Riverdale politicians renew calls on MTA improved local bus service

[Cait Sith]

Eastern Queens got the same BS with the LIRR. If they could do it in Eastern Queens, they can do it in Riverdale. The Q42 is a route made to connect to the LIRR and it's doing fine.

 

That's not quite true.

[TDXNYC88]

Eastern Queens got the same BS with the LIRR. If they could do it in Eastern Queens, they can do it in Riverdale. The Q42 is a route made to connect to the LIRR and it's doing fine.

 

Nope, it's a supplementary route designed to give service to residents that live further away from the Q4/Q5/Q83/Q84/Q85/X64/N4.

[paulrivera]

Don't be ridiculous. Why should some person paying $2.50 get that sort of service? When I use Metro-North during the week, if I use a pay-per-ride card for the Hudson Rail Link, it's $2.50 for that plus $8.25 for Metro-North, thus $10.75 one way, which is basically more than 4 times the base fare.

 

The Hudson Rail Link itself wouldn't be a part of anything NYCT needs to do. The point is Riverdale bus service needs improvement, whether NYCT itself runs more service (likely, even if they complain about costs) or they have to bring in someone else to do it (unlikely, but still ideas don't cost anything.)

[bobtehpanda]

Yea, the Bx3's reliability is already spotty and there was a reason the M100 was split into two...

 

Why not make the Bx20 more useful? Or why not expand the Rail Link concept and have NYCT pay a contractor to feed riders to the train like how Metro-North pays a contractor to feed riders to the Hudson Line?

 

Because the regular bus system already does that? If the unreliability is caused by traffic, a private operator will have the same issues, and the last time we had private operators touch the bus system they were a money sink for the city with poor customer service ratings and buses that weren't doing too great.

[B35 via Church]

Eastern Queens got the same BS with the LIRR. If they could do it in Eastern Queens, they can do it in Riverdale. The Q42 is a route made to connect to the LIRR and it's doing fine.

Negative....

 

The Q42 is a coverage route, not a shuttle type of route.... It minimizes the amount of people & the amt. of walking from Addisleigh Park that would have to make their way to the Merrick routes (Q4/5/84/85) otherwise....

 

Nope, it's a supplementary route designed to give service to residents that live further away from the Q4/Q5/Q83/Q84/Q85/X64/N4.

Not to mention the trackage that creates a sort of divide around the area....

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Eastern Queens got the same BS with the LIRR. If they could do it in Eastern Queens, they can do it in Riverdale. The Q42 is a route made to connect to the LIRR and it's doing fine.

 

 

 

 

The Hudson Rail Link itself wouldn't be a part of anything NYCT needs to do. The point is Riverdale bus service needs improvement, whether NYCT itself runs more service (likely, even if they complain about costs) or they have to bring in someone else to do it (unlikely, but still ideas don't cost anything.)

 

The Hudson Rail Link is unique.  Nowhere else along the Hudson Line within New York City is there a shuttle bus that connects directly with Metro-North.  The has been marketing Metro-North here in Riverdale heavily, especially since I moved here almost three years ago.  They posted Metro-North ads at the bus shelters here in Central Riverale at both bus shelters on Riverdale Avenue and West 236th street, and another one at the bus shelter at Kappock and Johnson.  They remained for some months.  Then they increased the frequency of Metro-North trains to the Riverdale and Spuyten Duyvil stations. Ridership here continues to grow.  

 

It's pretty simple as to what they're doing.  They know that there is money in my neck of the woods and down in Spuyten Duyvil.  They get heavy ridership west of the Henry Hudson Parkway and along the waterfront by Palisades and they are trying to attract as much ridership as possible, especially off-peak here in Downtown Riverdale, as there have been several luxury condos built here with the past few years.  

 

I know for a fact that Fernando Ferrer rides Metro-North, as I have seen him on the train standing.  He lives in North Riverdale, along with another board member (Charles Moerdler), so they know there's a market here that can be expanded since at least a few of them use the service.  The buses are very timely for the most part especially now with the switch up in drivers and it's very friendly service overall.  I get my same seat on the bus every time I use it and see just about all of the same faces that I've come to know over the years of living here.  The local bus service simply here is simply too unreliable here and I'm certain that Metro-North riders (overall would not use them), though I have seen a few take the local bus and walk down to the station on weekends.

 

The other reason why the service exists is because the Spuyten Duyvil station has very limited parking spaces.  Having the direct link service makes Metro-North attractive for those who wouldn't be able to get a parking spot.  The Riverdale station tends to serve North Riverdale and parts of Fieldston which are mainly less dense, but that station is well used too.

[Q43 Floral Park]

That's correct because past 239th you hit areas that are less density like Fieldston where folks are more likely to drive. However, you still have those who may need the service in North Riverdale and at the Yonkers border.Don't be ridiculous. Why should some person paying $2.50 get that sort of service? When I use Metro-North during the week, if I use a pay-per-ride card for the Hudson Rail Link, it's $2.50 for that plus $8.25 for Metro-North, thus $10.75 one way, which is basically more than 4 times the base fare.

N/B: a bx7 short turn would make 15 stops to 263 and a bx10 short turn, 19 (not including bway). Assume the buses leave 231/bway at max capacity and that ridership is spread evenly in Spuyten Duyvil leading them to be "practically empty" by 239. That's 6 stops on a 7 Short Turn and 10 stops on a 10 run. the runs are only being heavily used on 40% (6/15) and 53% (10/19) of the short turn routes with over coverage on the other 60% and 47% of the short turns (bx7 and bx10 respectively). Sounds like a waste

[Via Garibaldi 8]

N/B: a bx7 short turn would make 15 stops to 263 and a bx10 short turn, 19 (not including bway). Assume the buses leave 231/bway at max capacity and that ridership is spread evenly in Spuyten Duyvil leading them to be "practically empty" by 239. That's 6 stops on a 7 Short Turn and 10 stops on a 10 run. the runs are only being heavily used on 40% (6/15) and 53% (10/19) of the short turn routes with over coverage on the other 60% and 47% of the short turns (bx7 and bx10 respectively). Sounds like a waste

Yeah but they're not always practically empty by 239th.  Ridership in North Riverdale and the Yonkers border can AND does fluctuate, so I have seen buses that are practically empty at 239th, and sometimes still quite crowded past 239th.  It varies.  You are complaining about something that is a non-issue when from 239th to 263rd, it's a 5 -10 minute bus ride tops on both the Bx7 and Bx10.  For what it's worth, just about all of the buses that are short-turned now would be deadheading directly to the depot.  Instead, they put those buses in service so that they can get some revenue since they're already going that way and the ride isn't that long.  Makes sense to me.  Even with that I still see a TON of NOT IN SERVICE buses deadheading from 263rd back to the depot in the morning while waiting for the express bus.  There was one this morning as I waited at 239th and Henry Hudson Parkway West.

[bobtehpanda]

To be honest, if Eastern Queens were to get a version of the rail link, the only way I could see that working is if they remade the Q79 with a terminus at Floral Park LIRR and let it out to a private contractor. Maybe you could run really small, dinky vans around Douglaston and Little Neck, but I don't think Eastern Queens is set up for a Rail Link shuttle. It's a bit too sparsely populated.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

To be honest, if Eastern Queens were to get a version of the rail link, the only way I could see that working is if they remade the Q79 with a terminus at Floral Park LIRR and let it out to a private contractor. Maybe you could run really small, dinky vans around Douglaston and Little Neck, but I don't think Eastern Queens is set up for a Rail Link shuttle. It's a bit too sparsely populated.

Yeah, the other thing with Riverdale is that there are A LOT of co-ops and luxury condos, and they are building another one just below 232nd street and Henry Hudson Parkway, so all of the stops that the shuttle makes have potential.  There are numerous luxury condos and co-ops all around where I live in Central Riverdale, many of which have just been completed within a 2 - 5 year period, and then you have the same situation down in Spuyten Duyvil along the waterfront and along Kappock.  It's Manhattan living in a suburban style neighborhood, which is quite unique.  The building below was finally finished late last year.  It's a rental luxury building but the prices are quite high...

 

$4,350 for a two bedroom... 

 

http://www.blocksy.com/nyc/rental/9678339-3620-oxford-ave-ph#/0

 

So there's definitely a new market of money coming to Riverdale with these new developments here in Central Riverdale that are being snatched up quickly in some cases.

[Q43 Floral Park]

Floral Park didn't want the service and that would have been the only thing that saved the Q79. the Q36 service is better, I just wish the midday runs lined up with E/B PW trains.

 

VG8: don't you understand your eyesight isn't a valid measurement of service and your opinion isnt worth anything to me without facts to support it? Unless you have access to KBs run sheet you don't know for sure what they're doing with those buses going out of service. They could plausibly be needed for service elsewhere

 

The price of a 2 bedroom unit has little to do with service levels, this is getting quite old.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Floral Park didn't want the service and that would have been the only thing that saved the Q79. the Q36 service is better, I just wish the midday runs lined up with E/B PW trains.

 

VG8: don't you understand your eyesight isn't a valid measurement of service and your opinion isnt worth anything to me without facts to support it? Unless you have access to KBs run sheet you don't know for sure what they're doing with those buses going out of service. They could plausibly be needed for service elsewhere

 

The price of a 2 bedroom unit has little to do with service levels, this is getting quite old.

You have trouble reading... That was a discussion about Metro-North and how the has been marketing Metro-North to this area.  That had NOTHING to do with local bus service levels.

 

Excuse me, but I live here so yes, my eyesight is much better than yours and my opinion is far more worthy and valid than yours given that you're going off of your recollection from YEARS AGO? DECADES?    Furthermore for an extra 5 - 10 minutes of run time tops, the is not going to run shuttle buses on the Bx7 and Bx10 and not let them run to the city border at 263rd.

[Q43 Floral Park]

You have trouble reading... That was a discussion about Metro-North and how the has been marketing Metro-North to this area.  That had NOTHING to do with local bus service levels.

 

Excuse me, but I live here so yes, my eyesight is much better than yours and my opinion is far more worthy and valid than yours given that you're going off of your recollection from YEARS AGO? DECADES?    Furthermore for an extra 5 - 10 minutes of run time tops, the is not going to run shuttle buses on the Bx7 and Bx10 and not let them run to the city border at 263rd.

Save the personal insults, argumentum ad hominem won't work on me. Are you familiar with sociology? You have to provide a correlation between average rental prices in Riverdale and metro north service levels in order for this to be relevant to the discussion at hand.

 

Eyesight/observations (be it mine or yours) aren't a viable measurement for transportation planning without data. Even better the basis for your arguments are a false authority (said authority being you), just because you live there now doesn't make you more knowledgeable than anyone else. You don't support your claims with so I'm not inclined to believe your observations are the norm. You don't know how often I use these routes and for what reasons to make the base assumption that my responses are based solely off previous experience alone. I never said anything about shuttle buses...

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Save the personal insults, argumentum ad hominem won't work on me. Are you familiar with sociology? You have to provide a correlation between average rental prices in Riverdale and metro north service levels in order for this to be relevant to the discussion at hand.

 

Eyesight/observations (be it mine or yours) aren't a viable measurement for transportation planning without data. Even better the basis for your arguments are a false authority (said authority being you), just because you live there now doesn't make you more knowledgeable than anyone else. You don't support your claims with so I'm not inclined to believe your observations are the norm. You don't know how often I use these routes and for what reasons to make the base assumption that my responses are based solely off previous experience alone. I never said anything about shuttle buses...

You never said anything about shuttle buses?? You talked specifically about providing stats for running more local bus service WITHIN Riverdale and whether or not that would make sense.  And spare me with your claims of using the buses here because if you did, you would have no problem admitting it.  If one sees constant crowds at local bus stops on a daily basis at various hours then that is probably a sign that there are service issues.

[qjtransitmaster]

To be honest, if Eastern Queens were to get a version of the rail link, the only way I could see that working is if they remade the Q79 with a terminus at Floral Park LIRR and let it out to a private contractor. Maybe you could run really small, dinky vans around Douglaston and Little Neck, but I don't think Eastern Queens is set up for a Rail Link shuttle. It's a bit too sparsely populated.

the Q36 brings them to queens village lirr no need. Q88& 27 also can be used like rail links.

[Q43 Floral Park]

You never said anything about shuttle buses?? You talked specifically about providing stats for running more local bus service WITHIN Riverdale and whether or not that would make sense. And spare me with your claims of using the buses here because if you did, you would have no problem admitting it. If one sees constant crowds at local bus stops on a daily basis at various hours then that is probably a sign that there are service issues.

Look through this entire thread and find one quote of me referencing "shuttle buses". I discussed short turns but that's not the same as a shuttle bus.

 

From what I see the 231 crowds stem directly from the bx7 bunching. If it came when it was supposed to (7 min headways) it would be no problem but when you have 1-3 buses coming at the same time after a 15-20 min wait it's a nightmare (this also occurs at 238 with the bx3). It wouldn't make sense to add more bx7 runs along the full route because they'll just get caught in the same traffic. So you would have to look at short turns as the next option, which I have concerns about. While it would solve the gaps in bx7 service, the politicians might be right for once it'd be a patch fix. On a day when traffic isn't bad you'll have extra runs lying around that might not be needed. the ridership isn't evenly distributed in Riverdale and I'm not sure how cost effective it would be running a short turn at less than 50% capacity for a good portion of the route. A Bx10 short turn would be more efficient (if my math was more or less correct in my early post) but that wouldn't help 7 riders between 231 and 239 and they appear to be the ones suffering the most. Which is why I wanted to look at the possibility of adding a route to supplement the bx7. I'm not ashamed to admit that I use the bx7 2x a week in the PM rush but I chose not to mention my personal observations because I'm smart enough to know that I couldn't possibly observe the full spectrum of the scenario and determine if what I'm seeing is the statistical norm. That's what ridership data is for.

 

Out of curiosity, how often do you take the 1 and bx7 home?

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Look through this entire thread and find one quote of me referencing "shuttle buses". I discussed short turns but that's not the same as a shuttle bus.

 

From what I see the 231 crowds stem directly from the bx7 bunching. If it came when it was supposed to (7 min headways) it would be no problem but when you have 1-3 buses coming at the same time after a 15-20 min wait it's a nightmare (this also occurs at 238 with the bx3). It wouldn't make sense to add more bx7 runs along the full route because they'll just get caught in the same traffic. So you would have to look at short turns as the next option, which I have concerns about. While it would solve the gaps in bx7 service, the politicians might be right for once it'd be a patch fix. On a day when traffic isn't bad you'll have extra runs lying around that might not be needed. the ridership isn't evenly distributed in Riverdale and I'm not sure how cost effective it would be running a short turn at less than 50% capacity for a good portion of the route. A Bx10 short turn would be more efficient (if my math was more or less correct in my early post) but that wouldn't help 7 riders between 231 and 239 and they appear to be the ones suffering the most. Which is why I wanted to look at the possibility of adding a route to supplement the bx7. I'm not ashamed to admit that I use the bx7 2x a week in the PM rush but I chose not to mention my personal observations because I'm smart enough to know that I couldn't possibly observe the full spectrum of the scenario and determine if what I'm seeing is the statistical norm. That's what ridership data is for.

As far as we're concerned here they are shuttle buses to and from 231st.  The local leaders call them that as well.  In any event to off set any waste you could have more Bx7's running to Isham Street Northbound.  Those who need service further up can take the Bx20 from Isham Street to 246th or you could extend some Northbound Bx20's to 263rd.  The other option is to do what they've been doing, which is use more articulated buses to handle the loads, but that won't address the long waits.

 

For what it's worth good for you that you use the Bx7 twice a week   .  I don't have a need for it.  I just think that if you have to take the subway to the local bus from work in Manhattan to an area like Riverdale where the commute from the city is such a schlepp, one would be better off living in the ghetto in the Bronx because this is an affluent area, so if you're going to live here and pay expensive mortgages or rents, you should be able to afford the premium priced Metro-North, or the express bus and/or have a car if necessary.  In my case I have everything within a 5 - 10 minute walk, and the bulk of my commuting is to and from Manhattan to Riverdale, so having a car is unnecessary.  In the three years that I've been living here I may have used the Bx10, Bx20 and Bx7 combined maybe 5 times total and during those times I was purposely using the local bus to the subway to see how the service ran out of curiosity or had decided to get the bus from Metro-North since a bus was coming rather than walking to my apartment.  I do observe the crowds when waiting for the Hudson Rail Link bus and the express bus.

[Q43 Floral Park]

As far as we're concerned here they are shuttle buses to and from 231st.  The local leaders call them that as well.  In any event to off set any waste you could have more Bx7's running to Isham Street Northbound.  Those who need service further up can take the Bx20 from Isham Street to 246th or you could extend some Northbound Bx20's to 263rd.  The other option is to do what they've been doing, which is use more articulated buses to handle the loads, but that won't address the long waits.

 

For what it's worth good for you that you use the Bx7 twice a week   .  I don't have a need for it.  I just think that if you have to take the subway to the local bus from work in Manhattan to an area like Riverdale where the commute from the city is such a schlepp, one would be better off living in the ghetto in the Bronx because this is an affluent area, so if you're going to live here and pay expensive mortgages or rents, you should be able to afford the premium priced Metro-North, or the express bus and/or have a car if necessary.  In my case I have everything within walking a 5 - 10 minute walk, and the bulk of my commuting is to and from Manhattan to Riverdale, so having a car is unnecessary.  In the three years that I've been living here I may have used the Bx10, Bx20 and Bx7 combined maybe 5 times total and during those times I was purposely using the local bus to the subway to see how the service ran out of curiosity or had decided to get the bus from Metro-North since a bus was coming rather than walking to my apartment.  I do observe the crowds when waiting for the Hudson Rail Link bus and the express bus.

You've lost me, how would N/B short turns to Isham help? Where are the extra artics coming from?

Extending the bx20 north doesn't help Riverdale Av riders south of 239.

 

You don't even use the service but you know you need more.

 

I think the funniest part of your posts are the classist undertones and hasty generalizations you make. I never gave any specific reason for why I take the 1/bx7 Vs. bxm1/2/18 vs. metro north because I did not state my origin or destination points. The commute to Riverdale from midtown is about the same as the commute to Glen Oaks, the median family income for both areas are in the 100k range and the Q46 gets more than enough ridership out there even with the QM5/QM6

 

Let me ask you: if you're going to pay to live in an affluent area to avoid "the ghetto" why would you pay for one where its surrounded by what you deem to be "ghetto"?

[Via Garibaldi 8]

You've lost me, how would N/B short turns to Isham help? Where are the extra artics coming from?

Extending the bx20 north doesn't help Riverdale Av riders south of 239.

 

You don't even use the service but you know you need more.

 

I think the funniest part of your posts are the classist undertones and hasty generalizations you make. I never gave any specific reason for why I take the 1/bx7 Vs. bxm1/2/18 vs. metro north because I did not state my origin or destination points. The commute to Riverdale from midtown is about the same as the commute to Glen Oaks, the median family income for both areas are in the 100k range and the Q46 gets more than enough ridership out there even with the QM5/QM6

 

Let me ask you: if you're going to pay to live in an affluent area to avoid "the ghetto" why would you pay for one where its surrounded by what you deem to be "ghetto"?

LOL... When I came up here for a business trip in Westchester, I was concerned about riff raff and wondered how the neighborhood remained so nice and quaint considering the ghetto areas down the hill, but I was immediately taken away by the sheer beauty and leafy tree lined streets with charming English tudors. It's a very unique part of the city.  Riverdale is surrounded by the Hudson on the left with amazing views of the Palisades and Manhattan, and Van Cortlandt Park on the right, not to mention the steep hills.  I've always wanted to live up north, as I LOVE the Cloisters and have visited quite a few times, but Inwood (west of Broadway) is too close to the ghetto for my taste, so that ruled that out, not to mention the express bus being rather limited with just the BxM1.  Meanwhile Riverdale is actually quite isolated with three express buses, and the hilly geography keeps the riff raff out, along with the fact that most buildings are co-ops or luxury condos, not to mention the police presence here.  I feel perfectly safe here at all hours, and with the express buses you never have to venture into the ghettos (passing through them is fine - hell the folks in Westchester do the same with Metro-North) since the closest stop is by those projects at Broadway and they can't afford the higher fare so that isn't a problem. It's like those folks out in LA that live up in the nice areas of the hills away from the ghettos.  It's a true get away from the hustle of the city and you don't realize you're still in the city until the express bus starts to descend from the steep hills.

 

And you mean 100k - 200k range for Riverdale for the family median income with several tracts over $186k.  The highest tract I could find for Glen Oaks was around $119k for the family median income (unless you're including parts of Floral Park (Lake Success area where the QM6 goes?)) That area is indeed quite well to do.  Riverdale has a TON of elderly folks, and those senior homes deflate the wealth here to some extent, so when you consider that, I would argue that the two areas aren't as close as you're painting them in terms of wealth.  I don't believe Glen Oaks has any mansions, though it does have a Golf Course, which usually signals money, but we have one also down in Van Cortlandt Park.  The folks using the Q46 seems to be anti-express bus, and quite frankly can't afford the higher fare in most cases.  I was trying to get the QM1 once and asked at the last stop in there by Main Street and Union Turnpike where those charming co-ops are about whether or not the express bus had come, and several people gave me a dirty look as if to say that they didn't take the express bus and preferred the subway.  

 

Anywho, back to the topic at thand... You complained about waste with having so many short turned Bx7's run from 231st to 263rd, so I proposed having SOME Bx7's run from 168th to Isham.  Those buses can go right back to the depot OR go where needed. Select Bx20's can then be extended to 263rd from Isham.  They already run from from Isham to 246th now anyway weekdays during parts of the morning and afternoon.  Please don't act is if people who need Riverdale Avenue and 236th or 238th can't walk down the hill to those stops from Henry Hudson Parkway East and West 239th because they can, and furthermore it's only an extra five minutes going through Spuyten Duyvil.  That would give the Bx20 a boost in ridership and cut unnecessary waste.

[Q43 Floral Park]

LOL... When I came up here for a business trip in Westchester, I was concerned about riff raff and wondered how the neighborhood remained so nice and quaint considering the ghetto areas down the hill, but I was immediately taken away by the sheer beauty and leafy tree lined streets with charming English tudors. It's a very unique part of the city.  Riverdale is surrounded by the Hudson on the left with amazing views of the Palisades and Manhattan, and Van Cortlandt Park on the right, not to mention the steep hills.  I've always wanted to live up north, as I LOVE the Cloisters and have visited quite a few times, but Inwood (west of Broadway) is too close to the ghetto for my taste, so that ruled that out, not to mention the express bus being rather limited with just the BxM1.  Meanwhile Riverdale is actually quite isolated with three express buses, and the hilly geography keeps the riff raff out, along with the fact that most buildings are co-ops or luxury condos, not to mention the police presence here.  I feel perfectly safe here at all hours, and with the express buses you never have to venture into the ghettos (passing through them is fine - hell the folks in Westchester do the same with Metro-North) since the closest stop is by those projects at Broadway and they can't afford the higher fare so that isn't a problem. It's like those folks out in LA that live up in the nice areas of the hills away from the ghettos.  It's a true get away from the hustle of the city and you don't realize you're still in the city until the express bus starts to descend from the steep hills.

 

And you mean 100k - 200k range for Riverdale for the family median income with several tracts over $186k.  The highest tract I could find for Glen Oaks was around $119k for the family median income (unless you're including parts of Floral Park (Lake Success area where the QM6 goes?)) That area is indeed quite well to do.  Riverdale has a TON of elderly folks, and those senior homes deflate the wealth here to some extent, so when you consider that, I would argue that the two areas aren't as close as you're painting them in terms of wealth.  I don't believe Glen Oaks has any mansions, though it does have a Golf Course, which usually signals money, but we have one also down in Van Cortlandt Park.  The folks using the Q46 seems to be anti-express bus, and quite frankly can't afford the higher fare in most cases.  I was trying to get the QM1 once and asked at the last stop in there by Main Street and Union Turnpike where those charming co-ops are about whether or not the express bus had come, and several people gave me a dirty look as if to say that they didn't take the express bus and preferred the subway.  

 

Anywho, back to the topic at thand... You complained about waste with having so many short turned Bx7's run from 231st to 263rd, so I proposed having SOME Bx7's run from 168th to Isham.  Those buses can go right back to the depot OR go where needed. Select Bx20's can then be extended to 263rd from Isham.  They already run from from Isham to 246th now anyway weekdays during parts of the morning and afternoon.  Please don't act is if people who need Riverdale Avenue and 236th or 238th can't walk down the hill to those stops from Henry Hudson Parkway East and West 239th because they can, and furthermore it's only an extra five minutes going through Spuyten Duyvil.  That would give the Bx20 a boost in ridership and cut unnecessary waste.

Calling the neighboring communities ghettoes is highly offensive.

 

Just because someone prefers the subway/local bus doesn't mean they can't afford the express bus.

 

Bx7 short turn runs bet 231-263 and 168-Isham? Then riders coming from south of Isham who need the Bronx have to transfer and a good portion might not have unlimiteds

 

select bx20s get extended? It's on 20 min headways so what every 40 mins? Oh look the old bx24 headway that didn't work. the 20 to 263 covers the Bx7 in North not in South where a bulk of the ridership is. An extra 5 mins after schlepping home on the 1 and waiting 15 mins for a bus sounds like no big deal when you're on the deegan. Pitch this to the large elderly population you just went on about. I doubt you'll be able to convince them to walk downhill from 239/HHP and there's no way they'd walk up in the morning.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Calling the neighboring communities ghettoes is highly offensive.

 

Just because someone prefers the subway/local bus doesn't mean they can't afford the express bus.

 

Bx7 short turn runs bet 231-263 and 168-Isham? Then riders coming from south of Isham who need the Bronx have to transfer and a good portion might not have unlimiteds

 

select bx20s get extended? It's on 20 min headways so what every 40 mins? Oh look the old bx24 headway that didn't work. the 20 to 263 covers the Bx7 in North not in South where a bulk of the ridership is. An extra 5 mins after schlepping home on the 1 and waiting 15 mins for a bus sounds like no big deal when you're on the deegan. Pitch this to the large elderly population you just went on about. I doubt you'll be able to convince them to walk downhill from 239/HHP and there's no way they'd walk up in the morning.

Excuse me but you're the one b*tching about running excess service.  If it were up to me I would run shuttle buses from 231st as needed and call it a day and keep the regular Bx7's, Bx10's and Bx20's as they are.

 

And those communities are known for high crime, high levels of welfare and poverty, like most Bronx neighborhoods.  No other better word to describe them.  

 

 

 

The tour's controversial description states that when thinking of the Bronx, people envision when the borough "was notorious for drugs, gangs, crime and murders." 

 

http://www.cnn.com/2013/05/23/travel/new-york-bronx-ghetto-tours/

[Q43 Floral Park]

Excuse me but you're the one b*tching about running excess service.  If it were up to me I would run shuttle buses from 231st as needed and call it a day and keep the regular Bx7's, Bx10's and Bx20's as they are.

 

And those communities are known for high crime, high levels of welfare and poverty, like most Bronx neighborhoods.  No other better word to describe them.

 

Haha, not "b*tching" just trying to get you make a real service proposal. Too little service and no one will use it, too much service and MTA won't even provide it. Can't just leave buses on 231 there isn't enough layover room, so how many short turns would you estimate are needed per hour per route?

 

Underprivileged communities would be sufficient and I'm sorry that you feel that way. You'll never get to experience all that the Bronx has to offer with that mentality. Besides check a crime map, 52nd might not be the best but it's safer than some of the gentrifying neighborhoods in Brooklyn

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Haha, not "b*tching" just trying to get you make a real service proposal. Too little service and no one will use it, too much service and MTA won't even provide it. Can't just leave buses on 231 there isn't enough layover room, so how many short turns would you estimate are needed per hour per route?

 

Underprivileged communities would be sufficient and I'm sorry that you feel that way. You'll never get to experience all that the Bronx has to offer with that mentality. Besides check a crime map, 52nd might not be the best but it's safer than some of the gentrifying neighborhoods in Brooklyn

Well I've always said that they could just use more artics.  That would at least handle the crowds.  You could have one artic during periods when the traffic is the worst come in and pick at 231st this way there wouldn't be a back up of buses.  That could be every 20 minutes or as needed.  They already have three artics now, so you wouldn't need too many more to deal with the overcrowding.

 

As for your other comment about the Bronx, please. I'm in the South Bronx at least once a week tutoring and it's a hell hole down there. I see the ghetto with my own two eyes. I take the BxM4 in by 161st or Metro-North from Riverdale or the city to do my consulting sessions and get the hell out and go back to Riverdale.  I've seen quite a bit of the Bronx... Parts of Pelham Parkway, Pelham Gardens (especially Indian Village), Morris Park, Woodlawn... Very nice areas... However, the ghettos... Mercy... I've been going down to the South Bronx now for almost two years and every time I go down there there is always something that amazes me.  Either the filth everywhere, the lack of people working or just people's sheer disregard for and lack of respect for others.  And Fordham (the shopping area) and the Hub are equally disgusting.  Looks like something out of a time warp.  Filthy also.

[MysteriousBtrain]

You complained about waste with having so many short turned Bx7's run from 231st to 263rd, so I proposed having SOME Bx7's run from 168th to Isham.  Those buses can go right back to the depot OR go where needed. Select Bx20's can then be extended to 263rd from Isham.  They already run from from Isham to 246th now anyway weekdays during parts of the morning and afternoon.  Please don't act is if people who need Riverdale Avenue and 236th or 238th can't walk down the hill to those stops from Henry Hudson Parkway East and West 239th because they can, and furthermore it's only an extra five minutes going through Spuyten Duyvil.  That would give the Bx20 a boost in ridership and cut unnecessary waste.

I was looking at the Bx7 schedule, and it shows short turn Bx7s between Riverdale and 207 Street and between Marble hill (218 Street) and Washington Heights. early in the morning and late at night. And I'm pretty sure that the reason the Bx20 runs rush hours is because it duplicates the Bx7 and Bx10.

Therefore, no Bx20 needs to extend to 263 Street and instead could use the Bx7 or Bx10. I don't see it happening.

[Q43 Floral Park]

Well I've always said that they could just use more artics.  That would at least handle the crowds.  You could have one artic during periods when the traffic is the worst come in and pick at 231st this way there wouldn't be a back up of buses.  That could be every 20 minutes or as needed.  They already have three artics now, so you wouldn't need too many more to deal with the overcrowding.

 

As for your other comment about the Bronx, please. I'm in the South Bronx at least once a week tutoring and it's a hell hole down there. I see the ghetto with my own two eyes. I take the BxM4 in by 161st or Metro-North from Riverdale or the city to do my consulting sessions and get the hell out and go back to Riverdale.  I've seen quite a bit of the Bronx... Parts of Pelham Parkway, Pelham Gardens (especially Indian Village), Morris Park, Woodlawn... Very nice areas... However, the ghettos... Mercy... I've been going down to the South Bronx now for almost two years and every time I go down there there is always something that amazes me.  Either the filth everywhere, the lack of people working or just people's sheer disregard for and lack of respect for others.  And Fordham (the shopping area) and the Hub are equally disgusting.  Looks like something out of a time warp.  Filthy also.

Where do more spare artics come from?

 

It's better than when it was gutted by Robert Moses and then burned down. Improvement and economic investment take time but these communities will be on the path to gentrification soon enough.