MTA Tests Bike Rack on s53 Bus Route (SI Advance)

[MHV9218]

Yes, but after 9/11 they don't use them. I remember seeing posts about people using the luggage compartments on MTA MCIs prior to the attack.

 

Which is a silly policy, imo. Just like nonsense TSA shit like no electronics on planes. 

 

Idk about you, but I love riding my bike around Staten Island. Sucks that I have to go through Manhattan and the SI Ferry, but I don't have a choice.

 

Same here. Plus, you could make a lot of parts of the Island less shithole-y if there were some decent bike infrastructure, easier ways for people to get around.

[LTA1992]

lol... Please... The city's "middle-class" (mainly the working class) has been leaving in droves for years now.  There is still a sizable upper middle class that is alive and thriving.  For those who can't afford it, there are cheaper places elsewhere.  That's just the way it works.  You are part of the new breed on Staten Island, and one of the reasons I fled the island years ago while I could get out and haven't looked back. Staten Island is far too crowded these days, and the quality of life continues to decrease there.  Longer commute times, higher crime (even though Staten Island's crime rate remains fairly low in comparison to the other boroughs, etc., etc.) You yell about better transportation, but what about the infrastructure? Staten Island was not built to deal with the influx of people and congestion that is invading the island, and that's why things will only get worse before it gets better.  I'm aware of the fact that the toll is high due to payment only being required one way, but it still deters travel from outsiders onto the island.  

 

You may think that making Staten Island more accessible is a good thing, but short term it isn't.

Then by that logic, most of this city wasn't meant to have higher populations and not built to handle a wide influx of people. But that was before the advent of rapid transit.

 

Staten Island was only not built for higher densities because the infrastructure needed (ala Subway Connection) was never built. But I'll leave you with this: A lot of the older homes on the South Shore, namely those in Annadale, New Dorp, and Princes Bay, were sold by real estate to developers using a possible subway link as a selling point as plans existed. A big motivation for the plans, and had Mayor Hylan not had such a problem with private operation, was that the next logical step after building the 4th Avenue Subway was to extend service to SI. "By providing connections to SI, you will relieve Manhattans congestion with a baseball bat. Hasten the building of this subway and you will introduce the poor man to cheap land". The line has many provisions for such a connection though the best one at 65th Street is now covered by a large apartment building.

 

Again, in another universe where such events did occur, this discussion would not be happening. Though one or both of us may not exist anyway.

 

*On a side note, I wish there was a way I could look in greater detail within the deja vu I have. See the road not take and where I may have ended up.

[bobtehpanda]

Making Staten Island is a fools' errand simply due to geography; there's a reason why Staten Island is now depicted in a little inset box in the same way that Alaska and Hawaii are on US maps. Either you dump billions of dollars in a direct tunnel to Manhattan, or you dump slightly less billions into a tunnel under the Narrows, which either gives Staten Island excruciatingly slow, unreliable service or screws over or riders, and in any scenario is not time-competitive with the Ferry from the North Shore. The complete lack of a northern terminal doesn't help things, unless you want to dump riders into the wonderful, wheelchair accessible cathedral known as Chambers St. 

 

Besides, Census data shows that a plurality of Staten Islanders don't even work outside of Staten Island.  It would be better to reinforce the existing subway network and expand into the rest of the four boroughs, since you'd get more bang for your buck.

[North Shore Line]

A subway is not necessary as half of the job has been done already and that is the S79 Select Bus Service. Give the S53 bus a Select Bus Service and there you have it! Every single bus line on Staten Island would be connected to the train via Select Bus Service.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

The hilly topography in most of Staten Island makes riding a bike more of a challenge anyway.. Yet another reason why many people don't rdie.

[Fresh Pond]

The hilly topography in most of Staten Island makes riding a bike more of a challenge anyway.. Yet another reason why many people don't rdie.

That ain't gonna stop me.

 

I rode to Bayonne, Riverdale (my favorite place because of the hills), Staten Island Mall, Fort Lee NJ, and Yonkers on my bike (from Brooklyn).

[bobtehpanda]

A subway is not necessary as half of the job has been done already and that is the S79 Select Bus Service. Give the S53 bus a Select Bus Service and there you have it! Every single bus line on Staten Island would be connected to the train via Select Bus Service.

 

Isn't S79 SBS just an LTD with some prepay and like a tiny bit of dedicated lanes?

[Fresh Pond]

Isn't S79 SBS just an LTD with some prepay and like a tiny bit of dedicated lanes?

To this day, I still don't know why they didn't put off-board payment there

[LTA1992]

Making Staten Island is a fools' errand simply due to geography; there's a reason why Staten Island is now depicted in a little inset box in the same way that Alaska and Hawaii are on US maps. Either you dump billions of dollars in a direct tunnel to Manhattan, or you dump slightly less billions into a tunnel under the Narrows, which either gives Staten Island excruciatingly slow, unreliable service or screws over or riders, and in any scenario is not time-competitive with the Ferry from the North Shore. The complete lack of a northern terminal doesn't help things, unless you want to dump riders into the wonderful, wheelchair accessible cathedral known as Chambers St. 

 

Besides, Census data shows that a plurality of Staten Islanders don't even work outside of Staten Island.  It would be better to reinforce the existing subway network and expand into the rest of the four boroughs, since you'd get more bang for your buck.

It's as if you guys completely disregard why rapid transit was built in this city to begin with. Also, Manhattan was a swampy and hilly wreck before the commissioners plan of 1811. Terra-forming could have been done. It also would have been inexpensive considering how sparsely settled the island was. The displaced land could have been used to expand the shorelines in other places or build and/or extend other islands in the city for varous uses. Just like the southern portion of Governors Island was expanded with displaced land from the Lexington Avenue Subway. And who says that in this day in age, the Bklyn-SI line would need to run via 4th Avenue? It is the cheapest option yes, but there are others.

 

I mean, saying there is a reason SI is in a little box for a reason is stupid. Of course a borough with no direct transit connection and one line of railroad would be in a small box. Just like how Alaska is huge but sparsely settled with only a couple major settlements. Hawaii being small and also having a few small or well known settlements.

 

You say that most Staten Islanders have jobs on the island. It's only because of the lack of proper connections. If it takes me and hour and 45 minutes just to get to Lower Manhattan from the North Shore, why bother? If it takes me longer to get from the South Shore, again, why bother? Then, there are a lot of people who do not even bother going to SI because of the lack of connections. In fact, every time I hear someone talk about SI, the first things that come out of their mouths is how nice the ferry is and the lack of a subway. The best way to increase travel between the overall City and SI is and always has been to build a rapid transit link. Once that is done, more development would come because the island is more accessible. Have the new line connect with BOTH branches of the SIR. Supplemental service could be achieved around the island by LRT along Victory, the S53 corridor, and Richmond Avenue.

 

The fact that rapid transit has been the answer to this city's accessibility and growth issues has been known for decades. Of course their won't be immediate results but I can assure you that real estate companies would be all over it. More connections means that their lots and homes would sell. Those who cannot afford the main four boroughs can migrate to SI. People are already doing that, but with proper connections, it would happen more and more.

 

Where are you peoples vision? Where is it? So quick to shoot things down even though results have been seen time and time again. YES, money. But with the right voices, the right pressure, and done as a collective, anything can be done.

A subway is not necessary as half of the job has been done already and that is the S79 Select Bus Service. Give the S53 bus a Select Bus Service and there you have it! Every single bus line on Staten Island would be connected to the train via Select Bus Service.

That's very short sighted of you. That will not make trips much faster and on top of that, would only benefit those in Brooklyn below Downtown. What about the majority that need faster service to Manhattan? It can take, at the least, 1 hour and 45 minutes depending on the time of day, to get to Lower Manhattan from Forest Avenue and South Avenue. Express X12s can drop that trip to 40 minutes at the least. What is needed is a way to get to SI that not only makes trips convenient, but makes the borough more accessible to those who are considering moving there and those looking to move away.

 

The hilly topography in most of Staten Island makes riding a bike more of a challenge anyway.. Yet another reason why many people don't rdie.

Hilly topography is only a deterrent for the lazy. For those who care about their bodies and want to travel in the cheapest way, it's a benefit.

[bobtehpanda]

It comes down to this; a Narrows connection is going to be expensive, since the Narrows is the deepest part of the harbor. If you do Narrows and don't connect it to 4th Avenue, that just makes costs even less likely to pencil out. One thing you're forgetting about the subway extensions into farmland is that they were actually very cheap; farmland doesn't cost that much, and neither does building an elevated railroad. There are so many subway extensions closer in to the actual network that would benefit just as many people, if not more, but at less expense. But I guess in the world of railroad fantasy, money is just something that comes out of a printer.

 

If you do it under the Bay direct to Manhattan, that would be one of the longest underwater tunnels in the world at over 5 miles in length. Given that underwater tunnel construction is more costly than regular tunnel construction, and tunnel construction is already way too expensive, that likely wouldn't pencil out either.

 

200 years ago Manhattan's shoreline was smaller, and we did a lot of land reclamation. 40 years ago, however, we stopped Westway because the land reclamation involved would've destroyed the flow of the Hudson and it cost way too much. Times have changed, and to not recognize that is just plain foolish. (I also don't know why you would try and reclaim into one of the busiest sections of the Harbor, but that's just me.)

[BreeddekalbL]

It comes down to this; a Narrows connection is going to be expensive, since the Narrows is the deepest part of the harbor. If you do Narrows and don't connect it to 4th Avenue, that just makes costs even less likely to pencil out. One thing you're forgetting about the subway extensions into farmland is that they were actually very cheap; farmland doesn't cost that much, and neither does building an elevated railroad. There are so many subway extensions closer in to the actual network that would benefit just as many people, if not more, but at less expense. But I guess in the world of railroad fantasy, money is just something that comes out of a printer.

 

If you do it under the Bay direct to Manhattan, that would be one of the longest underwater tunnels in the world at over 5 miles in length. Given that underwater tunnel construction is more costly than regular tunnel construction, and tunnel construction is already way too expensive, that likely wouldn't pencil out either.

 

200 years ago Manhattan's shoreline was smaller, and we did a lot of land reclamation. 40 years ago, however, we stopped Westway because the land reclamation involved would've destroyed the flow of the Hudson and it cost way too much. Times have changed, and to not recognize that is just plain foolish. (I also don't know why you would try and reclaim into one of the busiest sections of the Harbor, but that's just me.)

 

also if that tunnel was done to manhattan would that shut the ferry down or would the free aurora still keep it?

[LTA1992]

It comes down to this; a Narrows connection is going to be expensive, since the Narrows is the deepest part of the harbor. If you do Narrows and don't connect it to 4th Avenue, that just makes costs even less likely to pencil out. One thing you're forgetting about the subway extensions into farmland is that they were actually very cheap; farmland doesn't cost that much, and neither does building an elevated railroad. There are so many subway extensions closer in to the actual network that would benefit just as many people, if not more, but at less expense. But I guess in the world of railroad fantasy, money is just something that comes out of a printer.

 

If you do it under the Bay direct to Manhattan, that would be one of the longest underwater tunnels in the world at over 5 miles in length. Given that underwater tunnel construction is more costly than regular tunnel construction, and tunnel construction is already way too expensive, that likely wouldn't pencil out either.

 

200 years ago Manhattan's shoreline was smaller, and we did a lot of land reclamation. 40 years ago, however, we stopped Westway because the land reclamation involved would've destroyed the flow of the Hudson and it cost way too much. Times have changed, and to not recognize that is just plain foolish. (I also don't know why you would try and reclaim into one of the busiest sections of the Harbor, but that's just me.)

Of course it is, but the investments are worth it for future generations. I know they were very cheap, so don't assume I'm forgetting anything. Building in the outer boroughs is still way cheaper than building in Manhattan. And, if you knew anything about the FED, money DOES in fact come out of a printer and a lot of our economic problems come from the fact that money is literally printed out of thin air without any metal backing it like it's supposed to be. When I said another path to Manhattan, I did not mean direct SI-Manhattan service. I was referring to a path through Brooklyn via either 5th or 3rd Avenues making stops equivalent to the expresses on 4th Avenue. This would also reduce some of the passenger congestion on 4th avenue as a side effect.  When it comes to landfill, there are solutions to getting around that. There are subways in this city with stations within the exact landfill you are referring too. One solution is to freeze the new land and tunnel through that. It's been done. I also know times have changed, but time and this city as a whole will continue to change and if proper solutions are not created, it will blow up on us down the line.

 

So excuse me for trying to be proactive instead of looking for the most ad hoc of solutions like a lot of you here. I want to see this city better, for all. Money will need to be spent if this is to be achieved. The right voices are needed. If billions can be printed from thin air to fund things that will ultimately never benefit the common man, then something needs to be done.

[BreeddekalbL]

the bike rack is gone from 7038, the militant bikers will be mad 

[QM1to6Ave]

Yes, but after 9/11 they don't use them. I remember seeing posts about people using the luggage compartments on MTA MCIs prior to the attack.

 

How did that work? Would the B/O have to get off to load stuff in the compartment, or was it a "load it at your own risk" deal?

[bobtehpanda]

Of course it is, but the investments are worth it for future generations. I know they were very cheap, so don't assume I'm forgetting anything. Building in the outer boroughs is still way cheaper than building in Manhattan. And, if you knew anything about the FED, money DOES in fact come out of a printer and a lot of our economic problems come from the fact that money is literally printed out of thin air without any metal backing it like it's supposed to be. When I said another path to Manhattan, I did not mean direct SI-Manhattan service. I was referring to a path through Brooklyn via either 5th or 3rd Avenues making stops equivalent to the expresses on 4th Avenue. This would also reduce some of the passenger congestion on 4th avenue as a side effect.  When it comes to landfill, there are solutions to getting around that. There are subways in this city with stations within the exact landfill you are referring too. One solution is to freeze the new land and tunnel through that. It's been done. I also know times have changed, but time and this city as a whole will continue to change and if proper solutions are not created, it will blow up on us down the line.

 

So excuse me for trying to be proactive instead of looking for the most ad hoc of solutions like a lot of you here. I want to see this city better, for all. Money will need to be spent if this is to be achieved. The right voices are needed. If billions can be printed from thin air to fund things that will ultimately never benefit the common man, then something needs to be done.

 

Ignoring your loopy rant about macroeconomics (which you should probably read about, since putting your trust in a shiny metal that has no intrinsic value and is hard to move around is just as terrible as putting your trust in fiat money), the feds are not going to help us build more subway, and there is no way in the world that the City could raise all this money on its own. The last time the City tried doing that, we ended up going bankrupt years later under the sheer strain from all the debt. "Money will be spent, the right voices are needed" is a good way of saying "under present circumstances no one in their right mind, particularly politicians from the other boroughs, is going to willingly direct billions in city money into a tunnel going to Staten Island".

 

Only South Ferry is located in landfill. Remember all the issues that South Ferry had after the new station opened, from the leaks, to the complete destruction during Sandy? Let's not repeat that.

 

If anything, connecting Staten Island to the subway network is more ad-hoc than most subway extensions, due to the fact that a connection at St. George wouldn't be very easy to engineer, and a connection at Grasmere would both be difficult to implement service for, and also not time-competitive with the ferry at all, not even counting the fact that most SIR stations don't even take fares right now. Most other extensions at least are both cheaper, reduce commutes, and help rationalize the bus network.

[trainfan22]

How did that work? Would the B/O have to get off to load stuff in the compartment, or was it a "load it at your own risk" deal?

IDK as I never saw it for myself.