What Long Island Bus service may look like next year

[checkmatechamp13]

true but the direct link alternates. When a train links the N8 would meet trains that bypass new hyde park.

 

However my N16 idea and N25 one are not fails. But at least you answered most of my questions. Can the N74/73 become minibuses or use smaller ones that can use the parkway the loop??? I have to say SCT favors regional more than nassau

 

Well, I do feel that there should be a route down Stewart Avenue (and Nassau Road), but I think one reason might be NIMBYs opposing the route. I mean, Nassau Blvd is somewhat commercial, but Stewart Avenue is mostly residential.

 

But I think it should be the N2 going down Stewart Avenue, rather than the N8. It could end at Adelphi University or continue to Hempstead via Atlantic Avenue (though if it ends at Hempstead, that might create even more NIMBY opposition).

 

Of course, this would be if the budget was increased.

 

the 94 was cancelled due to low ridership, bring it back as something else would be a waste.

 

The ridership wasn't that low. The cost per passenger was under $5, so maybe it could be brought back with a headway increase (unless it was already running every 60 minutes)

 

I just thought of something:

 

-Discontinue off peak N48

-Run the N49 to SUNY Old Westbury

-Cut the N20 back to CW Post

 

This could work...

 

I think either the N49 should go to SUNY Old Westbury, or the N20 should go to CW Post, just so that anybody who wants to travel between the 2 sections of the N20 is able to.

 

Or maybe the N49 could be cut back to Hicksville and the N20 is left as is.

[User]

I just thought of something:

 

-Discontinue off peak N48

-Run the N49 to SUNY Old Westbury

-Cut the N20 back to CW Post

 

This could work...

The N20 makes more money going to Hicksville, more transfers there. I'd prefer as well as many others that they not cut that.

[lilbluefoxie]

N94 was a rush hour only route

[qjtransitmaster]

Again, there is no demand to go to Great Neck or Manhasset unless you live there. It isn't a major part of the island, and why would anyone sit on a bus in traffic on the LIE in the morning or evening rush to go to Queens when they can take the LIRR and then get on a local bus at Hicksville if they have no car. Even to go to flushing you can just catch a bus in queens that goes up there from Jamaica,

 

the 94 was cancelled due to low ridership, bring it back as something else would be a waste.

AGAIN the LIRR DOES NOT go to flushing!!!!!!! Unless it's the port washington line ppl who want speed will get off at great neck and transfer to that LIRR to reach Northeastern queens and flushing or stay on to reach destinations on northern blvd. The HOV ends at the queens border right??? the buses will use the HOV en rte to roslyn or great neck. Plus the bus from jamacia to flushing the Q44 slows to a crawl at rush hr not exactly a practical transfer. According to checkmate cost of N94 wasn't that high so only rush hr N74/73 trips would replace N94. Also Q44 is a SARDINE CAN it can't handle more ppl unless you put arctics.

Well, I do feel that there should be a route down Stewart Avenue (and Nassau Road), but I think one reason might be NIMBYs opposing the route. I mean, Nassau Blvd is somewhat commercial, but Stewart Avenue is mostly residential.

 

But I think it should be the N2 going down Stewart Avenue, rather than the N8. It could end at Adelphi University or continue to Hempstead via Atlantic Avenue (though if it ends at Hempstead, that might create even more NIMBY opposition).

 

Of course, this would be if the budget was increased.

 

 

 

The ridership wasn't that low. The cost per passenger was under $5, so maybe it could be brought back with a headway increase (unless it was already running every 60 minutes)

 

 

 

I think either the N49 should go to SUNY Old Westbury, or the N20 should go to CW Post, just so that anybody who wants to travel between the 2 sections of the N20 is able to.

 

Or maybe the N49 could be cut back to Hicksville and the N20 is left as is.

 

DUDE I completely dissagree ending at adelphi isn't enough that isn't a major transfer point. There is a reason why my N8 idea extends it to mineola to maximize travel opportunities what if ppl want to come from other rtes to adelphi. Ending at adelphi does nothing for folk venturing east that same incomplete routing is why ppl don't use LIB in a sense. It's like extending Airtrain to jewell ave rather than to LGA to maximise transfer opportunities your cutting it short cutting off possibilities. Lets leave the N48/49 ALONE!!!!! Leave HICKSVILLE N20 ALONE!!!!!!!!!! N2 err the N8 needs the ridership BOOST WAY MORE THAN THE N2!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[B35 via Church]

Well with the N16/32 combo I was hoping to reduce running time and return service to the Mercy Hospital. I feel the existing N31/32 route is often duplicated by N15 service on nearby Woodfield Road. The existing N16 route is also duplicated by the nearby N35.

 

All N19 buses could end at Sunrise Mall, but there'd need to be an ST bus replacing that portion along Montauk Highway, the S20 should take the place of it, it already runs down Montauk hwy partially.

 

I dunno how well the new Nassau system and Suffolk will work together.

Having the N73/74 config be replaced by that N29 suggestion could work, but the problem is the RF - Hicksville leg will need much more frequent service than the Hicksville-Wantagh leg.

 

Good idea with the N25, have only some am/pm runs serve that loop. Its not that much of a walk anyway from NHP Rd.

 

Having service along the Jericho Turnpike corridor will improve ridership numbers on those routes, as it is very commercial. Its one of the only major commercial areas on Long Island without any regular bus service, save for the Quad.

 

The N36 has weak ridership, maybe the eastern end of it should be discontinued, continue service on the west end and have it go to Long Beach to help the N15? If not than the N36 can just be canned, but it does leave the western part of Oceanside and East Rockaway without any bus service.

 

Yes I'd have all N55 service down Broadway, N54 would be discontinued.

 

I guess you could be right about the N79, at least weekdays it should serve Mineola.

 

As far as Jericho Turnpike goes, one could have the N81 go to Syosset via S.Oyster Bay Rd, and the N35 go east along Jericho Turnpike to Crossways.

N48/49 end at Hicksville, yeah that probably makes more sense.

 

Yeah NYCT does have short turns, but MTAB not as much. When the (city) came here they got rid of alot of the short turns having most routes run their entire length, which is pointless.

Not bad (suggestions/commentary) from a Brooklyn guy huh.....

Well anyway....

 

 

- That's why you don't really need the 15 on woodfield IMO... the W. Hempstead branch has been under utilized for the longest... let the N32 be the link b/w LIRR W. Hempstead & Hempstead (instead of the 15).... Have the 15 serve mercy hospital (which is what I'd do), on top of turning 15's off washington onto stewart, en route to RFM (your idea)... both of our ideas together eliminates duplication & cuts running time on that route.....

 

- the N16 should be eliminated; the route itself is "duplicative"..... The N35 only goes to Baldwin, so let it spend some time in the Nassau Hub area a bit (again, have the 15 be the quick link b/w HTC & RFM, since that has to go all the way to Long beach.... by doing this, there'd be no need to extend the 35 to no long beach (as QJT states))....

 

from your neck of the woods, I'd have the N35 continue down to miller... then have the N35 do everything that the N16 does at, and south of miller av, en route to HTC.... clinton av/rd doesn't really warrant a bus IMO.... one of the reasons the 35 gets jammed is b/c it's the direct link b/w NCC & HTC (while avoiding RFM, to boot).... your N24 can be the direct link b/w NCC & RFM (while the N43 & N45 would loom as alternatives).....

 

^^ I think we solved that problem

 

 

- N19.... yes, I believe suffolk should be the ones providing service along that portion.... have the S25 (I think it is, the North Babylon route that stops at the south bay shopping ctr) swing on over a couple miles along montauk hwy to Sunrise....

 

- N73/74 comment... yep, already ahead of ya....

 

your N29 from RFM to Hicksville via New Cassel is too short a route to run every 20 mins, all day (remember what we're dealing with here; no more MTA).... something would have to give....

However, you can still have N73/74's run hourly all day along said portion, on top of interlining the N48's/49's that would end at hicksville... those physical buses would be used as N73/74 short turns b/w RFM & Hicksville... you'd just have schedule them (the short turns) so that buses aren't arriving around the same time (the full N73/74's) would.....

 

 

- The Jericho tpke comment, you do have a point, it is moderately commercial in parts out there.... how about this....

 

What do you think of an hourly route (call it the "N77" for all I care) that would pan from RFM to Walt Whitman mall (via jericho tpke), w/ some peak runs parallelling your N80/81 revision up to LIRR Syosset? The route would run up glen cove rd to jericho tpke, and swing all the way out to walt whitman..... Give ppl. another option than having to ride out to huntington & dealing w/ the S1 to get to that mall....

 

^^ No N35, 48, or 49 extension necessary.... one route, one main purpose/corridor - Jericho tpke itself.

 

 

- I wouldn't bother sending another route to Long beach.... get rid of the N36, to supply for the amt. of buses the N15 is gonna need.... If Oceanside itself starts to clamor for bus service, then have the N14 act as an Oceanside-RVC loop - They may need it w/ what I would do the N16 & the N36.... Not sure if such a loop should actually come to fruition though.....

 

 

- Your original N80/81 restructure I think would suffice.... The N35 to crossways via NCC & HTC may be too much (meaning, it'd compromise the N35).... the 35 has the ridership to remain a north-south route for the most part (unlike the N73/74, which I don't have a problem with, being an 'L' shaped route)....

 

 

...and that point about full routes still doesn't fly with me.... you're comparing the city's MTA bus routes, to LIB routes..... the city's MTA bus routes aren't exactly hard-pressed for ridership like LIB routes are (that, and a lot of the old PBL routes simply ran/run shorter distances than NYCT routes [in general]).... any amount of passengers LIB routes could hope to pick up along a route's full length (outside of the N6's, 20's, etc. of the world), is a plus.....

 

let's leave the city's bus routes out of this... this is a good exchange/discussion we're having here so far... When you're not over dramatic, you do make good sound points..... The one thing no one can consider you, is a foamer....

 

regardless, let's keep the focus on LIB :tup:

[B35 via Church]

AGAIN the LIRR DOES NOT go to flushing!!!!!!!

http://lirr42.mta.info/stationInfo.php?id=18

 

The N20 makes more money going to Hicksville, more transfers there. I'd prefer as well as many others that they not cut that.

Someone that gets it.... Thank you !

 

the 94 was cancelled due to low ridership, bring it back as something else would be a waste.

The route by itself wasn't a big (or even a moderate) draw at all, I have to agree.... There's nothin really you can bring it back as AFAIC.....

 

Or maybe the N49 could be cut back to Hicksville and the N20 is left as is.

That's what pinepower & I are discussing (well, sort of).... the N48's/49's that would end at hicksville, could be used to add necessary service within new cassel & westbury.

 

The N20 physical route should be left alone....

[qjtransitmaster]

http://lirr42.mta.info/stationInfo.php?id=18

 

 

Someone that gets it.... Thank you !

 

 

The route by itself wasn't a big (or even a moderate) draw at all, I have to agree.... There's nothin really you can bring it back as AFAIC.....

 

 

That's what pinepower & I are discussing (well, sort of).... the N48's/49's that would end at hicksville, could be used to add necessary service within new cassel & westbury.

 

The N20 physical route should be left alone....

 

No need my new LTD stop rte N34 will provide service to new cassel and westbury along it's path. It's a penninsula blvd exp line and uses rte 106 to oyster bay while going through underserved areas. At first it will be weekday only route however weekend service may be needed but I am not sure. N34 will also serve mercy hospital eliminating the need to modify N15 and N16 lets leave em alone between hempstead and rockville centre plz. N16 gets useful with sunrise hwy extension and N15 gains a faster cousin the N35 and a crosstown brother N50.

 

 

The ONLY LIRR LINE TO FLUSHING IS PORT WASHINGTON!!!!!!!! Next!!!!!!!!!!! Q44 doesn't help for ppl coming from areas around ronkonkoma line it already is crushloaded with non LIRR ppl more LIRR ppl would absolutely turn it into a SLAVESHIP ON WHEELS!!!!!!!! N80 as an express rte can benefit from the ridership boost and also the HOV on LIE within nassau. It would make N20 short turns more efficient or CRUSH LOADED the rush hr service will time with port washington AND ronkonkoma trains at hicksville some AM trips will be N81 while N80 swaps with N81 to syosset at AM so express ronkonkoma trains aren't missed. However I do fear the LIRR capacity may hurt this plan.

 

N29 not needed due to my N34 penninsula express line will do the same thing BUT goes beyond nassau hub and to far rockaway via penninsula blvd. The N16 plan will help with the lack of western LIRR service west of rockville centre. So it will save those ppl alot of time not having to wait 30 mins or more for a connection and be a buffer to make up for lack of LIRR service along sunrise hwywest of rockville centre FOR BABYLON BOUND PPL. I know the schedule otherwise I would not be suggesting this.

 

N16 instead of elimination reroute to sunrise hwy then to green acres mall. N25 replaces former N16 baldwin segment. N35 extends to long beach so it's a faster version of the N15. N34 is a new rte helping N16 at nassau hub serving underserved areas connecting oyster bay and going express via penninsula while adding faster version of N32/31(sort of) basically a direct to nassau hub rte without having to transfer at hempstead shaving off even more time. Green acres mall will make the N16 more productive. Long beach will load up N35 and help N15. N50 would be like a residential crosstown kind of rte which will help out N49 on newbridge and help out N15 on long beach rd.

[B35 via Church]

The ONLY LIRR LINE TO FLUSHING IS PORT WASHINGTON!!!!!!!! Next!!!!!!!!!!!

 

No shit sherlock, you were the one that emphatically said the LIRR DOES NOT go to Flushing..... with all them dam exclamation points....

 

Which was a false ass statement.

 

NEXT......

 

Under that same worthless logic.... So I guess no LIRR train goes to Atlantic terminal, unless it's the long beach, west hempstead, or hempstead lines huh....

 

you really gotta think before you speak....

[lilbluefoxie]

No need my new LTD stop rte N34 will provide service to new cassel and westbury along it's path. It's a penninsula blvd exp line and uses rte 106 to oyster bay while going through underserved areas. At first it will be weekday only route however weekend service may be needed but I am not sure.

 

 

The ONLY LIRR LINE TO FLUSHING IS PORT WASHINGTON!!!!!!!! Next!!!!!!!!!!! Q44 doesn't help for ppl coming from areas around ronkonkoma line it already is crushloaded with non LIRR ppl more LIRR ppl would absolutely turn it into a SLAVESHIP ON WHEELS!!!!!!!! N80 as an express rte can benefit from the ridership boost and also the HOV on LIE within nassau. It would make N20 short turns more efficient or CRUSH LOADED the rush hr service will time with port washington AND ronkonkoma trains at hicksville some AM trips will be N81 while N80 swaps with N81 to syosset at AM so express ronkonkoma trains aren't missed. However I do fear the LIRR capacity may hurt this plan

 

as I said, Flushing isnt a major destination, if they want the to go to the east side, they can also get off at Woodside or Kew Gardens and take the . There will be no ridership boost, the 80 serves mostly middle-class suburbs where people already own cars that's why the ridership is low, its not like the upper class areas where the maids and stuff get on the 58 or the 23 for example. In the end you're going to need a coach bus like the MCI models that the city's express buses use, and a higher fare, so that in itself wont make it much of a possibility since Long Island Bus doesn't have those. If you make the fare $5.50 thats $11 both ways, for about 2-3 dollars more you can just take the train which is faster and more comfortable than a bus which is subject to traffic, you only get the HOV lane for part of the trip, then its just regular lanes.

[checkmatechamp13]

N94 was a rush hour only route

 

I know, but what were the headways?

 

DUDE I completely dissagree ending at adelphi isn't enough that isn't a major transfer point. There is a reason why my N8 idea extends it to mineola to maximize travel opportunities what if ppl want to come from other rtes to adelphi. Ending at adelphi does nothing for folk venturing east that same incomplete routing is why ppl don't use LIB in a sense. It's like extending Airtrain to jewell ave rather than to LGA to maximise transfer opportunities your cutting it short cutting off possibilities. Lets leave the N48/49 ALONE!!!!! Leave HICKSVILLE N20 ALONE!!!!!!!!!! N2 err the N8 needs the ridership BOOST WAY MORE THAN THE N2!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

I know, but it would appeal to the NIMBYs who wouldn't want a bus route through their area passing through an area they deem as "dangerous", but I guess they wouldn't consider Mineola dangerous.

 

The problem is that to get to Adelphi (which it should serve, considering that the only thing nearby is the LIRR Hempstead Branch), it has to go under the railroad, stop at Adelphi, and then loop back out, which could make it unattractive to riders going further east.

 

- The Jericho tpke comment, you do have a point, it is moderately commercial in parts out there.... how about this....

 

What do you think of an hourly route (call it the "N77" for all I care) that would pan from RFM to Walt Whitman mall (via jericho tpke), w/ some peak runs parallelling your N80/81 revision up to LIRR Syosset? The route would run up glen cove rd to jericho tpke, and swing all the way out to walt whitman..... Give ppl. another option than having to ride out to huntington & dealing w/ the S1 to get to that mall....

 

 

I don't see what you're saying. Do you mean some trips would take Jericho Turnpike to Jackson Avenue, and then serve Syosset instead of Walt Whitman?

 

That's what pinepower & I are discussing (well, sort of).... the N48's/49's that would end at hicksville, could be used to add necessary service within new cassel & westbury.

 

The N20 physical route should be left alone....

 

They would just interline right? You wouldn't actually extend them to New Cassel and Westbury (I just don't like circuitous routes unless they're local shuttles)

 

No shit sherlock, you were the one that emphatically said the LIRR DOES NOT go to Flushing..... with all them dam exclamation points....

 

 

To be fair, he did mention "Unless it's the Port Washington Branch"

[lilbluefoxie]

N94 Schedule from 2010

 

http://web.archive.org/web/20090313154535/http://mta.info/libus/routes/n94/weekday.pdf

 

service was rush hours only and every 30-45 minutes

[qjtransitmaster]

as I said, Flushing isnt a major destination, if they want the to go to the east side, they can also get off at Woodside or Kew Gardens and take the . There will be no ridership boost, the 80 serves mostly middle-class suburbs where people already own cars that's why the ridership is low, its not like the upper class areas where the maids and stuff get on the 58 or the 23 for example. In the end you're going to need a coach bus like the MCI models that the city's express buses use, and a higher fare, so that in itself wont make it much of a possibility since Long Island Bus doesn't have those. If you make the fare $5.50 thats $11 both ways, for about 2-3 dollars more you can just take the train which is faster and more comfortable than a bus which is subject to traffic, you only get the HOV lane for part of the trip, then its just regular lanes.

AGAIN THAT IS IMPRACTICAL AND DUMB ppl WILL NOT do it. Plus the parts of the LIE that have HOV will be the only parts that N80 will be on it it leaves to great neck or roslyn so it retains HOV immunity those who want speed will take it to LIRR then use port washington to get to northeast queens destinations AGAIN THOSE STUPID TRANSFERS ARE IMPRACTICAL!!!!!!!! And involve backtracking. I LOOKED AT THE SCHEDULE THE TRAINS ARE NOT TIMED TO MEET AT WOODSIDE!!!!!!!!!!! So for the N80's entire stint on LIE it's traffic immune the only traffic it will deal with is northern blvd BUT it will be doing closed door in queens anyway. Plus due to ridership only queensbound buses will go super express to great neck at AM rush only. At PM rush and all other times it goes via roslyn to LIE shaving off 20 to 30 mins off the trip to hicksville over the N20 local/LTD.

I know, but what were the headways?

 

 

 

I know, but it would appeal to the NIMBYs who wouldn't want a bus route through their area passing through an area they deem as "dangerous", but I guess they wouldn't consider Mineola dangerous.

 

The problem is that to get to Adelphi (which it should serve, considering that the only thing nearby is the LIRR Hempstead Branch), it has to go under the railroad, stop at Adelphi, and then loop back out, which could make it unattractive to riders going further east.

 

 

 

I don't see what you're saying. Do you mean some trips would take Jericho Turnpike to Jackson Avenue, and then serve Syosset instead of Walt Whitman?

 

 

 

They would just interline right? You wouldn't actually extend them to New Cassel and Westbury (I just don't like circuitous routes unless they're local shuttles)

 

 

 

To be fair, he did mention "Unless it's the Port Washington Branch"

 

Wrong answer the line would use south ave stopping in front of the college then down to cherry valley ave en rte to mineola eliminating this roundabout way.

 

Agreed trying to make N48/49 go there would ruin the routes with a stupid backtracking segment. Backtracking NEVER makes sense. Let my N34 do that instead O it times with westbury LIRR trains too. N34 will use a very direct method to reach it's points so it will serve brush hollow rd NO OTHER ROUTES DEFINATELY NOT N49/48 Leave them alone!!!!!

[B35 via Church]

lemme try somethin.....

 

To be fair, he did mention "Unless it's the Port Washington Branch"

had he not capitalized it, I wouldn't have even noticed it.... the blatantly incorrect part is what he capitalized.... You don't emphasize incorrectness (if you're smart, anyway).....

 

They would just interline right? You wouldn't actually extend them to New Cassel and Westbury (I just don't like circuitous routes unless they're local shuttles)

- Yes, they would simply interline....

- I'm not suggesting extending actual N48's/49's to RFM via New Cassel & westbury.... c'mon....

 

I don't see what you're saying. Do you mean some trips would take Jericho Turnpike to Jackson Avenue, and then serve Syosset instead of Walt Whitman?

- What I'm sayin is, buses would serve LIRR Syosset AND walt whitman during peak hours.....

- Off peak, no LIRR Syosset with that "N77" idea of mine I'm waiting for dude to comment on.

[lilbluefoxie]

AGAIN THAT IS IMPRACTICAL AND DUMB ppl WILL NOT do it. Plus the parts of the LIE that have HOV will be the only parts that N80 will be on it it leaves to great neck or roslyn so it retains HOV immunity those who want speed will take it to LIRR then use port washington to get to northeast queens destinations AGAIN THOSE STUPID TRANSFERS ARE IMPRACTICAL!!!!!!!! And involve backtracking. I LOOKED AT THE SCHEDULE THE TRAINS ARE NOT TIMED TO MEET AT WOODSIDE!!!!!!!!!!! So for the N80's entire stint on LIE it's traffic immune the only traffic it will deal with is northern blvd BUT it will be doing closed door in queens anyway. Plus due to ridership only queensbound buses will go super express to great neck at AM rush only. At PM rush and all other times it goes via roslyn to LIE shaving off 20 to 30 mins off the trip to hicksville over the N20 local/LTD.

 

 

you seem to be unable to get how the HOV lane works, the nearest entrance from NY 107 is between NY 25 (Exit 40) and Glen Cove Rd (Exit 39)

 

 

then the nearest exit to get out for the Community Drive exit is by Exit 36 (Searingtown Road)

 

 

its about 2-3 miles to the community drive exit. You can't get in and out wherever you want.

 

 

as you see here teh bus cannot just get over to that exit, the HOV lane ends past Exit 33.

 

Great Neck is NOT a major destination for Nassau residents! its not a big job center like Mineola or the Nassau Hub area. I dont know what you are talking about with timing, the runs every 2-5 minutes during rush hours.

[B35 via Church]

Great Neck is NOT a major destination for Nassau residents! its not a big job center like Mineola or the Nassau Hub area.

 

I made that exact same point to him in one of these LIB threads....

[qjtransitmaster]

you seem to be unable to get how the HOV lane works, the nearest entrance from NY 107 is between NY 25 (Exit 40) and Glen Cove Rd (Exit 39)

 

 

then the nearest exit to get out for the Community Drive exit is by Exit 36 (Searingtown Road)

 

 

its about 2-3 miles to the community drive exit. You can't get in and out wherever you want.

 

 

as you see here teh bus cannot just get over to that exit, the HOV lane ends past Exit 33.

 

Great Neck is NOT a major destination for Nassau residents! its not a big job center like Mineola or the Nassau Hub area. I dont know what you are talking about with timing, the runs every 2-5 minutes during rush hours.

 

Thx for a well done explanation I needed that. But the involves backtracking and sometimes can be a mess since you are mixing in with NYC ppl. Plus the N80x won't end in great neck it's just recycled N20 short turns merged with a rte that needs a boost. Plus again it's more direct if push comes to shove the bus can always do what some MTA express rtes do and use service rd. You are fun to discuss with kudos to you:tup::tup::cool: The bus will use whatever it can do to get to the entrance the fastest then at rush only will go untill the end of the HOV then exit. OHH and the bus will continue onward into queens via northern blvd. Think about it as a merger of lines.

[lilbluefoxie]

Im not sure what backtracking you are refering to, people use the (7)/<7> from the N20 to get to Manhattan for the most part. theres no backtracking, you just walk upstairs, catch the or preferably the and ride to Grand Central and get where you need to be.

 

East Side Access, teh project to bring the LIRR into Grand Central will negate the need to use the for that purpose however. That is expected to be done in 2013-14.

 

and im glad you enjoy discussing things with me. My advice to you would be to come to Long Island more often and get a better feel for what places are like. Its one thing to just look at a map and say oh this can go here, that can go there, its another to actually be there, to live there, and to know what the places are like on that map.

[R188 7857]

Im not sure what backtracking you are refering to, people use the (7)/<7> from the N20 to get to Manhattan for the most part. theres no backtracking, you just walk upstairs, catch the or preferably the and ride to Grand Central and get where you need to be.

 

East Side Access, teh project to bring the LIRR into Grand Central will negate the need to use the for that purpose however. That is expected to be done in 2013-14.

 

and im glad you enjoy discussing things with me. My advice to you would be to come to Long Island more often and get a better feel for what places are like. Its one thing to just look at a map and say oh this can go here, that can go there, its another to actually be there, to live there, and to know what the places are like on that map.

 

Agreed.

And I am not harassing you, but your harassing me.

If I were you, I would make the N80 go between Flushing and Roosevelt Field Mall.....via Highways - Northern State/Grand Central/Clearview...

at Flushing via northern, then onto the Clearview and then on to the GCP and then to the N Pkwy.

[qjtransitmaster]

Im not sure what backtracking you are refering to, people use the (7)/<7> from the N20 to get to Manhattan for the most part. theres no backtracking, you just walk upstairs, catch the or preferably the and ride to Grand Central and get where you need to be.

 

East Side Access, teh project to bring the LIRR into Grand Central will negate the need to use the for that purpose however. That is expected to be done in 2013-14.

 

and im glad you enjoy discussing things with me. My advice to you would be to come to Long Island more often and get a better feel for what places are like. Its one thing to just look at a map and say oh this can go here, that can go there, its another to actually be there, to live there, and to know what the places are like on that map.

 

I meant using another LIRR line to woodside to get flushing bound trains. If using N20 to 7 then yes that's not backtracking but I was referring to long distance ppl coming from areas east like in suffolk along ronkonkoma line stations. Local yes you are definately spot on not refuting that. But I was mentioning travel possibilities and was talking about ppl from several origins it would take forever to explain them all. All my ideas are with LONG RANGE TRAVEL IN MIND. So I am manipulating lines around each other and LIRR they affect ridership in distant areas all my plans are like that. My NYS intercity rural absorption plan, Lower hudson valley,New Jersey (the one that had gotten me weinstein's business card), MD however isn't ready as I must fan federick buses first(DOESN'T AFFECT LOCAL RTES). I am not really thinking about just one small area. I don't plan for short distance or even medium. I plan with several different regions in the back of my head. So you confused my ideas with only being limited to nassau they are not.

[lilbluefoxie]

I meant using another LIRR line to woodside to get flushing bound trains. If using N20 to 7 then yes that's not backtracking but I was referring to long distance ppl coming from areas east like in suffolk along ronkonkoma line stations. Local yes you are definately spot on not refuting that. But I was mentioning travel possibilities and was talking about ppl from several origins it would take forever to explain them all. All my ideas are with LONG RANGE TRAVEL IN MIND. So I am manipulating lines around each other and LIRR they affect ridership in distant areas all my plans are like that. My NYS intercity rural absorption plan, Lower hudson valley,New Jersey (the one that had gotten me weinstein's business card), MD however isn't ready as I must fan federick buses first(DOESN'T AFFECT LOCAL RTES). I am not really thinking about just one small area. I don't plan for short distance or even medium. I plan with several different regions in the back of my head. So you confused my ideas with only being limited to nassau they are not.

 

either way, whos gunna get off the train after they been on it for a while from suffolk county, then go on a bus then back on a subway train for a destination that isn't really that major, flushing is more of a transfer point than a destination people end up in like Manhattan.

 

Your intercity plans, first off theres already Amtrak that goes between major cities. Whos going to want to take a Greyhound or Fung Wah type of bus when you can hop on a train that is much faster and not bound by traffic. Or if you have a car you can skip all that and just drive. Thats another thing I find your plans dont take into account, whats the incentive to use your buses if theres already other options? and if you have a car theres even less incentive to.

[checkmatechamp13]

N94 Schedule from 2010

 

http://web.archive.org/web/20090313154535/http://mta.info/libus/routes/n94/weekday.pdf

 

service was rush hours only and every 30-45 minutes

 

Well, if the service ran every hour, it would probably become cheaper. I mean, it cost a little under $5 per passenger to operate under those headways (I believe it was $4.92), so cutting service by 1/4 would bring it down to around $3.70 per passenger. Plus, if it is connected to a route that brings N94 riders where they want to go (for instance, if N80 riders were interested in going to the Crossways), it can become even cheaper.

 

Wrong answer the line would use south ave stopping in front of the college then down to cherry valley ave en rte to mineola eliminating this roundabout way.

 

Agreed trying to make N48/49 go there would ruin the routes with a stupid backtracking segment. Backtracking NEVER makes sense. Let my N34 do that instead O it times with westbury LIRR trains too. N34 will use a very direct method to reach it's points so it will serve brush hollow rd NO OTHER ROUTES DEFINATELY NOT N49/48 Leave them alone!!!!!

 

Makes sense. So what are your plans for Nassau Blvd?

 

And your N34 may serve Brush Hollow Road, but you still need something reasonably frequent serving Union Avenue.

 

- Yes, they would simply interline....

- I'm not suggesting extending actual N48's/49's to RFM via New Cassel & westbury.... c'mon....

 

- What I'm sayin is, buses would serve LIRR Syosset AND walt whitman during peak hours.....

- Off peak, no LIRR Syosset with that "N77" idea of mine I'm waiting for dude to comment on.

 

Just making sure.

 

And is there anything of interest around the Syosset LIRR station (besides the station itself of course)? If there is a big shopping center or something then yeah, it should serve it. If not, keep it along Jericho Turnpike without the diversion.

 

And what headways are you thinking of for the route?

 

Great Neck is NOT a major destination for Nassau residents! its not a big job center like Mineola or the Nassau Hub area. I dont know what you are talking about with timing, the runs every 2-5 minutes during rush hours.

 

He means that somebody coming from, say Hicksville going to Great Neck doesn't have a timed transfer at Woodside. The wouldn't help them because they're going past Flushing.

 

Im not sure what backtracking you are refering to, people use the (7)/<7> from the N20 to get to Manhattan for the most part. theres no backtracking, you just walk upstairs, catch the or preferably the and ride to Grand Central and get where you need to be.

 

East Side Access, teh project to bring the LIRR into Grand Central will negate the need to use the for that purpose however. That is expected to be done in 2013-14.

 

and im glad you enjoy discussing things with me. My advice to you would be to come to Long Island more often and get a better feel for what places are like. Its one thing to just look at a map and say oh this can go here, that can go there, its another to actually be there, to live there, and to know what the places are like on that map.

 

I doubt N20 riders would switch to the LIRR just because of ESA. Right now, taking the LIRR to Flushing for the (or maybe Woodside can help you get a train ahead) is faster than taking the N20 to the , so if they're not on the LIRR already, it's because they don't want to pay the extra money.

[lilbluefoxie]

He means that somebody coming from, say Hicksville going to Great Neck doesn't have a timed transfer at Woodside. The wouldn't help them because they're going past Flushing.

 

 

 

I doubt N20 riders would switch to the LIRR just because of ESA. Right now, taking the LIRR to Flushing for the (or maybe Woodside can help you get a train ahead) is faster than taking the N20 to the , so if they're not on the LIRR already, it's because they don't want to pay the extra money.

 

he was talking about flushing and thats why I brought up the

 

well let them stay on the N20 then, if they want to get to manhattan faster than a subway and a bus they can take the LIRR. An express route by definition isnt going to be the same cost as the local routes, so if they arent going to pay for the LIRR they probably wont pay for an express bus.

[PinePower]

Not bad (suggestions/commentary) from a Brooklyn guy huh.....

Well anyway....

 

 

- That's why you don't really need the 15 on woodfield IMO... the W. Hempstead branch has been under utilized for the longest... let the N32 be the link b/w LIRR W. Hempstead & Hempstead (instead of the 15).... Have the 15 serve mercy hospital (which is what I'd do), on top of turning 15's off washington onto stewart, en route to RFM (your idea)... both of our ideas together eliminates duplication & cuts running time on that route.....

 

- the N16 should be eliminated; the route itself is "duplicative"..... The N35 only goes to Baldwin, so let it spend some time in the Nassau Hub area a bit (again, have the 15 be the quick link b/w HTC & RFM, since that has to go all the way to Long beach.... by doing this, there'd be no need to extend the 35 to no long beach (as QJT states))....

 

from your neck of the woods, I'd have the N35 continue down to miller... then have the N35 do everything that the N16 does at, and south of miller av, en route to HTC.... clinton av/rd doesn't really warrant a bus IMO.... one of the reasons the 35 gets jammed is b/c it's the direct link b/w NCC & HTC (while avoiding RFM, to boot).... your N24 can be the direct link b/w NCC & RFM (while the N43 & N45 would loom as alternatives).....

 

^^ I think we solved that problem

 

 

- N19.... yes, I believe suffolk should be the ones providing service along that portion.... have the S25 (I think it is, the North Babylon route that stops at the south bay shopping ctr) swing on over a couple miles along montauk hwy to Sunrise....

 

- N73/74 comment... yep, already ahead of ya....

 

your N29 from RFM to Hicksville via New Cassel is too short a route to run every 20 mins, all day (remember what we're dealing with here; no more MTA).... something would have to give....

However, you can still have N73/74's run hourly all day along said portion, on top of interlining the N48's/49's that would end at hicksville... those physical buses would be used as N73/74 short turns b/w RFM & Hicksville... you'd just have schedule them (the short turns) so that buses aren't arriving around the same time (the full N73/74's) would.....

 

 

- The Jericho tpke comment, you do have a point, it is moderately commercial in parts out there.... how about this....

 

What do you think of an hourly route (call it the "N77" for all I care) that would pan from RFM to Walt Whitman mall (via jericho tpke), w/ some peak runs parallelling your N80/81 revision up to LIRR Syosset? The route would run up glen cove rd to jericho tpke, and swing all the way out to walt whitman..... Give ppl. another option than having to ride out to huntington & dealing w/ the S1 to get to that mall....

 

^^ No N35, 48, or 49 extension necessary.... one route, one main purpose/corridor - Jericho tpke itself.

 

 

- I wouldn't bother sending another route to Long beach.... get rid of the N36, to supply for the amt. of buses the N15 is gonna need.... If Oceanside itself starts to clamor for bus service, then have the N14 act as an Oceanside-RVC loop - They may need it w/ what I would do the N16 & the N36.... Not sure if such a loop should actually come to fruition though.....

 

 

- Your original N80/81 restructure I think would suffice.... The N35 to crossways via NCC & HTC may be too much (meaning, it'd compromise the N35).... the 35 has the ridership to remain a north-south route for the most part (unlike the N73/74, which I don't have a problem with, being an 'L' shaped route)....

 

 

...and that point about full routes still doesn't fly with me.... you're comparing the city's MTA bus routes, to LIB routes..... the city's MTA bus routes aren't exactly hard-pressed for ridership like LIB routes are (that, and a lot of the old PBL routes simply ran/run shorter distances than NYCT routes [in general]).... any amount of passengers LIB routes could hope to pick up along a route's full length (outside of the N6's, 20's, etc. of the world), is a plus.....

 

let's leave the city's bus routes out of this... this is a good exchange/discussion we're having here so far... When you're not over dramatic, you do make good sound points..... The one thing no one can consider you, is a foamer....

 

regardless, let's keep the focus on LIB :tup:

 

That's not a bad idea with the 15, have it go via Peninsula and have the 32 fill the W.Hempstead part of the route. The 35 could become the "local" spending more time in the HUB area and filling the 16's shoes to HTC. 35 doesn't go to RFM and is filled by the new 24. That could work.:tup:

And this brings up another thing, the 27 duplicates the 16, between Oak and HTC, but that portion of the 27 gets good ridership. Much of the 27s ridership stays on till HTC, not many get off at RF. So that has to stay.

Yes differnent lines could service the Prospect corridor but it still needs the frequent service, as its a busy spot along the route. The N77 is also an intesting idea as well. Only thing is it will serve a dead stretch of Jericho Turnpike between Glen Cove Rd and west of Brush Hollow. However, it could run via Old Country, Post, and Brush Hollow to Jericho which adds more service to the N.C. corridor. I may revise my plans to add that.

Yeah part of the 36 could be merged into a 14, and due to the light ridership minibuses should be used on that route, it'd run weekday AM and PM rush hours only.

[B35 via Church]

And is there anything of interest around the Syosset LIRR station (besides the station itself of course)? If there is a big shopping center or something then yeah, it should serve it. If not, keep it along Jericho Turnpike without the diversion.

 

And what headways are you thinking of for the route?

 

The closer you get to the RR station (Syosset), the more commercial it gets....

There's no one big shopping center, but there are a couple shopping plaza's..... just about everything patrons in a neighborhood could need, all in one specific area basically (it's much bigger than most suburban "downtowns", if you need something to gauge it on).....I gotta take a trip out there again sometime....

 

As for headways..... hourly, all day...

The route would run weekdays & saturdays only.....

 

 

That's not a bad idea with the 15, have it go via Peninsula and have the 32 fill the W.Hempstead part of the route. The 35 could become the "local" spending more time in the HUB area and filling the 16's shoes to HTC. 35 doesn't go to RFM and is filled by the new 24. That could work.

 

And this brings up another thing, the 27 duplicates the 16, between Oak and HTC, but that portion of the 27 gets good ridership. Much of the 27s ridership stays on till HTC, not many get off at RF. So that has to stay.

 

Yes differnent lines could service the Prospect corridor but it still needs the frequent service, as its a busy spot along the route.

 

The N77 is also an intesting idea as well. Only thing is it will serve a dead stretch of Jericho Turnpike between Glen Cove Rd and west of Brush Hollow. However, it could run via Old Country, Post, and Brush Hollow to Jericho which adds more service to the N.C. corridor. I may revise my plans to add that.

 

Yeah part of the 36 could be merged into a 14, and due to the light ridership minibuses should be used on that route, it'd run weekday AM and PM rush hours only.

 

- Everything said in the first paragraph, :tup:

 

- Yeh, there's no problem w/ the 27 down in the hub area; that'll remain as is.... instead of the 16 & the 27 on westbury blvd, it'd be the 27 & the 35.... the 27 will remain turning on oak, en route to RFM, etc.... the 35 will pan on over lindbergh, en route to NCC, etc.....

 

- ok, How much more frequent do you wanna make that segment (Prospect av, etc)..... anything lower than every 15 mins. peak & 20 mins. off peak is overkill..... I know you wanna protect home, but (as checkmatechamp would say) let's be fair here.....

 

- N77 thing.... I just threw that out there....

However you think such a route should be physically routed to bring in as much riders as possible to justify hourly headways is good enough with me.... feel free to add that in your list of plans to send to veolia if you'd like.....

 

- N14/N36....yeh, I agree, throw mini's on the route that would be formed from this.... also agree w/ rush hr. only service......

[User]

N94 Schedule from 2010

 

http://web.archive.org/web/20090313154535/http://mta.info/libus/routes/n94/weekday.pdf

 

service was rush hours only and every 30-45 minutes

What are the Gateways? What exactly did the N94 do?