NICE Fare Increase

[Burrstone]

You are not isololating anyone if both trhe metrocard and nice card are accepted in both systerms.

 

All you have is assumptions and it is a waste of time talking to a sheep who thinks the MTA way is the only way of doing anything or else it's not logical or has no benifits.  I have posted what real benefits it would have but you are to closed with your "that's the way it's always been attitude" to think on a broader lever.  I don't have the patience to continue to beat my head against the wall in frustration at the narrow minded minded assumptions you continue to post here over and over. The narrow minded sheep win, the nice card is a great idea but I don't have the patience to sit here and read "no, nice card bad because I say so...  and continue to post my assuptions that go against logic..."  Conversation is over, goodbye!

Look, your benefits aren't real, I've said this before. I've read through them, and it's a fantasy to consider those benefits to actually become a reality. All you're doing is isolating Nassau from NYC for no reason other than  "WE'RE DIFFERENT." You're adding senseless complications with step-up fares and different fare cards and having NICE or the MTA have to accept both cards. All that adds COST and TIME. It would be an awful waste of time and money on Nassau's part. You realize the development and implementation cost for a fare card system is in the millions, right? It's a bloody awful idea, please let it go.

[Culver]

You are not isololating anyone if both trhe metrocard and nice card are accepted in both systerms.

 

All you have is assumptions and it is a waste of time talking to a sheep who thinks the MTA way is the only way of doing anything or else it's not logical or has no benifits.  I have posted what real benefits it would have but you are to closed with your "that's the way it's always been attitude" to think on a broader lever.  I don't have the patience to continue to beat my head against the wall in frustration at the narrow minded minded assumptions you continue to post here over and over. The narrow minded sheep win, the nice card is a great idea but I don't have the patience to sit here and read "no, nice card bad because I say so...  and continue to post my assuptions that go against logic..."  Conversation is over, goodbye!

Which makes literally the entirety of your proposal irrelevant. The MTA is not wasting its time and money modifying its fareboxes to accept your card. Likewise, if Nassau has to accept both cards, that's more money it has to pay to the MTA and Cubic to integrate that system. And you still deal with money going to the MTA for MetroCard users. You've really not thought this out at all. My attitude isn't "that's the way it's" been, it's "you idea is an awful waste of everyone's time and money." You've ignored all logistics and costs in your proposal. I mean, really, you want the MTA to retrofit its nearly 6,000 buses to take your card? And its turnstiles? Please don't take this personally, but your idea is a kid's dream: where everything other than "I want this to happen" is ignored.

[Burrstone]

Good lord man....  If you really can't see the benefit there is something wrong!  Open your eyes!

[Culver]

Good lord man....  If you really can't see the benefit there is something wrong!  Open your eyes!

No, I can't see the benefit of the MTA spending millions of dollars to retrofit its fareboxes and turnstiles to accept a fare card used by Nassau county and only Nassau County. And Nassau spending millions on their own card in the first place. You really don't understand this whole "money" thing, do you? Look, you're probably a younger member and don't get this whole "hey, somebody has to pay for these things" concept, so I'm letting it go. Go on imagining a new fare card system dropping out of the sky and the MTA happily just going ahead and bending over backwards to please Nassau (even more than it already does).

[FamousNYLover]

Atlantic Express X23/X24, Bee-Line buses and Roosevelt Island Tramway might have to upgrade their turnstile/farebox to accepted NICE Card also. Including Hudson Rail Link.

For example:

Student MetroCard issued by NYCBOE cannot be used on NICE or Bee-Line buses.

Student MetroCard issued by Westchester County cannot be used on MTA or NICE Buses.
Student MetroCard issued by Nassau County cannot be used on MTA or Bee-Line buses.

[Burrstone]

if Nassau has to accept both cards, that's more money it has to pay to the MTA and Cubic to integrate that system. And you still deal with money going to the MTA for MetroCard users. You've really not thought this out at all.

 

A majority of NICE riders use the Metrocard while only 25% transfer to an MTA service yet a majoritry of the rides have to a $2.50 fare using the metrocard.  Why should those who want the  convience of using a card have to pay more when 75% of them are transferring to an MTA service.

 

Riders transfering to an MTA service could use whatever card they like.

 

By having at least 75% of those riders looking for a convient way to pay using the nice card and having at the most 25% of users who use a card using the metrocard will decrease whatever it is NICE pays the MTA everytime a metrocard is use.

 

This also ensures that the money of at least 75% of users using a card would end in NICE's bank account faster than waiting for coming from the MTA.

 

I keep saying at least 75% of NICE riders would use the NICE card as already stated 75% of NICE riders using a metrocard don't use the MTA.  These riders would obviously switch to a NICE card because the NICE card would offer a $2.25 fare (the same as the cash fare) it makes no sense that riders who don't need to transfer to the MTA would pay $2.50 per ride.

 

Riders using a nice card could you either card beacuse NICE cards would be programed to be read in an MTA farebox because that's what NICE uses...  So if the NICE cards are programed to work in MTA fareboxes used by NICE wouldn't they work in all MTA fareboxes?  Why would MTA need to spend milions to reprogram boxes to read technology it already understand, please explain what I'm missing? 

 

NICE cards and Metrocards would be accepted unilaterally because the fareboxes reads both cards.  The MTA fareboxes will charge a 25cent step up fee on nice cards.

 

It only seems logical all NICE riders who live in Nassau would switch the NICE card because on days they are off and don't have to switch to the MTA they could use the NICE bus to go to the mall or do whatever they do only only pay $2.25 instead of $2.50.

 

With NICE's decision to keep the cash fare at $2.25 there is concern over buses being slowed down by numerous peoplie boarding paying with coins.  There is also concern about extra coins in the system and the overhead in dealing with that.  The NICE card solves these problems.

 

 

I mean, really, you want the MTA to retrofit its nearly 6,000 buses to take your card? And its turnstiles?

 

Again, why would MTA have to retrofit all of its fareboxes and turnstyles to red a technology?  Why couldn't Cubic just write a code on the magentic strip that MTA fareboxes understands?  After all wouldn't the card be used in MTA fareboxes/turnstyles in the MTA as well as MTA fareboxes in NICE?

 

 

Why are they going to waste millions of dollars and spend a handful of years developing it when everybody in the area will just end up using the MTA's new card by the time it's done?

 

It's all about whether the costs would exceed the costs of collecting extra coins in the system + the cost NICE pays to the MTA for 75% of card users who don't transer the MTA to use the Metrocard.

 

Where did you get the figure of millions of dollars and years?  To tell you the truth you or I don't know what it would cost for Cuic to put a code on card that MTA fareboxes understand.  But the benefits I have proposed show it is not only worth it but logical to look into the costs of a NICE card (if NICE hasn't done so already).

 

You really don't understand this whole "money" thing, do you? Look, you're probably a younger member and don't get this whole "hey, somebody has to pay for these things" concept, so I'm letting it go.

 

Bwahahahahaahahahahahahaha!  What is money?  I don't understand this whole money thing.  What do you mean people have to pay for these things?  Bwhahahahahahahaha!  That really did make me LOL, thanks I needed a good laugh.

[Culver]

You're seriously continuing to insist on this? Look man, like I said, it's an insanely bad idea, so keep dreaming. Every single point you make is based on how you imagine things. I can't win an argument with someone's imagination. You're not being serious on this, and I just got trolled big time. Got what I deserved, I suppose.

EDIT: One more thing I forgot, the MTA is not spending a second or cent to do anything to accommodate NICE cards. Even in your imagined modified MetroCard, the MTA still has to do something on its end in terms of loading new software: that something will mean time and money. Time. Money. Reality. Please understand these three words.

 

Actually, I just imagined a fare card that can be used all over the Northeast and costs nothing to implement because I imagine that its development costs will be $0 and it will be 100% backwards compatible and cost $0 to implement because the old fareboxes will transmagically accept it. I'll go take it to the MTA and see what they tell me.

[Burrstone]

I'll go take it to the MTA and see what they tell me.

 

There you again, you're obsessed with the MTA.  I forgot the MTA is the only way, right?

 

I'm tired of dealing with narrow minded sheep who are incapable of looking beyond the MTA because that's the way it's always been done, and can't accept good ideas because that's not how the MTA did it.

 

Bye.

 

 

I already told you the narrow minded sheep won because I don't have the energey to listen to your assumptions based on teh way it's always been done, so why do you continue to harp on the same shit?

 

Every single point you make is based on how you imagine things.

 

I'm I missed where you posted any facts or data...  Where are they?  You can't win an argument against my imagination, but i'm just supposed to accept the assumptions in your imagination.  You really thought that one out!

[Culver]

There you again, you're obsessed with the MTA.  I forgot the MTA is the only way, right?

 

I'm tired of dealing with narrow minded sheep who are incapable of looking beyond the MTA because that's the way it's always been done, and can't accept good ideas because that's not how the MTA did it.

 

Bye.

 

 

I already told you the narrow minded sheep won because I don't have the energey to listen to your assumptions based on teh way it's always been done, so why do you continue to harp on the same shit?

OK, I'll take my imagined idea to NICE, sorry to offend you. You keep repeating the same post over and over about how I'm narrow-minded because I keep pointing out that your idea is nothing more than a Foamer child's imagination being pasted into a forum. I don't know how much simpler I can put my point: Your idea is not thought out and makes no financial or logistical sense. There are no solid facts or ideas behind it. You imagined a NICE Card and thought it would be totally cool to have one. In the process you've continually ignored basic things behind planning a fare card; those basic things being the ones that confirm that your idea is pure foam. I don't know what else to tell you. I mean, keep dreaming.

[Burrstone]

You keep repeating the same post over and over about how I'm narrow-minded because I keep pointing out that your idea is nothing more than a Foamer child's imagination being pasted into a forum

 

I figured I'd copy what you do so you can can see how irritating it is.  This foamer kid is leaving now, I have to go foam over some foamer stuff.

 

Bye.

[checkmatechamp13]

I'd just like to point out that the MTA said a while back that it costs about 7 cents to print up a MetroCard (and also remember that the MTA is much larger than NICE, so it might cost NICE a little bit more, unless they do a contract that covers all of their systems). NICE pays the MTA $0.0175 per MetroCard used, so it takes 4 rides for NICE to break even. This is before accounting for other costs involved.

 

I don't really care either way, but I'm just throwing that fact out there.

[Amtrak7]

For every $1 the MTA receives in fares, it spends 15 cents to collect it.

[RtrainBlues]

What if a user takes the F train and gets a free transfer to the N6 bus?  How much of the $2.25 does NICE get for the N6, and how much of the $2.25 does the MTA get for the F train ?

[Amtrak7]

What if a user takes the F train and gets a free transfer to the N6 bus?  How much of the $2.25 does NICE get for the N6, and how much of the $2.25 does the MTA get for the F train ?

 

You can't board the subway without a MetroCard, so its $2.50.

 

From what I've heard, the first agency gets all of the fare.

[Burrstone]

You can't board the subway without a MetroCard, so its $2.50.

 

From what I've heard, the first agency gets all of the fare.

 

I guess that's fair considering most users will do a roundtrip in a day so both agencies would get one complete fare.

 

What happens in the case of unlimited Metrocards?  Do you know how that is split up for transfers between MTA/NICE?

 

NICE should focus on bringing more people to the LIRR...  When I have to gointo the city I like to take the NICE to the LIRR, it's easier than walking, it takes the exact time on the bus to get to the LIRR as it would take me to walk to my LIRR station., and it's FREE.  I use my metrocard on the bus and then I get a free transfer at Penn Station whenI transfer to the subway.  If NICE made a real effort to attract LIRR riders and advertised it's basically (because of transfers) NICE would be able to keep all the money in the morney MTA would normally keep (if the pax took LIRR>Subway).

[Turbo19]

Yet the MTA would still be recieving money as an LIRR fare.

[Burrstone]

Of course they would, that's obvious people are going to take the LIRR anyway but if NICE can sway riders to take the bus to the train they'd keep the fare in the morning that riders are going to shell out anyway at Penn.

[N6 Limited]

I guess that's fair considering most users will do a roundtrip in a day so both agencies would get one complete fare.

 

What happens in the case of unlimited Metrocards?  Do you know how that is split up for transfers between MTA/NICE?

 

NICE should focus on bringing more people to the LIRR...  When I have to gointo the city I like to take the NICE to the LIRR, it's easier than walking, it takes the exact time on the bus to get to the LIRR as it would take me to walk to my LIRR station., and it's FREE.  I use my metrocard on the bus and then I get a free transfer at Penn Station whenI transfer to the subway.  If NICE made a real effort to attract LIRR riders and advertised it's basically (because of transfers) NICE would be able to keep all the money in the morney MTA would normally keep (if the pax took LIRR>Subway).

Have you suggested that to NICE?

[Burrstone]

Have you suggested that to NICE?

 

No.

[N6 Limited]

No.

You should try, see what they say.

[qjtransitmaster]

I guess that's fair considering most users will do a roundtrip in a day so both agencies would get one complete fare.

 

What happens in the case of unlimited Metrocards?  Do you know how that is split up for transfers between MTA/NICE?

 

NICE should focus on bringing more people to the LIRR...  When I have to gointo the city I like to take the NICE to the LIRR, it's easier than walking, it takes the exact time on the bus to get to the LIRR as it would take me to walk to my LIRR station., and it's FREE.  I use my metrocard on the bus and then I get a free transfer at Penn Station whenI transfer to the subway.  If NICE made a real effort to attract LIRR riders and advertised it's basically (because of transfers) NICE would be able to keep all the money in the morney MTA would normally keep (if the pax took LIRR>Subway).

best thing you said getting people to use buses to. LIRR should be NICE's priority. I agree but I don't see NICE doing it.

[Burrstone]

Have you suggested that to NICE?

You should try, see what they say.

 

I'd rather think out loud with my ideas than actually suggest them to any entity.

 

best thing you said getting people to use buses to. LIRR should be NICE's priority. I agree but I don't see NICE doing it.

 

I agree, but with the schedule change on Dec n19th, it seems nice got it, better than they did before, better than MTA LIB who had me running for the train, I get to Freeport LIRR with 10 minutes to spare!  That's enough to calmly walk to the train and not feel rushed during the ride keeping on checking time, you don't have to worry about minor delays, like the bus getting there 5 min late, traffic etc.

 

 

best thing you said getting people to use buses to. LIRR should be NICE's priority. I agree but I don't see NICE doing it.

 

I think this should be a real focus but a priority would be fixing the problem lines.  Although if this was a priority maybe it would generate enough to fix some of the problems within the system.  For this to really work they really need to poll LIRR riders, have nice employees getting riders to fill out question cards at Penn in the afternoon to see what stations riders are using, what time, and where the riders live to get the info on what service they should add (if any). 

 

Once this service is implimented nice needs to have people in Penn in the afternoons promoting the service, showing the rider how they will get a free ride, what hassles they are giving up, and what conveniences they gain.  This really needs to be marketed in Penn by people who know what they are doing, for instance a nice employee could approach a rider (wearing a nice orance red jacket so people aren't defensive at first) asking an good question to get the rider interested such as asking if they'd like a free ride to the train in the morning, how much touble it is looking for parking and how costly it is, how long it took them to dig their car out this morning.  After customers tell them about the PIA they have in the morning they will want to listen, and then the knowledgable nice employee can ask them where they live and show them the easiest way to take the train to the bus in the morning for free.

 

The only problem I see with this is that from my experience if I was transfering to a nice from the LIRR later in that day I would be charged again on the bus, I think the time I hit the subway, travel to Penn, wait for the LIRR, and time it takes on the LIRR my transfer has expired and I have to pay again on the bus.  To spin this into a positive it is NICE making an extra fare in the afternoon, more money into the system but people may feel screwed over or not understand why the transfer is not free in the afternoon.  You see, people will see nice taking thier money in the morning, the MTA letting them transfer them to the subway for free then they pay the MTA for the subway and nice "not returning the favor" and gouging them again in the afternoon (unless they have an unlimited metrocard).

 

Although code being written on the NICE Card to allow free transfers for these rides in another benefit of using the NICE card, as a metrocard would not allow a free transfer, casung more riders to use the NICE Card (I'm kidding btw ).

[qjtransitmaster]

I'd rather think out loud with my ideas than actually suggest them to any entity.

 

 

 

I agree, but with the schedule change on Dec n19th, it seems nice got it, better than they did before, better than MTA LIB who had me running for the train, I get to Freeport LIRR with 10 minutes to spare!  That's enough to calmly walk to the train and not feel rushed during the ride keeping on checking time, you don't have to worry about minor delays, like the bus getting there 5 min late, traffic etc.

 

 

 

 

I think this should be a real focus but a priority would be fixing the problem lines.  Although if this was a priority maybe it would generate enough to fix some of the problems within the system.  For this to really work they really need to poll LIRR riders, have nice employees getting riders to fill out question cards at Penn in the afternoon to see what stations riders are using, what time, and where the riders live to get the info on what service they should add (if any). 

 

Once this service is implimented nice needs to have people in Penn in the afternoons promoting the service, showing the rider how they will get a free ride, what hassles they are giving up, and what conveniences they gain.  This really needs to be marketed in Penn by people who know what they are doing, for instance a nice employee could approach a rider (wearing a nice orance red jacket so people aren't defensive at first) asking an good question to get the rider interested such as asking if they'd like a free ride to the train in the morning, how much touble it is looking for parking and how costly it is, how long it took them to dig their car out this morning.  After customers tell them about the PIA they have in the morning they will want to listen, and then the knowledgable nice employee can ask them where they live and show them the easiest way to take the train to the bus in the morning for free.

 

The only problem I see with this is that from my experience if I was transfering to a nice from the LIRR later in that day I would be charged again on the bus, I think the time I hit the subway, travel to Penn, wait for the LIRR, and time it takes on the LIRR my transfer has expired and I have to pay again on the bus.  To spin this into a positive it is NICE making an extra fare in the afternoon, more money into the system but people may feel screwed over or not understand why the transfer is not free in the afternoon.  You see, people will see nice taking thier money in the morning, the MTA letting them transfer them to the subway for free then they pay the MTA for the subway and nice "not returning the favor" and gouging them again in the afternoon (unless they have an unlimited metrocard).

 

Although code being written on the NICE Card to allow free transfers for these rides in another benefit of using the NICE card, as a metrocard would not allow a free transfer, casung more riders to use the NICE Card (I'm kidding btw ).

I like your plan it is very NICE PLEASE come to the next NICE meeting tell em about.

[Amtrak7]

The MTA isn't charging step up fees for NICE paper transfers, apparently.

[Turbo19]

The MTA isn't charging step up fees for NICE paper transfers, apparently.

So the MTA is losing fare revenue?