Manhattan Express Bus

[Gorgor]

If a new proposed M90 would be making all local stops along York Avenue then it would just take way too long. The M31 is really slow and it already makes all local stops there. If anything the M90 should make the same stops at the X90, or just limited stops like on the other lines like at 91st, 86th, 79th, 72nd, 66th, and 57th.

 

And why are you guys suggesting creating a regular bus route for it instead of an express bus, which has a fare of more than double the local? I don't think that half of the people who would consider taking the new bus would decide not to just because it's a higher fare.

[Cait Sith]

If a new proposed M90 would be making all local stops along York Avenue then it would just take way too long. The M31 is really slow and it already makes all local stops there. If anything the M90 should make the same stops at the X90, or just limited stops like on the other lines like at 91st, 86th, 79th, 72nd, 66th, and 57th.

 

And why are you guys suggesting creating a regular bus route for it instead of an express bus, which has a fare of more than double the local? I don't think that half of the people who would consider taking the new bus would decide not to just because it's a higher fare.

 

Because for one, there's no need for a Manhattan Express route (at least in my opinion). Secondary, this route would have regular frequencies rather than running only during peak hours. Third, unless you want people to bitch about how this bus service doesn't stop near the blocks they live near or along, you can have fun with that x90 scenario, its one reason why the M31 is the way it is now. You already have Yorkville residents bitching about the "lack of options" they have to choose (pure bullshit in my opinion), this would solve most of those issues IF they dont want to take the subway.

 

Unless you dont know, the main reasons why the x90 was axed is because it emulated the M15 & The Lexington Avenue lines, also because of the fact that ridership was very infrequent, those people wanted frequent service and yet its their fault that the line got axed because they didnt meet with the demands they preached for. Their eyes and mouths are too big!

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Because for one, there's no need for a Manhattan Express route (at least in my opinion). Secondary, this route would have regular frequencies rather than running only during peak hours. Third, unless you want people to bitch about how this bus service doesn't stop near the blocks they live near or along, you can have fun with that x90 scenario, its one reason why the M31 is the way it is now. You already have Yorkville residents bitching about the "lack of options" they have to choose (pure bullshit in my opinion), this would solve most of those issues IF they dont want to take the subway.

 

Unless you dont know, the main reasons why the x90 was axed is because it emulated the M15 & The Lexington Avenue lines, also because of the fact that ridership was very infrequent, those people wanted frequent service and yet its their fault that the line got axed because they didnt meet with the demands they preached for. Their eyes and mouths are too big!

 

In all honesty, there was no need for an x25 at all considering 99.9% of the time, it only carried air. You have a multitude of service around the WTC area including the subways, the M103, and quite a few other connections!

 

Yes the whole point of the X25 was to relieve pressure on the line. Okay so they eliminated it, but I don't see any real improvements on that line.

 

As far as Yorkville residents b*tching, I don't blame them. One of my co-workers lives in Yorkville and she often complains about the lack of buses on York Avenue. Since she's in the 70s sometimes she'll just walk to the office if the weather is decent.

 

I happen to agree with Yorkville/Upper East Side residents. I used to spend a lot of time up there going to the restaurants along 1st and 2nd Avenue and specialty stores and getting Crosstown or Downtown can be a real b*tch. Very slow going...

[Gorgor]

Yes the whole point of the X25 was to relieve pressure on the line. Okay so they eliminated it, but I don't see any real improvements on that line.

 

As far as Yorkville residents b*tching, I don't blame them. One of my co-worker lives in Yorkville and she often complains about the lack of buses on York Avenue. Since she's in the 70s sometimes she'll just walk to the office if the weather is decent.

 

I happen to agree with Yorkville/Upper East Side residents. I used to spend a lot of time up there going to the restaurants along 1st and 2nd Avenue and specialty stores and getting Crosstown or Downtown can be a real b*tch. Very slow going...

 

Oh, don't even get me started on cross town buses. I can and have easily out-walked many buses from 1st to 5th. Former X90 riders that have to use the now have a 10 minute bus ride just to get to the subway.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Because for one, there's no need for a Manhattan Express route (at least in my opinion). Secondary, this route would have regular frequencies rather than running only during peak hours. Third, unless you want people to bitch about how this bus service doesn't stop near the blocks they live near or along, you can have fun with that x90 scenario, its one reason why the M31 is the way it is now. You already have Yorkville residents bitching about the "lack of options" they have to choose (pure bullshit in my opinion), this would solve most of those issues IF they dont want to take the subway.

 

Unless you dont know, the main reasons why the x90 was axed is because it emulated the M15 & The Lexington Avenue lines, also because of the fact that ridership was very infrequent, those people wanted frequent service and yet its their fault that the line got axed because they didnt meet with the demands they preached for. Their eyes and mouths are too big!

 

Oh, don't even get me started on cross town buses. I can and have easily out-walked many buses from 1st to 5th. Former X90 riders that have to use the now have a 10 minute bus ride just to get to the subway.

 

I never sit and say well so and so has such and such ride so you can deal with it because most folks have a tough commute, even those in Manhattan. Overall my belief is that we need more service all around, not less and yes and it's very easy for those to say that folks don't need such and such when they're making that commute everyday.

 

I can remember very clearly taking the (M79) Crosstown and it taking over 30 minutes just to do that, so Manhattan residents don't have so peachy either.

[checkmatechamp13]

And the reason why is because the and seem to run better (a little "faster") going Downtown than going Uptown. Going Uptown you are better off getting on the train during certain parts of the rush hour because they (the and ) just stand there between stations and keep giving annoucements about there being train traffic ahead. I mean seriously, they spent months and months inconveniencing riders putting in that new signal system on that line and I don't see any real benefits from it. There still seems to be the same problem.

 

They know why they created those express buses and the main reason was to give alleviate the overcrowded and line and give those riders other alternatives, then they turn around and cut those alternatives and claim that all is well because of the SBS service. I mean really the is a joke. The problems on the and won't be helped until the SAS is built.

 

Realistically, no express route that parallels a subway line was created to relieve the subway line. The X90 got 620 riders. A single subway train can carry 1,500 riders, meaning that, throughout the course of the day, the X90 didn't even take a trainload of people off of the Lexington Avenue Line.

 

That what I meant. Have the X90 become a Downtown M90 Limited.

 

I was thinking to have it remain as an express bus. As a local bus, it would parallel the M15, and wouldn't really be a faster alternative. It wouldn't offer the cushioned seats and lower crowds that made people take the X90 in the first place.

 

It's still emulating what is the current M15. The way I'd do it, let it start from its current last stop and have it run LTD from the WFC to 57th and 1st Avenue, right onto 57th and left onto york making all local stops up to 96th Street. The way your idea is planned is to bypass some of the more vital parts of the routing which would backfire.

 

 

 

Living near the FDR, I can tell you firsthand that it gets caught every once in a while. Whenever the 59th Street Bridge is crammed with traffic, it affects the FDR and the x90 would always get caught in that mess.

 

 

 

In all honesty, there was no need for an x25 at all considering 99.9% of the time, it only carried air. You have a multitude of service around the WTC area including the subways, the M103, and quite a few other connections!

 

That is why I suggested rerouting the X90 to serve Grand Central: It would provide more frequent service than the X25 and would therefore attract additional riders.

 

Because for one, there's no need for a Manhattan Express route (at least in my opinion). Secondary, this route would have regular frequencies rather than running only during peak hours. Third, unless you want people to bitch about how this bus service doesn't stop near the blocks they live near or along, you can have fun with that x90 scenario, its one reason why the M31 is the way it is now. You already have Yorkville residents bitching about the "lack of options" they have to choose (pure bullshit in my opinion), this would solve most of those issues IF they dont want to take the subway.

 

Unless you dont know, the main reasons why the x90 was axed is because it emulated the M15 & The Lexington Avenue lines, also because of the fact that ridership was very infrequent, those people wanted frequent service and yet its their fault that the line got axed because they didnt meet with the demands they preached for. Their eyes and mouths are too big!

 

How frequent was the X90 before its elimination?

 

Yes the whole point of the X25 was to relieve pressure on the line. Okay so they eliminated it, but I don't see any real improvements on that line.

 

As far as Yorkville residents b*tching, I don't blame them. One of my co-workers lives in Yorkville and she often complains about the lack of buses on York Avenue. Since she's in the 70s sometimes she'll just walk to the office if the weather is decent.

 

I happen to agree with Yorkville/Upper East Side residents. I used to spend a lot of time up there going to the restaurants along 1st and 2nd Avenue and specialty stores and getting Crosstown or Downtown can be a real b*tch. Very slow going...

 

The X25 was useless as far as relieving the Lexington Avenue Line. It carried a measly 20 people throughout the whole day. That's 2-3 people per trip.

 

I never sit and say well so and so has such and such ride so you can deal with it because most folks have a tough commute, even those in Manhattan. Overall my belief is that we need more service all around, not less and yes and it's very easy for those to say that folks don't need such and such when they're making that commute everyday.

 

I can remember very clearly taking the (M79) Crosstown and it taking over 30 minutes just to do that, so Manhattan residents don't have so peachy either.

 

Crosstown service always has been a problem in Manhattan because of its slow speed. Still, Manhattan residents don't have a perfect commute, but their commute is a lot better than the commute of people in the outer boroughs.

[Cait Sith]

Yes the whole point of the X25 was to relieve pressure on the line. Okay so they eliminated it, but I don't see any real improvements on that line.

 

As far as Yorkville residents b*tching, I don't blame them. One of my co-workers lives in Yorkville and she often complains about the lack of buses on York Avenue. Since she's in the 70s sometimes she'll just walk to the office if the weather is decent.

 

I happen to agree with Yorkville/Upper East Side residents. I used to spend a lot of time up there going to the restaurants along 1st and 2nd Avenue and specialty stores and getting Crosstown or Downtown can be a real b*tch. Very slow going...

 

You're agreeing with the same people that killed the x90 because of the demands that even they couldn't meet with, there is something wrong with that picture. It's not hard to go Downtown, it's called the M15 SBS.

 

You are also agreeing with the same people that wanted Lower East Side service to get cut dramatically so they can get an improvement of their own service. The same people that said Lower East Side residents don't use the bus as much as they do, which is total bullshit. I'm sorry but other people in the city got much more worse commutes than those Yorkville folk, so they can go complain to people who give a damn because we all know for a fact that there are a ton of New Yorkers in the five boroughs that have more harsh and time consuming commutes than those Yorkville folk, especially those in Staten Island, Queens AND The Bronx. And you should know that better than anyone considering you have a hellacious commute from Staten Island alone IF you didnt have any Express Bus Options....

 

I never sit and say well so and so has such and such ride so you can deal with it because most folks have a tough commute, even those in Manhattan. Overall my belief is that we need more service all around, not less and yes and it's very easy for those to say that folks don't need such and such when they're making that commute everyday.

 

I can remember very clearly taking the (M79) Crosstown and it taking over 30 minutes just to do that, so Manhattan residents don't have so peachy either.

 

Yeah? If that's the case, tell me why there are so many routes that hit up York Avenue? People have the M15 to get to their places along with several other alternatives. That whole point is full of crap and that insults me as a Manhattan resident.

 

I'm at the Lower East Side where service cuts in Manhattan got hit the worst. We lost vital connections and have to experience longer waits, waits that are much longer than what those Yorkville folk out there with their 6-10 minute waits. They got a ton of options to choose from all over that area and you're going to tell me that Yorkville residents got no other alternatives to get around in the city? That's a load of shit and then-some if you ask me.

 

The only bad cut for them was the x90, we lost two subway lines, the and the . We lost the M15 City Hall branch which is severely screwed over by the current M9 pattern, the same M9 that lost its direct service to Battery Park City, which at the same time is screwing over THOSE residents because they only have TWO bus routes, the M20 and M22. The M9 was a vital connection for those people who had to get to the subway or the Lower East Side/Chelsea Areas for the other subway & bus connections

 

We've also lost the M21 to Bellevue Hospital, which was one hell of a lifeline for those Bellevue hospital seekers. The M21 is now a crosstown and lost about half of its ridership it used to have. We lost the M1 and the M6 to South Ferry, replacing it is the M5 which has not been that good of a replacement.

 

The one vital route that was axed was the B39, Marcy Avenue was a major transfer point after the B39 as people would go onto the connecting buses. Now people have to run from the train station to ensure that their bus connections are met.

 

Now, you cannot tell me that their commutes are bad because we down here at the Lower East Side suffered much worse than they did, they only lost the M30 and x90. We lost MUCH MORE than they did and they gained a schedule increase while we got the decrease. Other boroughs suffered much more worse than they did and much worse than the Lower East Side, making their commutes much more harder, while they had a schedule increase up to 5 minutes. To say that their commutes arent so good and their choices arent so great, that right there is a statement that is full of bullshit and more....

 

Realistically, no express route that parallels a subway line was created to relieve the subway line. The X90 got 620 riders. A single subway train can carry 1,500 riders, meaning that, throughout the course of the day, the X90 didn't even take a trainload of people off of the Lexington Avenue Line.

 

 

That is why I suggested rerouting the X90 to serve Grand Central: It would provide more frequent service than the X25 and would therefore attract additional riders.

 

 

 

How frequent was the X90 before its elimination?

 

 

 

The X25 was useless as far as relieving the Lexington Avenue Line. It carried a measly 20 people throughout the whole day. That's 2-3 people per trip.

 

Crosstown service always has been a problem in Manhattan because of its slow speed. Still, Manhattan residents don't have a perfect commute, but their commute is a lot better than the commute of people in the outer boroughs.

 

Post #1 : Yes, the x90 did gain a lot of passengers, but it barely cleaned off any wound from the Lexington Avenue Lines.

 

Post #2 : Having the x90 serve Grand Central would only be a inconvinence, it would have to route back via Madison and then via 57th Street, which is always swamped by traffic.

 

Post #3 : I'll put it this way, the x90 was about as frequent as most of the S.I express routes on the downtown portion of those routes. You'd see one x90 picking up people and the one behind it not picking up a single person. The route was way too frequent to even meet with the little amount of people it picks up per rush hour. You'd have one bus with decent amount of people, then you'd have another bus with only 4-5 people. Infrequent and stupid to have such demand for service. It's one big reason why it got the axe.

 

Post #4 : Best post of the evening. That x25 was the most useless thing to come across the Express Bus table. It USED to pick up when the x92 was still around, not anymore! I've scouted that x25 quite a good few times and within every PM rush hour trip, I have never seen more than 4 people on any bus. Only reason it stayed alive is because it directly interlined with the x29. I agree 100% with that last statement, there are many other commuters within the 5 boroughs that have a much more harder and crazier commute than those Yorkville folk, so they can't complain about a damn thing when it comes to getting around.

 

Here's another sticking point, you wanna know why the M31 is "slow" in that part of the East Side? It's because of those people that bitched about the M31 not stopping at their area when the x92 got cut/merged with the x90 years ago. As a result of that, they had to add a few more stops along York Avenue so they can appease those people. And NOW they will blame the MTA for the line being so slow. Well you know what, someone get them their baby bottles and tell them to grow up, because they literally brought this shit on themselves, NOT the MTA!

[checkmatechamp13]

I know that the X90 barely made a dent in the Lexington Avenue Line ridership. Even the north-south buses in the area (M15, M101/M102/M103) carry less than 10% of what the Lexington Avenue Line carries.

 

If the X90 were to serve Grand Central, I would have it run down Park Avenue to serve the office buildings in the area, for UES residents who work in Midtown (as well as any residents who work in Westchester and take the Metro-North from Grand Central).

 

When the buses had those uneven loads, were they bunched up, or that was just the natural ridership of the route?

 

If the X25 was interlined with the X29, why did it cost so much to operate? It didn't take that much longer for the bus to make the trip on the X25 on its way back to Brooklyn.

 

Agreed about the commute part. The people move into Manhattan in order to have a good commute. People living in the Bronx have to deal with the Lexington Avenue crowds plus an extra 40 minutes on the train.

[Cait Sith]

I know that the X90 barely made a dent in the Lexington Avenue Line ridership. Even the north-south buses in the area (M15, M101/M102/M103) carry less than 10% of what the Lexington Avenue Line carries.

 

If the X90 were to serve Grand Central, I would have it run down Park Avenue to serve the office buildings in the area, for UES residents who work in Midtown (as well as any residents who work in Westchester and take the Metro-North from Grand Central).

 

When the buses had those uneven loads, were they bunched up, or that was just the natural ridership of the route?

 

Agreed about the commute part. The people move into Manhattan in order to have a good commute. People living in the Bronx have to deal with the Lexington Avenue crowds plus an extra 40 minutes on the train.

 

I would agree to that, but if we are talking about Park Avenue North, buses in general are not allowed to go down or up Park Avenue North because of complaints from the people that live there, buses can only travel up and down Park Avenue South because the area is more of a business area. It's only alternative is Madison Avenue

 

It's a mix of both, it was bunching & natural ridership, the two problems that caused the x90 to get the axe. Had the schedule been expanded to actually meet with the demands, it would be alright.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

You're agreeing with the same people that killed the x90 because of the demands that even they couldn't meet with, there is something wrong with that picture. It's not hard to go Downtown, it's called the M15 SBS.

 

You are also agreeing with the same people that wanted Lower East Side service to get cut dramatically so they can get an improvement of their own service. The same people that said Lower East Side residents don't use the bus as much as they do, which is total bullshit. I'm sorry but other people in the city got much more worse commutes than those Yorkville folk, so they can go complain to people who give a damn because we all know for a fact that there are a ton of New Yorkers in the five boroughs that have more harsh and time consuming commutes than those Yorkville folk, especially those in Staten Island, Queens AND The Bronx. And you should know that better than anyone considering you have a hellacious commute from Staten Island alone IF you didnt have any Express Bus Options....

 

 

 

Yeah? If that's the case, tell me why there are so many routes that hit up York Avenue? People have the M15 to get to their places along with several other alternatives. That whole point is full of crap and that insults me as a Manhattan resident.

 

I'm at the Lower East Side where service cuts in Manhattan got hit the worst. We lost vital connections and have to experience longer waits, waits that are much longer than what those Yorkville folk out there with their 6-10 minute waits. They got a ton of options to choose from all over that area and you're going to tell me that Yorkville residents got no other alternatives to get around in the city? That's a load of shit and then-some if you ask me.

 

The only bad cut for them was the x90, we lost two subway lines, the and the . We lost the M15 City Hall branch which is severely screwed over by the current M9 pattern, the same M9 that lost its direct service to Battery Park City, which at the same time is screwing over THOSE residents because they only have TWO bus routes, the M20 and M22. The M9 was a vital connection for those people who had to get to the subway or the Lower East Side/Chelsea Areas for the other subway & bus connections

 

We've also lost the M21 to Bellevue Hospital, which was one hell of a lifeline for those Bellevue hospital seekers. The M21 is now a crosstown and lost about half of its ridership it used to have. We lost the M1 and the M6 to South Ferry, replacing it is the M5 which has not been that good of a replacement.

 

The one vital route that was axed was the B39, Marcy Avenue was a major transfer point after the B39 as people would go onto the connecting buses. Now people have to run from the train station to ensure that their bus connections are met.

 

Now, you cannot tell me that their commutes are bad because we down here at the Lower East Side suffered much worse than they did, they only lost the M30 and x90. We lost MUCH MORE than they did and they gained a schedule increase while we got the decrease. Other boroughs suffered much more worse than they did and much worse than the Lower East Side, making their commutes much more harder, while they had a schedule increase up to 5 minutes. To say that their commutes arent so good and their choices arent so great, that right there is a statement that is full of bullshit and more....

 

 

 

Post #1 : Yes, the x90 did gain a lot of passengers, but it barely cleaned off any wound from the Lexington Avenue Lines.

 

Post #2 : Having the x90 serve Grand Central would only be a inconvinence, it would have to route back via Madison and then via 57th Street, which is always swamped by traffic.

 

Post #3 : I'll put it this way, the x90 was about as frequent as most of the S.I express routes on the downtown portion of those routes. You'd see one x90 picking up people and the one behind it not picking up a single person. The route was way too frequent to even meet with the little amount of people it picks up per rush hour. You'd have one bus with decent amount of people, then you'd have another bus with only 4-5 people. Infrequent and stupid to have such demand for service. It's one big reason why it got the axe.

 

Post #4 : Best post of the evening. That x25 was the most useless thing to come across the Express Bus table. It USED to pick up when the x92 was still around, not anymore! I've scouted that x25 quite a good few times and within every PM rush hour trip, I have never seen more than 4 people on any bus. Only reason it stayed alive is because it directly interlined with the x29. I agree 100% with that last statement, there are many other commuters within the 5 boroughs that have a much more harder and crazier commute than those Yorkville folk, so they can't complain about a damn thing when it comes to getting around.

 

Here's another sticking point, you wanna know why the M31 is "slow" in that part of the East Side? It's because of those people that bitched about the M31 not stopping at their area when the x92 got cut/merged with the x90 years ago. As a result of that, they had to add a few more stops along York Avenue so they can appease those people. And NOW they will blame the MTA for the line being so slow. Well you know what, someone get them their baby bottles and tell them to grow up, because they literally brought this shit on themselves, NOT the MTA!

 

While I do admit that you guys lost a lot down there, folks in Yorkville and the Upper East Side have one subway line to depend on, which is already overcrowded and at capacity. I do agree that the X90 was too frequent. It should've been reduced, yes, but not axed.

 

Now I think the assumption is that because these guys live in a more affluent zip code that they don't use their transportation and don't need it, and that is certainly not the case. They do use it and while the express bus was in abundance, their local service is well used and quite frankly suffers from some of the same problems that other lines do across the city, such as bunching.

 

I used to work on the Upper West Side (I quit after a month because the commute from Staten Island up to 72nd & Broadway was a killer) and the (M72) is horrendous, so the loss of the (M30) was a big one to say the least as they already suffered from a lack of service. Often times I'd just walk rather than wait for a (M72).

 

 

Now I also go down to the Bowery and used to use the train so while I do understand the importance of it and the fact that the was lost too, you guys still have a pretty good amount of options, albeit not as convenient. I now take the when I go down to the Bowery/Lower East Side. I hope you're willing to admit that lines like the (M21) have decreased in ridership and should've been reduced since it wasn't being used. Everytiime I see that bus it is usually empty.

 

Now you also complain about the (M6) being axed, which I agree with, but that line also didn't carry all that much Downtown, nor did the (M1). Nevertheless, the (M20) and (M5) have been rerouted, and while I agree with you that they haven't been the best alternatives, they still have two bus lines down there just as they did before.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Realistically, no express route that parallels a subway line was created to relieve the subway line. The X90 got 620 riders. A single subway train can carry 1,500 riders, meaning that, throughout the course of the day, the X90 didn't even take a trainload of people off of the Lexington Avenue Line.

 

 

 

I was thinking to have it remain as an express bus. As a local bus, it would parallel the M15, and wouldn't really be a faster alternative. It wouldn't offer the cushioned seats and lower crowds that made people take the X90 in the first place.

 

 

 

That is why I suggested rerouting the X90 to serve Grand Central: It would provide more frequent service than the X25 and would therefore attract additional riders.

 

 

 

How frequent was the X90 before its elimination?

 

 

 

The X25 was useless as far as relieving the Lexington Avenue Line. It carried a measly 20 people throughout the whole day. That's 2-3 people per trip.

 

 

 

Crosstown service always has been a problem in Manhattan because of its slow speed. Still, Manhattan residents don't have a perfect commute, but their commute is a lot better than the commute of people in the outer boroughs.

 

But let's be realistic here. In an ideal world we'd have subway lines all over the place, but the reality is they take forever to build, and cost a ton. I mean you talk as if folks are just supposed to hope and hope for subway lines to be built because they carry more people. In the meantime, are those people not supposed to expect some sort of service because the subway carries more people??? Your point isn't a moot one but it is an obvious one.

[Cait Sith]

While I do admit that you guys lost a lot down there, folks in Yorkville and the Upper East Side have one subway line to depend on, which is already overcrowded and at capacity. I do agree that the X90 was too frequent. It should've been reduced, yes, but not axed.

 

Now I think the assumption is that because these guys live in a more affluent zip code that they don't use their transportation and don't need it, and that is certainly not the case. They do use it and while the express bus was in abundance, their local service is well used and quite frankly suffers from some of the same problems that other lines do across the city, such as bunching.

 

I used to work on the Upper West Side (I quit after a month because the commute from Staten Island up to 72nd & Broadway was a killer) and the (M72) is horrendous, so the loss of the (M30) was a big one to say the least as they already suffered from a lack of service. Often times I'd just walk rather than wait for a (M72).

 

 

Now I also go down to the Bowery and used to use the train so while I do understand the importance of it and the fact that the was lost too, you guys still have a pretty good amount of options, albeit not as convenient. I now take the when I go down to the Bowery/Lower East Side. I hope you're willing to admit that lines like the (M21) have decreased in ridership and should've been reduced since it wasn't being used. Everytiime I see that bus it is usually empty.

 

Now you also complain about the (M6) being axed, which I agree with, but that line also didn't carry all that much Downtown, nor did the (M1). Nevertheless, the (M20) and (M5) have been rerouted, and while I agree with you that they haven't been the best alternatives, they still have two bus lines down there just as they did before.

 

Already stated that the M21 lost its ridership. The whole point of the M21 rant was to explain how we lost our own direct access to Bellevue Hospital which was one hell of a needed route. We didn't see any other hospital route get screwed up as bad as the M21. That "assumption" came from one of my family members who works for the TA and went to the Manhattan Service Cut meeting up at the Upper East Side where those folk wanted "useless service" like the M14A to get axed just because of the people that used the line!

 

Broadway only has 1 bus line and Battery Park folk have no direct access to parts of Manhattan that they originally had. The M20 didn't solve that issue too well nor did the M15 SBS. While we did lose two subway lines, we ended up losing the Express in Manhattan which screws over the in Manhattan because of switching in 2 stations, Canal & 34th Street. Yorkville folk have almost the same amount of options than we do, hell, maybe even more, but they sure as hell can't complain that their commute sucks because other boroughs suffered more than they did....

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Already stated that the M21 lost its ridership. The whole point of the M21 rant was to explain how we lost our own direct access to Bellevue Hospital which was one hell of a needed route. We didn't see any other hospital route get screwed up as bad as the M21. That "assumption" came from one of my family members who works for the TA and went to the Manhattan Service Cut meeting up at the Upper East Side where those folk wanted "useless service" like the M14A to get axed just because of the people that used the line!

 

Broadway only has 1 bus line and Battery Park folk have no direct access to parts of Manhattan that they originally had. The M20 didn't solve that issue too well nor did the M15 SBS. While we did lose two subway lines, we ended up losing the Express in Manhattan which screws over the in Manhattan because of switching in 2 stations, Canal & 34th Street. Yorkville folk have almost the same amount of options than we do, hell, maybe even more, but they sure as hell can't complain that their commute sucks because other boroughs suffered more than they did....

 

I read what you wrote and while you stated that the (M21) lost ridership, you didn't say that it should be axed or even reduced and justified it by saying it serves the hospital. That was my point, but I won't say you shouldn't defend your services. It's only natural as I would too and yes service to the LES does suck now in some aspects. I go to my beer spot a lot less now by the Bowery because it takes forever for an train on Saturdays and instead opt for my wine spot which is better served by the Downtown and a slew of buses. So do you think that because a line serves a hospital but has low ridership that it should kept to run over a line like the (M30)?

 

I would probably compromise by reducing service on both, but I wouldn't axe either. I can imagine the (M72) being worse than it was before the (M30) was axed.

 

Also, one thing that you didn't mention is how when the is screwed up, it causes havoc for Upper East Side/Yorkville residents who have no other subway on the East Side and to use checkmate's train-bus analysis, we know that subways carry more folks than buses do. lol

 

P.S. Yes Broadway only has one line, but the problem is that it isn't heavily used on Broadway past a certain point going Downtown and I don't see how you can solve that problem because it is just faster to take the subway. The only way I take the bus is if I'm going down to NYU and have time to kill or something and I don't feel like dealing w/the crowd on the subway.

[Cait Sith]

I read what you wrote and while you stated that the (M21) lost ridership, you didn't say that it should be axed or even reduced and justified it by saying it serves the hospital. That was my point, but I won't say you shouldn't defend your services. It's only natural as I would too and yes service to the LES does suck now in some aspects. I go to my beer spot a lot less now by the Bowery because it takes forever for an train on Saturdays and instead opt for my wine spot which is better served by the Downtown and a slew of buses. So do you think that because a line serves a hospital but has low ridership that it should kept to run over a line like the (M30)?

 

I would probably compromise by reducing service on both, but I wouldn't axe either. I can imagine the (M72) being worse than it was before the (M30) was axed.

 

Also, one thing that you didn't mention is how when the is screwed up, it causes havoc for Upper East Side/Yorkville residents who have no other subway on the East Side and to use checkmate's train-bus analysis, we know that subways carry more folks than buses do. lol

 

P.S. Yes Broadway only has one line, but the problem is that it isn't heavily used on Broadway past a certain point going Downtown and I don't see how you can solve that problem because it is just faster to take the subway. The only way I take the bus is if I'm going down to NYU and have time to kill or something and I don't feel like dealing w/the crowd on the subway.

 

The M21 already got reduced after the service cuts, headways increased up to 12-15 minutes from its old 6-8 minute headways and does not run on weekends, how much more do you want to reduce it?

 

The M30 had much less ridership and trips over the M21 so towards your question, yes, if it were to save a route with much more of a need over a route that barely picks up people, then it should work. The M21 has no reason to be axed because its the only bus line running along Houston Street, whereas you had a route that started from Yorkville and ended at 57th Street and barely picked up a good amount of people to begin with. The M72 had loads of people, the M30 did not.

 

Yes, the Lexington Avenue lines are at capacity and screw up at times, but it most certainly gets to places faster than the bus with the exception of the M15 +SBS+, I've had much faster trips on the SBS over the , and trains. Lately Lexington Avenue service has been getting better, I've been seeing frequent & trains with trains being on-point.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

The M21 already got reduced after the service cuts, headways increased up to 12-15 minutes from its old 6-8 minute headways and does not run on weekends, how much more do you want to reduce it?

 

The M30 had much less ridership and trips over the M21 so towards your question, yes, if it were to save a route with much more of a need over a route that barely picks up people, then it should work. The M21 has no reason to be axed because its the only bus line running along Houston Street, whereas you had a route that started from Yorkville and ended at 57th Street and barely picked up a good amount of people to begin with. The M72 had loads of people, the M30 did not.

 

Yes, the Lexington Avenue lines are at capacity and screw up at times, but it most certainly gets to places faster than the bus with the exception of the M15 +SBS+, I've had much faster trips on the SBS over the , and trains. Lately Lexington Avenue service has been getting better, I've been seeing frequent & trains with trains being on-point.

 

 

lol... Good points my friend... I can't speak for the reliability of the (M21) since I usually just walk when I'm on Houston, but the (M72) is a joke and I say that because I believe that in some instances (without looking at the schedule) their frequencies are similar. I am usually hard pressed to get an (M72).

[Cait Sith]

lol... Good points my friend... I can't speak for the reliability of the (M21) since I usually just walk when I'm on Houston, but the (M72) is a joke and I say that because I believe that in some instances (without looking at the schedule) their frequencies are similar. I am usually hard pressed to get an (M72).

 

I wouldnt really say its a joke, it's mostly because the main traffic points of the M72 is on the West Side and in occasion, along the transverse. The M66 is much better than the M72. Those two Crosstown routes are much more better than the M57.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

I wouldnt really say its a joke, it's mostly because the main traffic points of the M72 is on the West Side and in occasion, along the transverse. The M66 is much better than the M72. Those two Crosstown routes are much more better than the M57.

 

The (M66) is really good and I was also surprised at how fast it fills up. I've used it from Broadway and 65th to go Crosstown and that stop there gets a ton of riders. The (M57) isn't bad either. It just seems that when I get off of the X10 there is always one just pulling out there at Madison and 57th.

[FamousNYLover]

X90 had more frequent service than X25 during peak rush hour.

X25 to Battery Park City only had 3 trips I think and PM return trip to Grand Central was about 4 trips.

 

X90 run very frequent.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

X90 had more frequent service than X25 during peak rush hour.

X25 to Battery Park City only had 3 trips I think and PM return trip to Grand Central was about 4 trips.

 

X90 run very frequent.

 

I never got around to using the X90 because it ran during hours that didn't work for me, plus it was out of the way for me a little, but I did use X25 and it wasn't always empty. I would get on by City Hall and there it would have a few folks already on it from the WTC I guess. It would pick up nicely by the time we got up around 42nd though, maybe about 15 - 20 people or so total on the bus and that wasn't during the real heat of rush hour.

 

However, I used to spot the X90s as we were coming onto the FDR and most of them were not packed, so there were too many of them in terms of frequency, but it should've been axed. 620 riders a day is still better than some of the other express bus lines. That line had more frequency than some express buses with higher ridership on Staten Island, which I have to admit did puzzle me, BUT I still support any effort to revive their service. Who knows when the SAS will be done...

[Q101viaSteinway]

Here is one way to revive X90

 

Operate Downtown Express Bus via BxM7 and BxM7A route in Bronx then operate across RFK bridge then operate via X90 route until 34th Street use FDR then operate X90 Lower Manhattan route

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Here is one way to revive X90

 

Operate Downtown Express Bus via BxM7 and BxM7A route in Bronx then operate across RFK bridge then operate via X90 route until 34th Street use FDR then operate X90 Lower Manhattan route

 

And why would you pick the BXM7/BXM7A for this???

[Q101viaSteinway]

And why would you pick the BXM7/BXM7A for this???

 

strong bus routes

[Gorgor]

The comparison for the to the X90 in terms of riders doesn't mean much. How about you take the amount of riders entering in the stations between 59th and 96th that are going to downtown Manhattan/Battery Park and not Brooklyn. Yes, it's still much greater than the amount of people who used the X90, but it's probably not that much.

 

Something else, the X90 looped around and went to Battery Park. The only buses that go there are the M5 and M20, which come from the West Side. Oh and of course the M22 which runs cross town on Chambers that you can get from the Brooklyn Bridge station, which can EASILY be out-walk at a normal walking pace. There is so much traffic on Chambers. And does the M15 SBS even connect to the M22? I'd be satisfied if they combined the M22 with either the 98/101/102/103 or simply extended one of them there.

 

As for the idea of diverting one of the Bronx Express bus routes to do the X90 route, I think that's a fantastic idea. Although it would add maybe 5-10 more minutes to the commute of the people coming from the Bronx, it would greatly benefit the MTA and result in more money. And if the people from the Bronx using that bus route don't like it, there's other express bus routes close by that they could take that go to the same place, right?

[Q101viaSteinway]

The comparison for the to the X90 in terms of riders doesn't mean much. How about you take the amount of riders entering in the stations between 59th and 96th that are going to downtown Manhattan/Battery Park and not Brooklyn. Yes, it's still much greater than the amount of people who used the X90, but it's probably not that much.

 

Something else, the X90 looped around and went to Battery Park. The only buses that go there are the M5 and M20, which come from the West Side. Oh and of course the M22 which runs cross town on Chambers that you can get from the Brooklyn Bridge station, which can EASILY be out-walk at a normal walking pace. There is so much traffic on Chambers. And does the M15 SBS even connect to the M22? I'd be satisfied if they combined the M22 with either the 98/101/102/103 or simply extended one of them there.

 

As for the idea of diverting one of the Bronx Express bus routes to do the X90 route, I think that's a fantastic idea. Although it would add maybe 5-10 more minutes to the commute of the people coming from the Bronx, it would greatly benefit the MTA and result in more money. And if the people from the Bronx using that bus route don't like it, there's other express bus routes close by that they could take that go to the same place, right?

 

Then lets seriously go about getting this done instead of sitting

[Via Garibaldi 8]

The comparison for the to the X90 in terms of riders doesn't mean much. How about you take the amount of riders entering in the stations between 59th and 96th that are going to downtown Manhattan/Battery Park and not Brooklyn. Yes, it's still much greater than the amount of people who used the X90, but it's probably not that much.

 

Something else, the X90 looped around and went to Battery Park. The only buses that go there are the M5 and M20, which come from the West Side. Oh and of course the M22 which runs cross town on Chambers that you can get from the Brooklyn Bridge station, which can EASILY be out-walk at a normal walking pace. There is so much traffic on Chambers. And does the M15 SBS even connect to the M22? I'd be satisfied if they combined the M22 with either the 98/101/102/103 or simply extended one of them there.

 

As for the idea of diverting one of the Bronx Express bus routes to do the X90 route, I think that's a fantastic idea. Although it would add maybe 5-10 more minutes to the commute of the people coming from the Bronx, it would greatly benefit the MTA and result in more money. And if the people from the Bronx using that bus route don't like it, there's other express bus routes close by that they could take that go to the same place, right?

 

BXM7/BXM7A serve specific areas Co-op City and Pelham Bay/City Island respectively. You would have to re-route those two express buses to have them come down York Avenue instead of having them run down Fifth & Madison Avenue, which they currently run on for most of their route in Manhattan, which would displace a lot of Bronx folks. I'm not too wild about that idea. Just bring back the X90 and run it every 20 minutes. That should suffice.