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Deucey

So this is what MTA's new guy left TTC with...

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They've been debating it since the '80s. Toronto hasn't had long-term planning for a while.

What Byford's done is actually pretty impressive, given that he had to deal with Mayor Crackhead ripping up what long-term plans existed.

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The TTC is woefully underbuilt for what Toronto has become. Council is in love with streetcars and seems to be allergic to heavy-rail subways. The Downtown Relief Line should have been built 30 years ago and it's still just a glimmer in a transit planner's eye. They should go back to interline operation via lower bay as well. Byford did the best he could with what he had, and he clearly has the passion for urban mass transit. Toronto's politicians are as bad as or worse than what we have in NYC, though, and their only constant is that they're vehemently anti-car and pro-bike-lane. They don't seem to have much in the tank beyond that. You'll never see new roads built in the 416, and there is no vision to implement a transit plan that does more than bring workers from the 'burbs into the downtown core in the morning and get them back home in the evening.

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26 minutes ago, Peter Dougherty said:

The TTC is woefully underbuilt for what Toronto has become. Council is in love with streetcars and seems to be allergic to heavy-rail subways. The Downtown Relief Line should have been built 30 years ago and it's still just a glimmer in a transit planner's eye. They should go back to interline operation via lower bay as well. Byford did the best he could with what he had, and he clearly has the passion for urban mass transit. Toronto's politicians are as bad as or worse than what we have in NYC, though, and their only constant is that they're vehemently anti-car and pro-bike-lane. They don't seem to have much in the tank beyond that. You'll never see new roads built in the 416, and there is no vision to implement a transit plan that does more than bring workers from the 'burbs into the downtown core in the morning and get them back home in the evening.

I've been on the King Street street car, it was interesting and antique, lol. I haven't ridden the subway there yet, but I'll try the next time I go. I looked at a map and didnt realize how far up the Bloor St line was relative to downtown. The Yellow [1] line must be really crazy packed to downtown. Which side of the yellow line is more busy south of Bloor? The east or west?

Speaking of new roads, the sprawl there is crazy, it reminds me of Texas and Florida. The higways were in good condition, and the 401 was like the NJTP with closer exits.

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1 hour ago, Peter Dougherty said:

The TTC is woefully underbuilt for what Toronto has become. Council is in love with streetcars and seems to be allergic to heavy-rail subways. The Downtown Relief Line should have been built 30 years ago and it's still just a glimmer in a transit planner's eye. They should go back to interline operation via lower bay as well. Byford did the best he could with what he had, and he clearly has the passion for urban mass transit. Toronto's politicians are as bad as or worse than what we have in NYC, though, and their only constant is that they're vehemently anti-car and pro-bike-lane. They don't seem to have much in the tank beyond that. You'll never see new roads built in the 416, and there is no vision to implement a transit plan that does more than bring workers from the 'burbs into the downtown core in the morning and get them back home in the evening.

Not to mention that the TTC has been underfunded for a long time now.

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1 hour ago, Peter Dougherty said:

The TTC is woefully underbuilt for what Toronto has become. Council is in love with streetcars and seems to be allergic to heavy-rail subways. The Downtown Relief Line should have been built 30 years ago and it's still just a glimmer in a transit planner's eye. They should go back to interline operation via lower bay as well. Byford did the best he could with what he had, and he clearly has the passion for urban mass transit. Toronto's politicians are as bad as or worse than what we have in NYC, though, and their only constant is that they're vehemently anti-car and pro-bike-lane. They don't seem to have much in the tank beyond that. You'll never see new roads built in the 416, and there is no vision to implement a transit plan that does more than bring workers from the 'burbs into the downtown core in the morning and get them back home in the evening.

Do you think implementing through-running again will reduce reliable/reduce throughput?

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The toronto council is in love with lrts

They love it they are willing to ignore extending line 4 just to build lrt

And scarborough the million dollar question is subway or lrt?

Also the relief line is also the big problem

Edited by BreeddekalbL

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5 hours ago, N6 Limited said:

I've been on the King Street street car, it was interesting and antique, lol. I haven't ridden the subway there yet, but I'll try the next time I go. I looked at a map and didnt realize how far up the Bloor St line was relative to downtown. The Yellow [1] line must be really crazy packed to downtown. Which side of the yellow line is more busy south of Bloor? The east or west?

The east side, which was the original subway from 1954 (Eglinton to Union), at least while I was living there, up to 2000.

Quote

Speaking of new roads, the sprawl there is crazy, it reminds me of Texas and Florida. The higways were in good condition, and the 401 was like the NJTP with closer exits.

The 401 is insane, as is the DVP/404 and Gardiner. Rush "hour" lasts from 6am to 10am, and from 2pm to 8pm (and it's still bad after that on weekends). Development was allowed to explode across the GTA without a corresponding increase in transportation infrastructure, and the city will pay the price for decades now.

4 hours ago, Union Tpke said:

Do you think implementing through-running again will reduce reliable/reduce throughput?

I do, but only if it's done correctly. CBTC (NYC's implementation, to be specific) is being installed on the Yonge-University-Spadina line now. Once the Bloor-Danforth line has also been converted as well, that's the time to bring back interlining, essentially as it was done in the 60s, with short-turn trains only providing service variations. Eglinton to Keele and Donlands, or some variation along those lines. Maybe out to Main St. since there's a GO train connection there, provided they could build a center track on one side and a double crossover on the other.

I doubt this would work without CBTC fully operational. Scheduling would be difficult but not impossible; and advertise the hell out of it 6 months before implementation.

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20 minutes ago, Peter Dougherty said:

Once the Bloor-Danforth line has also been converted as well, that's the time to bring back interlining, essentially as it was done in the 60s, with short-turn trains only providing service variations.

Wasn’t interlining stopped because people waiting for a train to Woodbine or Eglinton at Bay couldn’t tell which platform to stand on to get the fastest train to that destination?

I remember reading that somewhere 

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15 hours ago, Deucey said:

Wasn’t interlining stopped because people waiting for a train to Woodbine or Eglinton at Bay couldn’t tell which platform to stand on to get the fastest train to that destination?

I remember reading that somewhere 

People waited on the stairs between the two platforms, because they didn't know which platform the next train was going to arrive at.

 

We have countdown clock technology now, so that won't be an issue in a contemporary implementation.

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41 minutes ago, P3F said:

People waited on the stairs between the two platforms, because they didn't know which platform the next train was going to arrive at.

 

We have countdown clock technology now, so that won't be an issue in a contemporary implementation.

What's funny is that people do that now with the uptown (F) and (M) at Essex Street

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1 hour ago, Around the Horn said:

What's funny is that people do that now with the uptown (F) and (M) at Essex Street

People have been doing that since 2010, when the (M) started running over 6th Avenue. Hell, I used to do that when I lived in the LES:lol:

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