Moving ahead with Queens Blvd Line Signal Improvements

[Art Vandelay]

Car assignments will not stand in the way of CBTC as long as there are cars capable of simple CBTC conversion which can run on said lines. 

 

If the Queens CBTC project requires CBTC equipped cars prior to the R211,(which considering the timing of the contracts, it appears it likely will) the Queens Boulevard lines will need to be entirely R160, and the R46s will have to go elsewhere. A simple Jamaica R46 for Coney Island R160 swap makes the most sense to me, but I suppose other scenarios could come to pass.  

[Sparen of Iria]

Regardless, I do wonder how they will swap out trains to install the CBTC equipment. 

[Via Garibaldi 8]

The average commuter doesn't care about what type of subway car they get on.

And what gave you that idea? Every time the "average commuter" is given a "report card" to grade the on subway cars, they talk about how old the cars are, how dirty they are etc.  If that was the case, you wouldn't have people constantly complaining about those old cars on the line.  Commuters certainly DO care.  They want cars that are clean, with audible announcements, and proper climate control, things that cars in the 21st century provide, so of course they care if they are in old, dirty poorly air conditioned cars with inaudible announcements.

[S78 via Hylan]

I meant in the sense that most passengers don't foam or fan over specific types of subway cars or what to see them on certain lines just for the fun of it.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

I meant in the sense that most passengers don't foam or fan over specific types of subway cars or what to see them on certain lines just for the fun of it.

That's quite different, but believe me they do care.  At the end of the day, everybody is paying for a service.  I would much rather pay $2.50 and be on a newer train than on the old ones with poor lighting and inaudible announcements.

[RollOver]

The may be a real line and all, but I don't care much about it, since it's basically another (just doing local stops in Manhattan and Brooklyn)...the R32s are the only reason why those Rider Alliance complain. I mean you yourself and a lot of other people here claim that the is always crowded no matter what time a day and night. *rolls eyes*

 

So going by that logic, the Riders Alliance should be more focus on the and not the , since the local already has new cars (even when/after the R32s retire) while the will still have the R46s for the next 5-10+ years. -.-

[Via Garibaldi 8]

The may be a real line and all, but I don't care much about it, since it's basically another (just doing local stops in Manhattan and Brooklyn)...the R32s are the only reason why those Rider Alliance complain. I mean you yourself and a lot of other people here claim that the is always crowded no matter what time a day and night. *rolls eyes*

 

So going by that logic, the Riders Alliance should be more focus on the and not the , since the local already has new cars (even when/after the R32s retire) while the will still have the R46s for the next 5-10+ years. -.-

They need to focus on both lines because they both stink in terms of reliability and frequency.  You can have back-to-back trains and then nothing for over 15 minutes during rush hour, causing unnecessary overcrowding.  Those two back-to-back trains usually have uneven loads, meaning the first train is crushloaded while the train behind it is relatively light (for rush hour).

[RollOver]

That's nothing new. That always happens on the (as I always, always say), even on middays, evenings and weekends.

 

Always.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

That's nothing new. That always happens on the (as I always, always say), even on middays, evenings and weekends.

 

Always.

Yes, but with more people using the line, crowding is becoming worse as trains aren't being efficiently enough.

[N6 Limited]

And what gave you that idea? Every time the "average commuter" is given a "report card" to grade the on subway cars, they talk about how old the cars are, how dirty they are etc.  If that was the case, you wouldn't have people constantly complaining about those old cars on the line.  Commuters certainly DO care.  They want cars that are clean, with audible announcements, and proper climate control, things that cars in the 21st century provide, so of course they care if they are in old, dirty poorly air conditioned cars with inaudible announcements.

 

The is much better with the R160s.

 

They need to focus on both lines because they both stink in terms of reliability and frequency.  You can have back-to-back trains and then nothing for over 15 minutes during rush hour, causing unnecessary overcrowding.  Those two back-to-back trains usually have uneven loads, meaning the first train is crushloaded while the train behind it is relatively light (for rush hour).

When I use the or (usually in Brooklyn) I don't specifically wait for the unless i'm going to an only station. Many times I'll get on the Manhattan bound and the will not pass by the time the train gets to Hoyt-Schermerhorn.  

 

Brookyn bound, unless an and are at Canal St at the same time there is no point in waiting for an usually it won't catch up before Utica or Broadway Junction. One time an didn't pass the I was on until Shepard Ave!

[Via Garibaldi 8]

The is much better with the R160s.

 

When I use the or (usually in Brooklyn) I don't specifically wait for the unless i'm going to an only station. Many times I'll get on the Manhattan bound and the will not pass by the time the train gets to Hoyt-Schermerhorn.  

 

Brookyn bound, unless an and are at Canal St at the same time there is no point in waiting for an usually it won't catch up before Utica or Broadway Junction. One time an didn't pass the I was on until Shepard Ave!

These days I only use the in Manhattan when I have tutoring sessions uptown.  I usually will just stick with the if possible, but it can be a sardine can, so if the comes, I'll take that to 59th street and hope an is there or coming soon.  With the express it's a tad faster, but more importantly, you don't have to keep shifting around with people getting on and off.

[bobtehpanda]

And what gave you that idea? Every time the "average commuter" is given a "report card" to grade the on subway cars, they talk about how old the cars are, how dirty they are etc.  If that was the case, you wouldn't have people constantly complaining about those old cars on the line.  Commuters certainly DO care.  They want cars that are clean, with audible announcements, and proper climate control, things that cars in the 21st century provide, so of course they care if they are in old, dirty poorly air conditioned cars with inaudible announcements.

 

If you're talking about those Straphangers' Campaign reports, I'd take those with a grain of salt, considering how shoddy their methodologies for conducting surveys are.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

If you're talking about those Straphangers' Campaign reports, I'd take those with a grain of salt, considering how shoddy their methodologies for conducting surveys are.

No, I'm talking about the report cards given out by the .  I have never filled out anything from the Straphangers' organization, nor would I.  Speaking of which, I haven't seen any in quite some time.  

[Lance]

They come out once a year. I forget when, but I want to say sometime in the fall.

[East New York]

I agree keep the R160s on the and and the R68/68As are not garbage they are good trains the can last up till the 2030s I just can't tolerate how slow they are sometimes the crew at coney island yard plans to supplement service with the R68/68As on the and going further into the future.

I was on one on the 2 weeks ago and it was great for me because I've never been on any other than an R160 on that line.

 

lol... Yeah it's annoying when they move around so much. It's not about foaming with me.  I just put myself in the shoes of ordinary commuters and if you ask any of them, they prefer to have the new cars.

Of course anyone prefers newer cars, however most all people don't care as long as they get to where they need to go. Sure I prefer an R142/143/160/188 over the rest, but I couldn't care less which one pulls up. And again, everyone can't get what they want.... I distinctly remember you saying people on the Upper East Side were going to have a fit when I created the R188 discussion thread, and mentioned the cars would be moving to the line....

 

This wasn't the case, and they don't really care as a whole.

 

Car assignments will not stand in the way of CBTC as long as there are cars capable of simple CBTC conversion which can run on said lines. 

 

If the Queens CBTC project requires CBTC equipped cars prior to the R211,(which considering the timing of the contracts, it appears it likely will) the Queens Boulevard lines will need to be entirely R160, and the R46s will have to go elsewhere. A simple Jamaica R46 for Coney Island R160 swap makes the most sense to me, but I suppose other scenarios could come to pass.

 

 

 

MTA is currently planning the installation to be complete as R179's are slated to go to the and lines now. R211's will replace the remaining 46's that are supposed to be displaced to other lines.

 

The may be a real line and all, but I don't care much about it, since it's basically another (just doing local stops in Manhattan and Brooklyn)...the R32s are the only reason why those Rider Alliance complain. I mean you yourself and a lot of other people here claim that the is always crowded no matter what time a day and night. *rolls eyes*

So going by that logic, the Riders Alliance should be more focus on the and not the , since the local already has new cars (even when/after the R32s retire) while the will still have the R46s for the next 5-10+ years. -.-

The and ARE always crowded... They aren't just light claims you know. And the isn't fully R160 either.... Just because you don't care anything about the line doesn't take away from the fact that it's among the heaviest used in the city.. The is up next to new cars which should be all in place well before the timeline you stated above.... More like 3-4 years if there are no more significant delays. And they should just about all be displaced by then.... The R179 test train is due in short order.

[MysteriousBtrain]

MTA is currently planning the installation to be complete as R179's are slated to go to the and lines now. R211's will replace the remaining 46's that are supposed to be displaced to other lines.

The MTA revised the R179 order again? Do the ENY lines still get a piece of the order?

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Of course anyone prefers newer cars, however most all people don't care as long as they get to where they need to go. Sure I prefer an R142/143/160/188 over the rest, but I couldn't care less which one pulls up. And again, everyone can't get what they want.... I distinctly remember you saying people on the Upper East Side were going to have a fit when I created the R188 discussion thread, and mentioned the cars would be moving to the line....

 

This wasn't the case, and they don't really care as a whole.

 

I can't comment on it since I only use the subway here and there during the summer months, and use the express bus as much as possible.  Too hot to be taking the subway now.  I average maybe one or two rides a week at the moment on random lines provided that the express bus doesn't go there.

[RollOver]

The and ARE always crowded... They aren't just light claims you know. And the isn't fully R160 either.... Just because you don't care anything about the line doesn't take away from the fact that it's among the heaviest used in the city.. The is up next to new cars which should be all in place well before the timeline you stated above.... More like 3-4 years if there are no more significant delays. And they should just about all be displaced by then.... The R179 test train is due in short order.

 

Yeah whatever, if you say so smh....And I didn't say that the is fully NTT. I said that it has new cars already, generally speaking, not literally. And yes, the will be stuck with old cars for the next 5-10+ years. I was very disappointed that the will stay 480 feet unit for the next 45-50+ years though, because I believe that a full-length train/longer headway is cheaper than a short-length train/shorter headway. As soon as the becomes entirely NTT (after the R32s retire for good), they might add some more service on the line. Maybe the Brooklyn portion could see a bit more service during the rush (not saying reverse peak and off-peak though, but during the rush). That is what I can indeed understand. Otherwise, I have my doubts for more service on the line for obvious reasons.

[T to Dyre Avenue]

MTA is currently planning the installation to be complete as R179's are slated to go to the and lines now. R211's will replace the remaining 46's that are supposed to be displaced to other lines.

 

So then the MTA is once again revising the R179 order to be mostly 5-car sets? Because three of those four lines run 600-foot trains (either 60x10 or 75x8). Trains of eight 60-footers would pose serious problems for commuters on the , and lines. Has the MTA thought about what they're going to do about the remaining R32s and 42s if they're planning to assign the R179s to a yard other than ENY or Pitkin? And what about the third rail issues in the Rockaways. Wasn't it not so long ago that the MTA sent an R160 train out that way on an emergency reroute only for the poor thing to start smoking up by the time it got to Howard Beach?

The MTA revised the R179 order again? Do the ENY lines still get a piece of the order?

I sure hope so. Because I don't think they can afford to keep the R32s and R42s currently based at ENY going for more than a couple (as in literally two) more years, if they are indeed planning to put some of the 179s on the and lines.

[RollOver]

Only 260/300 R179s will be in four-car sets. The last 40 will be in five-car sets. The isn't revising the R179 order. All the four-car sets will run on the , and , whereas the five-car sets will wind up at either Coney Island or Jamaica.

 

Am I wrong East New York...

[T to Dyre Avenue]

Yes, that plan. That's the one that makes the most sense because it would allow the remaining R32s and 42s to retire at last. I really hope it stays that way.

[RollOver]

Correct. The and the Rockaway Park Shuttle are unlikely to get the five-car sets anyway, because of the aforementioned issues on the IND Rockaway Line.

[Art Vandelay]

I don't see how the R179s could possibly end up on the A F and R. (C and J/M are practically a given for the 4 car fleet.) 

The 5 car fleet is incredibly small. 4 trains in total, likely meaning 3 available trains after spares are taken into account. I could not imagine that the MTA would split a 40 car fleet between multiple shops. 

[itmaybeokay]

MTA is currently planning the installation to be complete as R179's are slated to go to the and lines now. R211's will replace the remaining 46's that are supposed to be displaced to other lines.

 

 

I don't see how the R179s could possibly end up on the A F and R. (C and J/M are practically a given for the 4 car fleet.) 

 

The 5 car fleet is incredibly small. 4 trains in total, likely meaning 3 available trains after spares are taken into account. I could not imagine that the MTA would split a 40 car fleet between multiple shops.

 

I agree with Art. By my math, 370 R46 cars run on the Queens Blvd Line every day. For CBTC to go live those would all have to be replaced, and 40 R179's arent going to cut it. 

 

As far as I knew, the 4 5-car R179 trains were fleet expansion for the Q via 2nd ave. I'm pretty sure we'll have to wait until the R211s come in before QBLCBTC can actually go live. Unless...

 

They could, I suppose, almost completely gut the N and the Q of NTT's

 

Oh no you don't... Keep those new trains right where they are.  The few times that I do use the I like the new cars.  It's bad enough dealing with those garbage R68 cars on the and .

 

Except I forgot car assignments are based on the preferences of one guy in riverdale, not the logistical needs of actual rail operations  

 

(also, really? the R68's are some of my favorites. though the CIY ones are kept nicer than Concourse's)

[Via Garibaldi 8]

 

Except I forgot car assignments are based on the preferences of one guy in riverdale, not the logistical needs of actual rail operations  

 

(also, really? the R68's are some of my favorites. though the CIY ones are kept nicer than Concourse's)

Yada yada yada... If they can be kept on the then they should.  The end.