MysteriousBtrain Posted November 22, 2014 Share #1726 Posted November 22, 2014 extend the Bx1 to Riverdale Ave/246th St. extend the Bx2 to Broadway/238th St. and revert back to 165th St/Melrose Ave route. extend the Bx4 to Pelham Bay extend the Bx8 to Wakefield-241st St. extend the Bx10 to Woodlawn to replace the Bx34 via Grand Concourse, Van Cortlandt Park Ave, Bainbridge Ave instate a new route the Bx14 from Riverdale: Mosholu Ave/Fieldston Rd to Fordham Plz. via Fieldston Rd, Mosholu Ave, HH Pkwy, Johnson Ave, 231st St, Bailey Ave, Fordham Rd extend the Bx16 to Fordham Center via Valentine/Bainbridge Avs. extend the Bx19 to Lehman College extend the Bx22 to Lehman College full time eliminate the Bx24, replace with the Bx31 extend the Bx26 from Bedford Park to 192nd St/Valentine Ave. eliminate the Bx34 extend the Bx41 to Alexander Ave/135th St reinstate the Bx55 from Williamsbridge to the Hub full time 7 days a week Bx1: It dosen't need to be longer, you could use the Bx10 instead. Bx2:The return of Melrose service is a good idea, but why extend it to 238 Street when you can use both the Bx1 and Bx3 for Riverdale service? Bx4: Sure why not DUPLICATE THE SOME MORE since it won't WASTE MONEY anyway? Bx8: Not sure about this one, but seems decent. Bx10: What about Norwood service? Bx14: Like everyone said, the original route was discontinued due to low ridership. Bx16/Bx34: I guess, but people would be upset about the loss of the Bx34. Why do you thing weekend service got restored on the Bx34? Bx19: I guess it won't hurt for it to connect to the Bx26, but that's about it. Bx22: No comment. Bx24/Bx31: Apparently, Hutchinson Metro Center service does not matter to you. Also, I think the Bx31 is long enough. Bx26: Happened in 1990's, discontinued shortly after. Bx41: I always wondered why it got cut to 149th Street.... Bx55: You have to fight the Bx15 LTD and Bx41 SBS for this to happen. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BxM4Woodlawn Posted November 22, 2014 Share #1727 Posted November 22, 2014 Bx1: It dosen't need to be longer, you could use the Bx10 instead. Bx2:The return of Melrose service is a good idea, but why extend it to 238 Street when you can use both the Bx1 and Bx3 for Riverdale service? Bx4: Sure why not DUPLICATE THE SOME MORE since it won't WASTE MONEY anyway? Bx8: Not sure about this one, but seems decent. Bx10: What about Norwood service? Bx14: Like everyone said, the original route was discontinued due to low ridership. Bx16/Bx34: I guess, but people would be upset about the loss of the Bx34. Why do you thing weekend service got restored on the Bx34? Bx19: I guess it won't hurt for it to connect to the Bx26, but that's about it. Bx22: No comment. Bx24/Bx31: Apparently, Hutchinson Metro Center service does not matter to you. Also, I think the Bx31 is long enough. Bx26: Happened in 1990's, discontinued shortly after. Bx41: I always wondered why it got cut to 149th Street.... Bx55: You have to fight the Bx15 LTD and Bx41 SBS for this to happen. I remember the Bx26 running there in the 90s. Dont know why it was cut out. the Bx41 should go back to 135th St, also why was it cut down to Gun Hill Road from 241st St. The Bx10 would be there in Woodlawn where the Bx34 went to so they would still have bus service. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MysteriousBtrain Posted November 22, 2014 Share #1728 Posted November 22, 2014 I remember the Bx26 running there in the 90s. Dont know why it was cut out. the Bx41 should go back to 135th St, also why was it cut down to Gun Hill Road from 241st St. The Bx10 would be there in Woodlawn where the Bx34 went to so they would still have bus service. The Bx41 is more frequent than the Bx39, so it was easier to switch their northern terminals. As for the Bx10, there are too much turns to use if it is extended to Woodlawn. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Garibaldi 8 Posted November 22, 2014 Share #1729 Posted November 22, 2014 I remember the Bx26 running there in the 90s. Dont know why it was cut out. the Bx41 should go back to 135th St, also why was it cut down to Gun Hill Road from 241st St. The Bx10 would be there in Woodlawn where the Bx34 went to so they would still have bus service. The folks in Woodlawn want the Bx31 and Bx34 as is. The Bx10 is too unreliable as it is. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B35 via Church Posted November 27, 2014 Share #1730 Posted November 27, 2014 (edited) extend the Bx1 to Riverdale Ave/246th St. extend the Bx2 to Broadway/238th St. and revert back to 165th St/Melrose Ave route. extend the Bx4 to Pelham Bay extend the Bx8 to Wakefield-241st St. extend the Bx10 to Woodlawn to replace the Bx34 via Grand Concourse, Van Cortlandt Park Ave, Bainbridge Ave instate a new route the Bx14 from Riverdale: Mosholu Ave/Fieldston Rd to Fordham Plz. via Fieldston Rd, Mosholu Ave, HH Pkwy, Johnson Ave, 231st St, Bailey Ave, Fordham Rd extend the Bx16 to Fordham Center via Valentine/Bainbridge Avs. extend the Bx19 to Lehman College extend the Bx22 to Lehman College full time eliminate the Bx24, replace with the Bx31 extend the Bx26 from Bedford Park to 192nd St/Valentine Ave. eliminate the Bx34 extend the Bx41 to Alexander Ave/135th St reinstate the Bx55 from Williamsbridge to the Hub full time 7 days a week Bx1: Simply put, riverdale has no use for concourse service, and the current Bx10 (which runs deeper into riverdale, mind you) & the Bx1 run in the same general area b/w riverdale/231st & tracey towers.... Riverdalians in general, aren't even riding that far on the 10 (tracey towers), so there is no real reason to run Bx1's in Riverdale.... Bx2: While I agree that the Bx2 should end elsewhere, there's no where to terminate more buses over there by 238th (being that the Bx2 is an artic route, that definitely doesn't help matters), and you don't need anymore buses making that u-turn just west of the el anyway..... It's enough that the Bx3 has to do that shit... As far as reverting the via Melrose & the via 165th routing, I agree with that.... Never wanted Bx2's running along 149th st. from jump. Bx4: Inefficient to run it to PBP (pelham bay park); the current situation with buses ending at Westchester Sq. is the best you're gonna get... You'd benefit too few riders... Bx8: For what..... The Bx8 north of Westchester Sq. is a huge coverage route, and it is used as such.... It's enough that it terminates arbitrarily at 225th (well technically, 226th/WPR)..... The Bx31, Bx39 (now, thanks to the 39/41 terminal swap), and the Bx16 is all the service you need up there (Wakefield area)... You're not gonna take riders off the Bx31 (which also runs to Westchester Sq.) running Bx8's up to Wakefield, if that's the thinking... Bx10: There's another member on here (cotb16) that's suggested Bx10's run up to Woodlawn - Katonah av.... Didn't care for it then, and I still don't think 10's should run north of 205th ... The Bx10 meanders enough with its current routing.... See here, if you want to create a rift between Riverdalians (especially the folks along the henry hudson pkwy side) & Woodlawn patrons, extend Bx10's up to Woodlawn.... Riverdalians have little use for the Bx10 east of Broadway... Woodlawn patrons have little use for the Bx34 south of the .... The Bx10 already suffers from unreliability as it is... It would only worsen with an extension up to Woodlawn. "Bx14": This is more or less the old Bx24 that ran to Riverdale, which no longer exists.... I don't see a need to connect both "sides" of Riverdale (meaning the riverdale av side & the henry hudson pkwy side), to Fordham anyway..... The few people on the HHP side can continue transferring the Bx9 & be done with it..... Bx16: There's a common theme here with your ideas, and it's obvious.... You want to do away with the more shorter routes in the system & extend already established routes over them, which is poor planning.... This plan of eliminating the Bx34 to have the Bx10 take on the northern portion & the Bx16 to take on the southern portion will result in the creation of two winding, unreliable routes... Bx19: This route has enough (pax.) to deal with within Manhattan alone, for it to be running all the way over to Lehman.... Even if there is a demand for what's being suggested, simply put, the route would have to be split.... The Bx19 ending where it does, is not much more these days than a convenient turnaround spot..... Bx22: Gross waste of resources.... The demand from the south is for the short turn routing... We're lucky there's still as much Lehman College service as there currently is... Which is why I say the service distribution on this route should be left alone.... Bx24: ....but, you also want the Bx4 running to Pelham bay. You would send much too much service to(wards) PBP... All that bus service along Westchester av (extended Bx4's & extended Bx31's) east of Westchester Sq. is nothing more than overkill.... The result of this plan would yield a very noticable increase of emptier buses past Westchester Sq..... Absolutely wasteful. Bx26: Is this your way of restoring the service that was lost on the Bx28 (of which, runs to valentine/192nd)? Because the last thing the 28 needs, is help from an additional route to fordham..... Bx34: The one thing I have noticed with this route in the past 2-3 years or so, is that ever since the old Bx28 (via all sections of co-op) was split into today's 28 & 38, there seems to have been an increase of usage b/w Fordham & Norwood (Gun Hill rd/Bainbridge).... They f*cked up the 28 to the point where the Bx38 has become more prevalent over the 28 for the masses that utilize it to/from Gun Hill from the east.... What did that mean for the Bx34? With the decrease in service on the Bx28, enough of the Fordham riders (that aren't riding east of Bainbridge) seemed to have gravitated to it.... Doesn't help (the 28) that the 34 puts you off closer to commercial fordham rd either.... And I don't blame em either, because I have always found the Bx28 b/w the neighborhoods of fordham & norwood indirect as hell..... So the Bx34 has become more useful these days, thanks to the tinkering of the Bx28.... Bx41: Eh, Alexander av.... Although I can agree that the SBS should run down to 3rd/138th , the biggest obstacle is the creation of the Bx15 LTD..... Bx55: I miss the route too, but with the way things are setup in Bronx's bus network now, it has no place.... Edited November 27, 2014 by B35 via Church 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Garibaldi 8 Posted November 27, 2014 Share #1731 Posted November 27, 2014 (edited) Bx1: Simply put, riverdale has no use for concourse service, and the current Bx10 (which runs deeper into riverdale, mind you) & the Bx1 run in the same general area b/w riverdale/231st & tracey towers.... Riverdalians in general, aren't even riding that far on the 10 (tracey towers), so there is no real reason to run Bx1's in Riverdale.... Bx10: There's another member on here (cotb16) that's suggested Bx10's run up to Woodlawn - Katonah av.... Didn't care for it then, and I still don't think 10's should run north of 205th ... The Bx10 meanders enough with its current routing.... See here, if you want to create a rift between Riverdalians (especially the folks along the henry hudson pkwy side) & Woodlawn patrons, extend Bx10's up to Woodlawn.... Riverdalians have little use for the Bx10 east of Broadway... Woodlawn patrons have little use for the Bx34 south of the .... The Bx10 already suffers from unreliability as it is... It would only worsen with an extension up to Woodlawn. The only thing I agree with here, is the taking of the Bx10 off Jerome..... Bx16: There's a common theme here with your ideas, and it's obvious.... You want to do away with the more shorter routes in the system & extend already established routes over them, which is poor planning.... This plan of eliminating the Bx34 to have the Bx10 take on the northern portion & the Bx16 to take on the southern portion will result in the creation of two winding, unreliable routes..... lol@Bx1 and Bx10 comments... I agree... There is no need to extend the Bx1 because Riverdalians are certainly not looking to travel to the South Bronx. The only thing those local folks use the Bx10 for is to get to and from 231st for the subway. Very few Riverdalians actually shop along Broadway. The either shop locally in Riverdale, drive up to Westchester or go to Manhattan. Aside from that it's simply too long and requires too many transfers to get from Riverdale to the South Bronx. It's far easier (and safer) for me to use the BxM1 or BxM2 and transfer in the city to the BxM4 when going to my tutoring sessions down there. No way in hell would I use that local bus, and if I didn't have sessions down there, I would have no need or desire to go there. Edited November 27, 2014 by Via Garibaldi 8 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B35 via Church Posted November 27, 2014 Share #1732 Posted November 27, 2014 I'm gonna ask. What are you trying to accomplish with these extensions/changes. I don't see these extensions/combos as necessary, especially the Bx24/Bx31 and the Bx10/Bx34. The old Bx24 operated on almost all the same streets as the Bx14 you're proposing. It had very low ridership. Plus, many people from the Great City of Riverdale wouldn't want to go to those areas. The Bx2 Melrose Avenue proposal I can't really comment, but seems the most plausible. You forgot the notorious Bx16/Bx34 combination suggestion.... He's trying to phase out a route that's growing in ridership, with two of the most indirect routes in our entire system with that whole Bx10/16/34 ordeal.... He's trying to get rid of (what he seemingly believes) are under-performing short routes & extending (what I call) intermediate distanced routes in its place - which is exactly what I think the MTA is setting up for..... See, I believe they would like to rid itself of the Bx34, but it'd be with having 16's run through residential Woodlawn & 16's running no further south than 205th .... In other words, telling folks to take the or the Bx28 for service southward.... Country Club would be even less accepting of the Bx31 running in their area, than what the MTA did back in 2010 running Bx8's from the south through there..... As far as Hutchinson Metro Ctr. that Q43LTD mentioned, I'll be honest - I don't think the Bx24 should be running through there; that should be done with either the Bx21 or the Bx31 (although I would favor the Bx31 over the Bx21 doing it)...... But yeah, this dude just wants to get rid of short routes & replace them with longer ones..... He is also exhibiting nostalgic tendencies as well; Bx14 to Riverdale, Bx26 to Fordham, Bx41 to Alexander..... Bx1: It dosen't need to be longer, you could use the Bx10 instead. Bx2:The return of Melrose service is a good idea, but why extend it to 238 Street when you can use both the Bx1 and Bx3 for Riverdale service? Bx4: Sure why not DUPLICATE THE SOME MORE since it won't WASTE MONEY anyway? Bx8: Not sure about this one, but seems decent. Bx10: What about Norwood service? Bx14: Like everyone said, the original route was discontinued due to low ridership. Bx16/Bx34: I guess, but people would be upset about the loss of the Bx34. Why do you thing weekend service got restored on the Bx34? Bx19: I guess it won't hurt for it to connect to the Bx26, but that's about it. Bx22: No comment. Bx24/Bx31: Apparently, Hutchinson Metro Center service does not matter to you. Also, I think the Bx31 is long enough. Bx26: Happened in 1990's, discontinued shortly after. Bx41: I always wondered why it got cut to 149th Street.... Bx55: You have to fight the Bx15 LTD and Bx41 SBS for this to happen. - Bx4 comment: My problem with the idea is more, the patrons in that area (along/around Westchester av NE of Westchester sq.) don't seem to want buses (if not for the Bx8 from the south).... If you noticed, the old Bx14 (parkchester - country club) had the crux of its ridership in 2 sections: [Parkchester & Westchester Sq.] and [PBP & Country Club]..... - Bx8 comment: Nah famm, the demand up in that part of the Bronx is for the Bx31 (and for good reason, being that it serves the Edenwald houses, who account for a large enough amt. of people using it to/from the , the Bx12/SBS, or even the ).... Running the Bx8 to Wakefield - 241st would be futile, since the action (so to speak) is along White Plains road.... The northern part of the Bx8 is, and should continue to be a gap filler/coverage route.... However, I believe if the route ran in the opposite direction (towards the projects & towards one of the Dyre av branch stations, it would yield more ridership (problem is, the routing is would be rather infeasible).... I do wonder how that, along with splitting the Bx8 @ Westchester Sq. would work - the northern split would run along its current route at and north of Westchester Sq, and the southern split would be extended to Parkchester (meaning, running from Parkchester - Locust Point).... That would eliminate the need for the Bx4a service (all service would go back to being designated as the Bx4) & it would have folks in those areas south of Westchester av abandoning taking the for such a short distance..... - Bx10 comment: Good catch, I just picked up on that.... So that extension would force the Woodlawn patrons that need the to walk those 2 long blocks to 206th.... - Bx24/31 comment: I honestly think the HMC deserves a little more service than what the Bx24 offers.... - Bx41 comment: I don't know the reason as to why the move was made, but the move was made sometime in 2008 to have the Bx41 cut back to the Hub - in exchange for the Bx2 running down to Mott Haven (terminating with its Concourse counterpart; which of course is the Bx1)..... - Bx55 comment: ....Which is exactly why I said it has no place in our current bus system anymore.... I remember the Bx26 running there in the 90s. Dont know why it was cut out. the Bx41 should go back to 135th St, also why was it cut down to Gun Hill Road from 241st St. The Bx10 would be there in Woodlawn where the Bx34 went to so they would still have bus service. The Bx41 was cut from Wakefield - 241st to Gun Hill/WPR because the MTA swapped northern terminals of the Bx39 & the Bx41.... It was a cost cutting measure, since more buses were dedicated to running the Bx41, compared to the Bx39..... The folks in Woodlawn want the Bx31 and Bx34 as is. The Bx10 is too unreliable as it is. The folks in Woodlawn want the Bx34 as is.... The folks in Woodlawn could give two shits about the Bx31 (especially now that the Bx34 got its weekend service back).... The Bx31 having gotten extended to residential Woodlawn was solely done as a compromise for the MTA cutting weekend service on the Bx34 back in 2010.... The Bx31 still running to residential Woodlawn is wasteful, since Woodlawn riders simply did & still do not want the WPR corridor..... Saying this another way, the & the is FAR more valuable for those folks over the ..... lol@Bx1 and Bx10 comments... I agree... There is no need to extend the Bx1 because Riverdalians are certainly not looking to travel to the South Bronx. The only thing those local folks use the Bx10 for is to get to and from 231st for the subway. Very few Riverdalians actually shop along Broadway. The either shop locally in Riverdale, drive up to Westchester or go to Manhattan. Yep, that part further expounds on the point I made to the guy.... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Q43LTD Posted November 28, 2014 Share #1733 Posted November 28, 2014 It's like he looked at some old bus maps from 20 years ago...he's done this before. In addition to his fleet bias 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Garibaldi 8 Posted November 28, 2014 Share #1734 Posted November 28, 2014 (edited) You forgot the notorious Bx16/Bx34 combination suggestion.... He's trying to phase out a route that's growing in ridership, with two of the most indirect routes in our entire system with that whole Bx10/16/34 ordeal.... He's trying to get rid of (what he seemingly believes) are under-performing short routes & extending (what I call) intermediate distanced routes in its place - which is exactly what I think the MTA is setting up for..... See, I believe they would like to rid itself of the Bx34, but it'd be with having 16's run through residential Woodlawn & 16's running no further south than 205th .... In other words, telling folks to take the or the Bx28 for service southward.... Country Club would be even less accepting of the Bx31 running in their area, than what the MTA did back in 2010 running Bx8's from the south through there..... As far as Hutchinson Metro Ctr. that Q43LTD mentioned, I'll be honest - I don't think the Bx24 should be running through there; that should be done with either the Bx21 or the Bx31 (although I would favor the Bx31 over the Bx21 doing it)...... But yeah, this dude just wants to get rid of short routes & replace them with longer ones..... He is also exhibiting nostalgic tendencies as well; Bx14 to Riverdale, Bx26 to Fordham, Bx41 to Alexander..... The folks in Woodlawn want the Bx34 as is.... The folks in Woodlawn could give two shits about the Bx31 (especially now that the Bx34 got its weekend service back).... The Bx31 having gotten extended to residential Woodlawn was solely done as a compromise for the MTA cutting weekend service on the Bx34 back in 2010.... The Bx31 still running to residential Woodlawn is wasteful, since Woodlawn riders simply did & still do not want the WPR corridor..... Saying this another way, the & the is FAR more valuable for those folks over the ..... Actually folks in Woodlawn want the Bx31 for the Metro-North connection. Aside from that I agree with you. When I'm waiting at Katonah for the BxM4, I often notice how much service runs along there and say to myself, they've got it good here. The Bx31 and Bx34 seem to alternate, though closely together. Woodlawn IMO is rather small to have that much service, and then you have the Bx16 running through 233rd as well, but they are very vocal, so I don't see how they would cut back the Bx31 now. Woodlawn has a similar dilemma like Riverdale in that if you cut the Bx34, it forces customers to take two buses if they are north of 233rd to get to the Bx16 which appears to be crowded enough. Given how long of a commute one faces from Woodlawn and how hilly and isolated it is, it's hard to get rid of the Bx34. You need both the Bx31, and the Bx34, despite the area being so small. Aside from that you have the folks that work in Woodlawn that need the Bx31. Where did the Bx31 run prior to it being extended? Edited November 28, 2014 by Via Garibaldi 8 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Q43LTD Posted November 28, 2014 Share #1735 Posted November 28, 2014 Webster and Nereid by the Bronx River 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Garibaldi 8 Posted November 28, 2014 Share #1736 Posted November 28, 2014 Webster and Nereid by the Bronx River That's a weird terminal... It actually makes more sense to run it to Katonah and Van Cortlandt Park East. Not a lot of people need it but those who use Metro-North benefit from it. It actually seems as if some Bx31 trips coincide with Metro-North. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B35 via Church Posted November 28, 2014 Share #1737 Posted November 28, 2014 (edited) Actually folks in Woodlawn want the Bx31 for the Metro-North connection. Aside from that I agree with you. When I'm waiting at Katonah for the BxM4, I often notice how much service runs along there and say to myself, they've got it good here. The Bx31 and Bx34 seem to alternate though closely together. Woodlawn IMO is rather small to have that much service, and then you have the Bx16 running through 233rd as well, but they are very vocal, so I don't see how they would cut back the Bx31 now. Woodlawn has a similar dilemma like Riverdale in that if you cut the Bx34, it forces customers to take two buses if they are north of 233rd to get to the Bx16 which appears to be crowded enough. Given how long of a commute one faces from Woodlawn and how hilly and isolated it is, it's hard to get rid of the Bx34. You need both the Bx31, and the Bx34, despite the area being so small. Aside from that you have the folks that work in Woodlawn that need the Bx31. Where did the Bx31 run prior to it being extended? Those folks are too busy having family members (or whoever) dropping them off there (the RR station).... I'm telling you, they wouldn't wince if the Bx31 got truncated to its former terminal ending at the RR station; corner of 233rd/webster, on webster av (which answers your question).... It's not one of those deals where they've gotten so used to the Bx31, they would lash out if it were taken away.... In terms of BPH/overall bus service, yeah they got it good... They would have it even better if the exact same amount of BPH running through there consisted of the BxM4 & the Bx34..... It's pathetic to see or be on Bx31's running from 242nd/Katonah to 233rd & have less than a handful of people on the bus before the bus hits the station.... The Bx31 up there is not necessary; that route would have BEEN serving Katonah av before the MTA decided to extended that route up there as some sort of compromise (since Woodlawn residents have always utilized the RR station)... See, I remember the backlash from some of those folks up there when the 31 was extended; saying how does extending the Bx31 help us that need the Bx34 on the weekend & what not.... Of course, you still had those that were still miffed over express bus service every 2 hours..... But yeah, that move was one of the more nonsensical "compromises" the MTA has made - They basically told patrons in so many words back then that hey, *some* bus service to somewhere you don't want, is better than no bus service at all... Total slap in the face.... Having to take 31's to 16's to the subway created an unnecessary 2-fare commute... I'm glad they reinstated weekend service on that route.... I'm for communities that USE bus services, instead of fronting that they primarily use bus services - full knowing they only want to keep some bus route running in their area just in case the car breaks down, or the other significant other took the car, leaving him/her having to wait til hubby/"the wife" comes home, or else, god forbid, they gotta take the *stinkin bus*..... Webster and Nereid by the Bronx River The Bx31 ended right there on Webster off 233rd (MNRR Woodlawn) as soon as it made that right turn off 233rd to webster; directly across the street from that gas station... The first pickup stop was a few yards north of it (which is now is a current Ropes av bound Bx16 stop)... The turnaround though still consisted of Webster > Nereid > Bronx Blvd > 233rd That's a weird terminal... It's funny to me you get this guy BxM4 Woodlawn talking about running Bx8's to wakefield-241st, when it's the Bx31 I'm quite sure would have benefited from that far more.... But keeping buses along 233rd for the Bx31 is still a good thing.... Having had buses end at the RR station I honestly believe was done, because they couldn't have buses (Bx31's) ending with the BL-42 (via 233rd > Byron > 236th > WPR)..... Cotb16 will sell you a bill of goods about Montefiore (233rd/bronx blvd), but virtually no one takes the Bx31 to that hospital..... After the dropoffs are made on the Bx31 at white plains road, buses come really close to carrying air.... Edited November 28, 2014 by B35 via Church 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Q43LTD Posted November 28, 2014 Share #1738 Posted November 28, 2014 The Bx31 ended right there on Webster off 233rd (MNRR Woodlawn) as soon as it made that right turn off 233rd to webster; directly across the street from that gas station... The first pickup stop was a few yards north of it (which is now is a current Ropes av bound Bx16 stop)... The turnaround though still consisted of Webster > Nereid > Bronx Blvd > 233rd Damn Bronx bus map...lol 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BM5 via Woodhaven Posted November 28, 2014 Share #1739 Posted November 28, 2014 (edited) Actually folks in Woodlawn want the Bx31 for the Metro-North connection. Aside from that I agree with you. When I'm waiting at Katonah for the BxM4, I often notice how much service runs along there and say to myself, they've got it good here. The Bx31 and Bx34 seem to alternate, though closely together. Woodlawn IMO is rather small to have that much service, and then you have the Bx16 running through 233rd as well, but they are very vocal, so I don't see how they would cut back the Bx31 now. Woodlawn has a similar dilemma like Riverdale in that if you cut the Bx34, it forces customers to take two buses if they are north of 233rd to get to the Bx16 which appears to be crowded enough. Given how long of a commute one faces from Woodlawn and how hilly and isolated it is, it's hard to get rid of the Bx34. You need both the Bx31, and the Bx34, despite the area being so small. Aside from that you have the folks that work in Woodlawn that need the Bx31. Where did the Bx31 run prior to it being extended? I mean, if the MTA wanted to in 2010(but then, all they wanted was to save money), they could've ran a two branched Bx16 (one via Katonah/ McLean, the other via 233/webster) on weekends. Obviously, that didn't happen. However, if that happened, most probably, there would still be no weekend Bx34. Edited November 28, 2014 by BM5 via Woodhaven 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B35 via Church Posted November 28, 2014 Share #1740 Posted November 28, 2014 Damn Bronx bus map...lol *nods head* Yep, I figured you were going by that - it's one of the gaffe's (or intentionally misleading things) that the MTA never corrected on its maps.... I mean, if the MTA wanted to (but then, all they wanted was to save money), they could've ran a two branched Bx16 (one via Katonah/ McLean, the other via 233/webster) on weekends. Obviously, that didn't happen. ...which would have been ironic, being that they combined the mundy lane short turns/branch into the Ropes av branch! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Garibaldi 8 Posted November 28, 2014 Share #1741 Posted November 28, 2014 (edited) Those folks are too busy having family members (or whoever) dropping them off there (the RR station).... I'm telling you, they wouldn't wince if the Bx31 got truncated to its former terminal ending at the RR station; corner of 233rd/webster, on webster av (which answers your question).... It's not one of those deals where they've gotten so used to the Bx31, they would lash out if it were taken away.... In terms of BPH/overall bus service, yeah they got it good... They would have it even better if the exact same amount of BPH running through there consisted of the BxM4 & the Bx34..... It's pathetic to see or be on Bx31's running from 242nd/Katonah to 233rd & have less than a handful of people on the bus before the bus hits the station.... The Bx31 up there is not necessary; that route would have BEEN serving Katonah av before the MTA decided to extended that route up there as some sort of compromise (since Woodlawn residents have always utilized the RR station)... See, I remember the backlash from some of those folks up there when the 31 was extended; saying how does extending the Bx31 help us that need the Bx34 on the weekend & what not.... Of course, you still had those that were still miffed over express bus service every 2 hours..... But yeah, that move was one of the more nonsensical "compromises" the MTA has made - They basically told patrons in so many words back then that hey, *some* bus service to somewhere you don't want, is better than no bus service at all... Total slap in the face.... Having to take 31's to 16's to the subway created an unnecessary 2-fare commute... I'm glad they reinstated weekend service on that route.... I'm for communities that USE bus services, instead of fronting that they primarily use bus services - full knowing they only want to keep some bus route running in their area just in case the car breaks down, or the other significant other took the car, leaving him/her having to wait til hubby/"the wife" comes home, or else, god forbid, they gotta take the *stinkin bus*..... The Bx31 ended right there on Webster off 233rd (MNRR Woodlawn) as soon as it made that right turn off 233rd to webster; directly across the street from that gas station... The first pickup stop was a few yards north of it (which is now is a current Ropes av bound Bx16 stop)... The turnaround though still consisted of Webster > Nereid > Bronx Blvd > 233rd It's funny to me you get this guy BxM4 Woodlawn talking about running Bx8's to wakefield-241st, when it's the Bx31 I'm quite sure would have benefited from that far more.... But keeping buses along 233rd for the Bx31 is still a good thing.... Having had buses end at the RR station I honestly believe was done, because they couldn't have buses (Bx31's) ending with the BL-42 (via 233rd > Byron > 236th > WPR)..... Cotb16 will sell you a bill of goods about Montefiore (233rd/bronx blvd), but virtually no one takes the Bx31 to that hospital..... After the dropoffs are made on the Bx31 at white plains road, buses come really close to carrying air.... But that's the thing though... For those who don't or can't use the car, they have the Bx31 as "their bus" to the Railroad station since the folks working in the area wouldn't be using it in the morning and vice versa. Hell I used the Bx31 once when I first started doing my sessions in Westchester and realized that I could get dropped off at the border by my client as opposed to the Metro-North station. I'd take Metro-North just down to Woodlawn, then get the Bx31 from the station to the BxM4 since I'm interested in maximizing my profit and utilizing my express bus pass. It's quick and there's no ghetto element since it's already in Woodlawn and going to residential/commerical area of Woodlawn. Now you're right... Not a lot of people from Woodlawn using it, but you get a few. I usually get the BxM4 from the Yonkers border, and some will use the Bx31 to the border and then walk into Yonkers from there. I've done the same thing the few times I've use the local bus in Riverdale to the subway. The Bx20 in the mornings is almost all folks from Riverdale, with a few nursing home workers (if that) since it starts at 246th and Henry Hudson Parkway. It's the last symbol of a bus that truly serves only Riverdale since the express buses were pulled from Independence, and while it doesn't run often, it's still a bus that folks want here. It was funny that I had not used the subway or local bus for months when I moved to Riverdale and then realized that if I was in a pinch, I would be royally screwed not knowing how the local bus and subway ran, so I took it just to experiment. I of course hated it. It's downright awful. Even with the being express, it's just a long trip, especially if you need to transfer. So while I get your point, if for only having that bus for the RR station, they would be fools in Woodlawn not to make a stink. More transportation is always a good thing for property values, so long as it doesn't bring any ghetto element in with it, which the Bx31 doesn't do given the fact that it's mainly folks from Woodlawn going to Woodlawn, and the folks that work there (i.e. servers in the restaurants or bars) are out of Woodlawn by the evening. Edited November 28, 2014 by Via Garibaldi 8 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BxM4Woodlawn Posted November 29, 2014 Share #1742 Posted November 29, 2014 Bx1: Simply put, riverdale has no use for concourse service, and the current Bx10 (which runs deeper into riverdale, mind you) & the Bx1 run in the same general area b/w riverdale/231st & tracey towers.... Riverdalians in general, aren't even riding that far on the 10 (tracey towers), so there is no real reason to run Bx1's in Riverdale.... Bx2: While I agree that the Bx2 should end elsewhere, there's no where to terminate more buses over there by 238th (being that the Bx2 is an artic route, that definitely doesn't help matters), and you don't need anymore buses making that u-turn just west of the el anyway..... It's enough that the Bx3 has to do that shit... As far as reverting the via Melrose & the via 165th routing, I agree with that.... Never wanted Bx2's running along 149th st. from jump. Bx4: Inefficient to run it to PBP (pelham bay park); the current situation with buses ending at Westchester Sq. is the best you're gonna get... You'd benefit too few riders... Bx8: For what..... The Bx8 north of Westchester Sq. is a huge coverage route, and it is used as such.... It's enough that it terminates arbitrarily at 225th (well technically, 226th/WPR)..... The Bx31, Bx39 (now, thanks to the 39/41 terminal swap), and the Bx16 is all the service you need up there (Wakefield area)... You're not gonna take riders off the Bx31 (which also runs to Westchester Sq.) running Bx8's up to Wakefield, if that's the thinking... Bx10: There's another member on here (cotb16) that's suggested Bx10's run up to Woodlawn - Katonah av.... Didn't care for it then, and I still don't think 10's should run north of 205th ... The Bx10 meanders enough with its current routing.... See here, if you want to create a rift between Riverdalians (especially the folks along the henry hudson pkwy side) & Woodlawn patrons, extend Bx10's up to Woodlawn.... Riverdalians have little use for the Bx10 east of Broadway... Woodlawn patrons have little use for the Bx34 south of the .... The Bx10 already suffers from unreliability as it is... It would only worsen with an extension up to Woodlawn. "Bx14": This is more or less the old Bx24 that ran to Riverdale, which no longer exists.... I don't see a need to connect both "sides" of Riverdale (meaning the riverdale av side & the henry hudson pkwy side), to Fordham anyway..... The few people on the HHP side can continue transferring the Bx9 & be done with it..... Bx16: There's a common theme here with your ideas, and it's obvious.... You want to do away with the more shorter routes in the system & extend already established routes over them, which is poor planning.... This plan of eliminating the Bx34 to have the Bx10 take on the northern portion & the Bx16 to take on the southern portion will result in the creation of two winding, unreliable routes... Bx19: This route has enough (pax.) to deal with within Manhattan alone, for it to be running all the way over to Lehman.... Even if there is a demand for what's being suggested, simply put, the route would have to be split.... The Bx19 ending where it does, is not much more these days than a convenient turnaround spot..... Bx22: Gross waste of resources.... The demand from the south is for the short turn routing... We're lucky there's still as much Lehman College service as there currently is... Which is why I say the service distribution on this route should be left alone.... Bx24: ....but, you also want the Bx4 running to Pelham bay. You would send much too much service to(wards) PBP... All that bus service along Westchester av (extended Bx4's & extended Bx31's) east of Westchester Sq. is nothing more than overkill.... The result of this plan would yield a very noticable increase of emptier buses past Westchester Sq..... Absolutely wasteful. Bx26: Is this your way of restoring the service that was lost on the Bx28 (of which, runs to valentine/192nd)? Because the last thing the 28 needs, is help from an additional route to fordham..... Bx34: The one thing I have noticed with this route in the past 2-3 years or so, is that ever since the old Bx28 (via all sections of co-op) was split into today's 28 & 38, there seems to have been an increase of usage b/w Fordham & Norwood (Gun Hill rd/Bainbridge).... They f*cked up the 28 to the point where the Bx38 has become more prevalent over the 28 for the masses that utilize it to/from Gun Hill from the east.... What did that mean for the Bx34? With the decrease in service on the Bx28, enough of the Fordham riders (that aren't riding east of Bainbridge) seemed to have gravitated to it.... Doesn't help (the 28) that the 34 puts you off closer to commercial fordham rd either.... And I don't blame em either, because I have always found the Bx28 b/w the neighborhoods of fordham & norwood indirect as hell..... So the Bx34 has become more useful these days, thanks to the tinkering of the Bx28.... Bx41: Eh, Alexander av.... Although I can agree that the SBS should run down to 3rd/138th , the biggest obstacle is the creation of the Bx15 LTD..... Bx55: I miss the route too, but with the way things are setup in Bronx's bus network now, it has no place.... yep the Bx28 was very weird and indirect between Fordham and Norwood. But there have always been way more Bx28s than 34s. Personally now that I think about it, they should get rid of the Bx38 once and for all. And yeah I said extend the Bx26 back down to Fordham Center like the 1990s. I remember those days with the 26 going down there. and back then the Bx26 and 28 were dominated by RTS's. Ah yes those were the days. they seemed to carry a lot of people too 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Q43LTD Posted November 29, 2014 Share #1743 Posted November 29, 2014 (edited) yep the Bx28 was very weird and indirect between Fordham and Norwood. But there have always been way more Bx28s than 34s. Personally now that I think about it, they should get rid of the Bx38 once and for all. And yeah I said extend the Bx26 back down to Fordham Center like the 1990s. I remember those days with the 26 going down there. and back then the Bx26 and 28 were dominated by RTS's. Ah yes those were the days. they seemed to carry a lot of people too If you get rid of the Bx38, what will take its place? Why do want the Bx26 back to Fordham? Is there a need for Allerton customers to get to Fordham? The Bx28 is still indirect between Fordham and Norwood...cut out the damn fleet bias. It's annoying. LF buses are here to stay and there isn't a damn thing me or you can do about it. Edited November 29, 2014 by Q43LTD 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BxM4Woodlawn Posted November 29, 2014 Share #1744 Posted November 29, 2014 If you get rid of the Bx38, what will take its place? Why do want the Bx26 back to Fordham? Is there a need for Allerton customers to get to Fordham? The Bx28 is still indrect between Fordham and Norwood...cut out the damn fleet bias. It's annoying. LF buses are here to stay and there isn't damn thing me or you can do about it. yeah i know. on these Bronx routes the Orion V is the best we've got. and just let the Bx28 run its old pre-2010 route in Co-Op City. the Bx38 is just about as pointless as the Bx25 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Q43LTD Posted November 29, 2014 Share #1745 Posted November 29, 2014 yeah i know. on these Bronx routes the Orion V is the best we've got. and just let the Bx28 run its old pre-2010 route in Co-Op City. the Bx38 is just about as pointless as the Bx25 Co-Op residents don' t know what they want, first they want quicker rides out of Co-Op (with one saying I didn't pay 2.25 [the fare at the time] to get a tour of Co-Op) and now they want everything back to the way it was. All the Bx38 is just a short-turned Bx28. The Bx28 serves all of Co-Op overnight. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MysteriousBtrain Posted November 29, 2014 Share #1746 Posted November 29, 2014 yeah i know. on these Bronx routes the Orion V is the best we've got. and just let the Bx28 run its old pre-2010 route in Co-Op City. the Bx38 is just about as pointless as the Bx25 The reason the Bx28 split into the Bx38 partly is because of the money the always struggle to make. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B35 via Church Posted December 2, 2014 Share #1747 Posted December 2, 2014 Two things: - Talking about extending the Bx26 to Fordham..... I'd argue that the Bx28 shouldn't run to Fordham anymore, nor serve 205th if they're gonna have this Bx38 around (despite the fact I never like Valentine/192nd as a terminal; too far away from the "action" along commercial Fordham rd, so to speak)... Just have the thing (28) continue along Gun Hill to Jerome, then from off Jerome, turn onto W. Mosholu Pkwy to that current Tracey Towers stop, then proceed towards Paul to end at Paul/BPB (first stop heading back to co-op would be at Paul/205th).... If you want the , take the 38.... If you want the , take the 28.... Jerome b/w BPB & Kingsbridge on the 28 I find to be rather wasteful anyway.... The Bx34 is growing in ridership, and it could use a further boost in transporting even more riders b/w commercial Fordham rd. & Montefiore hosp (gun hill/bainbridge) via 205th .... Not this crap the 28 does to get b/w Montefiore & BPB .... I would draw a map of what I'm saying with the 28, but I am NOT liking the new Google Maps (separate rant to come in the OT OT thread.... maybe)..... - Something else I would do is take the Bx2 out of Kingsbridge Hgts.... Not because of its terminal placement either..... I'm sorry, but those folks are overserved with having the Bx1 & the Bx2 running in that area (it's something I've always told myself having rode each of the 3 routes through the area (Bx1/2/10)... Of the concourse routes, the Bx1 is sufficient enough.... I would truncate the Bx2 to Lehman (well, paul/205th) as for those student to not have to rely on the Bx28 to (half-ass) get to the part of Fordham so many are trying to get to.... and many more points further south than the Bx28 takes you.... ================ Co-Op residents don' t know what they want, first they want quicker rides out of Co-Op (with one saying I didn't pay 2.25 [the fare at the time] to get a tour of Co-Op) and now they want everything back to the way it was. All the Bx38 is just a short-turned Bx28. The Bx28 serves all of Co-Op overnight. See the first point I made about the 28.... That'll make that route quicker alright! As far as the indecisiveness from some co-op residences, the ones snidely bringing up a tour of co-op should get smacked back to yesterday..... I'm not even gonna play the *no one told you to live there* card, but I will say, you didn't realize that public transportation exists to serve the masses.... Sometimes I wonder if you have some folks out there that want (get this) a separate route for each section only, doing what the 26, 28, and 30 does... In other words: - a route via Boston/Gun Hill (30), via allerton (26), via Gun Hill (28) only serving Dreiser - a route via Boston/Gun Hill (30), via allerton (26), via Gun Hill (28) only serving section 5 ...etc, etc. What they really need out there is a free shuttle that encircles co-op (like the Bx23, except it never leaves co-op).... Perhaps it can also run to the pathmark inside bay plaza, but the general idea would be that of something like they got out there in Roosevelt Island.... So if current residents want to "take a tour" of co-op (like there aren't those that have to use the bus to head to certain establishments w/i co-op.... smh), they could do so that way..... It's always the selfish & inconsiderate...... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Q43LTD Posted December 2, 2014 Share #1748 Posted December 2, 2014 I don't know if you notice, but in a way your modified Bx28, still connects to the in a way 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BxM4Woodlawn Posted December 2, 2014 Share #1749 Posted December 2, 2014 about the Bx31. I used that bus every day from Katonah/City Line to Woodlawn MNRR to catch the train to White Plains for school. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Garibaldi 8 Posted December 2, 2014 Share #1750 Posted December 2, 2014 (edited) about the Bx31. I used that bus every day from Katonah/City Line to Woodlawn MNRR to catch the train to White Plains for school. Yeah and?? I use the BxM4 from Katonah/City Line to the city... Edited December 2, 2014 by Via Garibaldi 8 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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