Bronx Officials Want Additional Metro-North Stations In Borough

[Harry]

 

Folks who live in the eastern Bronx know the commute to Manhattan is long. "There are a lot of things you could do with that hour and a half to three hours in extra commuting time that we have," said Joseph Oddo, treasurer of the Pelham Bay Civic Association. Oddo said that's turning potential investors away. "Once we start discussing transportation, their attitude changes," he said.

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[GojiMet86]

Well, I believe a subway or a rapid transit line of some sort instead of Metro-North would serve eastern Bronx better. Perhaps that extension to the Bronx of the Second Avenue subway, if it ever gets finished and if the money appears. Pushing that aside, I just feel that Metro-North would be more expensive. But if it happens, it happens.

[qjtransitmaster]

Well, I believe a subway or a rapid transit line of some sort instead of Metro-North would serve eastern Bronx better. Perhaps that extension to the Bronx of the Second Avenue subway, if it ever gets finished and if the money appears. Pushing that aside, I just feel that Metro-North would be more expensive. But if it happens, it happens.

they can do a added ability that lets Metrocard monthly or Xbus plus holders use MNRR in the eastern or north bronx at no extra charge. Via pay by metrocard option added to ticket machines. Where monthly holders can get citytickets at no extra charge and PPR well will simply get the cost of the ticket like example $7 deducted from their card to get the ticket.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Well, I believe a subway or a rapid transit line of some sort instead of Metro-North would serve eastern Bronx better. Perhaps that extension to the Bronx of the Second Avenue subway, if it ever gets finished and if the money appears. Pushing that aside, I just feel that Metro-North would be more expensive. But if it happens, it happens.

LOL... MetroNorth would be much better received in areas like Morris Park than a subway for the exact reason you mentioned.  You attract certain types of people with MetroNorth and other types with the subway and clearly they want to attract high income professionals to those areas, hence the push for MetroNorth.

[qjtransitmaster]

LOL... MetroNorth would be much better received in areas like Morris Park than a subway for the exact reason you mentioned.  You attract certain types of people with MetroNorth and other types with the subway and clearly they want to attract high income professionals to those areas, hence the push for MetroNorth.

will it be frequent? I don't give a rats ass about types attracted one city is city period. If it's in the 5 boros it should be treated like every other train. Outside outer is different and this would be a boon for reverse travelers to CT from the bronx.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

will it be frequent? I don't give a rats ass about types attracted one city is city period. If it's in the 5 boros it should be treated like every other train. Outside outer is different and this would be a boon for reverse travelers to CT from the bronx.

What you think doesn't matter. This is about what the communities want and some may not want a subway there. MetroNorth will appeal to young middle and upper middle class professionals who may not want to use the subway AND those who have the money to INVEST in the Bronx.   This is about money and building for the Bronx in the long term. MetroNorth has a pretty good on time rate too while the subways in most of the Bronx are not reliable. Furthermore the cost to add the MetroNorth stations would be far cheaper than subways.

[qjtransitmaster]

What you think doesn't matter. This is about what the communities want and some may not want a subway there. MetroNorth will appeal to young middle and upper middle class professionals who may not want to use the subway AND those who have the money to INVEST in the Bronx.   This is about money and building for the Bronx in the long term. MetroNorth has a pretty good on time rate too while the subways in most of the Bronx are not reliable. Furthermore the cost to add the MetroNorth stations would be far cheaper than subways.

they are still trains and that mnrr is faster and more direct so it's better than a subway anyway. BUT it is also cheaper to implement as well and can improve connections with the subway network if timed well enough with 20 to 15 min headways throughout. I was talking farewise.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

they are still trains and that mnrr is faster and more direct so it's better than a subway anyway. BUT it is also cheaper to implement as well and can improve connections with the subway network if timed well enough with 20 to 15 min headways throughout. I was talking farewise.

Well of course it's going to be more expensive... That was my point... 

[MTARegional Bus]

LOL... MetroNorth would be much better received in areas like Morris Park than a subway for the exact reason you mentioned.  You attract certain types of people with MetroNorth and other types with the subway and clearly they want to attract high income professionals to those areas, hence the push for MetroNorth.

 

 

Oh great just what we need other riverdale 

 

Slap in a 3rd rail and Modded FRA Subway cars in that branch and boom, Subway 

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Oh great just what we need other riverdale 

lol

[Turbo19]

Oh great just what we need other riverdale 

 

Slap in a 3rd rail and Modded FRA Subway cars in that branch and boom, Subway 

No that you mention it, it'd be interesting to see an electrified MNRR line.

[MTARegional Bus]

No that you mention it, it'd be interesting to see an electrified MNRR line.

 

You know what? I think it be better to just install pantographs on the Modded subway car, it may be to costly to install miles of 3rd rail.

 

but then again it would be interesting what blue M8 would look like 

 

 

 

[qjtransitmaster]

You know what? I think it be better to just install pantographs on the Modded subway car, it may be to costly to install miles of 3rd rail.

 

but then again it would be interesting what blue M8 would look like 

 

 

 

 

 

don't the M8s have it already.

[mtattrain]

Quite strangely, this happened too:

Metro-North's plan to bring its trains into Penn Station for the first time would be an economic boon to the Bronx, generating $1 billion in business while delivering some 5,400 jobs to a borough that desperately needs them, according to a report commissioned by state and New York City leaders.

Bronx lawmakers used the report's findings to call on Metro-North's parent agency, the MTA, to include in the agency's next five-year capital program money to build four new Bronx station stops in Co-op City, Morris Park, Hunts Point and Parkchester.

"The benefits are clear and will be critical to launching the Bronx into the 21st century and beyond," said state Sen. Jeff Klein (D-Bronx, Westchester).

Also known as the West Side Access Project, the proposal to bring trains into Penn Station remains in the talking phase as details are hashed out and as officials try to summon the political and financial support that will make it a reality.

Aside from the four station stops in the Bronx, the project would require the construction of stations on the Upper West Side of Manhattan as well as one near Columbia University. A state comptroller's report has pegged the cost at $1.2 billion. The white paper estimates the cost of the four new stations at $364 million.

The goal is to open up the rail link in the fall of 2019, around the same time that Grand Central Terminal would open to LIRR trains for the first time, alleviating crowding at Penn Station. Currently, Metro-North is the only commuter rail using Grand Central.

 

The report, released Tuesday, highlighted Metro-North's emergence as the commuter rail with the nation's largest reverse market. Over the past two decades, the number of New York City commuters using Metro-North for jobs in the Hudson Valley and beyond has surged from 5,000 to 13,000, MTA figures show.

The trend has transformed Metro-North from a commuter rail identified mostly by the grey-suited morning Manhattan commuter of the "Mad Men" era to one that ferries health care workers, housekeepers and others to jobs in New York and Connecticut.

In White Plains, one of Metro-North's busiest station stops, the number of commuters getting off (3,400) during the morning rush now rivals the number getting on (3,650) for a ride into Manhattan, according to railroad officials.

"They (the stations) make sense because now we can have folks looking for employment opportunities not just in Manhattan but up in Connecticut," said Bronx Borough President Ruben Diaz.

Metro-North union leaders also argued for Bronx station stops, saying they will create jobs for people living in a borough with one of the state's highest unemployment rates at 11.6 percent.

"Investing in rail expansion now will have economic benefits, including quality job creation for years to come," said Anthony Bottalico, the general chairman of Metro-North's largest union, the Association of Commuter Rail Employees, representing mostly conductors and engineers.

The report estimates that the stations will increase the value of residential properties near the stations by an average of $142,000 to $587,000.

To make the West Side Access Project plan work, Metro-North's New Haven Line tracks would link up with existing Amtrak rails on its Hell Gate Line. Metro-North trains heading south would split after New Rochelle, with some going to Penn Station and others on to Grand Central. Six Westchester County stops on the New Haven Line -- New Rochelle, Larchmont, Mamaroneck, Rye, Port Chester and Harrison -- would benefit by gaining Penn Station access.

In a later phase, Hudson Line trains would be linked to Amtrak rails on its Empire Connection Line.

 

-Newsday

 

It seems that these additional Metro-North Stations are a part of an even larger project... this actually sounds real nice!

[qjtransitmaster]

Quite strangely, this happened too:

 

 

It seems that these additional Metro-North Stations are a part of an even larger project... this actually sounds real nice!

I hope metronorth makes an intermodal stop for GWB NJT service.

[bobtehpanda]

Weren't there going to be electrification issues with the whole Metro-North/Hell Gate operating system?

Isn't the Empire Connection partially single tracked?

For those of you who are advocating subway-through service, isn't the voltage difference on the third rails a problem, and is this kind of operation even legal by FRA standards?

Let's not overcomplicate this - this is a way for MNRR to pick up even more reverse commuters, and isn't really geared towards improving access to the city's core.

[qjtransitmaster]

Weren't there going to be electrification issues with the whole Metro-North/Hell Gate operating system?

 

Isn't the Empire Connection partially single tracked?

 

For those of you who are advocating subway-through service, isn't the voltage difference on the third rails a problem, and is this kind of operation even legal by FRA standards?

 

Let's not overcomplicate this - this is a way for MNRR to pick up even more reverse commuters, and isn't really geared towards improving access to the city's core.

I am not advocating for subway line as in through service or an actual subway line through but fare wise unification at rush hour for bronx commuters cause I doubt they would like to pony up for 2 separate services per month. MNRR and a metrocard err yeah right. However I kinda agree that this is geared more towards reverse commuters than manhattan bound folks. In bold not gonna lie you hit the nail on the head with that one.

 

FRA to my knowledge will not allow it at least that is what I know the rules can be updated at any time so who knows for sure.

 

The empire connection is only single tracked on the bridge over the hudson other than that as soon as it crosses into manhattan from the hudson line it becomes double tracked for the whole way.

 

There are no electrification issues with the hells gate as M8 rail cars can use both catenary and 3rd rail. But that is all catenary wire anyway.

[MTARegional Bus]

No if they don't but the 3rd, they can use Diesels at the moment.  

 

SIRT runs on Rail road track and FRA Modded converted Subway cars anyway, I don't see why not, it depends what Company the MTA will hire to do the installing off the pantographs and converting them to the correct voltage on the used Subway car.

 

Also last time I check the M8 can Run on different voltages 

[qjtransitmaster]

No if they don't but the 3rd, they can use Diesels at the moment.  

 

SIRT runs on Rail road track and FRA Modded converted Subway cars anyway, I don't see why not, it depends what Company the MTA will hire to do the installing off the pantographs and converting them to the correct voltage on the used Subway car.

 

Also last time I check the M8 can Run on different voltages 

But what is cheaper to operate modded subway cars Or M8 rail cars? 

 

In the mean-time in theory rail ferries can actually bring trains on the SIRT to bay ridge so they can continue on the old bay ridge LIRR as a crosstown over the triboro until a tunnel is built but it is possible physically. If electrified M8s should be able to do it.

[bobtehpanda]

No if they don't but the 3rd, they can use Diesels at the moment.  

 

SIRT runs on Rail road track and FRA Modded converted Subway cars anyway, I don't see why not, it depends what Company the MTA will hire to do the installing off the pantographs and converting them to the correct voltage on the used Subway car.

 

Also last time I check the M8 can Run on different voltages 

 

No, I'm talking about the fact that FRA regulations ban simultaneous operation of subway and rail equipment at the same time.

 

The M8 can run on different voltages, but that's for the overhead catenary.

[GojiMet86]

My understanding of the FRA regulations is that if the line shares trackage, or connects, with the mainline railroad, then it's subject to railroad rules.

[MTARegional Bus]

No, I'm talking about the fact that FRA regulations ban simultaneous operation of subway and rail equipment at the same time.

 

The M8 can run on different voltages, but that's for the overhead catenary.

 

 

The why does SIRT exist?  if it ban shouldn't SIRT have Commuter cars instead of Modded FRA subway cars?

[bobtehpanda]

The why does SIRT exist?  if it ban shouldn't SIRT have Commuter cars instead of Modded FRA subway cars?

 

First of all, there's a bit of confusion about whether or not SIRT, is, in fact, under any sort of FRA jurisdiction.

 

Second of all, there is no active through running of mainline railroad trains onto the SIRT, so that specific example is not illegal. A more relevant example would be the operation of the River Line in Trenton, where both diesel light rail and mainline rail services use the same track on a regular basis. However, due to FRA regulations, the non-light rail equipment is prohibited from operating with mainline rail services at the exact same time - the River Line services end pretty early to allow for freight service at night.

 

Essentially, this prohibits any sort of subway car from running on the same trackage as an FRA-compliant train line - linking any subway line to the mainline network and using it in regular service would theoretically subject the line to FRA regulation, and that would basically be bad for the subway since the weight requirements would effectively prevent reasonably priced rolling stock that would be capable of subway-style frequent acceleration and deceleration. You also have differences in curve radii, loading gauge, etc...

 

It's the reason why the LIRR stopped through-service on the BMT when the FRA was created.

[Vistausss]

Well, I believe a subway or a rapid transit line of some sort instead of Metro-North would serve eastern Bronx better. Perhaps that extension to the Bronx of the Second Avenue subway, if it ever gets finished and if the money appears. Pushing that aside, I just feel that Metro-North would be more expensive. But if it happens, it happens.

 

More expensive? Metro-North is already running there. People probably wouldn't want an el there so you have to dig the streets there and that would be way more expensive than a simple MNRR branch.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

More expensive? Metro-North is already running there. People probably wouldn't want an el there so you have to dig the streets there and that would be way more expensive than a simple MNRR branch.

You better believe that they don't want a subway there. A subway would just bring crime and destroy the character of the area.  If they ever considered extending a subway here I'd protest vehemently against it.  We have MetroNorth here and that's good enough.  There's a bus for those who so need the subway.  Keep it down the hill there in the Bronx!