Holiday train ideas

[Kamen Rider]

Please, watch the Nazi Banksters Crimes Ripple Effect at http://jforjustice.co.uk/banksters

[SubwayGuy]

1) F*ck the NFL, if people are too busy jerking off to a bunch of dudes in helmets chasing after a ball, then they don't get to ride the train. The train is for TOURISTS and SHOPPERS not washed up has-been high school athletes who live vicariously through a bunch of talking heads on TV sundays.

 

2) Why in the hell would a nostalgia train be run on the Broadway-Brooklyn line? Unless the goal is to get as few people on the train as possible, that's not going to accomplish anything. The Nassau St. platforms in Manhattan are some of the least utilized Manhattan stations...running the train there serves no purpose whatsoever. Not to mention, again, it's an inconvenient relay.

 

3) You can't run the train Saturday night AND Sunday because then the crew will not get the requisite rest to run the train on Sunday also. Asking them to work straight through is a violation of rules, and hazardous and unfair to the employees anyway.

 

Besides, even if someone is a hardcore, died in the wool, [insert NFL team name here] fan, you mean to tell me they have to watch every single NFL game (not just those of their team since with 5 weeks of holiday trains, there's bound to be a week [favorite NFL team] doesn't play, or plays on Thursday or Monday, or late Sunday)??? Who f*cking cares about out of town games. I'm sorry but that's the most ridiculous argument I've ever heard for scheduling a nostalgia train ride. They fill up just fine without all the 50 year old manchildren in full team facepaint and gear as it is.

[TwoTimer]

I may have to bring up the idea of an inhouse mod dedicated to this forum to shutter useless crap like this

[SubwayGuy]

I may have to bring up the idea of an inhouse mod dedicated to this forum to shutter useless crap like this

 

If that were really the case, maybe two threads a week would actually start!

[Kamen Rider]

Please, watch the Nazi Banksters Crimes Ripple Effect at http://jforjustice.co.uk/banksters

[Wallyhorse]

I was thinking of one weekend where the holiday train runs on Saturday night instead of Sunday knowing there are a lot of people who only are in NYC on Saturdays (I know quite a few who never venture into NYC on Sundays, but will go in on Saturday) and also knowing there are people who do in fact watch at least the Jets and Giants games (remember, the Jets and Giants, unless they are playing each other as they are on Christmas Eve are never on at the same time) and in most cases watches all of the out of town games shown (unless there is a REAL dog matchup) and in many cases all of the games.

 

You forget the NFL is the 800-pound gorilla of sports and really does dictate what a lot of people do on Sundays (and to a lesser extent, Monday nights all season and Thursday nights in the second half of the year). Many people do in fact adjust their weekend schedules from Labor Day onward around the NFL, and a Saturday night nostalgia special would be for those who for whatever reason can't do it on Sunday.

[Grand Concourse]

which sounds better; tons of useless clutter, or only a few threads, but they are worthwhile discusions.

Seems like it is the 'usual suspects' that continues with all the foaming. I'd say restrict their postings in certain sections.

But at this rate, I'd pick the latter. Quality over quantity.

[Kamen Rider]

Please, watch the Nazi Banksters Crimes Ripple Effect at http://jforjustice.co.uk/banksters

[Kamen Rider]

Please, watch the Nazi Banksters Crimes Ripple Effect at http://jforjustice.co.uk/banksters

[SubwayGuy]

I was thinking of one weekend where the holiday train runs on Saturday night instead of Sunday knowing there are a lot of people who only are in NYC on Saturdays (I know quite a few who never venture into NYC on Sundays, but will go in on Saturday) and also knowing there are people who do in fact watch at least the Jets and Giants games (remember, the Jets and Giants, unless they are playing each other as they are on Christmas Eve are never on at the same time) and in most cases watches all of the out of town games shown (unless there is a REAL dog matchup) and in many cases all of the games.

 

Well then that person needs to find something else to do with their life. Sitting in front of a f*cking TV for 9 hours straight is absolutely pathetic. If they still choose to live this pathetic lifestyle, since this is America, they then have no grounds (notice I didn't say "right") to complain about anything and can be summarily pointed at and told what a dolt they are at every twist and turn by the people with actual lives.

 

You forget the NFL is the 800-pound gorilla of sports and really does dictate what a lot of people do on Sundays (and to a lesser extent, Monday nights all season and Thursday nights in the second half of the year). Many people do in fact adjust their weekend schedules from Labor Day onward around the NFL, and a Saturday night nostalgia special would be for those who for whatever reason can't do it on Sunday.

 

Lots of people don't care about football. In 2009-10, league wide attendance was ~17 million in a country of ~307 million (also noted: many of the ~17 million are repeats, so it's not even technically 17 million unique individuals), and super bowl TV viewership is around 36% meaning that the MAJORITY (64%) of TV owning households don't even care enough about football to watch its annual overproduced championship, let alone a bunch of relatively meaningless December games.

 

If TV dictates your life, you deserve to miss out. What are these overtesteroned, undersexed manchildren going to do next...complain and miss out on a hot date because there's a game on? Actually, scratch that. I bet many of them do.

 

Holiday trains are not "football specials" nor should they be. They run when they run and like everything else if you don't like the time then you are free to make the CHOICE whether to go or not. But if you don't go, no whining. Because the trips are a smashing success as it is and there is no rule that prevents people from coming to New York on Sunday or requires people to sit in front of a TV with their d*ck in one hand and the remote in the other watching a bunch of grown men pile on top of each other chasing after a funny shaped brown ball.

 

If you choose to go, good. If you don't, good also. But no whining and complaining. MTA doesn't owe it to anyone to accommodate anyone's "special needs" the fact of the matter is ALL of you are lucky that trips like this even exist and you should enjoy them while you can or shut the hell up about it.

 

There is no reason a crew should have to make accommodations on a Saturday night, staying up late - you know some of them come from far away? - just so a few people can be happy and the train can run during the time of day when tourists and shoppers are LEAST likely to be out and ridership is far from its peak.

[Wallyhorse]

There is no reason a crew should have to make accommodations on a Saturday night, staying up late - you know some of them come from far away? - just so a few people can be happy and the train can run during the time of day when tourists and shoppers are LEAST likely to be out and ridership is far from its peak.

 

You do know that many stores now stay open extremely late during December (including Macys in Herald Square famously staying open 24/7 at one point last holiday season). Those hours have greatly expanded just from when I was last in New York during the holiday season a few years ago because the demand is there (and back when I was last in New York in December, they were packed at 9:30-10:00 PM on a Saturday night, and it's much more now in December from even then). That's why I said Saturday night for one run (I would say Saturday afternoon, but that would not be fair to those who observe the Jewish sabbath).

[RTOMan]

Good thread thanks for the laughs.... :tup:

[Kamen Rider]

Please, watch the Nazi Banksters Crimes Ripple Effect at http://jforjustice.co.uk/banksters

[R32 3838]

I don't know why you guys bash railfans for, Most of them spend their money on these trips as well

 

 

and for the ones saying the IRT SMEE's Are too New, They are not, There is ways of running those SMEE's without the 6 R33ML's you have the R36ML as well as the R21/22 Money cars, But the train i wanna see the most is the BMT standards That I would go crazy to ride because they are one of my top favorites and im glad they starting work on them,

 

I would still run the redbirds though, yeah 8 years ago they retierd but the hell with it, You run those cars for atleast 6-8 hours 45-55 dollars per person that alone would make the museum money, Foamers can give you money thats the point Im trying to make, I don't give a damn what people think about railfans, You guys sit there and talk so much shit about railfans but its the railfans who pay for these trips, As for the holiday train yes it makes sense to run it on 6th ave due to the fact that you have the shoppers on 6th ave but you also have them on broadway as well, the more you let those R33's sit as well as the R26,28,29 and the R36WF cars they will be unable to run, if the TA or NYCTM don't care for them why the hell they are there then, whats the point of wasting space if they don't use them expet the GEL train in the fall, they need work ASAP because it seems that they are just letting them just sit and rot, Railfans love those cars as much as the old ones but it would be nice if they prepare them for the 2013 by then it would be 10 years since they were retierd, but long story short they need to run them sometimes, point blank

[Grand Concourse]

INDman stated numerous times that those 'redbirds' were problematic and not worth taking them out for service.

MOD trips ended because they weren't making money- ie: too expensive to run. SO unless you have trips that costs like $80 per to cover the costs, then there ia no way you will have such an excursion type trip.

[INDman]

No one is bashing railfans, it's just that you people seem to not understand that the non Museum run trips (Hoilday Train, HBO Train, Yankees Specials, etc) are not run for you. They are run for tourists and average riders to be something special for them that they would not usually see. To them (average riders and tourists) the old cars like the Low-Vs and the R1/9s are alot cooler and have a greating "wow" factor then the SMEEs do and will have for a while. That's also why the trains run where they run. It's not worth suggesting anything because it's not going to change anytime soon. I talked to the 1 person who is incharge of this stuff and that is what he told me.

 

Now when is come to the trips that the Transit Museum does run, they get a bigger turn out for the R1/9s and Low-Vs then they do for the SMEEs and that's why they have no interest in running them. Now, if a bunch of you guys want the SMEEs to run that bad heres what you do. Get $20,000 together and go to the TA and tell them you want to charter some redbirds or there SMEEs. Untill then, ride the train or don't that's all up to you, but if people chase or just don't ride the train and the demand for Museum trips goes away, SO WILL THE TRAIN. Just keep that in the back of your mind the next time you chase the museum train.

[R32 3838]

No one is bashing railfans, it's just that you people seem to not understand that the non Museum run trips (Hoilday Train, HBO Train, Yankees Specials, etc) are not run for you. They are run for tourists and average riders to be something special for them that they would not usually see. To them (average riders and tourists) the old cars like the Low-Vs and the R1/9s are alot cooler and have a greating "wow" factor then the SMEEs do and will have for a while. That's also why the trains run where they run. It's not worth suggesting anything because it's not going to change anytime soon. I talked to the 1 person who is incharge of this stuff and that is what he told me.

 

Now when is come to the trips that the Transit Museum does run, they get a bigger turn out for the R1/9s and Low-Vs then they do for the SMEEs and that's why they have no interest in running them. Now, if a bunch of you guys want the SMEEs to run that bad heres what you do. Get $20,000 together and go to the TA and tell them you want to charter some redbirds or there SMEEs. Untill then, ride the train or don't that's all up to you, but if people chase or just don't ride the train and the demand for Museum trips goes away, SO WILL THE TRAIN. Just keep that in the back of your mind the next time you chase the museum train.

 

One thing I don't do is chase its pointless, If I miss a trip, Im not chasing, As for the SMEE part, I don't know why there is no intrest, and you have people who also want to ride those trains, As for the HBO special and the hoilday train and the yankee playoff specials that part i understand, and i do attend Museum trips, but for these past 2 years i haven't attended due to me being to busy, but thats the point, The low V's and R1/9's are money makers but the SMEE's can also be money makers if someone put an idea together, even if they ran the R10's,R16's and R30's hooked to an R38 and R32's just to add to the train that would even be better than the TOMC, but thats my input, not every railfan is going to sit there and want to help fix up a vintage train, and I wouldn't think it would be wise since they would foam more than pay attention, they would screw up big time, im glad we have vintage trains running but at the same time you gotta think of new ideas as well.

[Kamen Rider]

Please, watch the Nazi Banksters Crimes Ripple Effect at http://jforjustice.co.uk/banksters

[SubwayGuy]

You do know that many stores now stay open extremely late during December (including Macys in Herald Square famously staying open 24/7 at one point last holiday season). Those hours have greatly expanded just from when I was last in New York during the holiday season a few years ago because the demand is there (and back when I was last in New York in December, they were packed at 9:30-10:00 PM on a Saturday night, and it's much more now in December from even then). That's why I said Saturday night for one run (I would say Saturday afternoon, but that would not be fair to those who observe the Jewish sabbath).

 

Unrelated...

 

With each post you just show you have no idea about the way that these trips are organized, planned, and followed through on...

 

I'm not even going to bother explaining because in your head you think you're right and clearly the facts don't matter.

 

Be glad the train runs AT ALL is something many people don't seem to get...or perhaps you should try going to Boston to see how often they run vintage equipment in REGULAR PASSENGER SERVICE? (no knock on Boston again I'm just stating FACTS)

[SubwayGuy]

I don't know why you guys bash railfans for, Most of them spend their money on these trips as well

 

Unrelated. MTA does not intend these trips for railfans because let's face facts here...a lot of railfans are idiots that smell like sh*t, won't shut up about trains the whole trip, and bother the tourists/shoppers with useless minutia trying to impress them when they just want to be LEFT ALONE AND ALLOWED TO ENJOY THE RIDE.

 

It's bad PUBLIC RELATIONS...hey isn't the department that runs these things called Public Affairs? Oh my, I'm actually starting to see a pattern around these parts.

 

and for the ones saying the IRT SMEE's Are too New, They are not, There is ways of running those SMEE's without the 6 R33ML's you have the R36ML as well as the R21/22 Money cars

 

The money cars have nowhere for paying customers to sit and a lack of stanchions and grab holds for standees. They also do not have functioning pneumatic or electric doors. So they're out.

 

The public does not give a sh*t about the difference between an R33 and an R36.

 

To take it a step further, the public does not really give a sh*t about redbirds in general either. They might notice the train is red, but inside, it's not all that different from an R32/R42, so they're not going to find anything "unique" about the experience. And of course that's the goal here...giving them some sort of unique experience with a MUCH older train.

 

You know what the first four things people notice in the Arnines/Lo-V's is?

-Uncovered paddle ceiling fans

-Rattan/velon seats

-Old style advertisements

-Incandescent bulbs

 

On redbirds, the fans are enclosed or cars equipped with A/C (two of the cars even had working air conditioning as of fall 2009), the seats are fiberglass, the advertisements are from the early 2000s or late 1990s and therefore nearly indistinguishable from the present, and the lighting is fluorescent like modern cars. Making the cars nearly indistinguishable to the general public from the oldest cars running today.

 

But the train i wanna see the most is the BMT standards That I would go crazy to ride because they are one of my top favorites and im glad they starting work on them,

 

That would work. But restoration takes time and money. So in the meantime, what runs is the Arnines because they are in good mechanical condition and the train length is sufficient to accommodate a lot of people...which even if all the A/Bs were restored, would not be the case with those cars.

 

I would still run the redbirds though, yeah 8 years ago they retierd but the hell with it, You run those cars for atleast 6-8 hours 45-55 dollars per person that alone would make the museum money, Foamers can give you money thats the point Im trying to make, I don't give a damn what people think about railfans, You guys sit there and talk so much shit about railfans but its the railfans who pay for these trips

 

Funny you say that because I've seen attendance figures from SMEE trips and I've seen attendance figures from R1-9 trips and the R1-9 trips ROUTINELY outsell the SMEE trips by a significant number. As a matter of fact, the last time the redbirds ran, in 2009, was one of the lowest earning NYTM nostalgia trains in a while. They sold more tickets for the Lo-V's in 2010 and that was only a 5 car train, and they sold about as many tickets for the Lo-V's in 2011 with a FOUR car train.

 

Railfans are also notoriously cheap. It's easy to spot those who chase, and they NEVER pay but when the train is free there they are. There are a few who pay all the time, some of whom routinely get bashed on this board by the mental midgets who like to criticize their photography or some other bullsh*t that no one outside railfan circles cares about BUT AT LEAST they make some effort to contribute because these trips do not run as charity by the MTA OR the Museum they exist to give people a chance to ride LIVING HISTORY and make some money back (Museum) or generate good publicity .

 

As for the holiday train yes it makes sense to run it on 6th ave due to the fact that you have the shoppers on 6th ave but you also have them on broadway as well, the more you let those R33's sit as well as the R26,28,29 and the R36WF cars they will be unable to run, if the TA or NYCTM don't care for them why the hell they are there then, whats the point of wasting space if they don't use them expet the GEL train in the fall, they need work ASAP because it seems that they are just letting them just sit and rot, Railfans love those cars as much as the old ones but it would be nice if they prepare them for the 2013 by then it would be 10 years since they were retierd, but long story short they need to run them sometimes, point blank

 

Repeat 50x: Restoration takes time.

 

Or would you prefer all work cease on the AB's so that a bunch of cars it's already been established do NOTHING for the public at the present time can run?

 

Also, it's an enormous amount of effort to even KEEP WHAT RUNS IN OPERATIONAL CONDITION. Railfans don't seem to understand ANY of this. They have NO idea about what goes into train restoration. Believe me I'd LOVE to (hypothetically) see TA send a retired subway car off to an abandoned siding in the middle of nowhere on public property and release title to the car, just so that some of the keyboard warriors around here try and restore the subway car after a couple of years. I'd bet they wouldn't even have the tools to remove screws (it's not as easy as you think! - hey speaking of that I'm noticing ANOTHER pattern here!). It's more important to KEEP THE ARNINES AND LO-Vs RUNNING than anything else at this point because if that ceases to happen you can kiss ALL of these trips goodbye. And NONE of us want to see that happen so why don't you just let people do their jobs instead of sitting home and thinking you know more than them, k?

[TwoTimer]

And oh btw, a good mod knows when to leave good threads open (they do not have to contain new or original info), when to close others, and when to just clean up otherwise decent discussions.

[SubwayGuy]

And oh btw, a good mod knows when to leave good threads open (they do not have to contain new or original info), when to close others, and when to just clean up otherwise decent discussions.

 

Believe me, I'd love to see certain topics be automatically closed - "proposed" car moves, "service expansion" threads, museum/vintage equipment trip "ideas", museum/vintage equipment "complaints", "favorite subway car" threads...

 

Might help clean up the cesspool of idiocy around these parts.

[Grand Concourse]

The man of reason has spoken! [would give you 'thanks' if I didn't excede my limit for today].

[Harry]

Believe me, I'd love to see certain topics be automatically closed - "proposed" car moves, "service expansion" threads, museum/vintage equipment trip "ideas", museum/vintage equipment "complaints", "favorite subway car" threads...

 

When you run your own message board you can then go on and close every single thread on it because people aren't as informed as you are. Really fun message board that will be.

 

Might help clean up the cesspool of idiocy around these parts.

 

Now we can add crybabies to the idiocy because of people like you!

[SubwayGuy]

When you run your own message board you can then go on and close every single thread on it because people aren't as informed as you are. Really fun message board that will be.

 

Now we can add crybabies to the idiocy because of people like you!

 

I'm not going to get into a pissing contest with anyone about the "mission" of this site but these sorts of threads are counter productive in my opinion. I don't care who agrees with me or not, but it's the same tired, already debated and debunked ideas getting brought up time and again, and I'm just stating a fact - a lot of people here don't like that.

 

Do as you wish...far from being a "crybaby" as you call it, I am merely publicly expressing an opinion a lot of people here hold privately.