Burrstone Posted February 18, 2013 Share #951 Posted February 18, 2013 (edited) [TOO LATE TO EDIT] These are all 2008-2013 donations Veolia made in NY State that were publicly disclosed (this doesn't count anonymous regional/party SuperPAC donations). http://www.elections.ny.gov:8080/plsql_browser/CONTRIBUTORB_NAME?LAST_NAME_IN=&NAME_IN=Veolia&position_IN=ANYWHERE&date_from=01%2F01%2F2008&date_to=02%2F15%2F2013&AMOUNT_from=1&AMOUNT_to=1000000&ORDERBY_IN=N What we're looking for is Veolia Transportation, which started donating in 2012 after they got the contract. A nice thank you from them to Mangano; and then they got more state funding in return in 2013 (which will make their bottom line look nice when their service additions just end up scheduled buses actually showing up). Thanks for the link, very informative! Edited February 18, 2013 by Burrstone 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Culver Posted February 18, 2013 Share #952 Posted February 18, 2013 (edited) Very interesting. I agree it's about the money, hey that's what politics is right? Washington is full of lobbyists funding thier M O... I'd be interested to see what other campaigns Veolia (and the other big transportation companies) fund? Is it only republic because that's their party of choice or "thier man" who will get them into office. Will there be any public question sessions for Suozzi? I'd love to hear his stance on Veolia and who'd he'd like to see run the transit system in 2017! Culver, would you agree with me in that Veolia provides more service per dollar than the MTA did? Depends on what Veolia takes home at the end of the day. As far as I can tell based on posts here, Buschat, and news on the matter, Veolia found some efficiencies (running deadheads as in-service to collect fares and use the fuel productively), but also "saves" money by not bothering with maintenance and buses actually showing up (the n22 and n24 are a joke and a half). I'm not opposed to the concept of private operators (Westchester and Liberty seems to be a great partnership). In Westchester, a local company operates the fleet and does so efficiently and with a high level of service and commitment to the service. Veolia is a big company, and to them this is just another "make sure we make a dime, nothing else matters" operation. They have zero investment in the operation other than $9,790 in campaign donations.Veolia/Nassau is a crappy partnership in that it's purely a political favor back-and-forth. Veolia provides service at levels decent enough to where there are no pitchforks, and in exchange gets to pocket any savings from their budget. They then pass off a tiny percentage of that to politicians' campaigns to make sure they keep that contract. The politicians then reward them by getting them more state funding, which then will inevitably get split between Veolia's profits and campaign donations to those same politicians. In the end, Veolia and the politicians win, and the people using the buses, well nobody seems to have actually thought about them in this whole process. Long term, time will tell if NICE is better or worse than LIB. EDIT: Would've been nice to see Liberty Lines run Nassau's buses (and Suffolk). That's a private operation everybody would support. Edited February 18, 2013 by Culver 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qjtransitmaster Posted February 18, 2013 Share #953 Posted February 18, 2013 (edited) You're right since it makes zero sense at a time when NICE says they will be adding service. But I do think an n35 extension to serve the Brush Hollow/Jericho shopping area would help increase numbers north of NCC. Dude are you serious ridership would skyrocket. Cmon man. Heck if you made N51 do it people will start using it strangely enough. Edited February 18, 2013 by qjtransitmaster 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vistausss Posted February 18, 2013 Share #954 Posted February 18, 2013 (edited) @Culver: Please, don't be so general. This is a NICE issue because Veolia Europe does put the customer at the first place. So don't go talk about Veolia in general when it's really only a subdivison of 'em screwing some politics up. Btw, Transdev hasn't made as much profit last year as they did the years before. And they're not gonna make profit this year either with their recent takeover of Connexxion lol. So NICE is gonna feel some pain too when it comes to money unless NICE is gonna make profit this year. Edited February 18, 2013 by Vistausss 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blitz Posted February 18, 2013 Share #955 Posted February 18, 2013 1808 finally gone from Grand Ave CMF. Don't know where it went though... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joel Up Front Posted February 18, 2013 Share #956 Posted February 18, 2013 @Culver: Please, don't be so general. This is a NICE issue because Veolia Europe does put the customer at the first place. So don't go talk about Veolia in general when it's really only a subdivison of 'em screwing some politics up. Btw, Transdev hasn't made as much profit last year as they did the years before. And they're not gonna make profit this year either with their recent takeover of Connexxion lol. So NICE is gonna feel some pain too when it comes to money unless NICE is gonna make profit this year. Veolia Europe =/= Veolia USA 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burrstone Posted February 18, 2013 Share #957 Posted February 18, 2013 1808 finally gone from Grand Ave CMF. Don't know where it went though... Fanners Attack! I want a foamer on every corner near Mitchel Field and Rockville Centre, we will have photo confirmation if 1808 enters Nassau County! Veolia Europe =/= Veolia USA European transit funding =/= Transit funding in Nassau County 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Culver Posted February 18, 2013 Share #958 Posted February 18, 2013 @Culver: Please, don't be so general. This is a NICE issue because Veolia Europe does put the customer at the first place. So don't go talk about Veolia in general when it's really only a subdivison of 'em screwing some politics up. Btw, Transdev hasn't made as much profit last year as they did the years before. And they're not gonna make profit this year either with their recent takeover of Connexxion lol. So NICE is gonna feel some pain too when it comes to money unless NICE is gonna make profit this year. I'm not. I'm sorry if I generalized Veolia as a whole. My post reflects the corporate culture here in America. I'm sure the base company on Europe is committed to providing good service. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joel Up Front Posted February 18, 2013 Share #959 Posted February 18, 2013 I've noticed this a lot since April - on the NGs, the rear doors are supposed to close slowly, but a lot of them lately force the doors shut - they've almost slammed on me and hundreds of others of riders. What the hell is this supposed to be? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vistausss Posted February 18, 2013 Share #960 Posted February 18, 2013 (edited) Veolia Europe =/= Veolia USA With the money issue I'm not talking about Veolia Europe, I'm talking about TRANSDEV. Which is also the owner of NICE. Edited February 18, 2013 by Vistausss 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burrstone Posted February 18, 2013 Share #961 Posted February 18, 2013 Actually the way it is worded NICE is the County's bus system (not owned by Veolia) that is operated by Veolia. "Powered by Veolia" I've noticed this a lot since April - on the NGs, the rear doors are supposed to close slowly, but a lot of them lately force the doors shut - they've almost slammed on me and hundreds of others of riders. What the hell is this supposed to be? When machines attack! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vistausss Posted February 18, 2013 Share #962 Posted February 18, 2013 (edited) True, but either way, Transdev *is* pumping money into NICE and that money is gonna get less now that Transdev has made a small profit last year and because of buying a dying bus operator (Connexxion). Edited February 18, 2013 by Vistausss 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
checkmatechamp13 Posted February 18, 2013 Share #963 Posted February 18, 2013 Dude are you serious ridership would skyrocket. Cmon man. Heck if you made N51 do it people will start using it strangely enough. The thing that (according to him) wouldn't make sense is cutting the N35 back to Hempstead, not sending it down Brush Hollow or whatever. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qjtransitmaster Posted February 18, 2013 Share #964 Posted February 18, 2013 The thing that (according to him) wouldn't make sense is cutting the N35 back to Hempstead, not sending it down Brush Hollow or whatever.I know I agreed with his extension idea. N35 has some useless short turns that are no more than N37s reborn. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burrstone Posted February 19, 2013 Share #965 Posted February 19, 2013 True, but either way, Transdev *is* pumping money into NICE and that money is gonna get less now that Transdev has made a small profit last year and because of buying a dying bus operator (Connexxion). NICE's budget comes from Nassau County, New York State, and the federal government. These entities "give" money to Veolia to run the transit system, in return Veolia is paid a fee for doing a service. Veolia is not like acompany like, let's say Macy's, who would be like "we had a bad year, we need to make cuts." Veolia doesn't put any of their own money into NICE bus (sure maybe they front money for things to be paid back and probably had to spend a good amount of money to be in Nassau County and send people in from all over the country, but that's the proce of doing business). Veolia is "given" money to run the system and paid fir doiing this service. Veolia could not reduce service for NICE to reduce costs becuase the parent company lost money, that would violate the contract. Also if any Nassau, the State, or federal government gave Veolia money meant for the transit system and they decided to reduce the service and pocket the money instead I'm pretty sure whoever made that decision could be brought up on fraud charges. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Culver Posted February 19, 2013 Share #966 Posted February 19, 2013 Veolia could not reduce service for NICE to reduce costs becuase the parent company lost money, that would violate the contract. Also if any Nassau, the State, or federal government gave Veolia money meant for the transit system and they decided to reduce the service and pocket the money instead I'm pretty sure whoever made that decision could be brought up on fraud charges. With all due respect, that's incredibly naive. That would never happen. Maybe 50 years ago it would, but not in 2013, when they have all the politicians in their pocket legally via campaign donations. They'll use every loophole in the contract to pocket as much of the increase in state funding as possible. Mind you, Mangano won't care if they pocket it. That's part of the deal: they donate to him and other NY state politicians in his party, and they get to keep the contract and siphon as much money from the state as they can. He just needs them to keep service decent enough on their budget to where there are no mobs with pitchforks outside his house. Anything else, he couldn't care less about. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burrstone Posted February 19, 2013 Share #967 Posted February 19, 2013 With all due respect, that's incredibly naive. That would never happen. Maybe 50 years ago it would, but not in 2013, when they have all the politicians in their pocket legally via campaign donations. They'll use every loophole in the contract to pocket as much of the increase in state funding as possible. Mind you, Mangano won't care if they pocket it. That's part of the deal: they donate to him and other NY state politicians in his party, and they get to keep the contract and siphon as much money from the state as they can. He just needs them to keep service decent enough on their budget to where there are no mobs with pitchforks outside his house. Anything else, he couldn't care less about. Incredibly naive? I said if funds from the government meant for transit service ended up in their pocket becuase they didn't have as big of a profit they expected at the end of the year. You are talking about legal loop holes, the key word their is legal, obvious I was talking about pocketing funds not through legal loopholes. ie pocketing money from the government meant for transit service becauae they wanted to bad their bank account because thier profits weren't as big as they hoped ie NOT legal loopholes. What I described is stealing... Mind you, Mangano won't care if they pocket it. That's part of the deal: they donate to him and other NY state politicians in his party, and they get to keep the contract and siphon as much money from the state as they can. He just needs them to keep service decent enough on their budget to where there are no mobs with pitchforks outside his house. Anything else, he couldn't care less about. Ok, you make a point that maybe Mangano might look the the other way BUT Gov. Cuomo, Attorney General Schneiderman, and Nassau County DA Rice are Democrats, why would they look the other way? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Culver Posted February 19, 2013 Share #968 Posted February 19, 2013 Incredibly naive? I said if funds from the government meant for transit service ended up in their pocket becuase they didn't have as big of a profit they expected at the end of the year. You are talking about legal loop holes, the key word their is legal, obvious I was talking about pocketing funds not through legal loopholes. ie pocketing money from the government meant for transit service becauae they wanted to bad their bank account because thier profits weren't as big as they hoped ie NOT legal loopholes. What I described is stealing... Ok, you make a point that maybe Mangano might look the the other way BUT Gov. Cuomo, Attorney General Schneiderman, and Nassau County DA Rice are Democrats, why would they look the other way? Because all it would take to shut them up is a small political donation. We're talking state politicians here, it doesn't take $50,000 on the state level. Veolia is a private carrier and expects to turn a profit on their operations. An increase in state funding doesn't mean it will directly go towards tangible service improvements, whatever their PR says. I never said they would siphon money illegally. There will always be loopholes, whether in the law or the contract (those would be there intentionally) to allow them to make an extra buck. They didn't get the extra state funding (while the MTA had $20 million taken from them) for their good service and kind bus drivers. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Culver Posted February 19, 2013 Share #969 Posted February 19, 2013 Because all it would take to shut them up is a small political donation. We're talking state politicians here, it doesn't take $50,000 on the state level. Veolia is a private carrier and expects to turn a profit on their operations. An increase in state funding doesn't mean it will directly go towards tangible service improvements, whatever their PR says. I never said they would siphon money illegally. There will always be loopholes, whether in the law or the contract (those would be there intentionally) to allow them to make an extra buck. They didn't get the extra state funding (while the MTA had $20 million taken from them) for their good service and kind bus drivers. Again too late to edit... RE: Cuomo He probably literally could not care any less about transit than he already does. He's the last person to give two flips about a bus service somewhere. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joel Up Front Posted February 19, 2013 Share #970 Posted February 19, 2013 Rice is the LAST person I'd expect to care about transit out here. Probably got a brand-new car when she was in high school to boot. All of the town heads, especially Murray, were noticeably quiet about this issue. I can't remember his name (and I absolutely hate politicians) but someone from Valley Stream claimed he would "try" to fight the takeover. Maybe he just wanted something to come out of his mouth that wasn't absolute garbage. Like Mango was following Sandy. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burrstone Posted February 19, 2013 Share #971 Posted February 19, 2013 Rice is the LAST person I'd expect to care about transit out here. Probably got a brand-new car when she was in high school to boot. Again too late to edit... RE: Cuomo He probably literally could not care any less about transit than he already does. He's the last person to give two flips about a bus service somewhere. Guys we're not talking about transit, they would care about the issue of a multinational corperation stealing federal funds. Why would they care, and not look the other way for drop in the bucket of their campaign? Because being the one to bring this down is a huge notch in their career and a great bragging point at election time. Especially so if you can make it look like your opponent looked the way or was in bed with them? Because all it would take to shut them up is a small political donation. We're talking state politicians here, it doesn't take $50,000 on the state level. Veolia is a private carrier and expects to turn a profit on their operations. An increase in state funding doesn't mean it will directly go towards tangible service improvements, whatever their PR says. I never said they would siphon money illegally. There will always be loopholes, whether in the law or the contract (those would be there intentionally) to allow them to make an extra buck. Right, people who can pay off politicians don't go to prison, you better call up Bernie Madoof's attorney and tell him that one. An increase in state funding doesn't mean it will directly go towards tangible service improvements, You are talking about legal loop holes, the key word their is legal, obvious I was talking about pocketing funds not through legal loopholes. ie pocketing money from the government meant for transit service becauae they wanted to bad their bank account because thier profits weren't as big as they hoped ie NOT legal loopholes. What I described is stealing... I never said that, I think I was very clear in my last post! They didn't get the extra state funding (while the MTA had $20 million taken from them) for their good service and kind bus drivers. Bwhahahahahaahahahah! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Culver Posted February 19, 2013 Share #972 Posted February 19, 2013 Guys we're not talking about transit, they would care about the issue of a multinational corperation stealing federal funds. Why would they care, and not look the other way for drop in the bucket of their campaign? Because being the one to bring this down is a huge notch in their career and a great bragging point at election time. Especially so if you can make it look like your opponent looked the way or was in bed with them? Right, people who can pay off politicians don't go to prison, you better call up Bernie Madoof's attorney and tell him that one. I never said that, I think I was very clear in my last post! Bwhahahahahaahahahah! I should've specified: not the illegal money-under-the-table bribes, I'm referring to the legalized form of bribery known as political donations. And again, money allocated for transit is money Cuomo cares not for. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
User Posted February 19, 2013 Author Share #973 Posted February 19, 2013 I've noticed this a lot since April - on the NGs, the rear doors are supposed to close slowly, but a lot of them lately force the doors shut - they've almost slammed on me and hundreds of others of riders. What the hell is this supposed to be? LOL, it may not be intentional. The air power on the rear doors may be giving out. Something else to fix... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burrstone Posted February 19, 2013 Share #974 Posted February 19, 2013 I should've specified: not the illegal money-under-the-table bribes, I'm referring to the legalized form of bribery known as political donations. And again, money allocated for transit is money Cuomo cares not for. I have been clear from the begining that I was talking about illegal practices! Why are you jumping in to argue about legal tacticts? I don't get it... I post illegal illegal illegal.... and you want to counter it with legal legal legal... You say you should've specified you were talking about legalized whatever, but why? It has nothing to do with I said in the first place. Should I throw things into this that has nothing to do with what you said? Why the hell would a politician turn their head and ignore something legal? Why would they need a bribe to turn their head to something legal? I'm referring to the legalized form of bribery known as political donations. Oh well, this is politics, it happens everywhere in every election. I'm sure the ATU 1181 is funding the person they want to replace Bloomberg. And again, money allocated for transit is money Cuomo cares not for. And again Cuomo is a politician, if the situation I talked about ever happened you bet your ass Cuomo would care because him bringing those involved with stealing from the State would make him look good. Cuomo and that schmuck schumer would be all over TV bragging about the good they did! I swear to god I always see Schumer on TV taking credit for something someone else did, getting his "look at me and look at what I did" time. But that's a topic for another day. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vistausss Posted February 19, 2013 Share #975 Posted February 19, 2013 @Burrstone: Thanks for clearing it up to me. It's a little different in the USA with private operators than here, I guess. But I understand now (which is important for me) so thanks for explaining 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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