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R36 Preservation

Holiday train ideas

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Well, the holiday season is still over two months away, but the holiday trains always draw interest (as any special train would). Since 2006 the holiday special has run Sundays on the former 75px-NYCS-bull-trans-V_svg.png (now 75px-NYCS-bull-trans-M_svg.png) with R1-9s. Since it has been the same old concept for five straight years, why can't another route be used, to freshen up and get more people interested?

 

One simple change is to have the R1-9s run between 145 Street and the WTC on the 75px-NYCS-bull-trans-C_svg.png as a 75px-NYCS-bull-trans-K_svg.png . R1-9s on the 75px-NYCS-bull-trans-K_svg.png (145-WTC) would be a new experience, but would also allow holiday visitor to rider between lower, midtown and upper Manhattan on a special.

 

For the IRT, Low Vs or SMEEs could run on the 75px-NYCS-bull-trans-1_svg.png or 75px-NYCS-bull-trans-6_svg.png between 137-South Ferry and 3 Av/138-Brooklyn Bridge. The 75px-NYCS-bull-trans-7_svg.png could be another place. As a side note, the SMEEs did run several holiday weekend runs in 2004 on the 75px-NYCS-bull-trans-6_svg.png and 75px-NYCS-bull-trans-7_svg.pngwith 9306, the ML R33s, 6609 and 6239 (It would be great to see ML R36s 9542-43 come out for a special appearance).

 

One other idea I thought of could be a "Toys for Tots" or Santa train, which many railroads across the country sponsor. Here, a special run could run on a Saturday or Sunday in December along a line with unused express tracks and stop at major express stations along the route to collect toys for needy children before heading back to the yard to unload the collections. The 75px-NYCS-bull-trans-7_svg.png and the Brighton Line 75px-NYCS-bull-trans-Q_svg.png/75px-NYCS-bull-trans-B_svg.png have express tracks that could be used on weekends for this.

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Oh F**k, here we go again. Looks like someone dosent understand why the holiday train runs where it does.

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What he posted is a very good idea especially the last one, Maybe if the museum does something very different for once more people would show up not including railfans, Thats the biggest problem right now (I'm not bashing the museum) but they run almost the same trips every year since 2009 and its making people turn the other way, I mean I would love to ride vintage equipment but whats the point if you run them on the same holiday route since 2007, and the same trips, i don't even chase ether thats even pointless, the next trip coming up in october you gonna see more chasers than anything

 

 

 

Thats my 2 cents, Im not gonna give a crap if people disagree with me but this is the MAIN reason why the Museum is loosing money

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Ok, let me share some info with those who know not of what they speak...

 

The holiday train runs from second Ave to Queens Plaza for a reason. What's that reason you ask? Well the train is billed as the "shoppers special" and as most people know, the main shopping area in NYC is 5th av and Herald Sq. so runs along 8th av, Lexington Av, Broadway, and 7th Av would not really work. Also, there are less trains on the 6th av line on Sundays so the train will not disrupt service (it's and EXTRA train). Also, the terminals don't interupt other lines and allow the crew time to breath. Now for those of you who say that the run is old and boring, no one and i mean no one who is involved with the running of the holiday train cares. In fact, if buffs didn't show up it would be a releife. The train is meant to attract tourists and casual riders, and draw that it has with reailfans is secondary.

Now how pays for this train and who makes money off it? The train (and crews) are paid by the public affairs office (because this is a public relations event). The transit museum has NOTHING to do with it aside from letting 3 cars runon the train. They don't pay for it or make any money from it AT ALL! Infact, the trip that was run in July of this year didn't use ANY transit museum equipment.

 

Now can we stop with these silly holiday train idea threads, the people who run the train run it wear they do because it works and they run the R1-9s because they work and they work well in LOCAL sevice and they attract people and they have the capacity to move them. Running the SMEEs is stupid because they are TOO NEW, running the Low-Vs is stupid because there are TOO FEW of the them.

 

End of Rant/explanation of why things are the way they are....

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If the Holiday train is meant for shoppers along and around 6th Avenue, then why not have the R1/9 run to 145th Street on the Concourse M track to 2nd Avenue or Bedford? People will then have access to the shopping centers still and not interrupted.

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I agree with INDman - 6 Ave is the ideal line to run a Holiday train fo an excellent reason. Most of the shopping is done in stores served by the stops along the line. Running it elsewhere, as nice of a thought as it is, would make little to no sense.

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If the Holiday train is meant for shoppers along and around 6th Avenue, then why not have the R1/9 run to 145th Street on the Concourse M track to 2nd Avenue or Bedford? People will then have access to the shopping centers still and not interrupted.

 

How many tourists do you see on the Concourse? Those who decide where the train runs know alot more then you do, that's why their in charge and not you.

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There are also the shopping complexes along QB (71-Continental, 63dr, Woodhaven, Grand) to think about as well, not just midtown 6Av/5Av. There is no shopping north of 59, and its too widely scattered in the IRT.

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There are also the shopping complexes along QB (71-Continental, 63dr, Woodhaven, Grand) to think about as well, not just midtown 6Av/5Av. There is no shopping north of 59, and its too widely scattered in the IRT.

 

Ok, now where do you turn trains without getting in the way of roads?

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Ok, now where do you turn trains without getting in the way of roads?

 

My idea is to have the train go into a relay North of Continental Avenue, just like the (M) and (R) lines do. IMHO, there are fewer trains on the road on Sundays compared to Saturdays & the weekdays, so it should not be a problem. Plus, if there is a problem with the Holiday Train, for whatever reason, the Jamaica Yard is nearby.

 

Also, if the MTA wants to spend a little more $$ on this, they can always have it terminate at 179 St/Hillside Avenue, Queens, since that station can terminate 2 lines at one time.

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My idea is to have the train go into a relay North of Continental Avenue, just like the (M) and (R) lines do. IMHO, there are fewer trains on the road on Sundays compared to Saturdays & the weekdays, so it should not be a problem. Plus, if there is a problem with the Holiday Train, for whatever reason, the Jamaica Yard is nearby.

 

Also, if the MTA wants to spend a little more $$ on this, they can always have it terminate at 179 St/Hillside Avenue, Queens, since that station can terminate 2 lines at one time.

 

If the train were to lay down in the relay at Continental, there would be hell to pay. Most of you people don't know this, but it is a fight to do any thing with the train because everyone wants a piece of the action and they will try to blame anything that goes wrong on the museum train and I mean ANYTHING. The route where the train runs now is just fine. If the road blows up, it allows us to stay out of sight and out of mind.

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How many tourists do you see on the Concourse? Those who decide where the train runs know alot more then you do, that's why their in charge and not you.

 

Not going to bother, but pretty much they know more then all of us.

 

And besides, do you even know there are actually tourist on the QBL? Its about the same thing as it going on the CPW.

Edited by mark1447

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It's fine where it is and Most of us know whats the deal from point A-B.

I hope they run this Train period cause I know I look forward to it now.

Only grip that gets me is that 1575 is not the East Motor:cry:

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Ok, let me share some info with those who know not of what they speak...

 

The holiday train runs from second Ave to Queens Plaza for a reason. What's that reason you ask? Well the train is billed as the "shoppers special" and as most people know, the main shopping area in NYC is 5th av and Herald Sq. so runs along 8th av, Lexington Av, Broadway, and 7th Av would not really work. Also, there are less trains on the 6th av line on Sundays so the train will not disrupt service (it's and EXTRA train). Also, the terminals don't interupt other lines and allow the crew time to breath. Now for those of you who say that the run is old and boring, no one and i mean no one who is involved with the running of the holiday train cares. In fact, if buffs didn't show up it would be a releife. The train is meant to attract tourists and casual riders, and draw that it has with reailfans is secondary.

Now how pays for this train and who makes money off it? The train (and crews) are paid by the public affairs office (because this is a public relations event). The transit museum has NOTHING to do with it aside from letting 3 cars runon the train. They don't pay for it or make any money from it AT ALL! Infact, the trip that was run in July of this year didn't use ANY transit museum equipment.

 

Now can we stop with these silly holiday train idea threads, the people who run the train run it wear they do because it works and they run the R1-9s because they work and they work well in LOCAL sevice and they attract people and they have the capacity to move them. Running the SMEEs is stupid because they are TOO NEW, running the Low-Vs is stupid because there are TOO FEW of the them.

 

End of Rant/explanation of why things are the way they are....

 

Yup all sound arguments but you can't reason with these failfans (not a typo) who think the trip is JUST for them and who think that because they love the redbirds everyone else will too...especially on a personal shuttle somewhere in an outer borough where the train has to relay on an inconvenient track....

 

Clueless...

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My idea is to have the train go into a relay North of Continental Avenue, just like the (M) and (R) lines do. IMHO, there are fewer trains on the road on Sundays compared to Saturdays & the weekdays, so it should not be a problem. Plus, if there is a problem with the Holiday Train, for whatever reason, the Jamaica Yard is nearby.

 

Also, if the MTA wants to spend a little more $$ on this, they can always have it terminate at 179 St/Hillside Avenue, Queens, since that station can terminate 2 lines at one time.

 

The MTA does NOT want to spend more $$ on this. Second, there is no reason to run the train to Continental or Hillside. When you lengthen the run, you decrease the frequency of service. The short run on 6th Ave to Queens Plaza allows for plenty of trips so that more people get to ride the train in the congested areas of midtown rather than wasting time running a 90% empty train in a less utilized queens corridor.

 

And besides, do you even know there are actually tourist on the QBL? Its about the same thing as it going on the CPW.

 

The overwhelming majority of NYC tourists visit Manhattan between the South Ferry area and 59th Street.

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The MTA does NOT want to spend more $$ on this. Second, there is no reason to run the train to Continental or Hillside. When you lengthen the run, you decrease the frequency of service. The short run on 6th Ave to Queens Plaza allows for plenty of trips so that more people get to ride the train in the congested areas of midtown rather than wasting time running a 90% empty train in a less utilized queens corridor.

 

 

 

.

 

I thought the Museum is the one spending money, not the MTA? :confused:

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I thought the Museum is the one spending money, not the MTA? :confused:

 

Did you bother to read what I had posted before? Oh wait, you didn't because I had said that the Public Affairs office pays for the train or a sponsor does as in the case of the HBO train.

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I honestly think the idea that the holiday trains are ment to be touristy is something they can't process at all.

 

In all the time I've been doing the boards, I've only read of one in service run that was focused outside of the main area of manhattan (aside from the JFK trips) and that was when a MOD trip that visted the Franklin Shuttle made three in service round trips on the shuttle.

 

http://web.archive.org/web/20100109104626/http://www.forgotten-ny.com/SUBWAYS/nostalgia3/oldcars.html

 

Would I like them to run in more places, yes I would. I would also like a million dollars and a celebrity girlfriend. there is what you want, and then there's what you got.

 

They could run them in more placed. But they do anyways, just the summer times.

 

Did you bother to read what I had posted before? Oh wait, you didn't because I had said that the Public Affairs office pays for the train or a sponsor does as in the case of the HBO train.

 

lol...

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I thought the Museum is the one spending money, not the MTA? :confused:

 

The Transit Museum is not spending any money whatsoever to run the holiday train. This is strictly something MTA does through the Public Affairs department.

 

-March of Dimes trips were done through Subdivision C. Those are suspended indefinitely.

-ERA trips were sponsored by the ERA.

-Baseball service ("Lo-V 4's to Yankee Stadium" since the Mets never win anything) is sponsored by a corporate sponsor, or by a nonprofit, handled through the public affairs department

-Christmas trips are sponsored by the MTA, handled through the public affairs department

-The Lo-V's in September are specifically paid for and sponsored by HBO/Boardwalk Empire, through the public affairs department.

 

The only trips in any way run through the Transit Museum are the excursions that are printed on the Museum calendar, distributed to members, and listed on the website. The other trips have very little to do with the Museum at all (save for in some cases borrowing some of the TM equipment), and have their own very distinct set of rules and needs - not the least of which is working around other GO's, not interfering with regular service, being in a high visibility corridor for people to ride, and having a practical relay procedure. And they are most certainly not run for buffs.

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Actually:

 

If it didn't disrupt the (M) shuttle too much, I'd be looking to have the Holiday R-1/9s run to Myrtle Avenue on the (J). That would have it run above ground over the Willamsburg Bridge.

 

I would also have at least one run of the trains on Saturday evening so that those who are entrenched with the NFL on Sundays or otherwise can't be in NYC on Sunday can make the run (having it go perhaps from 5:00 PM-Midnight).

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My bad on the last one:

 

What I meant was, I would have it run to QP as it does now, but also to Myrtle using the (M) and (J), so long as doesn't disrupt the (Mx) shuttle too much for reasons otherwise already noted.

 

As for Saturday, I know a lot of people who on Sundays are so entrenched in the NFL they work their shopping schedule around the games (i.e.: No shopping on Sundays). That's why I would include one Saturday evening run (late enough so those who observe the Sabbath can still go on it) for those who never miss the NFL on Sundays.

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