Queens Bus Redesign Discussion Thread

[Krocyoin]

My main concern is the elimination of the QM3, yes it obviously has lower ridership than most other express bus routes in Queens but it is still used by a good chunk of riders, in 2019, the QM3 had a daily ridership of 104 riders, which is 17.33 riders per bus, which isn't filling close to filling a bus but it's proof that people ride it, the daily ridership did drop to 46 riders in 2020 but that was due to Covid-19. I think QM3's ridership can be boosted if more trips are added, and have it operate to/from downtown Manhattan, where the Port Washington Branch and the train can not serve. This could work out cause it'd be a one trip ride from Little Neck to Downtown Manhattan with no transfers needed. In another note I propose an off-peak and weekend Express bus fare of $4.75, the cheaper fare would get more people to ride the Express buses in general during the hours less people are riding it. 

[Krocyoin]

On 3/30/2022 at 9:47 PM, checkmatechamp13 said:

That Q1-Q6 combo seems like they just wanted to free up as many buses from terminating in Downtown Jamaica as possible. I think the proposed QT18 would've worked out better operationally (in terms of avoiding the heart of Downtown Jamaica), but the tradeoff of course is that people would've had to transfer at Jamaica Avenue.

I like the Q4 extension to Elmont, and the Q5 extension down to X63 territory. Gives people the option of catching the LIRR at Rosedale (especially with the Atlantic Ticket and expanded CityTicket).

The Q7 extension to the makes sense (With Crescent Street, I think the issue is that it's harder to find a suitable turnaround and layover location, so Eldert Lane is the next best alternative).

I suppose a Q8 extension to Livonia Avenue makes sense to connect those areas of Central Brooklyn with Jamaica. (I doubt the B6 & B15 will remain in their current forms after the Brooklyn redesign, but whatever bus connections are available after the redesign is implemented might be useful)

I definitely think the proposed QT47 via Lakewood Avenue & 130th Street was a better route than the present-day Q9. More centralized within the neighborhood, and down a more suitable street (130th Street is wider than Lincoln Street, and the Van Wyck Expressway divides the neighborhood in that area). Especially considering that it's being extended down 130th Street on the southern end anyway. If they're worried about reliability of service along Liberty Avenue, they can just add some "Q57" short-turns between Jamaica & Lefferts Blvd and call it a day.

Likewise, I think the QT46 was a better route than the present-day Q40. The proposed Q40 is going to be bypassing all of the stops along Lakewood Avenue anyway (except for 142nd/143rd Street). 

The Q10, I don't think it needs to be combined with the Q64, but as mentioned, there's a little bit of logic to the combination.

The Q11, should still be tied in with Woodhaven Blvd. I think leaving it as a standalone shuttle (especially at those frequencies) will just have people staying on the  train all the way to Howard Beach.

I think they still should've branched the Q12 and had some buses run along Marathon Parkway.

For the Q13, I think the QT51 routing (basically, a Crocheron/35th Avenue route) was fine. It just needed to run full-time.

Q14 is good.

The Q16/61/62 split doesn't make any sense. I think the original plan for the QT85 (basically, a Q16/Q28 combination) was a good idea. And then just run the QT48/49 (proposed Q61/62) full-time.

Q17 is generally good, but I'd run it along 132nd Street instead of 127th Street between 14th Avenue and 20th Avenue, to maintain the direct connection from Flushing to the College Point Shopping Center, and also keep the Q17 along a wider street.

Q18 streamlining in Maspeth makes sense.

Nice to see the Q19 get a span extension, but it's a shame it will come at the expense of a slower route from Corona to Flushing. I suppose it's to allow the Q23 to remain on 108th Street and not have to deviate to serve the  at 111th Street (with the Q19 from the north and the Q58 from the south, a good chunk of the Q23 riders are covered, and the rest can either walk from Roosevelt & 108th, or make their way to the Q14).

For the Q20, I think the Q62 could be rerouted to Beechurst, and allow the Q20 to terminate by the Cross Island Parkway. (Beechurst would get less frequent service, but it would more evenly distribute the ridership across those routes).

The Q21 reroute on the southern end is a good idea. On the northern end, I guess that's their way of somewhat maintaining the connection from Glendale to the  train for former Q29 riders.

The Q22 truncation on the western end was a long time coming, unfortunately. I'm disappointed they didn't create a route for Bayswater (e.g. Combining the Mott Avenue portion of the old Q22A with the Beach 9th Street portion of the present-day Q113/114).

The Q23/Q46 short-turn combination is odd, but I suppose there is something else to consider with that and the Q10/Q64 combination: Namely that the eastern end gets access to the Queens Blvd local (for example, for access to Queens Center Mall).

Q24 truncation to Broadway Junction makes lots of sense. B53 on the other hand...especially linked to the B32 of all routes...and the removal from Jamaica Hospital...I don't see what the Q42 has to do with it (other than the fact that 24 and 42 are transposed numbers...I really hope they weren't using that as a reason somehow). Just tell people that their alternative involves the Q54/55/56 or a backtrack on the train and call it a day.

I get that it's right by the College Point Depot, but they could've at least made an effort to have the Q25 serve at least a little bit of the residential section of College Point instead of ending it in the middle of nowhere.

I'm surprised the Q26 & Q27 are both basically going to match the present-day Q27 frequencies. I thought for sure one would see a cut, but in any case good for those riders I suppose...

Also a bit surprised they're having both the Q31 & Q76 run from Jamaica to College Point. I would assume at some point, they would start truncating some Q31s to only operate from Northern Blvd to Jamaica.

No comments for the Q32/33/35/37 changes. 

Glad they kept the eastern portion of the present-day Q38. The Juniper Blvd South routing should speed buses up a little bit through the area.

I was a bit taken aback by the extension of the Q39 on the northern/western end, but I suppose if it's truncated on the southern/eastern end, it shouldn't have too much of an impact on reliability. 

For the Q42, I think they should've just gone with a simple Brinkerhoff Avenue shuttle connecting to the Jamaica LIRR station. The Liberty Avenue portion is already covered by the Q65 & Q83, and as mentioned, the extension to Jamaica Hospital has absolutely nothing to do with the Q24.

Q43 extension to LIJ Hospital is good.

Q44 extension to Fordham Plaza is good.

Q45 is a good route, but it should run full-time (even if it means taking a bit of service from the Q1 and Q43). Would also provide some weekend service to Glen Oaks.

Q47 reroute to Woodside Avenue is pretty smart...provides some coverage over there and avoids traffic on Roosevelt Avenue, while also being a bit closer to Elmhurst Hospital. I don't think it needs to do the loop by Bulova, though.

Q49 getting 24/7 service is good. Don't really see a point in the extension east along Astoria Blvd, though. If anything, it should probably get cut back to 92nd Street, and use those resources to add a few trips to the Q19.

Nice to see the Q50 get 24/7 service. It would be nice if the rush hour service to Co-Op City ran like the BxM7 rather than making a full loop.

Nice to see they added some stops along Linden Blvd for the Q51. The route map shows it ending at Springfield Blvd, but the list of stops and the Remix map show it running to the present-day Q4 terminal.

Don't really see a point to the Q52 extension to Jackson Heights. If anything, considering the Q21 is also being extended, it makes sense to keep a reliable route starting at Hoffman Drive.

Q55 extension to Jamaica is good.

Q57...I'm warming up to the idea...provides a connection from eastern Queens to the  , though the vast majority of turnover will likely happen in Jamaica.

Q58/98: Definitely a good idea (and as a bonus, provides service on a small stretch of 111th Street, which is also near the busier section of the park, with the museum, zoo, and Hall of Science).

Q59 change in Brooklyn is definitely a good one.

I'd run the Q63 along 36th Avenue instead of 35th Avenue. I'd probably have it split Roosevelt Island with the Q104 (have one route cover the southern part and the other route cover the northern part). It's the only route from 21st Street to QBP, but most of those connections are available at Court Square anyway.

I don't think the Q83 is that slow along Liberty Avenue that it needs a full-time limited, but I guess that's also their way of maintaining the connection to the  train.

The Q66 should definitely have some short-turns at Northern Blvd & Broadway.

I still think the Q67 should run down Hunterspoint Avenue instead of Borden Avenue. I also think it should be truncated to end at Court Square.

Q68 is a good route.

I don't think it's necessary for the B62 to run to Astoria, but if it's doing so anyway, then I suppose the Q69 being turned into a rush route makes sense.

Wish the Q73 didn't have to run along Austin Street.

Q75 is a good idea. I suppose the different sections of Oakland Gardens trade a Jamaica route for a Flushing route, compared to the previous proposal (QT31 & QT33).

Q78 is a good idea. I'd extend it a little bit to Boundary Road to provide a connection to the Q7.

Q80 & Q82 are a good idea.

I'm surprised the Q85 will provide 24/7 service to Green Acres Mall, but good for any residents of that part of Valley Stream that use it, I suppose. (Though I assume the vast majority of riders at that stop are patrons of the mall itself)

They say no frequency or span changes to the Q88, but they made it a 24/7 route...assuming that's true (which I would assume so), that's a good thing.

Q105 is a good route.

Q109 is an interesting route...I suppose it's another way of ensuring a reliable Jamaica-Ozone Park connection, since the Q57 is coming from eastern Queens.

I'd add a stop by Rochdale Village on the Q111/114. Also, for the Q114, I'd run it down Beach 19th/20th Street, and have a shuttle route cover Beach 9th Street.

I can only assume that the B57 extension beyond Broadway & Roosevelt is due to lack of layover space.

For the express routes, I think the outbound routing should be via the Queens-Midtown Tunnel, so they don't have to take Van Dam Street and sit through that congested entrance to the LIE. Buses should do the inbound route in reverse (6th & Madison Avenue routes run down 5th Avenue, and 3rd Avenue routes run down Lexington Avenue). It'll save some unnecessary deadheading between 57th & 3rd and 6th & 36th. Maybe with the exception of the Queens Village express routes (but even then, it might not be a terrible idea...57th Street to 5th Avenue to 23rd Street to 1st Avenue, with a stop by the hospitals before getting in the tunnel). 

For the QM1/5/6, I don't see the need for off-peak service to skip stops west of 188th Street. The QM5 could cover QM4 riders along Jewel Avenue, and the QM6 should just make stops along Union Turnpike. The simplest thing is probably just to have that pattern, and run those routes hourly, instead of every 90 minutes. The hospital stop for the Downtown routes is a good idea. For the QM3, instead of eliminating it, they could try converting it to a Downtown route with a hospital stop. 

I made a route map of your proposal of having the QM3 serve Downtown Manhattan, but unlike all Downtown Manhattan Queens Express bus routes which travel down FDR Drive, the QM3 will travel down 34th Street, making 5 stops, then it'll travel non-stop along West Street, in this proposal, the QM3 has 29 stops bi-directional, 14 stops in Manhattan, and 15 stops in Queens. QM3 would now used the Long Island Expressway bi-directional and not Westbound only as it currently does, speeding up trips for riders going towards Little Neck. Finally, the QM3 will travel through Van Wyck Expressway instead of the Grand Central Parkway. 

[Via Garibaldi 8]

10 hours ago, Krocyoin said:

I made a route map of your proposal of having the QM3 serve Downtown Manhattan, but unlike all Downtown Manhattan Queens Express bus routes which travel down FDR Drive, the QM3 will travel down 34th Street, making 5 stops, then it'll travel non-stop along West Street, in this proposal, the QM3 has 29 stops bi-directional, 14 stops in Manhattan, and 15 stops in Queens. QM3 would now used the Long Island Expressway bi-directional and not Westbound only as it currently does, speeding up trips for riders going towards Little Neck. Finally, the QM3 will travel through Van Wyck Expressway instead of the Grand Central Parkway. 

There is nothing express about that trip. That's almost a three hour trip one way. For Downtown Loop express buses from Northeast Queens, it's usually almost a two hour trip end to end one way. You obviously are not aware of the traffic and congestion and haven't accounted for it either. 

Edited May 27, 2022 by Via Garibaldi 8

[BM5 via Woodhaven]

Also to add on to above, the LIE in the PM is a disaster when you get into the Maspeth. It's ridiculously slow, and you're better off on the service road where possible (but not by much). With some of the new routings on their proposed express network, you would need to have an HOV or a bus lane. The AM lane should be extended, and there should be a PM lane, with certain points of entry/exit for the different express routes. The entry points would also be helpful in the case of a breakdown somewhere in the lane, which wouldn't render the entire thing useless. 

Otherwise, routing buses on the LIE during the PM hours is straight up suicide. Those routes would be way too slow, like the existing routes are in that area, and would increase runtimes. I would keep them on Queens Boulevard if possible, because at the very least it moves better overall (even with all the lights). 

[Gotham Bus Co.]

13 hours ago, Krocyoin said:

I made a proposal based off your suggestion of extending the Q12 to Queens College, with another extension to the Great Neck LIRR Station, if you have any feedback, reply to this message. 

 

  NYCT's 2008 "expansion" plan included a  extension along Great Neck Road and Cutter Mill Road to Station Plaza. (Of course, that never happened.)

 

 Does it really need to go to Queens College? 

[Via Garibaldi 8]

53 minutes ago, BM5 via Woodhaven said:

Also to add on to above, the LIE in the PM is a disaster when you get into the Maspeth. It's ridiculously slow, and you're better off on the service road where possible (but not by much). With some of the new routings on their proposed express network, you would need to have an HOV or a bus lane. The AM lane should be extended, and there should be a PM lane, with certain points of entry/exit for the different express routes. The entry points would also be helpful in the case of a breakdown somewhere in the lane, which wouldn't render the entire thing useless. 

Otherwise, routing buses on the LIE during the PM hours is straight up suicide. Those routes would be way too slow, like the existing routes are in that area, and would increase runtimes. I would keep them on Queens Boulevard if possible, because at the very least it moves better overall (even with all the lights). 

That is exactly the point I made at the Zoom meeting last night, which is that there needs to be an HOV lane for the entire length of the LIE in both directions, and the upcoming meetings that I'm hosting/speaking at, I will note this again to the  reps. They thanked me for the feedback last night, but the truth of the matter is, no one thinks about these details that seem minor, but are major. In the Bronx Redesign, I was shocked to learn that despite them noting that parts of the plan required coordination with the DOT, no one had actually spoken with the DOT about that part of the plan. 

I'll add further to my QM3 comments and say that the West Side has its own congestion. There are just too many things that would need to go right to make such a route worthwhile. If it's going to stop near Penn Station, then it is directly competing with the LIRR, which is pointless. The QM3 is needed for areas AWAY from the LIRR, both in Queens and Manhattan.

Edited May 27, 2022 by Via Garibaldi 8

[7-express]

I just don't think there are any more good routes going east anymore, particular for NE Queens riders.  The LIE/Van Wyck alignment is suicide, Northern Blvd continues to get nerfed by lane restrictions and congestion, Astoria Blvd has slow flow in Corona, and the GCP is another bag of suicide.  Even the LIE to BQE route the SX takes is slow now since the BQE section is backed up from Jackson Heights south every day.

[MysteriousBtrain]

1 hour ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

That is exactly the point I made at the Zoom meeting last night, which is that there needs to be an HOV lane for the entire length of the LIE in both directions, and the upcoming meetings that I'm hosting/speaking at, I will note this again to the  reps. They thanked me for the feedback last night, but the truth of the matter is, no one thinks about these details that seem minor, but are major. In the Bronx Redesign, I was shocked to learn that despite them noting that parts of the plan required coordination with the DOT, no one had actually spoken with the DOT about that part of the plan. 

I'll add further to my QM3 comments and say that the West Side has its own congestion. There are just too many things that would need to go right to make such a route worthwhile. If it's going to stop near Penn Station, then it is directly competing with the LIRR, which is pointless. The QM3 is needed for areas AWAY from the LIRR, both in Queens and Manhattan.

Slightly off topic, but is there demand for flushing Exp bus service? Not to say the QM3 should be rerouted over there but I can see someone proposing that to replace/ combine QM3/X51 service. 

Going back to the QM3, if the route gets kept the route should run in a similar matter of LIE routes in the new plan, with nonstop service west of Main Street. Don't change anything in Manhattan. And if this goes through, there does need to be HOV lanes for the buses to be on. Everyday even for a city going back to pre-pandemic levels I never seen highways packed like this before.

[Krocyoin]

2 hours ago, Gotham Bus Co. said:

 

  NYCT's 2008 "expansion" plan included a  extension along Great Neck Road and Cutter Mill Road to Station Plaza. (Of course, that never happened.)

 

 Does it really need to go to Queens College? 

I made this based off someone's suggestion. 

[Krocyoin]

3 hours ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

There is nothing express about that trip. That's almost a three hour trip one way. For Downtown Loop express buses from Northeast Queens, it's usually almost a two hour trip end to end one way. You obviously are not aware of the traffic and congestion and haven't accounted for it either. 

Three hours???? It makes way less stops than the average Queens-Manhattan express bus route. According to google maps it's 1 hour, 23 Minutes by car, and buses make stops, so give or take, it'd be 2 hours to complete.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

10 minutes ago, Krocyoin said:

Three hours???? It makes way less stops than the average Queens-Manhattan express bus route. According to google maps it's 1 hour, 23 Minutes by car, and buses make stops, so give or take, it'd be 2 hours to complete.

It's usually an hour just to get into Midtown with no traffic. Then with no traffic, another 20 minutes across 34th St, then another 20 minutes to get Downtown and then another 10 minutes to do the Loop, so an hour 1 and 50 minutes with no traffic. That trip is impossible to do in an hour 23 minutes, unless there are almost no stops being made. It's clearly an hour and 23 minutes BY car, not via public transit.

[Gotham Bus Co.]

11 minutes ago, Krocyoin said:

Three hours???? It makes way less stops than the average Queens-Manhattan express bus route. According to google maps it's 1 hour, 23 Minutes by car, and buses make stops, so give or take, it'd be 2 hours to complete.

 

Did you check it on Google Maps during the AM rush (westbound) and PM rush (eastbound)?   

 

  Why not make just one stop on East 34th and then use the FDR like all the other Queens-to-Downtown routes in the redesign?

[Via Garibaldi 8]

48 minutes ago, MysteriousBtrain said:

Slightly off topic, but is there demand for flushing Exp bus service? Not to say the QM3 should be rerouted over there but I can see someone proposing that to replace/ combine QM3/X51 service. 

Going back to the QM3, if the route gets kept the route should run in a similar matter of LIE routes in the new plan, with nonstop service west of Main Street. Don't change anything in Manhattan. And if this goes through, there does need to be HOV lanes for the buses to be on. Everyday even for a city going back to pre-pandemic levels I never seen highways packed like this before.

It's hard to say because the demographics have changed considerably from back when the X51 ran. Some of the people that took the X51 at the time were concerned about subway crime. The folks that have moved in are more likely to take the subway now. 

@Gotham Bus Co. Those routes are already Downtown routes. The QM3 is a Midtown route. Different ridership bases.

[Krocyoin]

17 minutes ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

It's hard to say because the demographics have changed considerably from back when the X51 ran. Some of the people that took the X51 at the time were concerned about subway crime. The folks that have moved in are more likely to take the subway now. 

@Gotham Bus Co. Those routes are already Downtown routes. The QM3 is a Midtown route. Different ridership bases.

Subway crime has been going back up again, and the X51 serves a community of Asians, and we had a uprising of anti-Asian hate crime especially in subway stations so the X51 could do well if it did return, hell it had 10 trips to Manhattan in the AM and 8 trips to Queens in the PM before it got eliminated, also the X51 had better ridership it's final year of service than some current express bus routes.

[checkmatechamp13]

@Krocyoin Doing the Downtown Loop after going across 34th Street and down West Street would be way too long. It could do what the other Downtown routes do, and just take the FDR Drive, Water Street, and Church Street (possibly ending at the WFC if there is enough ridership). And reverse in the PM rush (run via Broadway instead of Church Street)

[Via Garibaldi 8]

2 minutes ago, Krocyoin said:

Subway crime has been going back up again, and the X51 serves a community of Asians, and we had a uprising of anti-Asian hate crime especially in subway stations so the X51 could do well if it did return, hell it had 10 trips to Manhattan in the AM and 8 trips to Queens in the PM before it got eliminated, also the X51 had better ridership it's final year of service than some current express bus routes.

The question is how many people would switch over from the subway? The areas further away could do better, but hard to say.

[Krocyoin]

3 minutes ago, checkmatechamp13 said:

@Krocyoin Doing the Downtown Loop after going across 34th Street and down West Street would be way too long. It could do what the other Downtown routes do, and just take the FDR Drive, Water Street, and Church Street (possibly ending at the WFC if there is enough ridership). And reverse in the PM rush (run via Broadway instead of Church Street)

Hmm okay, I'm currently working on a new proposal. 

[Krocyoin]

Edited May 27, 2022 by Krocyoin

[Krocyoin]

Just now, Krocyoin said:

This is my new proposal, after looking at feedback, I now have the QM3 running via FDR Drive, and I added a new route known as the QM33, which would run between Hudson Square and Little Neck, Via Houston Street and Northern Boulevard. 

[Krocyoin]

Just now, Krocyoin said:

This is my new proposal, after looking at feedback, I now have the QM3 running via FDR Drive, and I added a new route known as the QM33, which would run between Hudson Square and Little Neck, Via Houston Street and Northern Boulevard. 

The QM3 would make a total of 27 stops bi-directional (13 in Manhattan, and 14 in Queens). While the QM33 would make a total of 21 stops bi-directional (7 in Manhattan, and 14 in Queens).

[Via Garibaldi 8]

5 hours ago, Krocyoin said:

This is my new proposal, after looking at feedback, I now have the QM3 running via FDR Drive, and I added a new route known as the QM33, which would run between Hudson Square and Little Neck, Via Houston Street and Northern Boulevard. 

Hudson Square route? Based on what? lol

[BM5 via Woodhaven]

23 hours ago, MysteriousBtrain said:

Slightly off topic, but is there demand for flushing Exp bus service? Not to say the QM3 should be rerouted over there but I can see someone proposing that to replace/ combine QM3/X51 service. 

Going back to the QM3, if the route gets kept the route should run in a similar matter of LIE routes in the new plan, with nonstop service west of Main Street. Don't change anything in Manhattan. And if this goes through, there does need to be HOV lanes for the buses to be on. Everyday even for a city going back to pre-pandemic levels I never seen highways packed like this before.

 

22 hours ago, Krocyoin said:

Subway crime has been going back up again, and the X51 serves a community of Asians, and we had a uprising of anti-Asian hate crime especially in subway stations so the X51 could do well if it did return, hell it had 10 trips to Manhattan in the AM and 8 trips to Queens in the PM before it got eliminated, also the X51 had better ridership it's final year of service than some current express bus routes.

 

22 hours ago, Via Garibaldi 8 said:

The question is how many people would switch over from the subway? The areas further away could do better, but hard to say.

Regarding a Flushing express, while I wouldn't reinstate the X51, I would have the proposed QM5 make stops along Horace Harding Expressway (during off-peak hours). It would partially serve the areas the X51 did (the areas further away from the ). It's already proposed to run there, and it's a major corridor with virtually no other express bus route, subway, or LIRR line near it. Plus it wouldn't add too much time since the service road is rarely congested (sometimes it's better than the expressway itself), and relatively few traffic lights exist.

During peak hours, I would have a modified rendition of the existing QM10 serve Horace Harding Expressway while the QM5 operates non-stop along that corridor (which would make the QM10 more useful without having to get rid of it). I wonder if some express bus service on 46th Avenue is warranted, but something tells me that folks over there are content with the Q26/Q27. I don't see an express bus on Sanford doing too well nowadays, especially since both the Q12 +   and LIRR would offer similar, if not faster travel times into Manhattan. 

Edited May 28, 2022 by BM5 via Woodhaven

[checkmatechamp13]

22 hours ago, Krocyoin said:

This is my new proposal, after looking at feedback, I now have the QM3 running via FDR Drive, and I added a new route known as the QM33, which would run between Hudson Square and Little Neck, Via Houston Street and Northern Boulevard. 

I don't think the Northern Blvd has enough (express bus) ridership to justify two branches to different parts of Manhattan.

1 hour ago, BM5 via Woodhaven said:

Regarding a Flushing express, while I wouldn't reinstate the X51, I would have the proposed QM5 make stops along Horace Harding Expressway (during off-peak hours). It would partially serve the areas the X51 did (the areas further away from the ). It's already proposed to run there, and it's a major corridor with virtually no other express bus route, subway, or LIRR line near it.

I would tend to agree. The Q88 runs to a local subway stop, and the Q17 is somewhat of a backtrack (geographically speaking) even though Flushing does have express train service. 

[LTA1992]

On 5/27/2022 at 1:13 AM, Krocyoin said:

My main concern is the elimination of the QM3, yes it obviously has lower ridership than most other express bus routes in Queens but it is still used by a good chunk of riders, in 2019, the QM3 had a daily ridership of 104 riders, which is 17.33 riders per bus, which isn't filling close to filling a bus but it's proof that people ride it, the daily ridership did drop to 46 riders in 2020 but that was due to Covid-19. I think QM3's ridership can be boosted if more trips are added, and have it operate to/from downtown Manhattan, where the Port Washington Branch and the train can not serve. This could work out cause it'd be a one trip ride from Little Neck to Downtown Manhattan with no transfers needed. In another note I propose an off-peak and weekend Express bus fare of $4.75, the cheaper fare would get more people to ride the Express buses in general during the hours less people are riding it. 

I'm just here to ask if your name is a JoJo reference.

[bobtehpanda]

On 5/27/2022 at 1:28 PM, 7-express said:

I just don't think there are any more good routes going east anymore, particular for NE Queens riders.  The LIE/Van Wyck alignment is suicide, Northern Blvd continues to get nerfed by lane restrictions and congestion, Astoria Blvd has slow flow in Corona, and the GCP is another bag of suicide.  Even the LIE to BQE route the SX takes is slow now since the BQE section is backed up from Jackson Heights south every day.

What are the Chinatown vans doing these days?

Though, tbh even back in the day going east was kind of a crapshoot. You knew shit was going down if the vans started detouring through industrial Brooklyn streets. LIE gets f**ked up (particularly around Queens Blvd and Corona Park), GCP's f**ked up by LGA, BQE is the BQE, etc.

On 5/27/2022 at 2:45 PM, Krocyoin said:

Subway crime has been going back up again, and the X51 serves a community of Asians, and we had a uprising of anti-Asian hate crime especially in subway stations so the X51 could do well if it did return, hell it had 10 trips to Manhattan in the AM and 8 trips to Queens in the PM before it got eliminated, also the X51 had better ridership it's final year of service than some current express bus routes.

The Asians in the community take the Chinese vans, which are very well patronized.

They're faster, and cost less, than MTA routes, which is why the X51 failed in the first place. I'm not super convinced that you would be able to convince them to pay more money to switch to slower MTA service.