Gentrifying neighborhoods in NYC?

[MTARegional Bus]

 

Sorry, but I have to break with you here, but it has everything to do with the less fortunate. Do you really think that the majority of people would want to live in the South Bronx: of course not. They much rather live in Riverdale, but they don't have the money to do so. Section 8 helps out a lot, because it gives people extra mobility when looking for places to rent, since it allows them to extend the range, even by just a bit. And those people who live in the Bronx- they are working class, they're the ones, along with those who live in other so called undesirable sections, that keep this city moving. And great people have come from so-called getto, for example, like SCOTUS Justice Felix Frankfurter, who came from the L.E.S. while it was still a heavily working class, immigrant neighborhood in the 1900's. In regards to cops, the Precincts that cover the South Bronx: 41, 42, 44 - are some of the most heavily patrolled "Impact" areas - go there and see for yourself.

 

 

Well said.

 

NYC use to be a place were people can afford to live here, now it's not the case.

 

There is no way rent in an old tenement apartment can cost 1,000 a mouth, you will be surprised how much a one bed room small apartment cost in this city.

[Trainmaster5]

I couldn't stop laughing after reading and re-reading this thread a few times. Mott Haven, Morrisania, Soundview, Pelham and Riverdale. If you ask the Postal Service the 104 prefix in the zipcode means the BRONX, period.. Rich, poor, latino, white, black, they are all residents of the Bronx whether they like it or not. Many years ago I had an argument with a schoolmate over a similar question. We both lived in Flatbush at the time but his dad got a raise and he was moving " to" Long Island. I got tired of his constant bragging about Long Island and his upcoming " better life" and I was about to wipe the smirk off his face. Our teacher overheard the argument and inquired about the issue. He gave his version of the story and then I was asked to give mine. I politely pointed out that he wasn't moving "to" Long Island like he said he was, he was moving "to" Amityville. Believe it or not, only our teacher agreed with me at first. She finally explained to everybody what I knew all along. Prospect Park, Flatbush, Rego Park, Montauk , Amityville, Smithown, Patchogue, Bed-Stuy, are ALL part of Long Island so he wasn't moving "to" LI 'cause he already lived on the island. To this day I laugh at people who brag that they're from Long Island when any Brooklyn or Queens person who was born in those boroughs can say the same. I judge the person, not the residence, and it's served me well over the years. To me it makes no difference where you live but how you carry yourself.

[MTARegional Bus]

. To this day I laugh at people who brag that they're from Long Island when any Brooklyn or Queens person who was born in those boroughs can say the same. I judge the person, not the residence, and it's served me well over the years. To me it makes no difference where you live but how you carry yourself.

 

Or that they say that there from Manhattan but there from new jersey.

[checkmatechamp13]

Hell for years, Throggs Neck was considered to be one of the few relatively "safe" areas of the Bronx.

 

And you're saying it isn't now? Or did being Black or Hispanic suddenly become a crime now?

 

Sorry but it's the truth. For years I wouldn't go past 96th street and now suddenly I would embrace a borough that honestly I used to poke fun at?? The Bronx for me has always been a place that I never thought of venturing to. Just too run down, filthy and crime ridden and what is sad is how few good areas still remain in the Bronx. My friend Angelo is from the Bronx (Pelham Bay) and I'd always make fun of him living there. He has since moved to Westchester not that the neighborhood is changing. I mean think about it though, who in hell would want to associate with the Bronx when they're successful professionally, and live a neighborhood that is nothing like the Bronx?

 

In any event, I know an accountant who works for us that lives in Riverdale and he also puts Riverdale, NY. He would have a heart attack I'm sure if Bronx, NY was listed. The Bronx invokes images of the ghetto, with what a successful professional wants no part of. A neighbor of mine who is an IT guy also says he lives in Riverdale.... He would never say the Bronx.

 

All neighborhoods are equally a part of the borough they're in. Stapleton is as much in Staten Island as Todt Hill. Brownsville is as much in Brooklyn as Manhattan Beach. East Harlem is as much in Manhattan as the Upper East Side. South Jamaica is as much in Queens as Douglaston. And Riverdale and Mott Haven, like it or not, are in the same borough: The Bronx.

 

The truth is the Bronx was always a poor borough since the 1920's, even before Latinos and Hispanic came into the picture. I guess is just bad luck but one things for sure that this borough will always be a home to many working class immigrant's past, present and future.

 

Actually, I think it became poor in the 1960s. During the 1920s, you had a bunch of beautiful buildings being built along the Grand Concourse, so it was definitely a middle (or maybe even upper middle) class neighborhood then. It was only small sections like Port Morris that were poor at the time.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

I couldn't stop laughing after reading and re-reading this thread a few times. Mott Haven, Morrisania, Soundview, Pelham and Riverdale. If you ask the Postal Service the 104 prefix in the zipcode means the BRONX, period.. Rich, poor, latino, white, black, they are all residents of the Bronx whether they like it or not.

 

I would disagree with you... We here in Riverdale are the only ones that use Riverdale, NY... Here is an article that shows that the postmen do indeed NOT see as as the same. Here is a quote from a postman....

 

“Riverdale is technically part of the Bronx, I guess, but I don’t view them as the Bronx,” United States Postal Worker Lee Kim of the Throggs Neck Branch said. “When there is outgoing or incoming mail for Riverdale it specifically says Riverdale on the mailing address; everywhere else in the Bronx says Bronx. Maybe once I’ve seen it done by any other Bronx town.”

 

 

Yet there not proud of being part of Bronx lol, Riverdale will always be part of the Bronx, were the community likes it or not lol.

 

It's not a question of being proud of being part of the Bronx as it is a question of being different and unique. The fact of the matter is we are the complete opposite of the Bronx. The realtors sure as heck don't use the Bronx. If it was up to them all of the Bronx would be listed as "Riverdale". It's not about anything but that we're different up here. We don't want to be known as "NoMA" (I sure as hell don't). We just want to be known as Riverdale. We have our own little town up here and we're happy just the way we are. Riverdale has always been a place that the wealthy have escaped to going back hundreds of years ago and that's why we set ourselves apart because we are indeed different and proud of our neighborhood. The natural beauty is what makes this place so awesome. Outside of my balcony I have tons of trees and a huge rock which is reflective of Riverdale. Very fortunate to have such a unique apartment.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Sorry, but I have to break with you here, but it has everything to do with the less fortunate. Do you really think that the majority of people would want to live in the South Bronx: of course not. They much rather live in Riverdale, but they don't have the money to do so. Section 8 helps out a lot, because it gives people extra mobility when looking for places to rent, since it allows them to extend the range, even by just a bit. And those people who live in the Bronx- they are working class, they're the ones, along with those who live in other so called undesirable sections, that keep this city moving. And great people have come from so-called getto, for example, like SCOTUS Justice Felix Frankfurter, who came from the L.E.S. while it was still a heavily working class, immigrant neighborhood in the 1900's. In regards to cops, the Precincts that cover the South Bronx: 41, 42, 44 - are some of the most heavily patrolled "Impact" areas - go there and see for yourself.

 

I'll take your word for the police comment, but I'm of the belief that the politicians (Democrats) are just fine with these folks living in projects and off of Section 8. Come election time they get to use that to their advantage to get re-elected and install fear in folks... Díaz Jr. would rather have folks not working, claiming that he wants more higher paying jobs for the borough... Please... I've worked all sorts of jobs in college skate guard, tutor, worked in the mailroom, etc. and I have no shame in it. I've worked hard to get to where I am and folks need to learn that hard work is what it takes in life. NO HANDOUTS. Everything that I have I've earned. I came from a middle class family and worked hard from day one. These folks have no excuse.

[MTARegional Bus]

I'll take your word for the police comment, but I'm of the belief that the politicians (Democrats) are just fine with these folks living in projects and off of Section 8. Come election time they get to use that to their advantage to get re-elected and install fear in folks... Díaz Jr. would rather have folks not working, claiming that he wants more higher paying jobs for the borough... Please... I've worked all sorts of jobs in college skate guard, tutor, worked in the mailroom, etc. and I have no shame in it. I've worked hard to get to where I am and folks need to learn that hard work is what it takes in life. NO HANDOUTS. Everything that I have I've earned. I came from a middle class family and worked hard from day one. These folks have no excuse.

 

 

Will I applaud for your hard work, but there people out there that work hard yet they can't have a better like you Via Garibaldi, because there jobs pays crap that it only pays for the apartment rent and don't bring a lot of food to the table. now I know what your going to say, get other job or quit, you think that's easy in today's economy ? even if you quit that job it will be a long time to get other one, but hope, maybe less, long almost or after your unemployment checks runs out.

 

While I believe in the value of hard work you have to draw the line some were when it comes to your live, some people work 7 days with no days offs or vacation and for wait ? you spend less time with your family and friends. whats the Value of hard work if you can't enjoy your live, it seem now a days working hard is just for survival in trying to keep a roof over head that's all.

 

 

Also not everyone that is on Section 8 or in the projects are lazy as you say. true they are people that don't want to work because there lazy, (that has to change when people register for Section 8 or in the public housing) but some work hard for this city and Section 8 helps them so they can use there pay check for other things and that helps the economy.

 

Actually, I think it became poor in the 1960s. During the 1920s, you had a bunch of beautiful buildings being built along the Grand Concourse, so it was definitely a middle (or maybe even upper middle) class neighborhood then. It was only small sections like Port Morris that were poor at the time.

 

 

it was still poor borough though, it was still a place of high crime in the 20's(thanks to prohibition). The Grand Concourse was the Riverdale of it's day lol.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Will I applaud for your hard work, but there people out there that work hard yet they can't have a better like you Via Garibaldi, because there jobs pays crap that it only pays for the apartment rent and don't bring a lot of food to the table. now I know what your going to say, get other job or quit, you think that's easy in today's economy ? even if you quit that job it will be a long time to get other one, but hope, maybe less, long almost or after your unemployment checks runs out.

 

While I believe in the value of hard work you have to draw the line some were when it comes to your live, some people work 7 days with no days offs or vacation and for wait ? you spend less time with your family and friends. whats the Value of hard work if you can't enjoy your live, it seem now a days working hard is just for survival in trying to keep a roof over head that's all.

 

 

Also not everyone that is on Section 8 or in the projects are lazy as you say. true they are people that don't want to work because there lazy, (that has to change when people register for Section 8 or in the public housing) but some work hard for this city and Section 8 helps them so they can use there pay check for other things and that helps the economy.

 

 

Well guess what?? I worked 7 days a week for a few years before I moved into my current job, not because I had to but because I like earning money and the part time job I had brought in an additional $1,000.00 of income a month so I taught a few classes and worked a few hours in the office where needed on top my regular office job. At that time I was about 24 or so and was earning rather nicely. Even now I still go into the office and work a few hours on the weekends. Now my job is supposed to be from 10:00 - 18:00 Monday through Friday but I don't have fixed hours because my clients are all over the world. Aside from that I also tutor privately when I feel like it. Granted I set my own hours but still, many folks that have money work very hard too. Once I graduated high school my parents made it clear that I would responsible for supporting myself through college because I was the one that wanted to go and they simply couldn't afford all of the expenses. Now my tuition here in the U.S. was taken care of, but my spending money... I tutored, worked at the our local college hockey rink and worked in the mail room a few hours and still maintained a 3.9+ GPA. During school breaks, I would return to work at organizations that I worked for during my time off since I was a good employee. My study abroad costs were about 20k for the final semester and I paid for at least half of the costs of that with my own money, with the rest coming from student loans since my parents didn't qualify for much college aid.

 

What I'm saying is life doesn't hand you anything. I've been working since I was 15 and my first job was a summer camp counselor of 8 year olds. The job didn't pay that great, but it was a job nonetheless and it taught me responsibility and how to be independent. After that I worked with the for two summers and that job didn't pay great either, but it was about getting experience.

[MTARegional Bus]

Well guess what?? I worked 7 days a week for a few years before I moved into my current job, not because I had to but because I like earning money and the part time job I had brought in an additional $1,000.00 of income a month so I taught a few classes and worked a few hours in the office where needed on top my regular office job. At that time I was about 24 or so and was earning rather nicely. Even now I still go into the office and work a few hours on the weekends. Now my job is supposed to be from 10:00 - 18:00 Monday through Friday but I don't have fixed hours because my clients are all over the world. Aside from that I also tutor privately when I feel like it. Granted I set my own hours but still, many folks that have money work very hard too. Once I graduated high school my parents made it clear that I would responsible for supporting myself through college because I was the one that wanted to go and they simply couldn't afford all of the expenses. Now my tuition here in the U.S. was taken care of, but my spending money... I tutored, worked at the our local college hockey rink and worked in the mail room a few hours and still maintained a 3.9+ GPA. During school breaks, I would return to work at organizations that I worked for during my time off since I was a good employee. My study abroad costs were about 20k for the final semester and I paid for at least half of the costs of that with my own money, with the rest coming from student loans since my parents didn't qualify for much college aid.

 

What I'm saying is life doesn't hand you anything. I've been working since I was 15 and my first job was a summer camp counselor of 8 year olds. The job didn't pay that great, but it was a job nonetheless and it taught me responsibility and how to be independent. After that I worked with the for two summers and that job didn't pay great either, but it was about getting experience.

 

 

 

Lucky you.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Lucky you.

 

 

You don't become "lucky" just because...

[checkmatechamp13]

it was still poor borough though, it was still a place of high crime in the 20's(thanks to prohibition). The Grand Concourse was the Riverdale of it's day lol.

 

 

Yeah, but it didn't have the reputation that it does today (or rather that it had and is getting rid of). I mean, it was just a couple of little pockets, and the main crime was probably in areas in Manhattan (LES, probably East Harlem which had a lot of Italian immigrants back in the day. I think the area near Lincoln Center used to be a slum in the beginning of the century, etc). Back then, the outer boroughs were considered the suburbs, and so they were safe for the most part. The term "inner-city" was more true then compared to today.

[MHV9218]

I've worked all sorts of jobs in college skate guard, tutor, worked in the mailroom, etc. and I have no shame in it. I've worked hard to get to where I am and folks need to learn that hard work is what it takes in life. NO HANDOUTS. Everything that I have I've earned. I came from a middle class family and worked hard from day one. These folks have no excuse.

 

Well guess what?? I worked 7 days a week for a few years before I moved into my current job, not because I had to but because I like earning money and the part time job I had brought in an additional $1,000.00 of income a month so I taught a few classes and worked a few hours in the office where needed on top my regular office job. At that time I was about 24 or so and was earning rather nicely. Even now I still go into the office and work a few hours on the weekends. Now my job is supposed to be from 10:00 - 18:00 Monday through Friday but I don't have fixed hours because my clients are all over the world. Aside from that I also tutor privately when I feel like it. Granted I set my own hours but still, many folks that have money work very hard too. Once I graduated high school my parents made it clear that I would responsible for supporting myself through college because I was the one that wanted to go and they simply couldn't afford all of the expenses. Now my tuition here in the U.S. was taken care of, but my spending money... I tutored, worked at the our local college hockey rink and worked in the mail room a few hours and still maintained a 3.9+ GPA. During school breaks, I would return to work at organizations that I worked for during my time off since I was a good employee. My study abroad costs were about 20k for the final semester and I paid for at least half of the costs of that with my own money, with the rest coming from student loans since my parents didn't qualify for much college aid.

 

What I'm saying is life doesn't hand you anything. I've been working since I was 15 and my first job was a summer camp counselor of 8 year olds. The job didn't pay that great, but it was a job nonetheless and it taught me responsibility and how to be independent. After that I worked with the for two summers and that job didn't pay great either, but it was about getting experience.

 

 

Thanks for that heartwarming life story. Maybe someday, I too can live in the Bronx!

 

Oh wait -- mah bad -- Riverdale. Forgot y'all are separate.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Thanks for that heartwarming life story. Maybe someday, I too can live in the Bronx!

 

Oh wait -- mah bad -- Riverdale. Forgot y'all are separate.

 

 

Very funny... Yeah, the Bronx I'm sure is doable... Riverdale... a bit more difficult... I look at the prices up here to rent and they're soaring right now... 1 bedrooms going for $1,600.00 and up and studios for $1,250.00. Buying up here is still reasonable IMO though.

[MTARegional Bus]

It's still a lot for the average buyer . But I forgot it's riverdale WOW.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

It's still a lot for the average buyer . But I forgot it's riverdale WOW.

 

 

You can wow all you want but Riverdale (upstairs) is one of the most desirable areas to live in of NYC.

[MTARegional Bus]

With the way you talk about how Great Riverdale is I hope I don't meet people like you there lol.

[VWM]

Riverdale is part of the Bronx. A nice part. 'nuff said.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

With the way you talk about how Great Riverdale is I hope I don't meet people like you there lol.

 

 

lol... If you don't come to Riverdale then you won't have to worry about that.

[MTARegional Bus]

lol... If you don't come to Riverdale then you won't have to worry about that.

 

 

 

Been there plenty of times, nothing special then any other place that I when to around the city.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Been there plenty of times, nothing special then any other place that I when to around the city.

 

 

lol... Well I can tell you right now... I doubt I'm missing much in the South Bronx. I'm sure you'll tell me it is just fine and I'll just trust your word on it.

 

You can keep telling me that Riverdale is in the Bronx, though it resembles nothing like the Bronx. We may technically be part of the borough for what it's worth, but we have absolutely nothing in common with the Bronx, geographically, economically, socially... Nothing.

[MTARegional Bus]

lol... Well I can tell you right now... I doubt I'm missing much in the South Bronx. I'm sure you'll tell me it is just fine and I'll just trust your word on it.

 

You can keep telling me that Riverdale is in the Bronx, though it resembles nothing like the Bronx. We may technically be part of the borough for what it's worth, but we have absolutely nothing in common with the Bronx, geographically, economically, socially... Nothing.

 

 

The South Bronx is full of culture of the Caribbean, great restaurants and great people. The South Bronx isn't perfect by any means in terms crime and all but it reviving everyday, I see a lot of construction going in vacant lots that use to be empty, now finding a vacant lots is like finding a needle in a haystack.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

The South Bronx is full of culture of the Caribbean, great restaurants and great people. The South Bronx isn't perfect by any means in terms crime and all but it reviving everyday, I see a lot of construction going in vacant lots that use to be empty, now finding a vacant lots is like finding a needle in a haystack.

 

 

Well if it's anything like Hunts Point is it needs A LOT of work... You can thank HBO for the "vivid images"...

[NYCtrainfan01]

 

 

The South Bronx is full of culture of the Caribbean, great restaurants and great people. The South Bronx isn't perfect by any means in terms crime and all but it reviving everyday, I see a lot of construction going in vacant lots that use to be empty, now finding a vacant lots is like finding a needle in a haystack.

 

This. I agree.

 

To VG8: South Bronx is changing for the better. Sure it may not be the best place in the Bronx but it's not like back then. I too have seen vacant lots turned into new apartments. I went down there not to long ago and I was surprised by the change. About Hunts point, It's changing too slowly but changing. There is not a whole lot of prostitution there as it was back then. As I always say "Don't believe everything you see on TV"

[Shortline Bus]

This. I agree.

 

To VG8: South Bronx is changing for the better. Sure it may not be the best place in the Bronx but it's not like back then. I too have seen vacant lots turned into new apartments. I went down there not to long ago and I was surprised by the change. About Hunts point, It's changing too slowly but changing. There is not a whole lot of prostitution there as it was back then. As I always say "Don't believe everything you see on TV"

 

 

I know a few times using the line in recent years, a growing number of "Hipsters' who get off at the 3rd Ave/138th, Brook and Cypress station stops. They actually moving to the lofts along 138th so maybe in couple of years that area will become the 'new' Bushwick.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

I know a few times using the line in recent years, a growing number of "Hipsters' who get off at the 3rd Ave/138th, Brook and Cypress station stops. They actually moving to the lofts along 138th so maybe in couple of years that area will become the 'new' Bushwick.

 

 

LOL... The thing is East Williamsburg is still up and coming. A friend of mine from college had plans to have his father in Turkey put up money for him to buy property in the area with the idea being that they would make like bandits... Well fast forward about 5 years and the area looks the same as it did back when I hung out with him over there. I don't know how in the world he lives there. You get off of the at Bogart Street and it's all vacant and desolate looking with one main corridor with small stores filled with hipsters. All around though, you see those big buildings that were clearly factories back in the day looking just as depressing as can be.

[checkmatechamp13]

FYI. Off topic for second but related to NYC demographics. Overall, the total number residents of American born Blacks(not counting those born in the Carribean or Africa)in NYC like most of this country's big cities is declining.

Afro-American are doing a reserve move back south to places such as the Carolinas, Fla., Georgia, Alabama and Virgina. By 2040 according to current US census trends(yes i worked briefly for the census in 2000 as a census taker) as much as 60-70 of American born Blacks in the US will be living in the Southeast and "Deep South." With Atlanta already on it's way to being the new 'captial city' for African-Americans in the 21st century.

 

While NYC will be a majority 75% Latino and Asian population.

 

 

I doubt Asians and Latinos would make up 75% of the population any time soon. As of now, they make up about 40% combined, and while both the White and Black populations are declining (well, not really the White population, but it's been fairly stagnant), there are always going to be immigrants coming in to replace them.

 

And I figured this would be as good a place as any to ask, but what areas have a lot of African-born Blacks? I know a decent chunk of the Northeast Bronx and Southeast Queens has a lot of Carribean-born Blacks mixed with African-Americans (meaning those who have been here for many generations), as well as the whole Flatbush/East Flatbush/Canarsie area of Brooklyn, but what about African-born Blacks? I know some people call Park Hill, Staten Island "Little Liberia" (and I have some Nigerian friends who live there), but that's the only area I can think of. Is it that their numbers aren't large enough for them to have any real enclave, or is it that they spread themselves out more compared to Carribean-born Blacks and African-Americans?