EastFlatbushLarry

with all due respect to everyone on this board, I would hope people understand history dictating a process such as this. from the creation of MaBSTOA in 1962, to the takeover of Avenue B & Broadway in the 1980's, to the finality of the NYCTA/MaBSTOA consolidation pick process in the early 2000's took approx. 40+ years. yes, Bus Company will be around for a hot minute. it'll pretty much take all the pre-consolidation (incumbent) employees retiring on all 3 sides in order for this process to "begin". by the way, in my opinion, i firmly believe that a full surface transit merger won't happen until I'm a retiree in approx. 2042 (God willing) bringing it back to the topic at hand, i do however feel as if the network redesigns in some small way (specifically in reference to Queens) is a way to adjust the workforce numbers in favor of TA Queens (ATU 1056) as opposed to Bus Company (TWU & ATU 1179). as has been pointed out, its hella early to conjure up an adequate depot assignment list, however, i will say that in my personal opinion, i do see the runs/lines favoring NYCTA Queens Division. just though I'd add these points

fair point(s). can't argue with that line of thinking. that backtracking into Jamaica via the 54 from Lefferts (for example) just to connect to the 44 does seem a bit much. if there's room for legitimate thru traffic across queens blvd, then I'm with it.

THIS. i have yet to hear from anyone, on this forum or in those communities, any legitimate reasoning as to why a 10/64 combination is a good idea, letalone the outcry for such a thing to exist.

THIS. there could easily be scenarios where depots could/could've gone bye-bye if work is/was assigned a certain way. there's still a healthy amount of anxiety pertaining to the potential for b/o's to flip from Bus Company to TA based solely on work availability or the lack thereof. it's still rather early, however, there are alot of moving parts (unions) in Queens Division and it's a healthy discussion nevertheless. i sincerely hope all parties affected are in fact paying attention.

for this reason (this topic specifically) is why i was initially reluctant to speak on the network redesigns, because i can't help but wonder what will end up where and in what capacity, because that determines how effective and efficient these "new" ideas are

absolutely. those 16's and 17's do rather well as is. and the 15 is no slouch even with the Woodhaven stops. i used to commute to 100 street depot from lindenwood on a somewhat regular basis some years back (QM15 to 3rd Avenue, then 101,102 or 103 to work) it was actually one of the best experiences i had riding any bus, express or local. and I'm not just speaking about early morning commutes.. I was on the am extra list so the 15 was my go-to between 6 & 11am.

exactly. i remember when the 16 & 17 used to loop thru lindenwood with the 15

I'm assuming the 15's existence is predicated on the fact that lindenwood residents don't/didn't want to fight for limited seats on 16's & 17's emanating from the rockaways

in discussions I've had with my shop steward and other ranking members of TWU, this entire redesign, regardless of if certain lines retain the exact routing, headway or designations, gives the authority full control of what lines/runs go where, specifically between Bus Company & TA/OA. in regards to Queens, it's my understanding that routes will be assigned based on proximity, and not hold to the depot alignments prior to whenever the redesigned network is implemented. with that being said, anything can (and usually does) change, and in my opinion, based on some of the line consolidations that are proposed, i definitely see Bus Company depots losing out on lines & runs, UNLESS there's going to be significant amount of lines being split between TA & Bus Co. yards in order to accommodate everyone. if not, i can definitely see a potential "messy" situation for all unions affected (TWU & the ATU Locals)

glad someone else pointed it out. can't get something "new" without chopping away at the old. I guess the woodhull nurses & hha's that work north of DeKalb will be overjoyed with the fact that no matter what, it'll be a 2 bus ride to reach Bushwick/Williamsburg via Utica/Malcom X Blvd. that layover area for the 46sbs is already a mess (with or without artics) hell, back in the day, it was a zoo for the 46 LTD/local short signs, i can't imagine trying to turn back all 46 service at DeKalb unless there's a fulton street short sign or they go full nuclear and short turn even more buses at eastern pkwy. anyway, that B53 on paper is an absolute joke: northern leg of the 24 + the 32 + some ADA substitute for the via a full broadway bus line = trash. i can't imagine that line ever being on time the way traffic on Broadway has deteriorated over the past several years. THIS. it really seems like they're going to attempt to do the bare minimum headway on this one, aside from 24/7 services and extending it to 82nd street at worst, a line like this should have 10-12 minute headways to provide clean-up duty for the sbs52/53. yeah, I've often thought about what exactly can be done with the 35 to get itself away from the parking lot that is flatbush avenue (which used to be an issue during rush hours, now off-peak there seems to be problems getting thru that area around flatbush depot) i honestly want a reroute off flatbush via fillmore/gerritsen/Nostrand since after all, the purpose of the Q35 is not to provide alternate service for the B41, but to get customers to the as efficiently as possible which isn't currently happening via Flatbush Avenue over the past almost 3 years I've been utilizing the 22 more frequently than I ever have and i have noticed that a significant amount of employees at the various 5 towns stores live in the rockaways, and I'm talking about from hammels, arverne & edgemere. that current set up of trying to catch the 113/114 off the hope that the 22 is on time is annoying to be polite. this is why the dollar vans clean up the way they do from beach 90 to beach 20. so for me, any attempt to offset the dollar vans and actually help a sizeable employee base at 5 towns is somewhat admirable on transit's behalf. at least they didn't attempt to extend the 113 or 114 to edgemere or hammels.

Q109 = a "crosstown" version of the Q41 via 109 avenue (i see what you did there, transit), without carrying air into howard beach. The q11 being chopped in favor of the q21: didn't see that one coming... not by a LONG shot. and 24 hour service on the 21 via lindenwood/84 Street? i dig it, however, we'll see how long that lasts. the Q52 & 53 running to & from 74/broadway: in regards to the 53... FINALLY! that layover on 61st with artics is atrocious, letalone traffic along Roosevelt to 61st. my natural assumption is that the 52/53 will both run out of La Guardia Depot and possibly interline at 74/Broadway, but time will tell. The Guy R. Brewer corridor: yikes... and not necessarily in a bad way. i mean the 111 & 114 basically bypassing most of Guy Brew in favor of the 111 short-sign (Q115... geez, they love upping the ante with these triple digit route numbers, innit?) is at first glance disgusting, but if you really think about it (or have ever commuted along Guy Brew in the first place) you'd overstand that most 113's, 114's & 111's from rosedale are ram-jam packed by the time they reach farmers, letalone Rochdale village, so they're already being "bypassed" anyway. thankfully, artics run along Brewer and at under 10 minute headway out of farmers, the Q115 SHOULD be ok. they seem to have a perpetual hard-on for combining the Q10 & 64... they're philosophy must be to kill 2 birds with one stone: run artics out of one depot across 2 corridors because other than this, i don't see the necessity to merge lefferts & jewel into one. my swing time is up. i have some other thoughts about the brooklyn/queens routes, but my brain is processing alot of info. plus, the express network. i truly hope that any queens residents on this forum offer their authentic analysis regarding this redesign based on their past & present commuting patterns because... damn, son. 🤟🏾✌🏾

i thought i saw somewhere that the B15 has a AirTrain Station code. I'm assuming that the code hasn't been programed into other units. regardless, that's not a major issue/problem imo, as long as announcements are made

to be honest, over the years I've had conversations about how there isn't a CMF on staten island, a dedicated CMF for the bronx aside from the general CMF at zerega and possibly a dedicated brooklyn/queens CMF in brooklyn aside from Grand Avenue, especially now since east ny is bus company CMF. imo it makes absolutely no sense to have 3 CMF's for such a vast, diverse and growing fleet. the practices they have all in the name of saving money or to limit spending is completely ass backwards. as big as the bus company's fleet is, the logical way to do business is only have east ny be the CMF? why isn't there a feasible facility at Eastchester? aside from scrapping buses, there's no way to get that going?

recently, i rode one those units on the 53 when the artics were grounded and wondered the same thing, especially when we approached rockaway blvd/liberty av... at this point, it seems like laziness as to why the luggage racks haven't been removed. seating capacity is severely being compromised

NYCT: S79 SBS. if you have a B/O that is experienced, it's definitely worth the ride... mind you, I don't fan bus lines at all, but i definitely did when they sbs'd this bad boy. MaBSTOA: Bx12 SBS. i rode this because i considered transferring to Gun Hill for a late run some years ago (didn't pull the trigger) and was shocked at how quickly we got to Broadway from Pelham. loved every second of the ride. MTA Bus Co: Q53 (current day AND Pre-SBS) i adore the Q53. i had a classmate who went to La Guardia after we were laid off, and homeboy had a RTS on his 53 LTD run. i was hooked instantly. and the current SBS? even with the bunching, i dig this line IDGAF. now i know this wasn't asked, but I'll offer my favorite lines to operate (obviously, i can't provide a Bus Co. line) NYCTA: B17 (both branches) i strictly preferred 17 only runs (i despise 14/17 splits tbh) MaBSTOA: tied between the Bx3 & Bx13 (the runs interline depending on what you pick, and i prefer 3/13 splits tbh)

thank you for this, because now that you mention it, i vaguely remember the NYBS training classroom on wheels in lower Manhattan (the bulky blue International bus) and i also remember Varsity Transportation. I've always wondered what the set up was with those PBL companies in comparison to TA/OA... the similarities, differences... or if there were any differences from an employee aspect (it's well documented that the passenger experience changed, in some cases for the better... if you ask my homeboy that grew up in Co-op, in regards to QBx1 vs the Bx23/Q50, he begs to differ) My experience with PBL's as a youth was damn near non existent. i mean, i never rode Command bus until I was attending South Shore, and although i had family living in Edgemere projects, i never rode the Q22 or 35 to/from Brooklyn back in the Green Lines days. most of my PBL experience came seconds before the takeover as I was just getting ready to figure out what to do before/after graduating h.s.

speaking along the lines of PBL's, i do have a question. how was training carried out amongst the PBL's in regards to the Bus Operators? was there one central facility for NYCDOT to train all operators regardless of company affiliation or was it carried out at the individual companies? stupid question i guess, but I've had this on my brain going back to high school (2001-2005) and somehow I've never asked 🤷🏾‍♂️

i must say that i agree wholeheartedly. those buses will carry air, however, i believe the reason they decided to terminate those lines at Parsons - Hillside is to safely/easily have buses utilize the layover area on Hillside as opposed to the current Q40 layover/turnaround at 88 Avenue & 148 street, which is a considerable nuisance.

is there an article or pdf you can provide for more reading on this subject? I'd be very interested in understanding more. much appreciated

2 totally unrelated issues. the reason why MTA was able to take over the SIM23/24 is because they simply took over operation of the work ALONE. meaning they only took over the runs and lines themselves. The reason why MTA Bus was created is because they took over lines, runs, equipment, Depots AND all personnel, which did NOT occur with the SIM23/24 situation. MTA Bus Company is currently "separate" (technically) due to the incumbent (PBL) employees seniority protection, pension benefits protection, etc.

if I'm not mistaken, the SIM23/24 runs are assigned to Charleston Depot

i read in the Chief newspaper that the decertification vote was close, like barely half of the membership was in favor of leaving 1181, however recently I've received info that the part timers in SC are usually offered full-time positions at ATU 1179 (JFK/FR) and in some cases SC, after a period of 3-12 months... NO MENTION of full time offers to TWU yards (LG, BP, etc.) so that alone led me to believe that SOMETHING happened to prevent TWU from representing those employees (I'm of the personal belief that management doesn't want TWU at SC, but it's a lengthy theory i have)

to my understanding, Spring Creek is still under ATU 1181. I could be wrong, but I'd love to get verification one way or the other.

those units were probably being serviced at ENY Base Shop, which is the CMF (Central Maintenance Facility) for Bus Company. so it's possible they were performing a diagnostics run thru Canarsie

to my understanding (and feel free to correct me/correspond with me if I'm wrong) the reason why WF is giving up the Bx39 is so that they'll acquire the M125. what's supposed to happen (and i KNOW that info can change at any point) is that we (Kingsbridge) will lose runs (obviously) on the Bx15 due to reallocated resources (runs/buses) kingsbridge will send WF most of what they'll need to run artic service on 125th. management doesn't want shorties on the M125, due to the headway they intend on running (which would be every 3-4 minutes WITH 40 footers instead of 8 minutes with artics) AND to my understanding, Manhattanville wouldn't be able to accommodate that type of work in the first place... that place is already jam packed as is (run-wise) and what exactly are they willing to lose to take on the M125? nothing. in regards to OF (Mother Clara Hale): the general consensus in that building is firstly they're not getting ANY more work for the foreseeable future... not some retooled M102, not the Bx19, not the full M35 (which they're slowly trying to pawn off on 100 street) nothing. secondly, IF they were to somehow take on any more work, the Bx33 & M2 (which Manhattanville WILL want "adequate" compensation for) would be the first choices well before the M125. finally, IF any more artic work were to be miraculously assigned to Hale, the Bx19 would be the choice... not the scraped together remnants of the Bx15.