Montague St Tunnel Closure - Exp. Bus Service Restorations & Increases Requested

[itmaybeokay]

Are you kidding me?? You obviously don't use the on weekends... That train runs like garbage.  I've waited almost 20 minutes for an train on weekends on multiple occasions, not to mention all of the stops it makes. I can see you recommending the but certainly not the .

 

What? The runs fine on weekends. If you waited 20 minutes for it, it must have been after midnight, when the train runs with 20 minute headways like pretty much every other line. 

[Via Garibaldi 8]

What? The runs fine on weekends. If you waited 20 minutes for it, it must have been after midnight, when the train runs with 20 minute headways like pretty much every other line. 

Nope... Maybe it runs fine now on weekends, but the times I've used it it didn't and it certainly wasn't after midnight either.

[Culver]

Nope... Maybe it runs fine now on weekends, but the times I've used it it didn't and it certainly wasn't after midnight either.

No, it just runs normally on weekends and has for decades. You're exaggerating, and doing a sloppy job of it. I'll say what everyone else said: don't blame anyone else for your decision to take an awful route down to Coney Island. Plenty of one-seat rides down there from Manhattan.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

No, it just runs normally on weekends and has for decades. You're exaggerating, and doing a sloppy job of it. I'll say what everyone else said: don't blame anyone else for your decision to take an awful route down to Coney Island. Plenty of one-seat rides down there from Manhattan.

I don't need to exaggerate.  This was on multiple occasions during the weekends, waiting at various stops for the in the city on weekends, so I know what I'm talking about.  Quite frankly the 6th Avenue line doesn't run that great on weekends anyway.

[Fresh Pond]

I don't need to exaggerate. This was on multiple occasions during the weekends, waiting at various stops for the in the city on weekends, so I know what I'm talking about. Quite frankly the 6th Avenue line doesn't run that great on weekends anyway.

it runs pretty fine whenever I use it...are you sure you're taking the same train as everyone else because it seems like only you are having problems with it...

[Eric B]

The is prone to bunching, where there will be long gaps, and then frequent service. It's a long winding route, and in the course, some crews might be faster or slower, which will become more noticeable the longer the trip; and then of course, the usual causes of delays.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

The is prone to bunching, where there will be long gaps, and then frequent service. It's a long winding route, and in the course, some crews might be faster or slower, which will become more noticeable the longer the trip; and then of course, the usual causes of delays.

Thanks for clarifying/confirming.  I've bee using the subway for well over 15 years.  I know what I'm talking about.

[Culver]

Thanks for clarifying/confirming.  I've bee using the subway for well over 15 years.  I know what I'm talking about.

Not 20 minute waits. I've been riding it as my home line since 1996. You're exaggerating. Yes, it can bunch, but not 20 minutes. Here's a hint: next time you think you're waiting 20 minutes, check your watch/phone. You will find you were actually waiting like 10 minutes.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Not 20 minute waits. I've been riding it as my home line since 1996. You're exaggerating. Yes, it can bunch, but not 20 minutes. Here's a hint: next time you think you're waiting 20 minutes, check your watch/phone. You will find you were actually waiting like 10 minutes.

Yeah well I was there, not you, so I think I know what I'm talking about.   I've been riding the subways well before 1996...

[AndrewJC]

So you think eliminating all weekend Queens Express buses and Brooklyn is a good idea?

 

The express bus system in general is a drain on scarce resources. While one can make a case for some of the busier lines, I would certainly be willing to say that any express bus that doesn't even carry a dozen people per bus should be done away with. They can take the local bus to the subway, like the vast majority of their neighbors, or, if for whatever reason they'd rather not do that, they're welcome to take a taxi or car service on their own dime.

 

(That is, unless the riders are willing to pay the full cost of operating the service, minus the small subsidy that the typical local bus rider incurs. That seems unlikely, but I have no objection to trying it out.)

 

 

The X27 is NOT a new service.  It was a service restoration from 2010, being passed off as a "new service".  The X27 had weekend service until 2010 when it was cut due to budget constraints.

 

The service reductions in 2010 were permanent.

 

Last year's service improvement package included some restorations of canceled services (such as the weekend X27) and some new services (such as the Sunday X17, along with the weekend Brooklyn stop and the off-peak Tottenville extension).

 

Most of the services canceled in 2010 remain canceled and will continue to remain canceled. The B37 and weekend X28 are hardly unique.

 

It states right here: "The NY MTA is deciding all the time how to spend the discretionary part of its budget. But rarely is that budget unexpectedly enriched by an extra $40 million, which occurred last month when Albany bestowed that much more than requested in state funds. Now the debate begins on how to spend it."

 

 

http://www.wnyc.org/blogs/transportation-nation/2013/apr/22/ny-mta-ponders-how-spend-extra-40-million/

 

 

Congratulations, you found a reporter who was confused by the state's deliberate obfuscation.

 

The reality isn't quite so generous: http://www.streetsblog.org/2013/03/29/in-state-budget-tax-receipts-giveth-to-mta-and-cuomo-taketh-away/

 

As for my commute, what part of it wasn't a planned commute do you not understand?? I originally wasn't going to Coney Island but with a change of plans at the last minute, I saw an X17 and jumped on it since I was heading to Southern Brooklyn. The point was to get moving and figure out the particulars later. The was an afterthought.

 

Did you know you were going to Coney Island before you boarded the X17?

 

If so, that was a pretty stupid move - the X17 simply takes you to the wrong place. So instead of having a one-block walk to a train that would take you directly to Coney Island, you ended up 1.5 miles from the nearest train that normally would take you to Coney Island, except in fact it wasn't running to Coney Island at all that weekend.

 

If not, that points to one of the disadvantages of riding express buses: with the long non-stop segment between the boarding zone and the alighting zone, it's difficult to change your travel plans. (At least the X17 stopped in Brooklyn - without that stop you would have had to find your way to Coney Island from Staten Island.) On the subway, if your travel plans change, you can usually adjust your course within a few minutes.

 

 

As for the Verrazano, we're not talking about on a round trip basis.

 

So those Brooklyn residents who visit family in Staten Island don't come home?

 

If you're only focusing on one direction, maybe you should focus on eastbound rather than westbound.

 

 

You're also wrong about the X28.

 

It states right here: "Restoring B37 service, X28 service in Bensonhurst and Dyker Heights, and a new route that would go along 65thStreet down First Avenue towards Lutheran Medical Center are also on the table, Cappelli said."

 

"Cappelli explained that the 2010 service cuts were due to a $2 billion budget deficit. “I know how much the express bus cuts hurt. It was on everyone’s mind,” he said."

 

Source: http://www.homereporternews.com/news/general/bay-ridge-mta-roundtable-discussion/article_5bd61562-dbf6-11e1-8f51-0019bb2963f4.html

 

 

Cappelli is referring to X28 WEEKEND service because weekday service is back to where it was prior to 2010.

 

What am I wrong about? Have you seen any references to any of the 2010 service cuts that are explicitly off the table? None of them have been formally declared off-the-table - but that doesn't mean that they're going to come back any time soon.

 

By the way, that article is from nearly 11 months ago. (I wouldn't have even noticed if not for Cappelli's reference to "new MTA Chair Joseph Lhota.")

 

Surely he does even though those cuts would leave many riders stranded since they have no subways in those areas.

 

Fortunately, they have local buses in almost all of them, so, no, it wouldn't leave riders stranded - it would just make it somewhat less convenient and more time-consuming to get to Manhattan.

 

It seems to me that, if transit service to Manhattan is important to you, but you don't want to ride local buses, then perhaps you should strongly consider living near the subway.

 

Yeah well I was there, not you, so I think I know what I'm talking about.   I've been riding the subways well before 1996...

 

Nobody's saying that there has never been a 20 minute gap in F service on a weekend. It just isn't how the service normally runs.

 

By the way, that same 20 minute headway is the shortest headway on the weekend X17. And your BxM1 and BxM2 don't do any better than 30. So maybe a rare 20 minute wait for the F isn't so bad after all.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

The express bus system in general is a drain on scarce resources. While one can make a case for some of the busier lines, I would certainly be willing to say that any express bus that doesn't even carry a dozen people per bus should be done away with. They can take the local bus to the subway, like the vast majority of their neighbors, or, if for whatever reason they'd rather not do that, they're welcome to take a taxi or car service on their own dime.

 

(That is, unless the riders are willing to pay the full cost of operating the service, minus the small subsidy that the typical local bus rider incurs. That seems unlikely, but I have no objection to trying it out.)

 

 

 

The service reductions in 2010 were permanent.

 

Last year's service improvement package included some restorations of canceled services (such as the weekend X27) and some new services (such as the Sunday X17, along with the weekend Brooklyn stop and the off-peak Tottenville extension).

 

Most of the services canceled in 2010 remain canceled and will continue to remain canceled. The B37 and weekend X28 are hardly unique.

 

 

Congratulations, you found a reporter who was confused by the state's deliberate obfuscation.

 

The reality isn't quite so generous: http://www.streetsblog.org/2013/03/29/in-state-budget-tax-receipts-giveth-to-mta-and-cuomo-taketh-away/

 

 

Did you know you were going to Coney Island before you boarded the X17?

 

If so, that was a pretty stupid move - the X17 simply takes you to the wrong place. So instead of having a one-block walk to a train that would take you directly to Coney Island, you ended up 1.5 miles from the nearest train that normally would take you to Coney Island, except in fact it wasn't running to Coney Island at all that weekend.

 

If not, that points to one of the disadvantages of riding express buses: with the long non-stop segment between the boarding zone and the alighting zone, it's difficult to change your travel plans. (At least the X17 stopped in Brooklyn - without that stop you would have had to find your way to Coney Island from Staten Island.) On the subway, if your travel plans change, you can usually adjust your course within a few minutes.

 

 

 

So those Brooklyn residents who visit family in Staten Island don't come home?

 

If you're only focusing on one direction, maybe you should focus on eastbound rather than westbound.

 

 

 

What am I wrong about? Have you seen any references to any of the 2010 service cuts that are explicitly off the table? None of them have been formally declared off-the-table - but that doesn't mean that they're going to come back any time soon.

 

By the way, that article is from nearly 11 months ago. (I wouldn't have even noticed if not for Cappelli's reference to "new MTA Chair Joseph Lhota.")

 

 

Fortunately, they have local buses in almost all of them, so, no, it wouldn't leave riders stranded - it would just make it somewhat less convenient and more time-consuming to get to Manhattan.

 

It seems to me that, if transit service to Manhattan is important to you, but you don't want to ride local buses, then perhaps you should strongly consider living near the subway.

 

 

Nobody's saying that there has never been a 20 minute gap in F service on a weekend. It just isn't how the service normally runs.

 

By the way, that same 20 minute headway is the shortest headway on the weekend X17. And your BxM1 and BxM2 don't do any better than 30. So maybe a rare 20 minute wait for the F isn't so bad after all.

-The express bus system serves a vital service for many neighborhoods where subway service is not suitable or needed.

 

-The 2010 service cuts were NOT permanent.  The goal has always been to restore as much service as possible.

 

-I missed my original express bus saw and X17 and got on, so it wasn't at all planned.  The X28 was always a backup for me and that's why it's vital to get it back because it makes getting to Southern Brooklyn MUCH quicker and convenient over the subway.  The X17 only serves those in Dyker Heights.

 

-The was the disadvantage because I was stuck once I got down to Bay Parkway.  Doubling back would've been pointless so I chose the local bus the rest of the way.  The real issue again was NO SHUTTLE BUS was running, which I've stated numerous times now.  I don't understand how they can knock out the subway with no shuttle buses.  Typical planning.  

 

-A lot of people cut through Staten Island from NJ.

 

-The money is there to restore more service from 2010 and every effort should be made to get the to stop trying to pretend like they're broke and restore the services that they stole from numerous communities with the ploy that they were broke.  They were broke but they wanted to get rid of certain routes a long time ago.  Being broke just allowed them to justify their decision but we can't allow them to make ridiculous excuses about why they can't restore vital services that numerous communities depended on.  We've got the B4 back, the X27 back, the B64 back, and the B2 back and we're going to continue to fight for South Brooklyn to get as much service as possible back.

 

-Re: Transit service to Manhattan: No need. I moved to Riverdale because of the good express bus service.  We use our service so and since there is no subway here the express bus is here to stay as much as I'm sure it pisses you.  Now we have the X27 back... Gotta keep fighting for the X28 and try to get later X27 service.

 

-Re train: Could've fooled me... Culver and FreshPond apparently don't take the subway enough because I've waited 20 minutes quite a few times for subways, like the for example.  With track work on weekends, it doesn't take much for a line to become screwed up.  

 

-Excuse me but the BxM1 and BxM2 run every 30 minutes most of Saturday, but between the two of them they run on roughly 15 minute headways WITH BusTime, so our express buses are pretty prompt.  My waits are usually no more than 5 minutes since I can time the buses accordingly.  

[Fresh Pond]

-The express bus system serves a vital service for many neighborhoods where subway service is not suitable or needed.

 

-The 2010 service cuts were NOT permanent. The goal has always been to restore as much service as possible.

 

-I missed my original express bus saw and X17 and got on, so it wasn't at all planned. The X28 was always a backup for me and that's why it's vital to get it back because it makes getting to Southern Brooklyn MUCH quicker and convenient over the subway. The X17 only serves those in Dyker Heights.

 

-The was the disadvantage because I was stuck once I got down to Bay Parkway. Doubling back would've been pointless so I chose the local bus the rest of the way. The real issue again was NO SHUTTLE BUS was running, which I've stated numerous times now. I don't understand how they can knock out the subway with no shuttle buses. Typical planning.

 

-A lot of people cut through Staten Island from NJ.

 

-The money is there to restore more service from 2010 and every effort should be made to get the to stop trying to pretend like they're broke and restore the services that they stole from numerous communities with the ploy that they were broke. They were broke but they wanted to get rid of certain routes a long time ago. Being broke just allowed them to justify their decision but we can't allow them to make ridiculous excuses about why they can't restore vital services that numerous communities depended on. We've got the B4 back, the X27 back, the B64 back, and the B2 back and we're going to continue to fight for South Brooklyn to get as much service as possible back.

 

-Re: Transit service to Manhattan: No need. I moved to Riverdale because of the good express bus service. We use our service so and since there is no subway here the express bus is here to stay as much as I'm sure it pisses you. Now we have the X27 back... Gotta keep fighting for the X28 and try to get later X27 service.

 

-Re train: Could've fooled me... Culver and FreshPond apparently don't take the subway enough because I've waited 20 minutes quite a few times for subways, like the for example. With track work on weekends, it doesn't take much for a line to become screwed up.

 

-Excuse me but the BxM1 and BxM2 run every 30 minutes most of Saturday, but between the two of them they run on roughly 15 minute headways WITH BusTime, so our express buses are pretty prompt. My waits are usually no more than 5 minutes since I can time the buses accordingly.

The B82 is right there for the record...

 

...and who are you to say i don't take the subway often? The (and to a lesser extent, the ) are my main lifelines to get around. I still say your statement on the is a blatant overreaction. You just want a reason to bash the subway (along with everything that isn't Riverdale, an express bus, or Metro-North).

[Via Garibaldi 8]

The B82 is right there for the record...

 

...and who are you to say i don't take the subway often? The (and to a lesser extent, the ) are my main lifelines to get around. I still say your statement on the is a blatant overreaction. You just want a reason to bash the subway (along with everything that isn't Riverdale, an express bus, or Metro-North).

Well what do you think people were waiting for? I know what runs there.  There should've been shuttle buses because the B82 was overcrowded with people having to wait several buses to get one and many of them were only going to 25th Avenue.

 

As for your other comment, I meant to say that you and Culver believe that I don't take the subway often.  LOL! A reason to bash the subway.... There are many reasons to bash the subway because it needs a lot of help.  All of these go's are due to years of neglect by the .  We can look at the Sea Beach Line for that. A so-called world class city with a subpar subway system.  

[Culver]

Well what do you think people were waiting for? I know what runs there.  There should've been shuttle buses because the B82 was overcrowded with people having to wait several buses to get one and many of them were only going to 25th Avenue.

 

As for your other comment, I meant to say that you and Culver believe that I don't take the subway often.  LOL! A reason to bash the subway.... There are many reasons to bash the subway because it needs a lot of help.  All of these go's are due to years of neglect by the .  We can look at the Sea Beach Line for that. A so-called world class city with a subpar subway system.  

That neglect came when politicians drove the subways into the ground in the 60s and 70s and then all the thiefs fled to the suburbs after the city was on the brink of collapse. The back then was even weaker than it is now. Please spare me the suburbanite "ooooh the evil (MTA)" nonsense. The issue still goes on to this day, with Albany having stolen more than half a billion dollars from the over the past decade and then faking outrage at the for daring to cut services. And then they make up shit like "two sets of books" to cover their thieving behinds. And then derpy suburbanites and sheep in the city trash the and tell us how brave their fake politicians are for standing up to the big, bad .

 

On topic: Anyone know if there will still be 59 St. drop-outs on the when it runs split when the tunnel closes? I'm assuming it'll all just be Jay-95 St runs, but would like to know for sure.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

That neglect came when politicians drove the subways into the ground in the 60s and 70s and then all the thiefs fled to the suburbs after the city was on the brink of collapse. The back then was even weaker than it is now. Please spare me the suburbanite "ooooh the evil (MTA)" nonsense. The issue still goes on to this day, with Albany having stolen more than half a billion dollars from the over the past decade and then faking outrage at the for daring to cut services. And then they make up shit like "two sets of books" to cover their thieving behinds. And then derpy suburbanites and sheep in the city trash the and tell us how brave their fake politicians are for standing up to the big, bad .

 

On topic: Anyone know if there will still be 59 St. drop-outs on the when it runs split when the tunnel closes? I'm assuming it'll all just be Jay-95 St runs, but would like to know for sure.

Well you clearly think that the walks on gold. 

[Culver]

Well you clearly think that the walks on gold. 

No I don't, but I also don't buy the bullshit that NY politicians sell. Those clowns are responsible for the financial mess and have the balls to turn around and demand restoration of service cuts. Here's an idea: demand Albany return the half a billion+ they've stolen over the past decade+ and then we can talk about running empty express buses 24/7 every 5 minutes to all corners of the city.

[Trainmaster5]

No I don't, but I also don't buy the bullshit that NY politicians sell. Those clowns are responsible for the financial mess and have the balls to turn around and demand restoration of service cuts. Here's an idea: demand Albany return the half a billion+ they've stolen over the past decade+ and then we can talk about running empty express buses 24/7 every 5 minutes to all corners of the city.

I'm glad to see that at least one person is aware of the game the politicians are playing with the and service enhancements. I'm going to be blunt here so I don't want any poster to take this personally. Those politicians "demanding" service improvements for their constituents are pandering, pure and simple. From county executive, mayor, assembly member, state senator, city council member, whomever, all they can do is ask (beg) on behalf of the public. These are the same people who did nothing to prevent the cuts in the first place. Does anyone recall these politicians calling for increased funding for the over the last couple of decades ? They didn't because those politicians don't control the and are as powerless as you and I are. It's good publicity for the politicians to carry these petitions to the . They, and the public, can attend the charade in front of the board called "public meeting" , speak their piece, and then shut up and can the BS. The board is the public face of the agency but any action or inaction on their part comes from the real power in transit. Majority Leader Skelos, Assembly Speaker Silver, and most of all Governor Cuomo control the , it's board and it's finances. They and the bondholders. Don't forget that the next time you see some politician on the news calling for restorations or service enhancements. Truth Is Mr Skelos and Mr Silver determine what comes up for a vote and the vote's outcome , up or down. They control the purse strings. Carry on.

[Culver]

I'm glad to see that at least one person is aware of the game the politicians are playing with the and service enhancements. I'm going to be blunt here so I don't want any poster to take this personally. Those politicians "demanding" service improvements for their constituents are pandering, pure and simple. From county executive, mayor, assembly member, state senator, city council member, whomever, all they can do is ask (beg) on behalf of the public. These are the same people who did nothing to prevent the cuts in the first place. Does anyone recall these politicians calling for increased funding for the over the last couple of decades ? They didn't because those politicians don't control the and are as powerless as you and I are. It's good publicity for the politicians to carry these petitions to the . They, and the public, can attend the charade in front of the board called "public meeting" , speak their piece, and then shut up and can the BS. The board is the public face of the agency but any action or inaction on their part comes from the real power in transit. Majority Leader Skelos, Assembly Speaker Silver, and most of all Governor Cuomo control the , it's board and it's finances. They and the bondholders. Don't forget that the next time you see some politician on the news calling for restorations or service enhancements. Truth Is Mr Skelos and Mr Silver determine what comes up for a vote and the vote's outcome , up or down. They control the purse strings. Carry on.

The only thing these politicians do is CUT funding (payroll tax) and then CELEBRATE those cuts. And then demand service increases.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

No I don't, but I also don't buy the bullshit that NY politicians sell. Those clowns are responsible for the financial mess and have the balls to turn around and demand restoration of service cuts. Here's an idea: demand Albany return the half a billion+ they've stolen over the past decade+ and then we can talk about running empty express buses 24/7 every 5 minutes to all corners of the city.

Oh please.  Politicians are supposed to represent their constituents, period.  How about the start becoming fiscally responsible? They finally woke up when they faced financial problems, but they're still getting ripped off.  The people suffering are the CUSTOMERS as usual.  Anytime we talk about fiscal responsibility, the automatic response is to cut service and deprieve the communities of the services they need.  When I talk about fiscal responsibility, I'm talking about things like hiring a gazillion project managers at 90k a pop that they don't need, not cutting bus service.

 

I'm glad to see that at least one person is aware of the game the politicians are playing with the and service enhancements. I'm going to be blunt here so I don't want any poster to take this personally. Those politicians "demanding" service improvements for their constituents are pandering, pure and simple. From county executive, mayor, assembly member, state senator, city council member, whomever, all they can do is ask (beg) on behalf of the public. These are the same people who did nothing to prevent the cuts in the first place. Does anyone recall these politicians calling for increased funding for the over the last couple of decades ? They didn't because those politicians don't control the and are as powerless as you and I are. It's good publicity for the politicians to carry these petitions to the . They, and the public, can attend the charade in front of the board called "public meeting" , speak their piece, and then shut up and can the BS. The board is the public face of the agency but any action or inaction on their part comes from the real power in transit. Majority Leader Skelos, Assembly Speaker Silver, and most of all Governor Cuomo control the , it's board and it's finances. They and the bondholders. Don't forget that the next time you see some politician on the news calling for restorations or service enhancements. Truth Is Mr Skelos and Mr Silver determine what comes up for a vote and the vote's outcome , up or down. They control the purse strings. Carry on.

So what are politicians supposed to do, stand by and watch their communities lose their service?  I get so tired of hearing the needing more money.  It seems as if the more they get the more they need.  It's a bloated agency, that's the real problem and the paying customers' service should not be the sacrificial lambs in the process.   We pay so many times for the service though the nickel and dime taxes that it's ridiculous.  We shouldn't have to BEG the for services.

 

Tell me why the should get more and more money when they put out capital projects like the South Ferry station? How much tax dollars was spent on that station that was wasted???  What needs to be cut is incompetent management, not our transportation services.

[Culver]

Oh please.  Politicians are supposed to represent their constituents, period.  How about the start becoming fiscally responsible? They finally woke up when they faced financial problems, but they're still getting ripped off.  The people suffering are the CUSTOMERS as usual.  Anytime we talk about fiscal responsibility, the automatic response is to cut service and deprieve the communities of the services they need.  When I talk about fiscal responsibility, I'm talking about things like hiring a gazillion project managers at 90k a pop that they don't need, not cutting bus service.

 

So what are politicians supposed to do, stand by and watch their communities lose their service?  I get so tired of hearing the needing more money.  It seems as if the more they get the more they need.  It's a bloated agency, that's the real problem and the paying customers' service should not be the sacrificial lambs in the process.   We pay so many times for the service though the nickel and dime taxes that it's ridiculous.  We shouldn't have to BEG the for services.

 

Tell me why the should get more and more money when they put out capital projects like the South Ferry station? How much tax dollars was spent on that station that was wasted???  What needs to be cut is incompetent management, not our transportation services.

Holy naive sheepsanity Batman.

Where to start. Where to start...

They're NOT representing their constituents. They're making generic demands. They demand literally whatever any moron tells them to demand in the hopes that it'll get the voters all riled up and thinking the airhead is representing them. (SEE: The blue light buses are scary!)

They're NOT representing their constituents. As I already pointed out: The State government has endless millions from dedicated MTA funds (that means taxes and fees paid by THEIR constituents in MTA areas that you say they're representing) and spread them throughout the general budget, and then declared the to be evil. Then for kicks, the "two books" bullshit that has been repeated for years now. These brave, noble politicians take YOUR money that you paid in taxes and fees for YOUR MTA services and appropriated it where it was not meant to be by law. They are NOT representing you. They don't give a flying [insert favorite expletive here] about you. They care about getting reelected. That means pander with a bunch of bullshit promises while doing the dirty work of corporate donors. Most of their proposals and demands are shit and do nothing but waste time and money.

 

And again you do the "evil MTA doesn't need money" thing. Honest question: with the millions the State has openly stolen from the MTA budget over the past decade, you think maybe the B37 or X28 weekend service might not have needed cutting? The has its problems, but please don't waste our damn time with this "oh politicians are awesome they're like totally fighting for me" shit. They've stolen around $500 million from the MTA over the past decade. Stop pretending that didn't happen and doesn't affect our services.

 

I will say this: if whatever your current job is doesn't work out, you have a great future on CNN telling politicians how awesome and honorable they are.

 

EDIT: corrected to million as it should be

[Trainmaster5]

 

 

So what are politicians supposed to do, stand by and watch their communities lose their service?  I get so tired of hearing the needing more money.  It seems as if the more they get the more they need.  It's a bloated agency, that's the real problem and the paying customers' service should not be the sacrificial lambs in the process.   We pay so many times for the service though the nickel and dime taxes that it's ridiculous.  We shouldn't have to BEG the for services.

 

Tell me why the should get more and more money when they put out capital projects like the South Ferry station? How much tax dollars was spent on that station that was wasted???  What needs to be cut is incompetent management, not our transportation services.

I don't knock the politicians who clamor for better services for their constituents. That's what they were elected to do. I'm just saying that it all adds up to "political theater" in the long run. You and I may rail at the as a bloated, incompetent, out of control agency and we might be 100% correct. So what? I remember when Governor Rockefeller's administration came up with the concept for the agency now known as the . It was created, in part, to save the LIRR from shutting down because it was bankrupt. The NYCTA was also going down the tubes so it was also included. Grandiose plans for railroad and subway improvements were made and almost everyone was happy. Some journalists like the Village Voice saw through the sham even then. The wasn't accountable to any one government in particular and no politician could be singled out for blame. It's funding was mainly raided from the TBTA with contributions from the city  counties, and state. Over the years the governmental funding has dropped or disappeared so the agency has resorted to borrowing to meet it's funding needs. You and I may say that the agency wastes money but it's those same politicians you appear to be championing who agreed to the legislation that causes a lot of the waste. Lowest bidder contracts, parts that must be sourced from New York State no matter the cost. That's the reason we end up with shoddy workmanship on many projects. I, too, was in the construction and rehab field for over a decade and I know you only get what you pay for. It's very easy to decry waste and incompetence in the but that's what the founders of the agency wanted. Since MNRR , LIRR, and the subways and buses all fall under the same umbrella one would expect to see the same complaints across the board but that's not the case. Do the local politicians propose breaking up the or what? These selfsame politicians are playing both sides IMO. Carry on.

[Culver]

I don't knock the politicians who clamor for better services for their constituents. That's what they were elected to do. I'm just saying that it all adds up to "political theater" in the long run. You and I may rail at the as a bloated, incompetent, out of control agency and we might be 100% correct. So what? I remember when Governor Rockefeller's administration came up with the concept for the agency now known as the . It was created, in part, to save the LIRR from shutting down because it was bankrupt. The NYCTA was also going down the tubes so it was also included. Grandiose plans for railroad and subway improvements were made and almost everyone was happy. Some journalists like the Village Voice saw through the sham even then. The wasn't accountable to any one government in particular and no politician could be singled out for blame. It's funding was mainly raided from the TBTA with contributions from the city  counties, and state. Over the years the governmental funding has dropped or disappeared so the agency has resorted to borrowing to meet it's funding needs. You and I may say that the agency wastes money but it's those same politicians you appear to be championing who agreed to the legislation that causes a lot of the waste. Lowest bidder contracts, parts that must be sourced from New York State no matter the cost. That's the reason we end up with shoddy workmanship on many projects. I, too, was in the construction and rehab field for over a decade and I know you only get what you pay for. It's very easy to decry waste and incompetence in the but that's what the founders of the agency wanted. Since MNRR , LIRR, and the subways and buses all fall under the same umbrella one would expect to see the same complaints across the board but that's not the case. Do the local politicians propose breaking up the or what? These selfsame politicians are playing both sides IMO. Carry on.

Honorable politicians championing the oppressed cars of Staten Island and the terror of buses with flashing blue lights.

http://secondavenuesagas.com/2013/06/26/sen-lanzas-six-minute-anti-sbs-rant-highlights-albany-circus/

Look at Lanza fighting for his constituents!

(All one of them who had a problem with the blue lights, so we have to change the system for one moron.)

 

So yeah, anyone know if the Brooklyn side of the will be all Jay-95 runs or if they'll still have some rush hour drop/put-in at 59 St when they split the line? Still wondering.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

 

 

Holy naive sheepsanity Batman.

Where to start. Where to start...

They're NOT representing their constituents. They're making generic demands. They demand literally whatever any moron tells them to demand in the hopes that it'll get the voters all riled up and thinking the airhead is representing them. (SEE: The blue light buses are scary!)

They're NOT representing their constituents. As I already pointed out: The State government has endless millions from dedicated MTA funds (that means taxes and fees paid by THEIR constituents in MTA areas that you say they're representing) and spread them throughout the general budget, and then declared the to be evil. Then for kicks, the "two books" bullshit that has been repeated for years now. These brave, noble politicians take YOUR money that you paid in taxes and fees for YOUR MTA services and appropriated it where it was not meant to be by law. They are NOT representing you. They don't give a flying [insert favorite expletive here] about you. They care about getting reelected. That means pander with a bunch of bullshit promises while doing the dirty work of corporate donors. Most of their proposals and demands are shit and do nothing but waste time and money.

 

And again you do the "evil MTA doesn't need money" thing. Honest question: with the millions the State has openly stolen from the MTA budget over the past decade, you think maybe the B37 or X28 weekend service might not have needed cutting? The has its problems, but please don't waste our damn time with this "oh politicians are awesome they're like totally fighting for me" shit. They've stolen around $500 million from the MTA over the past decade. Stop pretending that didn't happen and doesn't affect our services.

 

I will say this: if whatever your current job is doesn't work out, you have a great future on CNN telling politicians how awesome and honorable they are.

 

EDIT: corrected to million as it should be

I've worked with numerous politicians to improve transportation and not all of them are simply "pandering".  I think you have a lot of nerve pointing to all politicians as being corrupt and solely wanting votes.  There are some politicians that do WORK and work hard to represent their constituents.  

 

I'm a strong believer that the needs to look at management more and consolidate there, NOT with service cuts.  Let's not make this out to be Albany as the sole culprit in this because they aren't the sole culprit.  The continues to have other avenues that they can use to obtain more cash. They get a cut of the pie every time someone takes a cab here in the city.  They have real estate that they are sitting on with no tenants that they could be collecting rent from, yet they aren't aggressively looking to fill those voids.  In short, maybe the state could give them more funding, but at the same time, the is not maximizing on other sources of revenue.  People like you yell about Albany robbing them as if Albany is just supposed to roll over to give the money whenever they ask for it. I don't think so.  We need fiscal accountability.

 

They get a tax from the cabs, a tax from our cellphone (yes there's a surcharge on your cell phone bill that goes back to the ), the commuter tax and so on, so this isn't all about Albany and politicians pandering.  The question is what is the doing with the money they receive?

 

 

 

 

I don't knock the politicians who clamor for better services for their constituents. That's what they were elected to do. I'm just saying that it all adds up to "political theater" in the long run. You and I may rail at the as a bloated, incompetent, out of control agency and we might be 100% correct. So what? I remember when Governor Rockefeller's administration came up with the concept for the agency now known as the . It was created, in part, to save the LIRR from shutting down because it was bankrupt. The NYCTA was also going down the tubes so it was also included. Grandiose plans for railroad and subway improvements were made and almost everyone was happy. Some journalists like the Village Voice saw through the sham even then. The wasn't accountable to any one government in particular and no politician could be singled out for blame. It's funding was mainly raided from the TBTA with contributions from the city  counties, and state. Over the years the governmental funding has dropped or disappeared so the agency has resorted to borrowing to meet it's funding needs. You and I may say that the agency wastes money but it's those same politicians you appear to be championing who agreed to the legislation that causes a lot of the waste. Lowest bidder contracts, parts that must be sourced from New York State no matter the cost. That's the reason we end up with shoddy workmanship on many projects. I, too, was in the construction and rehab field for over a decade and I know you only get what you pay for. It's very easy to decry waste and incompetence in the but that's what the founders of the agency wanted. Since MNRR , LIRR, and the subways and buses all fall under the same umbrella one would expect to see the same complaints across the board but that's not the case. Do the local politicians propose breaking up the or what? These selfsame politicians are playing both sides IMO. Carry on.

Well you tell me if we should spend taxpayer dollars and not have those taxpayer dollars go back to New York State residents to support our economy? We pay some of the highest taxes in the nation and I think it's insane to use taxpayer dollars to prop up someone else's economy, including another state. The only time that that shouldn't be the case is if there are no qualified companies to do the work at a reasonable cost here and in those cases, there should be a clause written in that specifies that with the agreements that the adheres to.

 

In short they are bloated and incompetent.  Why does it cost the so much more to do the same things that other transportation agencies do?  That's the real question.  The LIRR is extremely overpriced, as is MetroNorth. They put out a study once that gave some astronomical figure about how much it would cost to actually keep the subway system clean the way that it's supposed to be.  One of the real issues IMO is a lack of oversight.  What's the point of having a ton of overpaid managers when you're short on cleaners, esp. if they aren't being managed which means that you're not maximizing the amount of work that they do for their salary?  Stuff like this is what the real problem is, not asking for X28 weekend service restorations.  

 

It's ridiculous to expect the paying public to expect LESS service while they continue to cough up more and more money for public transportation, more and more money for overpriced tolls and they have NOTHING to show for it.

[Culver]

I've worked with numerous politicians to improve transportation and not all of them are simply "pandering".  I think you have a lot of nerve pointing to all politicians as being corrupt and solely wanting votes.  There are some politicians that do WORK and work hard to represent their constituents.  

 

I'm a strong believer that the needs to look at management more and consolidate there, NOT with service cuts.  Let's not make this out to be Albany as the sole culprit in this because they aren't the sole culprit.  The continues to have other avenues that they can use to obtain more cash. They get a cut of the pie every time someone takes a cab here in the city.  They have real estate that they are sitting on with no tenants that they could be collecting rent from, yet they aren't aggressively looking to fill those voids.  In short, maybe the state could give them more funding, but at the same time, the is not maximizing on other sources of revenue.  People like you yell about Albany robbing them as if Albany is just supposed to roll over to give the money whenever they ask for it. I don't think so.  We need fiscal accountability.

 

They get a tax from the cabs, a tax from our cellphone (yes there's a surcharge on your cell phone bill that goes back to the ), the commuter tax and so on, so this isn't all about Albany and politicians pandering.  The question is what is the doing with the money they receive?

 

 

Well you tell me if we should spend taxpayer dollars and not have those taxpayer dollars go back to New York State residents to support our economy? We pay some of the highest taxes in the nation and I think it's insane to use taxpayer dollars to prop up someone else's economy, including another state. The only time that that shouldn't be the case is if there are no qualified companies to do the work at a reasonable cost here and in those cases, there should be a clause written in that specifies that with the agreements that the adheres to.

 

In short they are bloated and incompetent.  Why does it cost the so much more to do the same things that other transportation agencies do?  That's the real question.  The LIRR is extremely overpriced, as is MetroNorth. They put out a study once that gave some astronomical figure about how much it would cost to actually keep the subway system clean the way that it's supposed to be.  One of the real issues IMO is a lack of oversight.  What's the point of having a ton of overpaid managers when you're short on cleaners, esp. if they aren't being managed which means that you're not maximizing the amount of work that they do for their salary?  Stuff like this is what the real problem is, not asking for X28 weekend service restorations.  

 

It's ridiculous to expect the paying public to expect LESS service while they continue to cough up more and more money for public transportation, more and more money for overpriced tolls and they have NOTHING to show for it.

This is a waste of time if you're going to keep ignoring the fact that those awesome politicians have stolen over $500 million from the MTA and keep telling us that doesn't matter and those politicos are honorable awesome folks fighting for you. I'm now 50% convinced you're actually Wolf Blitzer.

[Brooklyn]

This is a waste of time if you're going to keep ignoring the fact that those awesome politicians have stolen over $500 million from the MTA and keep telling us that doesn't matter and those politicos are honorable awesome folks fighting for you. I'm now 50% convinced you're actually Wolf Blitzer.

Public transportation is heavily subsidized in some countries and for good reason: it's an economic driver.

 

That's how I think it should be seen.

 

Yes, I am sure there is "mismanagement", but to say that "mismanagement" is the cause of the shortfalls is extremely naive.

 

The bottom line is that the MTA isn't getting the money it needs from the state.