Via Garibaldi 8 Posted February 3, 2013 Share #351 Posted February 3, 2013 Well this tells me that the fare-hikes are justifiable actually. I'm gotta expect people bitching about this on the bus soon, huh? (As usual ) Whatever.... Proposals anybody? Well this is something being talked about across the board... When do the fares become too high and no longer attractive.... MetroNorth for example will continue to grow because an overwhelming majority can afford it but there are folks that use MetroNorth that scrap together the monies to do so that will now have to give up MetroNorth and switch to using another route.... Perhaps buses... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Metro CSW Posted February 3, 2013 Share #352 Posted February 3, 2013 Got my Bx15 back on page 17, with one post suggesting it would fail. I'd like some more feedback on it. Yeah, I would of extended the BxM10. Well this is something being talked about across the board... When do the fares become too high and no longer attractive.... MetroNorth for example will continue to grow because an overwhelming majority can afford it but there are folks that use MetroNorth that scrap together the monies to do so that will now have to give up MetroNorth and switch to using another route.... Perhaps buses... I guess it's kinda like that mental war of thinking: What's faster vs. What's cheaper, In my opinion. I just kinda made that up on the spot, I hope you know what I meant. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Garibaldi 8 Posted February 3, 2013 Share #353 Posted February 3, 2013 Yeah, I would of extended the BxM10. Unless that would be a short extension, I don't see that happening either... Another route that's roughly an hour or so (which is what the prefers for most express buses... Extensions=longer route, more expensive to run and more potential for unreliable service which the regular customers would not be thrilled about. I guess it's kinda like that mental war of thinking: What's faster vs. What's cheaper, In my opinion. I just kinda made that up on the spot, I hope you know what I meant. Yeah I follow.... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Metro CSW Posted February 3, 2013 Share #354 Posted February 3, 2013 (edited) Dude, Sometimes I wonder why you're not a Veteran Member like GC. Edited February 3, 2013 by Metro CSW 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Garibaldi 8 Posted February 3, 2013 Share #355 Posted February 3, 2013 Dude, Sometimes I wonder why you're not a Veteran Member like GC. He joined earlier than I did... I'm no expert per se... I just know what I know from using the system, the time I worked with the and from discussions with my uncle who is a B/Ow/Quill. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Metro CSW Posted February 3, 2013 Share #356 Posted February 3, 2013 Eh, good enough. Alright enough interview..... Next post. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B35 via Church Posted February 3, 2013 Share #357 Posted February 3, 2013 What's the consensus on the BxM15 (or 12, it's just a name), shit, good, or has potential? It goes through a part of Bx that doesn't seem to have much in terms of transit coverage. Got my Bx15 back on page 17, with one post suggesting it would fail. I'd like some more feedback on it. You may as well run it up baychester to nereid & have it end over on mundy lane... there's no point in having express buses shoot across sandford; that area could use local bus service before express service... lol.... Anyway, a Laconia express route huh... I think this would take some riders off the BxM11 specifically, but I'm not sure if it would draw enough riders on its own, otherwise.... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Culver Posted February 3, 2013 Share #358 Posted February 3, 2013 You may as well run it up baychester to nereid & have it end over on mundy lane... there's no point in having express buses shoot across sandford; that area could use local bus service before express service... lol.... Anyway, a Laconia express route huh... I think this would take some riders off the BxM11 specifically, but I'm not sure if it would draw enough riders on its own, otherwise.... This is where those RTS Express buses the MTA turned down would've been nice, eh? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Garibaldi 8 Posted February 3, 2013 Share #359 Posted February 3, 2013 This is where those RTS Express buses the MTA turned down would've been nice, eh? Who is exactly would this route be aimed at #1 and #2 what is up with these so called Bronx routes ending in Westchester??? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Culver Posted February 3, 2013 Share #360 Posted February 3, 2013 (edited) Who is exactly would this route be aimed at #1 and #2 what is up with these so called Bronx routes ending in Westchester??? People with no transit service in their neighborhood and the 5, 2/5, BxM10 and BxM11 a drive or long walk away. Like I said, this wasn't my most diligently-planned route. Just wondering if there's any potential. Route doesn't have to end in Westchester. Just saw a good spot for a terminal. It can end the few blocks to the west where it would stay in the Bronx. Edited February 3, 2013 by Culver 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qjtransitmaster Posted February 3, 2013 Share #361 Posted February 3, 2013 Would work if traffic was snappy on McLean, Katonah and East 233. which it isn't!!! Let westchester folks just use MNRR you are beating a dead horse it is too late for the 4C. Let it die. Also: just looked at BxM4 service map, and that looks like the least "express" route in express route history. It makes all local stops in The Bronx down to 158 St, crosses a bridge and makes the usual express bus stops in Manhattan. It's a long-distance Limited route with 45-foot express coaches; and it runs along a subway line. Basically it's useless more than half the trips are empty I know I had a few rush hour trips with me and less than 10 ppl real sad. It is the definition of waste you look up waste in the dictionary and you will see a pic of the BXM4 with very few folks on it. If anything it should either be reduced to hours when it actually carries OR canned completely and extend select 30 min BX1 LTD trips to 122nd and 2nd and make it a transfer stop for other express buses so folks can keep some service to manhattan with the abysmal ridership I am sure BX1 LTD can handle it with ease. It is a symbol of BS there are lines with 3 times the ridership of this pathetic excuse of an express route that are rush hour only. Even SE queens routes with peak direction only and duplication of LIRR too boot have more ridership than this line even when the economy was good it was pitiful. It provides an alternative for those who want a quick run to the city and don't want to use the MNRR or the subway and also provides an alternative to folks that are going to Yankees games. Even with the stops, the route is still only about one hour from end to end. I know what the schedule states but that's only if there is traffic/and or tons of passengers. Most runs finish quicker. Having runs over one hour makes it easier for them to be targeted to be cut since they cost more as the run time gets longer so it would be best to keep it the way it is. If anything the has cut back on the number of stops on that line which has cut down the run time. LOL defending the useless line again are we what point of low ridership duplicate do you not understand? It is nothing more than a closed-door LTD to manhattan it's useless every possible use can be beaten with MNRR or any other commute it is the ONLY full-time express bus with fewer than 500 riders it's OVERSERVED!!!!! BM4 has half the service and DOUBLE THE RIDERSHIP!!! Seriously that is effed up. The abysmal BM5 does better. Woodlawn riders have money and can use the faster MNRR anyway. Grand concourse has zero need for an express bus of any kind. Resulted in a 13%+ decease in annual ridership (Want from 182K in 2009 to 118K currently or last in the last three-four years). So sad. err look at it's route pattern. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreatOne2k Posted February 3, 2013 Share #362 Posted February 3, 2013 Here we go with this again... Let me be in clear in saying we would fight tooth and nail against any extension to Yonkers. The BxM3 which is also a Riverdale express bus (albeit it Downstairs Riverdale) excluding it not terminating in Yonkers is sufficient enough and if they aren't using that then that means there is no reason to extend any other NYC buses there past the city borderline, lengthening routes unnecessarily and making them potentially more unreliable and more expensive to operate to Westchester on the city's dime. Completely ridiculous. City taxes should be going for city services. We're already cleaning up their mess with the BxM18 picking up BxM4C riders. Enough is enough with this utter concern about Westchester residents while using city dollars. NYC NEEDS MORE BUS SERVICE. Let's worry about what we need and let Westchester deal with their problems. MTA proposed a Bx7 extension in 2007 to Ludlow MNR. Bx34 had a proposed extension to Mount Vernon sometime in the early 1990s A BxM4 extension to Yonkers Raceway was also discussed between Rob Astorino and Jay Walder (probably the best thing for the BxM4 at this point to boost its ridership, could still happen if the BxM4C got canned completely). W45, W54, W60, W61, and W62 are open door in the Bronx (except Fordham Road) and serve parts of the Bronx that the MTA doesn't serve, so the city and MTA do get some "help" from Westchester. MTA was even proposing to cut weekend Bx30 service, which would have left Boston Road on the weekends completely with only the W60 and W61. BxM18 picking up BxM4C riders isn't a problem, the BxM18 picks up many express bus riders needing to go downtown, unless you want the BxM18 to be only for Riverdale and everyone else should have their own buses to Downtown. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Garibaldi 8 Posted February 3, 2013 Share #363 Posted February 3, 2013 (edited) MTA proposed a Bx7 extension in 2007 to Ludlow MNR.Bx34 had a proposed extension to Mount Vernon sometime in the early 1990s A BxM4 extension to Yonkers Raceway was also discussed between Rob Astorino and Jay Walder (probably the best thing for the BxM4 at this point to boost its ridership, could still happen if the BxM4C got canned completely). W45, W54, W60, W61, and W62 are open door in the Bronx (except Fordham Road) and serve parts of the Bronx that the MTA doesn't serve, so the city and MTA do get some "help" from Westchester. MTA was even proposing to cut weekend Bx30 service, which would have left Boston Road on the weekends completely with only the W60 and W61. BxM18 picking up BxM4C riders isn't a problem, the BxM18 picks up many express bus riders needing to go downtown, unless you want the BxM18 to be only for Riverdale and everyone else should have their own buses to Downtown. Well the BxM18 hasn't been extended to specifically serve Westchester riders. It's already there and BxM4C riders can benefit from it being there so fine, but we should not be taking city taxes to extend routes to Westchester at a time when the city is in need of more bus service to deal with Westchester's service issues. The idea is completely absurd and that's one reason why the is so ****** financially now from propping up services that don't primarily serve city riders that are heavily subsidized on city dollars. It's a set up that residents in the city have been pissed about for years too, and I agree. Those Westchester routes have been there and are there moreso to benefit Westchester riders more than anything, but the Bee Line knew very well what they were doing when they cut the BxM4C from Downtown and now we're going to propose sending more of our service to deal with their problems. If they're cutting their service back from the city, one would be very naïve to think that they're going to pony up monies for city extensions into Westchester. Furthermore, just about each proposal that you've mentioned so far would make said city bus more unreliable than it is already. The Bx7 bunches terribly just going to the city border, so extending it could potentially make the service worse. Also it seems like most of the proposals on the table were before the recession hit. In short, you want to start sending city service to Westchester, then they had better make damn sure that Westchester pays their share for the service #1 (which as I said earlier I don't see happening) and #2 find a way to keep the service reliable (which the is terrible with when it comes to extensions), otherwise you're shooting yourself in the foot. How exactly would the BxM4 work when it already is over an hour from end to end and you've got folks complaining about the amount of stops? Extending it further north would more than likely mean some city stops would be eliminated which would piss off city residents, so I'd to see how that would work... Edited February 3, 2013 by Via Garibaldi 8 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Garibaldi 8 Posted February 3, 2013 Share #364 Posted February 3, 2013 (edited) LOL defending the useless line again are we what point of low ridership duplicate do you not understand? It is nothing more than a closed-door LTD to manhattan it's useless every possible use can be beaten with MNRR or any other commute it is the ONLY full-time express bus with fewer than 500 riders it's OVERSERVED!!!!! BM4 has half the service and DOUBLE THE RIDERSHIP!!! Seriously that is effed up. The abysmal BM5 does better. Woodlawn riders have money and can use the faster MNRR anyway. Grand concourse has zero need for an express bus of any kind.err look at it's route pattern. The BxM4 is not useless... What the should do is study the BxM4 further and re-structure it but any re-structuring would more than likely mean some community (the Grand Concourse area) would get screwed with the elimination of stops. The issue here is MONEY. The BxM4 outside of Woodlawn serves primarily poor areas of the Bronx and with the economy sagging that issue has been further exacerbated. I am hearing that gentrification is happening along the Concourse, but very slowly so perhaps things could improve later on but I do recall some stops being eliminated on the Concourse which residents didn't like. Edited February 3, 2013 by Via Garibaldi 8 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Metro CSW Posted February 3, 2013 Share #365 Posted February 3, 2013 My thought exactly.^ 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qjtransitmaster Posted February 3, 2013 Share #366 Posted February 3, 2013 The BxM4 is not useless... What the should do is study the BxM4 further and re-structure it but any re-structuring would more than likely mean some community (the Grand Concourse area) would get screwed with the elimination of stops. The issue here is MONEY. The BxM4 outside of Woodlawn serves primarily poor areas of the Bronx and with the economy sagging that issue has been further exacerbated. I am hearing that gentrification is happening along the Concourse, but very slowly so perhaps things could improve later on but I do recall some stops being eliminated on the Concourse which residents didn't like.want to make it useful run service to match its low ridership it has no business running till 10 pm at all. Eliminating grand concourse would be the best thing for the route. The northern part of bxm11 north of gun hill has very low off peak ridership. Let modified 11 run via gun hill rd to woodlawn on bxm4's route while retaining its strong segment. You still haven't provided a non bias argument to defend it it is the only full time route with fewer than 500 weekday riders. My thought exactly.^HOLD ON speaking of which what part of bxm3 gets more how many use it on broadway? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turbo19 Posted February 3, 2013 Share #367 Posted February 3, 2013 want to make it useful run service to match its low ridership it has no business running till 10 pm at all. Eliminating grand concourse would be the best thing for the route. The northern part of bxm11 north of gun hill has very low off peak ridership. Let modified 11 run via gun hill rd to woodlawn on bxm4's route while retaining its strong segment. You still haven't provided a non bias argument to defend it it is the only full time route with fewer than 500 weekday riders. And it's obvious you just want to eliminate the BxM4C, even if it means extensions of MTA routes that would end up costing more. If Westchester can afford to operate that route for the time time being then let them operate it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Metro CSW Posted February 3, 2013 Share #368 Posted February 3, 2013 HOLD ON speaking of which what part of bxm3 gets more how many use it on broadway? Sorry, you're gonna have to remix the question a little bit.... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qjtransitmaster Posted February 3, 2013 Share #369 Posted February 3, 2013 (edited) And it's obvious you just want to eliminate the BxM4C, even if it means extensions of MTA routes that would end up costing more. If Westchester can afford to operate that route for the time time being then let them operate it. DUDE I never suggested extending any MTA line to westchester. They don't need it. MNRR is good enough and cheaper than the bxm4C it is a shadow of it's former self. @VG8 & METRO CSW How much of the bxm3's ridedship is on s broadway? I know almost nobody uses it in yonkers but within the bronx excluding sedwick? Edited February 3, 2013 by qjtransitmaster 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Metro CSW Posted February 3, 2013 Share #370 Posted February 3, 2013 (edited) How much of the bxm3's ridedship is on s broadway? I know almost nobody uses it in yonkers but within the bronx excluding sedwick? Survey says, currently 690/weekly. Down from 720. Not bad. Edited February 3, 2013 by Metro CSW 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qjtransitmaster Posted February 3, 2013 Share #371 Posted February 3, 2013 Survey says, currently 690/weekly. Down from 720. Not bad.I meant on that segment alone not the whole route. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Metro CSW Posted February 3, 2013 Share #372 Posted February 3, 2013 (edited) I meant on that segment alone not the whole route. Yes, there's your answer. You think that amount was for one bus only? Edited February 3, 2013 by Metro CSW 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Culver Posted February 3, 2013 Share #373 Posted February 3, 2013 So how do we fix the BxM4? Less stops on Grand Concourse? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYCtrainfan01 Posted February 3, 2013 Share #374 Posted February 3, 2013 So how do we fix the BxM4? Less stops on Grand Concourse? That already happened... Folks were not too happy with that... 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Culver Posted February 3, 2013 Share #375 Posted February 3, 2013 That already happened... Folks were not too happy with that... So then just make it a local route all the way. Not really an express line if it makes all stops on GC and then Manhattan. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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