R10 2952 Posted January 3, 2010 Share #1 Posted January 3, 2010 Based on your own opinion, and careful analysis of each car class, which subway cars do you think are the best/worst? They can be any subway car that has ever ran in NYC. Give your reason(s) as to why you chose that rating. For example, these are my ratings: Worst: 1. R16- Very poor service record, slow, unreliable, badly neglected, prone to fires, dirty/filthy (between ~1973 and the end of its career) 2. IRT 'Composite'- prone to fires (when used for subway service), no Multiple Unit Door Control, mediocre service record, somewhat flimsy appearance/construction (at times) 3. BMT 'C'- clumsy construction/design, somewhat ugly appearance, sagging carbodies (in the last years of service or so) Best: 1. Redbirds (R17/26/27/28/29/30/33/36)- Good performance, excellent appearance, very iconic [All the same applies to the Greenbirds (R10, R33 "Green Machine") and WF cars as well] 2. R32/38/40/42- Reliable performance, attractive designs, somewhat historic 3. R1/4/6/7/9/10- Durable, vintage, pleasant appearance Other possible 'Best' candidates: Most BMT subway/el cars, most IRT subway/el cars, most SMEEs, R62/As, Low-Vs What would your ratings be? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LRG Posted January 3, 2010 Share #2 Posted January 3, 2010 Best: 1. R10-R42, with some exceptions: these cars revolutionized the braking system with SMEE technology that is sadly phasing out, but two very reliable cars are still providing reliable service with the technology. 2. Arnines: even at 80 years old, these trains haul you-know-what during revenue and museum trips, and there is no denying it. 3. R142A/R143: The MTA's most reliable NTTs, IMO. My only qualms are with the ATO system with the R143s on the but other than that I like them. Worst: 1. R16: I never rose them but from what I heard, they were too heavy and cumbersome and overall slow. No wonder the MTA wanted to get rid of them so badly. Some didn't even get to see 30 years. 2. R44: also too cumbersome and slow, and now with the problems they're giving it would make sense to take them out of service within the next year. 3. R160: The bulk at Jamaica makes me despise them even more because they aren't even being properly taken care of. Not to mention there are certain aspects of the car that I really can't trust, making me wonder if they'll last 30 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R10 2952 Posted January 3, 2010 Author Share #3 Posted January 3, 2010 3. R160: The bulk at Jamaica makes me despise them even more because they aren't even being properly taken care of. Not to mention there are certain aspects of the car that I really can't trust, making me wonder if they'll last 30 years. Agreed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2 Train Master Posted January 3, 2010 Share #4 Posted January 3, 2010 Worst:R44-slow,loud and not comfortable R42:Squeaky as heck in braking & cruves. Best:R142A & R143 reliable but R143 has loud a$$ HVAC R142A doesn't but they are fast they brake pretty good and are reliable. R160:Reliable but some have loud HVAC not good.Just an state of the art subway car seating is fair and space has increased.Powerful doors that won't just fall apart at any minute airbags work smooth when going fast in locations like Qns Blvd Line,Sea Beach,etc.And the FIND is great when its working because at least you don't have to get your a$$ up and walk to the other end of the car to look at a subway map you can just look up.When it doesn't work then do it old skool get up and look at the full map. In between:R46,68,62 & 32. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R68 Subway Car Posted January 3, 2010 Share #5 Posted January 3, 2010 Best R68: Solid MDBF performers, smooth rides, great design R68A: Solid MDBF performers, great ride, great design R32: The gold standard of old-school durability R160A: New look, nice ride, cool design, MDBF R160B: New look, nice ride, cool design, high MDBF R62: Solid MDBF performers, good from the start R62A: Solid MDBF performers R142: Solid MDBF performers R142A: Solid MDBF performers R143: Solid MDBF performers R38: Old school reliability Worst: R40 Slant: Structurally falling apart R42 CI: Flawed from beginning to end R44: Structurally falling apart, but performing way better mechanically R16: One of the worst cars of all time, one of the worst CARS OF ALL TIME! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R44 5278 Posted January 3, 2010 Share #6 Posted January 3, 2010 I don't want to get too extreme: Fine (Best and below): R68/A- Best ride in the system by far with very high MDBF R44- Their time is coming to an end, but I loved these very much for their exceptional ride and performance R62A- Best of the A Division by far in comfort and overall performance R160A/B- Most updated of the trains and one of the quietest (though the R160Bs can be loud esp. the Siemens sets). I prefer the R160A overall R46- Best rides on Queens Blvd, though their suspension could be better Not preferred (Worst and above): R32- Their exteriors are exceptional, but their ugly interiors never reflected their exteriors. I just don't get why I have the worst experiences with these trains in the worst times. R42- Drab, but at least never broke down on me. Also the only type to experience a roof leakage with. R142/A- How loud can the R142 HVACs get? Also, the Adtranz/Bombardier acceleration is loud and annoying. R143- Smooth but like the R142As, the Adtranz/Bombardier acceleration is loud and annoying. R62- I like the bucket seat and suspension, but why do these trains still flicker during 3rd Rails Gaps and brake abruptly like the old SMEEs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Art Vandelay Posted January 3, 2010 Share #7 Posted January 3, 2010 Best: R44- Most comfortable interior, some of the best HVAC, high capacity, smooth riding, etc. Worst: R44- While fairly reliable now, has been a lemon for nearly its whole life. Structural failings will likely result in the R32 and R42 fleets outlasting the R44. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KNIGHTRIDER3:16 Posted January 3, 2010 Share #8 Posted January 3, 2010 :tup::tup: :tup::tup: Subway .org takes credit but I'm not gonna state which is worst due to my dislikes and I know what will happen sooner or later so I'll stay posotive Thanks for understanding anyway some of you know which ones I hate anyway:p <R> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lilbluefoxie Posted January 3, 2010 Share #9 Posted January 3, 2010 Best: R142 - Bright Interiors, Features Strip Maps and display boards to show upcoming stops R143 - Same reasons as R142 R33 - Colorful Exteriors Worst: R46 - Dark, drab interiors, confusing LCD signs R40 - I honestly dont find the slant design attractive, despite what others say about them R38 - Aged terribly compared to the R32s Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bveguy Posted January 3, 2010 Share #10 Posted January 3, 2010 Best: R143/R142A - I just like it. All the SMEEs except the R46. - They're just good... The R46 is getting boring. The R68As are good just because I like their delay in the brakes and are one hell of a ride. And I think you know why I like the older ones. R1 - We can go for a joyride in that. Worst: R160 - Just gives me the shivers when I think of the junk. Get them outta here please. R46 - I wish they never purchased it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nel070 Posted January 3, 2010 Share #11 Posted January 3, 2010 THE BEST R-160 love the new cars nice and smooth ride the finds are a pleasure and very bright R-46 the best of the 75 footers love the lcd display they never age comfortable ride and morrrison-knudsen did an outstanding job rebuilding them they have another 15-20 years and jamaica maintains thems great THE WORST R-32S OLD The most unattractive exterior and interior and a pleasure to see them reefed and they were outdated R40/42 Rusted scrafittied up time to retire and outdated eye sore to the system Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJ MC Posted January 3, 2010 Share #12 Posted January 3, 2010 Please, watch the Nazi Banksters Crimes Ripple Effect at http://jforjustice.co.uk/banksters Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St Louis Car 09 Posted January 3, 2010 Share #13 Posted January 3, 2010 My best and worst..... Best R44-propulsion sounds great although sluggish.original 75 footer,Built by the St.Louis Car Company. R62(Kawasaki Rail Car)-Smooth ride,Technical soundness,Smmoth sheetmetal. R46-Speedy acceleration. R142(Bombardier)Smoother ride,Truck design.although heavier than R142A,European like intereior which is less of an eyesore than the R142A Worst R40M-What was the point. R38-Loud as a freight train,but yet faster than R32`S(No flame war please) R68/68A-nice but Could of had more to offer,no full width cab. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KeystoneRegional Posted January 4, 2010 Share #14 Posted January 4, 2010 Please, watch the Nazi Banksters Crimes Ripple Effect at http://jforjustice.co.uk/banksters Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St Louis Car 09 Posted January 4, 2010 Share #15 Posted January 4, 2010 If anything I think the R44 (NYCT) rebuilds are in worst shape and has the loudest whirling motors:( .At least MK`s version could last a lil longer:). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R32 3838 Posted January 4, 2010 Share #16 Posted January 4, 2010 The Best: R32 the best subways cars that I have been on R10 never rode them but just looking at them R38's fast, reliable and looks like an upgraded R32 R33ML/WF, They were the best Redbirds R26/R28's, Great perfromance R46, Very comfortable R142A's The Best NTT out there The Wrost R44, Pure Junk Westinghouse R29's ,They have a ton of problems R160's Very annoying R142's, Just the way it looks would make you sick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SubwayGuy Posted January 4, 2010 Share #17 Posted January 4, 2010 OK I'll put a few of the "best" and "worst" out there. When putting this together it is important to note that I looked at each car IN ITS TIME. Therefore it would be incorrect to knock older equipment for things like "not having A/C" or "not having a PA system". So these represent the best of the best FOR THEIR TIME in my opionion and the worst FOR THEIR TIME. BEST #3 - R32 As originally equipped, these cars had pep, but more importantly were the first stainless steel car ordered in bulk for the TA when they came in 1963-64. They've always been reliable, and their bodies have proven extremely durable. The only "fleet wide" problem that applied to these cars was only to those that were overhauled in Phase II that got NYAB equipment. Other than that they've been pretty reliable, and were very good cars for their time. They were miles ahead of the "redbirds" ordered around the same time. #2 - R1/9's These cars had extremely strong, durable body construction, and made the innovation to combine the size of a BMT car (well almost) with the speed of an IRT car. They were always a great ride. Also many of the early cars did not have bulkhead signage (only the D types, BMT multis/experimentals, and WF Lo-V had it) and these cars did. #1 - A/B Standards Quite possibly one of the best cars built for its time ever. Extremely strong construction. There were two A/B's that got into dustups with newer SMEE cars (an R16 and an R30 if memory serves) late in their lives and yet those other cars built to more modern specs still took the worst of the impact. Though they were slow and heavy they incorporated a number of design specs that would be go on to be used for many years in all cars (and later modernized - including the first rollsigns and interior door controls), and had a very comfortable, spread out interior. Worst #3 R-29 NYCT had a longstanding tradition of having ACF build part, or most, of its car orders through the R-28, and ACF by and large built reliable and durable cars. The R-29 went to St. Louis. A number of problems with these cars came up, particularly by the end of their service lives, and many of them were the poorest performers of the "redbird" car classes. #2 R-44 While the R-46's biggest problems were linked almost exclusively to truck design, the R44 frequently had electrical problems when delivered. The P-wire braking system was a failure, and all sorts of simple things such as the car being on a curve could cause a fault in the P-wire circuit that would apply the brakes and refuse to release them. Other electronic equipment on the cars made work difficult for car inspectors (and even T/O's who had an electronic "card" that controlled some some aspects of the train, which if it came out, would cause brakes to apply), they just had problems from the start. Add to that their poor door motors, and now problems with their frame, and they can go on this list. While these cars did introduce many new things and brought passenger comfort standards to a whole new level, they have however had more than their fair share of problems. #1 R-16 These cars were plagued with problems from the start. Door motor problems led them to be replaced with the bulky things that give the car its odd interior design. Debris catching in the grids underneath the car which were cooled by forced air (sucking debris in) could catch fire and cause track fires. They were basically mechanical lemons most of their service lives. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forest Glen Posted January 4, 2010 Share #18 Posted January 4, 2010 Best R46-after a rocky start (Rockwell Trucks) the R46 received a GOH and became one of the most reliable, attractive,and comfortable cars Worst R32-ugly, screeching brakes, no AC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nova RTS 9147 Posted January 4, 2010 Share #19 Posted January 4, 2010 R142's, Just the way it looks would make you sick. For subway cars with HVAC's as loud as they are, you would think it'd be super cold in there, but instead its barely cold. Those subway cars annoy the hell out of me. As for me, The Best -R160 Siemens -R142As -R32s (Not my personal favorite, but they're the best damn subway cars the MTA has ever purchased) -R42s -R40 Slants (I loved the way they looked) -R62/As (Nostalgia) The R44s have a weird place in my heart. They're built like crap and are probably the worst things the MTA has ever ordered, but they literally ushered in a new era of subway cars for the city. -First to have door chimes -First full width cab subway cars (ignoring the fact that said cabs are tiny) -While they weren't the first to come in married sets (The Triplex's), they did start off that trend officially. -Not to mention the fastest subway cars ever built (ignoring all of the mechanical issues that came with said speed). They also have a nice brake release sound. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nel070 Posted January 4, 2010 Share #20 Posted January 4, 2010 If anything I think the R44 (NYCT) rebuilds are in worst shape and has the loudest whirling motors:( .At least MK`s version could last a lil longer:). agreed i think the coney island rebuilts are in the worst shape, they should have let morrison-knudsen rebuild all the 44s like they did with the 46s Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St Louis Car 09 Posted January 4, 2010 Share #21 Posted January 4, 2010 At that particular time,MK had their hands full with..... 1)Rebuilding 754 R46 cars 2)finishing up the R32s and R42`s 3)The M6 order for metro-north May I continue? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St Louis Car 09 Posted January 4, 2010 Share #22 Posted January 4, 2010 agreed i think the coney island rebuilts are in the worst shape, they should have let morrison-knudsen rebuild all the 44s like they did with the 46sWhat the hell was (NYCT) thinking when rebulding the R44s? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R44 5278 Posted January 4, 2010 Share #23 Posted January 4, 2010 If anything I think the R44 (NYCT) rebuilds are in worst shape and has the loudest whirling motors:( .At least MK`s version could last a lil longer:). The whirling motors have nothing to do with how well a train performs. Like SubwayGuy stated many times, it's just a harmless metallurgical quirk in the traction motors. If you want to see loud ones, then nothing beats the R68s such as 2829. At that particular time,MK had their hands full with..... 1)Rebuilding 754 R46 cars Correction, 752 as 2 were totaled right before the GOH. What the hell was (NYCT) thinking when rebulding the R44s? Saving money just as they did with the R42s. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St Louis Car 09 Posted January 4, 2010 Share #24 Posted January 4, 2010 I wasn`t making a connection between the whirring noise and performance.The whirring noise is annoying to some and that was the connection I was trying to make.Thanks for the correction of the R46 count.Didn`t two of them go to the transit museum (Bi-centennial cars)? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NX Express Posted January 4, 2010 Share #25 Posted January 4, 2010 Best: R68/A- Very reliable R160A/B- Three FINDs in each car:tup:, too young to have gone through the test of age R40S- Sleek design, with stainless steel would have been 110% Worst: R16-From what I heard, :eek::mad::tdown::eek::mad::tdown::eek::mad::tdown: R46 because it cost the so much money with the Rockwell trucks:mad::mad: Middle: R32- Sorry to all the foamers, but it's just too old already. Squeaks and squeals like ****. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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