SCT Proposals 2012-2013 Thread

[B35 via Church]

S60 usage between Stony Brook and the mall is very heavy. Its lighter (but not empty) toward Port Jefferson. S62 usage is heaviest between Smith Haven and Rocky Point. The 5A carries air. The 5A and S76 being combined may not be a bad idea, but it needs to go to the mall to help out the 60. It can loop in Stony Brook village like it normally does but then send it down Stony Brook Rd. SUNY students could use it from 25a which runs right by the college (which is on the other side of the tracks). This would get more people on the 5A/S76 (renamed to just S76) since it goes to the mall and Stony Brook. Scheduling should connect with the S62 so ppl can get between SUNY Stony Brook and Riverhead more easily. Definately better than my S62 Stony Brook idea...

 

You're exaggerating with the S60 b/w the college & the mall... Towards smith haven, 60's are jammed well before they hit the college, dude.... I've never heard of a situation where SUNY kids are getting flagged at the college (which is pretty much what you're implicating by saying the 60 is "very heavy" b/w the 2 points)....

 

The problem is, not enough of those kids take the 3D b/w the college & the mall.....

 

As far as what you said about the 62 & 5a, you're spot on....

 

 

 

I know my original idea was crazy.

 

Yes the S71 is probably the least on time of all ST routes after the S92. Many diversions. I often hear them running 45 minutes late. But the main thing is the 60 needs help and the 76 doesn't really do much to help since it only runs between SB Village and Port Jeff.

 

Well at least you admit it.

 

I can agree that in order for a 5a/76 combination to work out for the better, it would have to serve smith haven..... But I'm not sure I like the idea for a route that runs from ridge to smith haven via the current 5a & 76 exactly as those 2 routes are.... Of the combined route routing-wise, some kinks would have to be worked out (esp. on the 5a end of the what would-be route)....

Edited October 9, 2012 by B35 via Church

[qjtransitmaster]

 

 

- You just answered your own question, regarding the 3D.... no one's really tryna get to stony brook RR from smith haven like that... whereas many people live along the 60 as you're heading towards pt. jefferson & points south... past smith haven & 347, the 3d runs up nicolls rd (which is basically a hwy; CR 97)... it goes on to serve the hospital & parts of the college before ending at the rr station.... That, and nicolls rd is farther away from smith haven than stony brook rd is..... You'd think usage would be interchangable up there b/w the 60 & 3d b/w the hospital & smith haven, but it really isn't....

 

- Ok, so you remembered what I said about bus service @ suffolk county cc....

 

 

 

 

It should encourage ppl. taking the rail to the bus, but it won't....

 

Having all the patchogue routes end by the RR station won't boost ridership on the buses.....

You can rant & post in caps as much as you'd like.....

 

 

 

 

Yeah, exactly.... Forget about having all those buses enter patchogue RR... it isn't like, say, babylon RR where the space exists to have all those buses enter the RR parking lot.... lol, Most ppl. don't park on the more western side of the lot @ patchogue.....

 

The 63 stops where the 7a/b does (in front the shelter).... the 54 & the 61 picks-up a few feet in front of it....

 

True at current frequencies that do not encourage use. But 61 & 54 are good as is stopping wise.

[qjtransitmaster]

interesting looks like S60 has issues where does its overcrowding begin?

 

 

I may be on to something.

[BM5 via Woodhaven]

I know it's been stressed enough, but the S76 and 5A should be combined. Along with this proposal the Mount Sinai S62 diversion should be eliminated. These trips will instead operate along the regular S62 route along route 25A. The Port Jefferson-Middle Island Portion of this combined route will have hourly service and will have service up to half hour later. This route will be named the S76. In addition, the S76 should rescheduled to operate 30 minutes behind an S60 on the S60/S76 corridor.

Edited November 1, 2012 by Q23 Central Terminal

[qjtransitmaster]

I know it's been stressed enough, but the S76 and 5A should be combined. Along with this proposal the Mount Sinai S62 diversion should be eliminated. These trips will instead operate along the regular S62 route along route 25A. The Port Jefferson-Middle Island Portion of this combined route will have hourly service and will have service up to half hour later. This route will be named the S76. In addition, the S76 should rescheduled to operate 30 minutes behind an S60 on the S60/S76 corridor.

 

Beat ya to it months ago.

[mac5689]

In addition, the S76 should rescheduled to operate 30 minutes behind an S60 on the S60/S76 corridor.

 

Hey stupid, the S76 does run 30 minutes after a S60, that was the WHOLE point that the route was created, besides to bring service BACK to Stony Brook Villiage, was to have service every 30 min's on the stretch that the S60 and S76 share. Some people need to look at a schudule before they comment of stuff they obviosuly don't know anything about.

[BM5 via Woodhaven]

Hey stupid, the S76 does run 30 minutes after a S60, that was the WHOLE point that the route was created, besides to bring service BACK to Stony Brook Villiage, was to have service every 30 min's on the stretch that the S60 and S76 share. Some people need to look at a schudule before they comment of stuff they obviosuly don't know anything about.

 

Towards Port Jefferson

The 60 pases At let's say 0:00. The 76 passes at 0:38. Then another 60 passes at 0:00

 

Thus there is a 38 minute gap during the first half of the hour and a 22 minute gap during the second half of the hour. COMBINED its thirty minutes, but IT'S NOT EVENLY SPACED OUT. That's the whole point of my proposal. It literally says on the schedule in the Port Jefferson direction that there's a 38 than 22 minute gap. How is that every 30 minutes (not combined). The other direction is fine.

Edited November 7, 2012 by Q23 Central Terminal

[BM5 via Woodhaven]

Here's a combined S76 and 5A schedule.

 

http://scaped.net/bus/S76

Some Things

Hourly Headways on the Port Jefferson- Middle Island section, instead of 90 minute headways

More evening service to Stony Brook Village and more evening service to/from Middle Island

Edited November 8, 2012 by Q23 Central Terminal

[mac5689]

Towards Port Jefferson

The 60 pases At let's say 0:00. The 76 passes at 0:38. Then another 60 passes at 0:00

 

Thus there is a 38 minute gap during the first half of the hour and a 22 minute gap during the second half of the hour. COMBINED its thirty minutes, but IT'S NOT EVENLY SPACED OUT. That's the whole point of my proposal. It literally says on the schedule in the Port Jefferson direction that there's a 38 than 22 minute gap. How is that every 30 minutes (not combined). The other direction is fine.

 

 

Its 30 min's between a bus each way, I've ridden the route and have studied the schudules, I have no idea where you get 38 minutes from - Unless you are talking about when the S60 have a reak and the time tables for both routes get changed - Unless there was a schudule change I'm not aware of the S76 has had the same schudule since it was started in 2005, the S60 has had the same schudlue for nearly 20 years, and the S76 schudlue claerly states that the S76 runs in both directions 30 minutes after a S60. It is highly annoying that you are trying to prove me wrong on stuff that I know better then you do. It may be hard for you to admit that you are wrong, but I assure you that you are. If you have any other comments on this matter please feel free to PM me.

 

Also a S76 and 5A merger makes no sence, not only because it would have to loop around Port Jefferson Station to get to the shopping plaza, but because both routes are listed on the chopping block should the system need to cut routes. (I got that from a reliable person, so I can tell you that that is 100% correct)

[checkmatechamp13]

I see what he's saying.

 

If you look at the westbound schedule (towards Stony Brook), everything's fine. The S60s leave the shopping plaza on the :00s, and the S76s leave on the :30s.

 

However, on the eastbound schedule (towards Port Jefferson/Gordon Heights), the S60s leave Setauket on the :00s, and the S76s leave Setauket on the :38s. So you have the S60, then a 38 minute gap for the S76, then a 22 minute gap for the S60.

Edited November 8, 2012 by checkmatechamp13

[mac5689]

I see what he's saying.

 

If you look at the westbound schedule (towards Stony Brook), everything's fine. The S60s leave the shopping plaza on the :00s, and the S76s leave on the :30s.

 

However, on the eastbound schedule (towards Port Jefferson/Gordon Heights), the S60s leave Setauket on the :00s, and the S76s leave Setauket on the :38s. So you have the S60, then a 38 minute gap for the S76, then a 22 minute gap for the S60.

 

 

Everyone is aware though that the S76 is basically a loop though Stony Brook, it doesn't actually doesn't stop like it does in Port Jefferson, so the :38 minutes doesn't actually mean anything.

[Turbo19]

Everyone is aware though that the S76 is basically a loop though Stony Brook, it doesn't actually doesn't stop like it does in Port Jefferson, so the :38 minutes doesn't actually mean anything.

 

Though the frequency could be better, the gap is fair, at least in my opinion.

Edited November 14, 2012 by Turbo19

[mac5689]

Though the frequency could be better, the gap is fair, at least in my opinion.

 

 

Probably, and I stress Probably, could. But knowing that area as well as I do, that is the best that could be done.

[BM5 via Woodhaven]

Also here's another thing I noticed.

In Mastic the S66 and the 7E along the same streets except for the 7E to Fire Island Routing

Is there something to do about that?

[mac5689]

Also here's another thing I noticed.

In Mastic the S66 and the 7E along the same streets except for the 7E to Fire Island Routing

Is there something to do about that?

 

 

The 7E and S66 only share the same routing on Mastic Road, in Mastic Beach and part of William Floyd Parkway. There is a bunch of the 7E route that doesn't overlap with the S66. Some of the 7E route got flooded out by Hurricane Sandy.

 

The 7D/E has horrible timing, and even if they were combined the timing isn't any better. So unless there is a major resturcturing of the 7D/E, which I don't see happening, there really isn't anything that can be done.

[checkmatechamp13]

A couple more ideas.

 

S42 extended to Ronkonkoma via Route 454, 13th Avenue, Peconic Street, Ocean Avenue, & Johnson Avenue.

 

S57 routed away from Colony Park Apartments (now served by S42) to streamline it, and make it the quick route between Ronkonkoma & Sayville.

 

If the S57 becomes the faster route on the southern end, it might be better to make it the quicker route on the northern end as well, so you have one really quick route between Smith Haven & Sayville. So you could swap the S57 & S59 north of Ronkonkoma.

 

The 3C has always irked me with the way it has to go up to Hauppauge and then go back to serve the courthouses (especially when one of the branches runs down Carleton anyway), so a seperate route should be created to serve Carleton Avenue. You could have the 3C between Hauppauge & South Shore Mall via Connequot Avenue, and the 3E between Hauppauge & South Shore Mall via Carleton Avenue.

 

And another idea up for consideration: Maybe the S45 could be rerouted to Ronkonkoma via Johnson Avenue, and either the 3C or 3E could cover the portion north of Hauppauge.

 

I think the S42 could be routed away from the South Shore Mall. Islip Avenue riders basically have the same connections available at Bay Shore, and if they want to go to the mall itself, the 3B & 3E would run on both sides (aside from that, there are a bunch of routes between Bay Shore & the South Shore Mall).

[PinePower]

I still think they need to come up with a Ronkonkoma LIRR - Riverhead service that would run down the LIE with a stop at Rt.112 (connect with the S61). The new Bolt Bus service that was started was a dissapointment, couldn't even buy tickets between Ronkonkoma and Riverhead. Route 58 is becoming a major tourist destination between Tanger and all the stores there, and with plans for another new shopping center with Costco and a Super-Walmart underway. The 110 Clipper carries air more or less, I'd can it and use the buses for the new Ronkonkoma-Riverhead service. Route would be Ronkonkoma LIRR-495-stop at Rt.112 and service road for 61 transfer-back on 495 to exit 73 and it would make all stops along Rt.58 and run to County Center via S58 route. I cant fathom why they havent done it yet, HJ and Bolt Bus are NYC-LI expresses, LIRR service to Riverhead is practically useless, someone at Suffolk Cty may be getting their pockets lined. If I had my own bus I'd run the service myself.

[B35 via Church]

A couple more ideas.

 

S42 extended to Ronkonkoma via Route 454, 13th Avenue, Peconic Street, Ocean Avenue, & Johnson Avenue.

 

S57 routed away from Colony Park Apartments (now served by S42) to streamline it, and make it the quick route between Ronkonkoma & Sayville.

 

If the S57 becomes the faster route on the southern end, it might be better to make it the quicker route on the northern end as well, so you have one really quick route between Smith Haven & Sayville. So you could swap the S57 & S59 north of Ronkonkoma.

 

The 3C has always irked me with the way it has to go up to Hauppauge and then go back to serve the courthouses (especially when one of the branches runs down Carleton anyway), so a seperate route should be created to serve Carleton Avenue. You could have the 3C between Hauppauge & South Shore Mall via Connequot Avenue, and the 3E between Hauppauge & South Shore Mall via Carleton Avenue.

 

And another idea up for consideration: Maybe the S45 could be rerouted to Ronkonkoma via Johnson Avenue, and either the 3C or 3E could cover the portion north of Hauppauge.

 

I think the S42 could be routed away from the South Shore Mall. Islip Avenue riders basically have the same connections available at Bay Shore, and if they want to go to the mall itself, the 3B & 3E would run on both sides (aside from that, there are a bunch of routes between Bay Shore & the South Shore Mall).

 

Like we discussed earlier, I also believe that there should be a route running to LIRR Ronkonkoma from the west....

Currently there's the 6a, 7a, and the 57/59.... of course the 57 runs due west along vets mem. hwy to get to the colony park apts, but from there, it turns around to head on down to sayville (which is south of ronkonkoma).... I also think that the 42 should be the route to do it, seeming that terminating at LIRR central islip (even if they have that nice little niche for the buses to pick up/drop off pax at) is rather arbitrary.... However, I don't think the 42 should be routed away from SS mall b/c you do have ppl. that board at LIRR Babylon that take it to SS mall.... East of Babylon, LIRR service isn't as frequent, so it isn't as easy as telling those folks to take the train to Bayshore for the 2a/b or the 45......

 

The 45 I'd likely take take off suffolk av completely.... instead, @ LIRR Brentwood, I'd have it continue up washington av to Motor pkwy along w/ the 27, except that buses wouldn't go up there like you're heading towards the hauppauge industrial park..... anyway, at motor pkwy, I'd continue the 45 due east to willets path, where it would serve the county offices (serving the north complex, the dennison bldg, and the NYS office bldg - in that order).... However, instead of running down to rabro drive and back up 111 to LIRR smithtown, I'd have the 45 (after serving the NYS bldg) run along 347 to 111, and continue along 111 en route to LIRR smithtown....

 

What I'd do with the "3E" is, have that continue to run along 27a to LIRR great river, then up connetquot, then make that turn the SB 3c's do to get back to carleton (I don't know the name of that street offhand), but instead, turn up carleton to serve touro law center, NYIT, etc..... when it hits suffolk av, have it serve LIRR central islip, then swing back over to wheeler rd & across motor pkwy to serve that complex over there on oval dr.... then from that complex, have it swing back on motor pkwy to then turn up wheeler rd, to end at NYS 111/rabro dr (not serving the county offices)....

 

The 3C I would, all you would then have to do is have that go from SS mall, to LIRR bay shore, then along 27a to carleton (no LIRR great river) to run up to the touro law ctr & the court complex..... from there, swing back down carleton to then turn along (the same street I'm talking about above, in red) to get to connetquot, then current 3c serving those residential areas along/around connetquot - current route until you get to lowell.... then turn up lowell to go on to serve LIRR central islip.... turn onto suffolk av to get to hawthorne, then hawthorne to get to the complex over on oval dr.... from there it would parallel the 3e (see part in above, in blue) - but instead of ending at rabro dr/111, it would run up wheeler, en route to serving all the county offices (NYS office bldg, dennison bldg, north complex - in that order).... This route would end at the north complex.....

 

Swapping the 57 (which would be routed away from the colony park apts) & the 59 north of LIRR Ronkonkoma... I get what you're saying, but I think that's SCT's attempt at sharing the pain (lol, don't know how else to put it); having the 57 being the longer route to LIRR Ronkonkoma & having the 59 being the longer route to LIRR Sayville.... Even if you were to remove the 57 from serving those apts (with a replaced 42 serving it to/from LIRR ronkonkoma), I still think the 57 & 59 north of LIRR Ronkonkoma should be left alone.... What you're suggesting outside of that would still be a plus for the 57.....

 

I know you don't really know suffolk county, so I'm gonna have to draw a map.... I get that reading all that could be confusing as well....

Overall, good job w/ these ideas.

[B35 via Church]

I still think they need to come up with a Ronkonkoma LIRR - Riverhead service that would run down the LIE with a stop at Rt.112 (connect with the S61). The new Bolt Bus service that was started was a dissapointment, couldn't even buy tickets between Ronkonkoma and Riverhead. Route 58 is becoming a major tourist destination between Tanger and all the stores there, and with plans for another new shopping center with Costco and a Super-Walmart underway. The 110 Clipper carries air more or less, I'd can it and use the buses for the new Ronkonkoma-Riverhead service. Route would be Ronkonkoma LIRR-495-stop at Rt.112 and service road for 61 transfer-back on 495 to exit 73 and it would make all stops along Rt.58 and run to County Center via S58 route. I cant fathom why they havent done it yet, HJ and Bolt Bus are NYC-LI expresses, LIRR service to Riverhead is practically useless, someone at Suffolk Cty may be getting their pockets lined. If I had my own bus I'd run the service myself.

 

(I'm) not exactly sure what routing it could take, but yeah, I can agree with this....

Riders shouldn't have to ride out to Smith Haven from Riverhead Tanger, etc. to catch another bus to get to LIRR Ronkonkoma (or LIRR Central Islip if they're taking a 3D).... I've had to do that more times than I can count on all my appendages.....

[mac5689]

A couple more ideas.

 

S42 extended to Ronkonkoma via Route 454, 13th Avenue, Peconic Street, Ocean Avenue, & Johnson Avenue.

 

S57 routed away from Colony Park Apartments (now served by S42) to streamline it, and make it the quick route between Ronkonkoma & Sayville.

 

If the S57 becomes the faster route on the southern end, it might be better to make it the quicker route on the northern end as well, so you have one really quick route between Smith Haven & Sayville. So you could swap the S57 & S59 north of Ronkonkoma.

 

The 3C has always irked me with the way it has to go up to Hauppauge and then go back to serve the courthouses (especially when one of the branches runs down Carleton anyway), so a seperate route should be created to serve Carleton Avenue. You could have the 3C between Hauppauge & South Shore Mall via Connequot Avenue, and the 3E between Hauppauge & South Shore Mall via Carleton Avenue.

 

And another idea up for consideration: Maybe the S45 could be rerouted to Ronkonkoma via Johnson Avenue, and either the 3C or 3E could cover the portion north of Hauppauge.

 

I think the S42 could be routed away from the South Shore Mall. Islip Avenue riders basically have the same connections available at Bay Shore, and if they want to go to the mall itself, the 3B & 3E would run on both sides (aside from that, there are a bunch of routes between Bay Shore & the South Shore Mall).

 

The S42 shouldn't be routed away from the South Shore Mall, as that is the only route that riders on NYS 111 SOUTH of Suffolk Ave have to get to the mall. Sure they could transfer at Bay Shore, but people normally want to stay on ONE bus to get to their destination.

 

The 3C travels down Connequot Avenue to get to the South Shore Mall alot more then it travels Carleton Avenue.to get there. As someone who has lived in the CI area, and had used the 3C, the 3C is just fine the way it is.

 

No offence but if your change makes the S57 the quicker route, then why on earth would you switch its northern routing with the S59. That makes no complete sense at all. And I don't think the quickness of either route is a problem, because I'm sure that it would have been brought up in the 2009 study. Besides any changes made would be so a rider doesn't have to transfer as much to get to where they are going, as the 2009 study showed with the S57, and would have nothing to do with the quickness of the route.

 

I still think they need to come up with a Ronkonkoma LIRR - Riverhead service that would run down the LIE with a stop at Rt.112 (connect with the S61). The new Bolt Bus service that was started was a dissapointment, couldn't even buy tickets between Ronkonkoma and Riverhead. Route 58 is becoming a major tourist destination between Tanger and all the stores there, and with plans for another new shopping center with Costco and a Super-Walmart underway. The 110 Clipper carries air more or less, I'd can it and use the buses for the new Ronkonkoma-Riverhead service. Route would be Ronkonkoma LIRR-495-stop at Rt.112 and service road for 61 transfer-back on 495 to exit 73 and it would make all stops along Rt.58 and run to County Center via S58 route. I cant fathom why they havent done it yet, HJ and Bolt Bus are NYC-LI expresses, LIRR service to Riverhead is practically useless, someone at Suffolk Cty may be getting their pockets lined. If I had my own bus I'd run the service myself.

 

You are aware that the S110 was created more or less for the same reason you want a route created to go from Ronkonkoma to Riverhead, and look how that turned out. The S110 has been running for about twenty years (the first few years using actually coach buses from HARRAN, or so I'm told) and according to everyone nobody barely uses it now.

[checkmatechamp13]

I know you don't really know suffolk county, so I'm gonna have to draw a map.... I get that reading all that could be confusing as well....

Overall, good job w/ these ideas.

 

 

Thanks, man.

 

With the 3C & 3E, it sounds like you're making them more indirect. I'd prefer just having one straight up Connequot and one straight up Carleton. But I'll wait for the map

 

No offence but if your change makes the S57 the quicker route, then why on earth would you switch its northern routing with the S59. That makes no complete sense at all. And I don't think the quickness of either route is a problem, because I'm sure that it would have been brought up in the 2009 study. Besides any changes made would be so a rider doesn't have to transfer as much to get to where they are going, as the 2009 study showed with the S57, and would have nothing to do with the quickness of the route.

 

 

The idea was so it makes it an even quicker route, so people trying to travel north-south have one, defined, direct route, instead of having one be quicker north of Ronkonkoma and the other be quicker south of it. But I see the logic with trying to "spread the pain", as well, though.

 

You are aware that the S110 was created more or less for the same reason you want a route created to go from Ronkonkoma to Riverhead, and look how that turned out. The S110 has been running for about twenty years (the first few years using actually coach buses from HARRAN, or so I'm told) and according to everyone nobody barely uses it now.

 

 

Well, I think part of it was that the S110 was intended to appeal to park-and-ride-type users (basically, people who already have cars), whereas this new route will appeal to people already using transit.

 

In any case, I think the route could run along the service road west of 112. It serves a few extra people that way (instead of bypassing them), and it also allows a connection to the S63.

[qjtransitmaster]

S110 I'd kill it and let CUSA be open door on their X-495 service. I also think buses need major reshaping in suffolk you know the system fails when you have buses at PM rush EMPTY.

[BM5 via Woodhaven]

Does anyone think the S57 and S59 can be combined successfully.

[mac5689]

S110 I'd kill it and let CUSA be open door on their X-495 service. I also think buses need major reshaping in suffolk you know the system fails when you have buses at PM rush EMPTY.

 

 

What routes are empty during the PM Rush, I've heard that there are afew routes that are packed during the PM. One now being the S60 since the county and SUNY Stony Brook made a deal where SUNY Stony Brook pays the fares for their students up font so they don't have to pay while boarding as long as they travel either from the campus to the mall and back or from the campus to Port Jeff and back. The deal also covers the 3D from the Campus to the mall. The deal DOES NOT cover the S71.

 

Does anyone think the S57 and S59 can be combined successfully.

 

 

I doubt it, unless it travels one way going to the mall and the other way towards Sayville. Though I doubt you will ever see those two routes combined.

[checkmatechamp13]

I don't think this has been mentioned before, but maybe the S40 could be extended to the Sunrise Mall (via Montauk) while the N19 is cut back to Sunrise. The portion east of Sunrise is the weakest portion of the route, so maybe it would get better ridership if the S40 covered it. There might be more demand headed out east compared to out west.

 

Or instead of going to Sunrise, the S40 could go up Broadway and terminate at the Amityville LIRR station, providing a connection to the S1 (also, the S20 already covers Babylon-Sunrise).