Messino Posted February 19, 2011 Share #1 Posted February 19, 2011 I read this in the chief regarding the Promo T/O list. Does the 1 in 3 rule apply to Open Competitve as well? Also it says 200 people eligible between numbers 28 and 305.. So I guess the remaining 77 people either refused the job or were not eligble or passed over because of the 1 in 3 rule, So that means after this 200 is hired they will start after list number 305? Also is it true alot of these conducters who took this promo test are not even taking the job, they just took the test for a paid day off? The Department of Citywide Administrative Services has certified sections of the eligible lists below for appointments and promotions in city agencies, subject to the 1-in-3 rule. Some of the appointments and promotions may already have been made. TRAIN OPERATOR—200 eligibles between Nos. 28 and 305 on List 8562 for 60 jobs at NYC Transit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donald Posted February 19, 2011 Share #2 Posted February 19, 2011 What is the 1 in 3 rule? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Messino Posted February 19, 2011 Author Share #3 Posted February 19, 2011 What is the 1 in 3 rule? It means out of the top 3 people on the list , they can pass over 1 and 2 to hire #3 but they cant pass over to #4 Q: What is the 1-in-3 rule? Civil Service law requires an agency to appoint in rank order from one of the top three candidates on a list. For example, the agency will consider numbers 1, 2, and 3 for a position. They can skip over 1 and 2 and appoint 3, but they cannot skip down to 4. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donald Posted February 19, 2011 Share #4 Posted February 19, 2011 Why would someone be passed over for a job? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Messino Posted February 19, 2011 Author Share #5 Posted February 19, 2011 Why would someone be passed over for a job? For promotionals it could be attendance record or anything else negative on the workers record. Not sure how it would work with open competitive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rtype3995 Posted February 19, 2011 Share #6 Posted February 19, 2011 I read this in the chief regarding the Promo T/O list. Does the 1 in 3 rule apply to Open Competitve as well? Also it says 200 people eligible between numbers 28 and 305.. So I guess the remaining 77 people either refused the job or were not eligble or passed over because of the 1 in 3 rule, So that means after this 200 is hired they will start after list number 305? Also is it true alot of these conducters who took this promo test are not even taking the job, they just took the test for a paid day off? The Department of Citywide Administrative Services has certified sections of the eligible lists below for appointments and promotions in city agencies, subject to the 1-in-3 rule. Some of the appointments and promotions may already have been made. TRAIN OPERATOR—200 eligibles between Nos. 28 and 305 on List 8562 for 60 jobs at NYC Transit. a lot of them go through the training so they can get sat/sun off for a few months, then they decide to go back to c/r...................some dont want to be extra/extra again.................... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LIRRtoPenn Posted February 19, 2011 Share #7 Posted February 19, 2011 Is this good news for us o/c guys ? I'm 276 on the o/c list. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Messino Posted February 19, 2011 Author Share #8 Posted February 19, 2011 Is this good news for us o/c guys ? I'm 276 on the o/c list. Thanks I guess so, it seems they are zippin through that promo list. Hopefully well get called no later than the end of the year Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rtype3995 Posted February 19, 2011 Share #9 Posted February 19, 2011 i would look at it that way..................i just dont see a mass exoudus of c/r moving to the front seat............... messino, whats ur list # on the test? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donald Posted February 19, 2011 Share #10 Posted February 19, 2011 I think you guys on the O/C T/O list have a much longer wait than you think. The promotional conductor list is half the length and they are creeping along in moving through it. On top of that, the T/O classes take longer to finish since T/O school car is 3 times as long as C/R school car. I would not count on being called before 2013. Sorry to be the bearer of bad news... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Messino Posted February 20, 2011 Author Share #11 Posted February 20, 2011 i would look at it that way..................i just dont see a mass exoudus of c/r moving to the front seat...............messino, whats ur list # on the test? Im in the low 200s on the oc. I got 2 wrong 97.6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donald Posted February 20, 2011 Share #12 Posted February 20, 2011 Anybody here take the condcutor exam in addition to the T/O exam? If your called for C/R first, what are you going to do? Take it and then take the next T/O promotional exam, or turn it down and take T/O? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blatherskite Posted February 20, 2011 Share #13 Posted February 20, 2011 I think you guys on the O/C T/O list have a much longer wait than you think. The promotional conductor list is half the length and they are creeping along in moving through it. On top of that, the T/O classes take longer to finish since T/O school car is 3 times as long as C/R school car. I would not count on being called before 2013. Sorry to be the bearer of bad news... I hate to say it, but I agree with you here 100%. There is no way the T/O promotional list is getting completed by December 31st 2011. Anyone that thinks this is not looking at reality. Also, most people that go to T/O stay there, because the next promotions are management, and they like being T/O's, so they stay there until retirment. Anybody here take the condcutor exam in addition to the T/O exam? If your called for C/R first, what are you going to do? Take it and then take the next T/O promotional exam, or turn it down and take T/O? What happens if someone takes both and becomes a C/R first is this. When T/O calls while they are still on probation as C/R, they have to resign C/R to become T/O. If their probation is complete for C/R when T/O calls, T/O becomes a promotion. The problem with resigning the C/R is if a couple of years later the T/O gets in trouble, they can't go back to C/R as a demotion if they resigned. They would get terminated because there is nothing to fall back on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RTOMan Posted February 20, 2011 Share #14 Posted February 20, 2011 Is this good news for us o/c guys ? I'm 276 on the o/c list. Thanks Put it this way dont wait by the Mailbox.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LIRRtoPenn Posted February 20, 2011 Share #15 Posted February 20, 2011 Thanks, not waiting , I have a full time job , good pay and not far from home, I'm 47, but would like to get in for some sort of pension, just hope to be called before I'm 50. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SubwayGuy Posted February 20, 2011 Share #16 Posted February 20, 2011 What happens if someone takes both and becomes a C/R first is this. When T/O calls while they are still on probation as C/R, they have to resign C/R to become T/O. If their probation is complete for C/R when T/O calls, T/O becomes a promotion. The problem with resigning the C/R is if a couple of years later the T/O gets in trouble, they can't go back to C/R as a demotion if they resigned. They would get terminated because there is nothing to fall back on. I don't believe that's entirely correct/complete but 95% of it is though. If a C/R is still on probation when T/O calls, they must resign as a C/R to take the promotion to T/O. If this person does not pass schoolcar for any reason whatsoever, having not completed conductor's probation they are out on the street. Therefore in this situation the best thing for the C/R to do is to work with NYCT to try and defer the promotion until probation is complete. However, once the person has completed probation as a C/R, then as I understand it the person can always be demoted to that position. During T/O probation, the person can also choose to go back to C/R if deciding that T/O is not for him or her. If an incident were to happen a couple of years later, the T/O would be demoted BACK to C/R (unless it was a major incident leading to outright termination). If any incident happened during T/O probation, again back to C/R. However, if the person had not completed C/R probation when an incident occurred as a T/O, then out on the street it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blatherskite Posted February 21, 2011 Share #17 Posted February 21, 2011 I don't believe that's entirely correct/complete but 95% of it is though. If a C/R is still on probation when T/O calls, they must resign as a C/R to take the promotion to T/O. If this person does not pass schoolcar for any reason whatsoever, having not completed conductor's probation they are out on the street. Therefore in this situation the best thing for the C/R to do is to work with NYCT to try and defer the promotion until probation is complete. However, once the person has completed probation as a C/R, then as I understand it the person can always be demoted to that position. During T/O probation, the person can also choose to go back to C/R if deciding that T/O is not for him or her. If an incident were to happen a couple of years later, the T/O would be demoted BACK to C/R (unless it was a major incident leading to outright termination). If any incident happened during T/O probation, again back to C/R. However, if the person had not completed C/R probation when an incident occurred as a T/O, then out on the street it is. That's exactly what I said. You are incorrect though about the failing school car and being out on the street. If you resign from conductor, you have 2 years in which to come back before you are officially a "civilian" and can only come back if it is after the 2 years by taking the conductor test again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BroadwayBuffer Posted February 21, 2011 Share #18 Posted February 21, 2011 I don't believe that's entirely correct/complete but 95% of it is though. If a C/R is still on probation when T/O calls, they must resign as a C/R to take the promotion to T/O. If this person does not pass schoolcar for any reason whatsoever, having not completed conductor's probation they are out on the street. Therefore in this situation the best thing for the C/R to do is to work with NYCT to try and defer the promotion until probation is complete. However, once the person has completed probation as a C/R, then as I understand it the person can always be demoted to that position. During T/O probation, the person can also choose to go back to C/R if deciding that T/O is not for him or her. If an incident were to happen a couple of years later, the T/O would be demoted BACK to C/R (unless it was a major incident leading to outright termination). If any incident happened during T/O probation, again back to C/R. However, if the person had not completed C/R probation when an incident occurred as a T/O, then out on the street it is. If a T/O was demoted to C/R, depending on the nature of the incident, wouldn't that demotion likely diminish the person's chances of ever returning to T/O or promoting to any supervisory position considering the 1-in-3 rule? Someone in that position may need to stay as a C/R for the remainder of their career in order to stay with the TA. Also, in the case of a T/O who had not served as a C/R, is a demotion to CTA, S/A or PP/A possible? They might be less desirable, but I thought some of those positions were filled by demotions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blatherskite Posted February 21, 2011 Share #19 Posted February 21, 2011 Also, in the case of a T/O who had not served as a C/R, is a demotion to CTA, S/A or PP/A possible? They might be less desirable, but I thought some of those positions were filled by demotions. They were most likely filled by people who once held those titles, or that's how the rules used to be. I know an old conductor (he's been a conductor for many many years) that years ago was offered the position of Train Operator because there was a shortage. He was offered it without taking a test. He declined it because he liked being a conductor because he felt less responsibility and enjoyed talking to the women without having to keep focused on operating a train. That's pretty sad, becoming a cleaner being considered a worse punishment than being terminated. I guess being unemployed is better than cleaning out a freshly deficated car. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DOB2RTO Posted February 21, 2011 Share #20 Posted February 21, 2011 What is the 1 in 3 rule? In short, 1 out of 3 get usually hired. For every one hired, two usually are dismissed, for several reasons. Sick record, lying on application, don't have proper documents and can't obtain them, etc. It applies to O/C and promotionals, but with different reasons one might be passed over of course. Sick record usually hurt those on the promo. Lying on the application, or not having proper documents, or credentials, usually hurt those on the O/C. This is for off the street O/C, not O/C persons, who already work for TA, but have to take tests on the O/C, cause their TA title or TA position, disqualifies them from taking an exam on the promotional. They are hired off the top of the O/C list, but their sick record at TA usually does them in.......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mediccjh Posted March 21, 2011 Share #21 Posted March 21, 2011 Please, watch the Nazi Banksters Crimes Ripple Effect at http://jforjustice.co.uk/banksters Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will-Bx-718 Posted March 22, 2011 Share #22 Posted March 22, 2011 I don't believe train operaters that are demoted can't go back to conductors or are terminated. I've worked with plenty of them that have been demoted to cleaners or station agents as well. I guess it just depends on the seriousness of your infraction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y2Julio Posted March 22, 2011 Share #23 Posted March 22, 2011 I don't believe train operaters that are demoted can't go back to conductors or are terminated. I've worked with plenty of them that have been demoted to cleaners or station agents as well. I guess it just depends on the seriousness of your infraction. Some still even **** up after being given a second chance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xentor Posted March 22, 2011 Share #24 Posted March 22, 2011 In short, 1 out of 3 get usually hired. For every one hired, two usually are dismissed, for several reasons. Sick record, lying on application, don't have proper documents and can't obtain them, etc. It applies to O/C and promotionals, but with different reasons one might be passed over of course. Sick record usually hurt those on the promo. Lying on the application, or not having proper documents, or credentials, usually hurt those on the O/C. This is for off the street O/C, not O/C persons, who already work for TA, but have to take tests on the O/C, cause their TA title or TA position, disqualifies them from taking an exam on the promotional. They are hired off the top of the O/C list, but their sick record at TA usually does them in.......... So the 1 out of 3 rule means you best get your shit together properly. Otherwise the MTA based on paper alone will simply pass/disqualify you. That's a bit similar to several other hiring processes. What would be bad is if they just hired one out of three people lottery style. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will-Bx-718 Posted March 22, 2011 Share #25 Posted March 22, 2011 So the 1 out of 3 rule means you best get your shit together properly. Otherwise the MTA based on paper alone will simply pass/disqualify you. That's a bit similar to several other hiring processes. What would be bad is if they just hired one out of three people lottery style. Yep that's exactly what it means. So if you know you have a bad sick record and a bad disciplinary record you might as well not take any promo exams. Because you will be 1 and 3'd out of the position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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