Today is the first anniversary of the devastating bus cuts

[Via Garibaldi 8]

You obviously read too far into the replies. Quit jumping the gun.

 

Yeah, I said that those people didnt deserve the x90. So what? Compared to every other Express Bus rider I've met and rode with on every line I've been on, the x90 folks were the definition of assholish-elitism. Why do I say that? Because they didn't appreciate a goddamned thing every time a bus pulled up into the stop. They didnt appreciate the buses, hell, they didnt even appreciate the drivers that DROVE on the line! And now that its gone, they want their line back? Too ******* bad, bro. There was a major difference in how the S.I riders and the Brooklyn riders appreciated both the buses and the drivers compared to the Yorkville folk.

 

They were the reason that line died in the first place as well, wanted too much service they couldn't keep up with!

 

Does the have **** all to do with the ferry services? No! So what in the bluest of blue hell does that have to do with THIS discussion?

 

One thing that seems to fly over everyone's heads is that the is on their own when it comes to funding, our previous Governor Jackass Patterson eliminated all funding to the system, hence why we are in the shitstorm of service reductions & cuts we are in right now. If that didnt happen, we wouldnt have to go through this mess. Jay Walder pretty much had no choice but to change things around in the system.

 

Oh so you saw a letter from a representative wrote to the MTA about the x90? Big deal. I've seen articles and news reports about the S.I routes that got axed, the x37/38 AND the QM22 and guess what, these were all publicized! Them x90 folk obviously isn't doing a good job if they really wanted their route back.

 

I'm just saying. I would be more willing to believe that it wasn't socioeconomic based if comments like that weren't made. Whether or not folks appreciate the service really shouldn't make a difference. I'm sure not every single passenger shows their appreciation for the service they use. That sort of statement sounds as if you are saying that the service is a luxury and not a necessity.

 

As for the ferry service, it benefits the by taking riders that would be on the train which is starting to turn into another line and puts those folks on another form of transportation. Certainly this HELPS the financially by having to perhaps run fewer trains.

 

As for the X90, quite frankly express bus talk is generally buried. When they talk about fare increases for example on the news, express bus increases are usually left out, so not hearing much about the X90 doesn't mean nothing was going on. We didn't hear anything about the X37/X38 until the service was restored. :cool:

[Cait Sith]

Ok I'm going to use your logic. There's a so-called "alternative" 4 Avenue blocks away, which is roughly half a mile.

 

All of these lines should therefore be eliminated because of their "close" proximity to the subway:

- BxM4

- BxM6

- BxM7

- BxM7A

- BxM10

- BxM11

- X27

- X28

- X37

- X38

- BM3

- QM5

- QM12

- QM15

- QM16

- QM17

- QM24

- QM25

 

In fact, ESPECIALLY the X27 & X37 because ALL of their stops are, according to someone here, right next door to the subway. And those people in Brooklyn wanted their X37/X38 back so that they could cut down a few minutes by taking the FDR? Yeah, they're not requesting UNEEDED service... -.-

 

You just made me lol because if there is one thing you missed, these are routes that go OUTSIDE of Manhattan, some of these routes go WAY PAST local bus AND subway service and obviously more than 4 blocks. Yeah, very funny bro. And this also shows your elitist background as well, nice job exposing yourself!

 

You try living in Co-Op City and having to rely on the Bx23/Q50 and several other lines to get to the Subway & other bus connections to get to the city within 45 minutes. The x90 was WITHIN ONE BOROUGH compared to these. Come back to me when you have a smarter logic, because that definitely wasn't my logic. You're elitist stupidity and lack of knowledge of other bus routes is getting the best of you. Know your shit before you post.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Ok I'm going to use your logic. There's a so-called "alternative" 4 Avenue blocks away, which is roughly half a mile.

 

All of these lines should therefore be eliminated because of their "close" proximity to the subway:

- BxM4

- BxM6

- BxM7

- BxM7A

- BxM10

- BxM11

- X27

- X28

- X37

- X38

- BM3

- QM5

- QM12

- QM15

- QM16

- QM17

- QM24

- QM25

 

In fact, ESPECIALLY the X27 & X37 because ALL of their stops are, according to someone here, right next door to the subway. And those people in Brooklyn wanted their X37/X38 back so that they could cut down a few minutes by taking the FDR? Yeah, they're not requesting UNEEDED service... -.-

 

And my beef is also this... People calling for axing of express buses have NO alternatives in place. How do you deal with the overcrowding that would occur on the local buses and subways??? They claim building subways is too expensive, but they don't want express buses either. LOL

[MHV9218]

Please, watch the Nazi Banksters Crimes Ripple Effect at http://jforjustice.co.uk/banksters

[Cait Sith]

I'm just saying. I would be more willing to believe that it wasn't socioeconomic based if comments like that weren't made. Whether or not folks appreciate the service really shouldn't make a difference. I'm sure not every single passenger shows their appreciation for the service they use. That sort of statement sounds as if you are saying that the service is a luxury and not a necessity.

 

As for the ferry service, it benefits the by taking riders that would be on the train which is starting to turn into another line and puts those folks on another form of transportation. Certainly this HELPS the financially by having to perhaps run fewer trains.

 

As for the X90, quite frankly express bus talk is generally buried. When they talk about fare increases for example on the news, express bus increases are usually left out, so not hearing much abou the X90 doesn't mean nothing was going on. We didn't hear anything about the X37/X38 until the service was restored. :cool:

 

Out of every other express line in this city, I've always looked at the x90 as a line of luxury. Almost every other Express Route especially the Staten Island routes are a necessity, thats the way I see it.

 

The ferry service does ease off the burden from the . I have seen a lot of folks get off on the Williamsburg end of the line. But the (L)'s ridership is increasing dramatically because the population in that area is literally exploding and increasing almost every month.

 

x90 talk is pretty much dead because they gave up on trying to get into the mind of the MTA suits to at least fix up or restructure the line.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

You know what makes the most sense? Axe the express bus model, keep a few profitable routes and run normal buses on them, and if they don't turn a profit, axe those too.

 

There's no reason that funding for normal bus service should suffer because some individuals' MCI coaches need to be replaced with Prevost coaches.

 

Yeah and like I said, what alternatives would you put in place?? We know you want to axe them. You think all local buses turn a profit?? Based on your analysis many local buses would be axed too, leaving neighbourhoods with no service at all. It's easy to say axe express buses, but what would you do with thousands of displaced people that need transportation??? You have a subway system that is under a ton of stress and the population is expected to grow substantially here in NYC thus putting further strain on the subway. Many express buses serve areas with no subways.

[MHV9218]

Please, watch the Nazi Banksters Crimes Ripple Effect at http://jforjustice.co.uk/banksters

[Cait Sith]

Reread what I said. Kill the model, not all the routes.

 

A nice Orion is good enough for every local rider, and will be good enough for every express rider too.Local/express fleet unification makes depots cost less, makes maintenance cost less, and is a practical thing. There's no need for the MTA to buy a small portion of its rider Prevosts just because they don't want to step foot on the subway. And for the few express bus riders who genuinely have no other options: keep the routes and run normal buses for less than the $5.50 fare.

 

While I agree with the rest of the post. I wouldn't say that an Orion would be that good enough for every express rider and route, I would say that it would have to depend on the routes themselves. As much as I would love to ride an RTS on the express routes once again, the MCIs are a step up for some of the routes that usually demand it, mostly routes that have incredibly high demand. But for the routes with less demand, I'm all for Orions and/or RTSs to be on those lines like the QM10 and a few others.

 

The way I see it, if we were to have both types of buses running for the express, it should be like how articulated routes are assigned, have MCIs run on the routes with high demand & high frequencies (i.e : x1s, x22s and other high demanding routes in the city) and RTSs and Orions running on routes with less of a realistic demand and such (i.e QM10, x90, QM12, BxM10 and so on).

 

But for the most part, I agree with the local/express bus fleet unification, maintenance costs went up when we started getting MCIs and when they start converting suburban buses to transit buses.

[Gorgor]

You just made me lol because if there is one thing you missed, these are routes that go OUTSIDE of Manhattan, some of these routes go WAY PAST local bus AND subway service and obviously more than 4 blocks. Yeah, very funny bro. And this also shows your elitist background as well, nice job exposing yourself!

 

You try living in Co-Op City and having to rely on the Bx23/Q50 and several other lines to get to the Subway & other bus connections to get to the city within 45 minutes. The x90 was WITHIN ONE BOROUGH compared to these. Come back to me when you have a smarter logic, because that definitely wasn't my logic. You're elitist stupidity and lack of knowledge of other bus routes is getting the best of you. Know your shit before you post.

 

I'm an elitist because I can look at a map and list express bus routes than run parallel to existing subway lines... ok sure. The point of that was that one of your arguments was that the X90 was "next door" to a perfectly good alternative, the train, but in fact some bus stops are nearly a mile away from the nearest subway station.

 

Oh and rely on a bus to get to the subway... there's plenty of people who now have to use the crosstown bus to get to the subway, and there's other people who take a cab to the subway so don't even start with that.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

I'm an elitist because I can look at a map and list express bus routes than run parallel to existing subway lines... ok sure. The point of that was that one of your arguments was that the X90 was "next door" to a perfectly good alternative, the train, but in fact some bus stops are nearly a mile away from the nearest subway station.

 

Oh and rely on a bus to get to the subway... there's plenty of people who now have to use the crosstown bus to get to the subway, and there's other people who take a cab to the subway so don't even start with that.

 

I say why f*ck up the Crosstown buses even more??? Also I'm willing to bet that with the X90 they haven't added enough service on those Crosstown buses to meet demand, so they cut express buses but STILL don't run enough local buses. That's why the whole blame the express bus riders BS is just that.

[Cait Sith]

I'm an elitist because I can look at a map and list express bus routes than run parallel to existing subway lines... ok sure. The point of that was that one of your arguments was that the X90 was "next door" to a perfectly good alternative, the train, but in fact some bus stops are nearly a mile away from the nearest subway station.

 

Oh and rely on a bus to get to the subway... there's plenty of people who now have to use the crosstown bus to get to the subway, and there's other people who take a cab to the subway so don't even start with that.

 

Once again, now you are seriously making me lol.

 

Ok, since you say the BxM7 duplicates service, how about this, you go commute from Co-Op City to Pelham Bay waiting for the Bx23 or Q50 and then transfer to the ? You do realize that is MUCH LONGER than a ride from Yorkville to Downtown and vice-versa? The Bx23 can take up to 30 MINUTES just to get to Pelham Bay Park. The take another 30 minutes to an hour just to get into the city.

 

If the BxM7 really did duplicate service, which it doesnt stop at Pelham Bay Park or go into Queens (lol) nor does the goes into Co-Op City, wouldnt you think that service would've been reduced or CUT a long time ago?

 

Also, lets bring up another route you mentioned. The QM5, which goes from 260th Street in Glen Oaks to Midtown. Glen Oaks only has one, count em', ONE route that goes from Glen Oaks to a central part of Queens, and thats the Q46. That is the ONLY alternative those people have. The Q46 by ITSELF is about 45 minutes up to an hour with the and being ANOTHER 30-45 minutes.

 

Compare these commutes with yours just to go from Yorkville to Downtown, you're self-centered moronic jackass self has it better than the folks who have to commute from these areas. Plus you have oh, I dont know.....

 

M31

M57

M66

M72

M79

M86

M101

M102

M103

The , and trains

 

And the ever so infamous M15 local and +Select Bus Service....

 

Once again.....

KNOW YOUR SHIT AND THINK BEFORE YOU POST! You are just making yourself sound and look more stupid!

 

Don't like what I gotta say, go cry to someone else!

[Gorgor]

Compare these commutes with yours just to go from Yorkville to Downtown, you're self-centered moronic jackass self has it better than the folks who have to commute from these areas. Plus you have oh, I dont know.....

 

M31

M57

M66

M72

M79

M86

M101

M102

M103

The , and trains

 

And the ever so infamous M15 local and +Select Bus Service....

 

I'm really laughing... M101/102/103, really? It'll take an hour to get down and it leaves you in the middle of nowhere.

 

M31, 25 minutes from 86th to 57th then another 20 minutes to Lex.

M57, 20 minutes to Lex.

M66/M72/M79/M86, 15 minutes to Lex.

Oh and don't forget about the time needed to wait for the bus.

 

Then 6 train down is about 30 minutes, 4/5 is about 15, plus waiting time.

 

Then for me, walking over to the West Side is about a 15 minute walk.

 

So it takes about an hour to get down plus a huge headache.

[Cait Sith]

I'm really laughing... M101/102/103, really? It'll take an hour to get down and it leaves you in the middle of nowhere.

 

M31, 25 minutes from 86th to 57th then another 20 minutes to Lex.

M57, 20 minutes to Lex.

M66/M72/M79/M86, 15 minutes to Lex.

Oh and don't forget about the time needed to wait for the bus.

 

Then 6 train down is about 30 minutes, 4/5 is about 15, plus waiting time.

 

Then for me, walking over to the West Side is about a 15 minute walk.

 

So it takes about an hour to get down plus a huge headache.

 

Ok, what about the rest of my post....?

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Once again, now you are seriously making me lol.

 

Ok, since you say the BxM7 duplicates service, how about this, you go commute from Co-Op City to Pelham Bay waiting for the Bx23 or Q50 and then transfer to the ? You do realize that is MUCH LONGER than a ride from Yorkville to Downtown and vice-versa? The Bx23 can take up to 30 MINUTES just to get to Pelham Bay Park. The take another 30 minutes to an hour just to get into the city.

 

If the BxM7 really did duplicate service, which it doesnt stop at Pelham Bay Park or go into Queens (lol) nor does the goes into Co-Op City, wouldnt you think that service would've been reduced or CUT a long time ago?

 

Also, lets bring up another route you mentioned. The QM5, which goes from 260th Street in Glen Oaks to Midtown. Glen Oaks only has one, count em', ONE route that goes from Glen Oaks to a central part of Queens, and thats the Q46. That is the ONLY alternative those people have. The Q46 by ITSELF is about 45 minutes up to an hour with the and being ANOTHER 30-45 minutes.

 

Compare these commutes with yours just to go from Yorkville to Downtown, you're self-centered moronic jackass self has it better than the folks who have to commute from these areas. Plus you have oh, I dont know.....

 

M31

M57

M66

M72

M79

M86

M101

M102

M103

The , and trains

 

And the ever so infamous M15 local and +Select Bus Service....

 

Once again.....

KNOW YOUR SHIT AND THINK BEFORE YOU POST! You are just making yourself sound and look more stupid!

 

Don't like what I gotta say, go cry to someone else!

 

 

That's very true, but all of these alternatives are pretty packed, so just because he has many alternatives doesn't mean anything. This whole alternatives thing is rather deceptive. Also, since when was Crosstown bus service in Manhattan become such a breeze? We both know that several Crosstown buses have been listed as some of the worst performing buses time wise in the entire system. I have used many of the Crosstown buses you've listed and they take quite a while themselves.

 

And even with some of those lines being packed, lines like the M72 are pretty unreliable in my experience. The M66 runs good, but that's another line that fills up fast. The M79 can be a nightmare at times going Crosstown and the M57 while decent in terms of frequencies can also be a slow go across town.

[MHV9218]

Please, watch the Nazi Banksters Crimes Ripple Effect at http://jforjustice.co.uk/banksters

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Reread what I said. Kill the model, not all the routes.

 

A nice Orion is good enough for every local rider, and will be good enough for every express rider too. Local/express fleet unification makes depots cost less, makes maintenance cost less, and is a practical thing. There's no need for the MTA to buy a small portion of its rider Prevosts just because they don't want to step foot on the subway. And for the few express bus riders who genuinely have no other options: keep the routes and run normal buses for less than the $5.50 fare.

 

What small portion of riders would you be referring to?? The Prevosts will be used in Staten Island which has no subways and in Southern Brooklyn, which serves areas where subway access is difficult to get to. Aside from that, most of the express buses serve areas that don't have subways so I don't know where you're getting this folks don't want to step foot on the subway crappola from. Besides, there are PLENTY of people that don't want to step foot on the subway and I can assure you that they are not all express bus riders.

 

In any event, the subway system IMO couldn't handle the crushload of people if everyone was forced on to the subway, so I don't even know why you keep bringing that up for anyway, as if our subway system is in such great shape. The system is moving millions of people, yes I know, but it is still in an extremely fragile and vulnerable state. Have one f*ck up on the line or even a short rather straightforward line like the line and you've got a mess that is beyond belief and yet you sit here and advocate for more folks using a system that is already overcapacity??? What sense does that make??

[MHV9218]

Please, watch the Nazi Banksters Crimes Ripple Effect at http://jforjustice.co.uk/banksters

[Cait Sith]

That's very true, but all of these alternatives are pretty packed, so just because he has many alternatives doesn't mean anything. This whole alternatives thing is rather deceptive. Also, since when was Crosstown bus service in Manhattan become such a breeze? We both know that several Crosstown buses have been listed as some of the worst performing buses time wise in the entire system. I have used many of the Crosstown buses you've listed and they take quite a while themselves.

 

And even with some of those lines being packed, lines like the M72 are pretty unreliable in my experience. The M66 runs good, but that's another line that fills up fast. The M79 can be a nightmare at times going Crosstown and the M57 while decent in terms of frequencies can also be a slow go across town.

 

Ok, here is where my point in my previous post stands out.

 

Granted that Crosstown Service is all screwed up from one end to another, how often does those services run? Every 5-7 minutes. At least if you miss a bus, you don't have to wait much longer for another one to arrive since the scheduling of 99.9% of the Crosstown Routes are very tight. How often does those other services run in the areas that I've mentioned? Not even close! Almost 15-20 minutes per bus!

 

At least the folks in the city are seeing more frequent service than those in certain areas of The Bronx, Queens, Brooklyn AND Staten Island and you should know this better than anyone!

[Via Garibaldi 8]

You just answered yourself. Exactly, there's no reason to provide service to "people don't want to step foot on the subway." I also never said to put everybody on the subway, I said ditch the current express bus model and and use normal buses. The Prevosts and MCIs aren't necessary, and the only people who need the service are those with no other options, which is why I'm advocating a universal bus fleet with no luxury liner express service under the MTA name.

 

So in other words, charge people more for a long commute and have them be miserable the entire time?? It's funny that the folks pushing this asinine idea have relatively short commutes or ones where they're not stuck on one mode of transportation for a long period of time. It's been shown that MCIs are just as cost efficient as any other bus. The maintenance costs are due to the not stepping up to the plate and keeping their buses up to par. Naturally if you neglect your vehicle more costs will be incured. Look at all of the MCIs that are run in the Bronx and in Queens and many of those express buses are 7 years old and they are running just fine because they are well maintained overall.

 

There are plenty of folks aside from express bus riders that don't want to step foot on a subway, so that is a load of BS. So I guess you would call for all LIRR and MetroNorth trains to be stripped of any "extras" as well right???

 

 

Express bus riders pay almost triple of what local bus riders pay. We got some cushioned seats a little climate control and overhead lights. Big deal. You act like we have beds on the express bus or something. I mean really, you are making a big deal over nothing. That's like comparing McDonald's to a 4 star restaurant and saying that folks should expect the same level of service.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Ok, here is where my point in my previous post stands out.

 

Granted that Crosstown Service is all screwed up from one end to another, how often does those services run? Every 5-7 minutes. At least if you miss a bus, you don't have to wait much longer for another one to arrive since the scheduling of 99.9% of the Crosstown Routes are very tight. How often does those other services run in the areas that I've mentioned? Not even close! Almost 15-20 minutes per bus!

 

At least the folks in the city are seeing more frequent service than those in certain areas of The Bronx, Queens, Brooklyn AND Staten Island and you should know this better than anyone!

 

That's true, but that still makes no difference in terms of how long it takes to get Crosstown. I mean I see M42s lined up in the morning one right after the other, but even with the frequency being high, you can still expect to have a good 30 - 40 minute Crosstown ride most of the time perhaps longer. I have certainly experienced that on the M79, which also has very frequent service, but these lines should because if they didn't you'd have overcrowding on another level.

 

You are making it sound as if the guy has it so good. The frequency has to be provided by the because of the demand for service on those lines.

[Cait Sith]

That's true, but that still makes no difference in terms of how long it takes to get Crosstown. I mean I see M42s lined up in the morning one right after the other, but even with the frequency being high, you can still expect to have a good 30 - 40 minute Crosstown ride most of the time perhaps longer. I have certainly experienced that on the M79, which also has very frequent service, but these lines should because if they didn't you'd have overcrowding on another level.

 

The M42 is ****** up for one specific reason, thats the moronic pedestrian plaza that ****** up the traffic flow in that area, thanks to Dictator Bloomberg....42nd Street between 6th and 10th Aves has been crippled because the pedestrian plaza completely destroyed the flow of traffic in that area. The stop at Park Avenue should be eliminated because 3rd Avenue is literally 15 feet away and there is another bus stop just footsteps away right by Grand Central.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

The M42 is ****** up for one specific reason, thats the moronic pedestrian plaza that ****** up the traffic flow in that area, thanks to Dictator Bloomberg....42nd Street between 6th and 10th Aves has been crippled because the pedestrian plaza completely destroyed the flow of traffic in that area. The stop at Park Avenue should be eliminated because 3rd Avenue is literally 15 feet away and there is another bus stop just footsteps away right by Grand Central.

 

lol... Well as far as I'm concerned, the M42 has been f*cked up well before the pedestrian plazas. If anything the plazas made the M42 worse.

[Cait Sith]

lol... Well as far as I'm concerned, the M42 has been f*cked up well before the pedestrian plazas. If anything the plazas made the M42 worse.

 

Not really, because the plaza forced more traffic onto 42nd Street. Before the M42 was known as the slowest route in the city. The M34 had that title, then the M8. The only reason the M34 is not the slowest anymore is because of the bus lanes which made the commute a hell of a lot faster.

 

You are making it sound as if the guy has it so good. The frequency has to be provided by the because of the demand for service on those lines.

 

Comparing his commute with those who live outside of the city, especially you and me, he does have it better than a majority of folks.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Not really, because the plaza forced more traffic onto 42nd Street. Before the M42 was known as the slowest route in the city. The M34 had that title, then the M8. The only reason the M34 is not the slowest anymore is because of the bus lanes which made the commute a hell of a lot faster.

You have to also remember that the M42 had the M104 to help out, which it no longer has.

 

Comparing his commute with those who live outside of the city, especially you and me, he does have it better than a majority of folks.

 

Only because he has more options, but if his commute is taking him an hour each way then that's not all that great. That's basically what my commute is on the X30 each way.

[Cait Sith]

You have to also remember that the M42 had the M104 to help out, which it no longer has.

 

Yeah, barely. The M104 always empties out at Times Square regardless, it always went to the East Side empty and left the East Side empty 90% of the time. The M42 always gets a decent load out of the West Side Pier. The M104 was more like a wet Band-Aid.