually on the (L) at the same time. I always thought that since ATO started on the midnights all the 160s get layed up and the line is 100% R143.

 

They run the R143s and R160s at the same time.

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That makes sense, is full service the strongest brake application short of emergency?

 

Yes.

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An interesting thing that i thought that i would bring up is this:

When I was in Toronto Canada, riding on the TTC (the subway) I noticed that they like to operate trains aggressively (to keep the 2 minute 30 sec interval in between trains). For those of you who don’t know, in Toronto, they use 6 car 75ft trains. The operator will go out full speed and brake hard. In fact there appears to be a special feature that allows the T/O to use the dead man’s handle as an active braking function, regardless of car type. Once, for example, we were coming into a station at 45 mph and the T/O just let go (took his hand off) of the controller as we passed the beginning of the platform from 3rd point to deadman’s activation (full service). The train coasted smoothly to a stop precisely on the stop indicator sign with the T/O just sitting there looking bored.

Keep in mind that the platform is shorter (460 ft avg.) than here (620 ft avg.). And the really cool thing was that it was ALL dynamic down to 5 mph.

:eek:

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I was just talking to a someone that works the (L) regularly. He said you can tell when the train is in ATO by the quick, hard stop, and the "thunk" noise as if an operator held a heavy brake for the final stop, every stop. If the train stops with no "thunk" noise, most likely an operator made it.. I don't know, I don't work over there..

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I was just talking to a someone that works the (L) regularly. He said you can tell when the train is in ATO by the quick, hard stop, and the "thunk" noise as if an operator held a heavy brake for the final stop, every stop. If the train stops with no "thunk" noise, most likely an operator made it.. I don't know, I don't work over there..

I don't know about that. The (L) trains that I've ridden in ATO seem to run better than with a T/O behind it. In my opinion the train in ATO stops smoother and runs quicker. Also, you can tell if a train is running in ATO before it arrives at the station because the signals leading to the station will be flashing.

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Also, you can tell if a train is running in ATO before it arrives at the station because the signals leading to the station will be flashing.

 

That's not true the signals will be flashing for CBTC also and a T/O will be operating. I have heard the same thing about the computer making very hard stops because it is ALLOWED to come in faster than we are.

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That's not true the signals will be flashing for CBTC also and a T/O will be operating. I have heard the same thing about the computer making very hard stops because it is ALLOWED to come in faster than we are.

 

mmm interesting.

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When a T/O picked the (L) Line they get CBTC/ATO quilification. I got it last year just couldn't use ATO. I am thinking about picking the (L) this pick.

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I have a better idea for a deadman's switch. On the handle you use to accelerate (on NTT's, R44's and R46's, to accelerate and brake) you must have a firm grip on it. Frokm what I read the R160 deadman sounds painful.

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I think that on newer cars they should have used a handle like the one that they have on LIRR M3 cars. It is a combine handle that is held down and rotates to take power or a bit of air for breaking.

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I think that on newer cars they should have used a handle like the one that they have on LIRR M3 cars. It is a combine handle that is held down and rotates to take power or a bit of air for breaking.

 

I think the "T" controller is fine but 1) it has to be in the middle and 2) I think the brake should still be separate. It's more intuitve that way.

 

One handle can be the "T" controller OFF / Min Power / all the way thru Max power

 

then, separate, the brake valve. The "T" controller is good b/c if a T/O were to fall asleep, maintaining a firm grip in the wrist is one of the first things to go and you avoid a dangerous situation like someone falling onto the controller, like Layton Gibson or that poor guy who had the heart attacked in the relay at 179 all those years ago

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