R211 Discussion Thread

[Kamen Rider]

5 minutes ago, darkstar8983 said:

Yeah moving main-line R160s now is not as feasible as it was before (2020-2021 when the  was on 10 minute headways) due to the 63 St tunnel reconstruction. There would have been enough R160s available had they done my plan for the track reconstruction:

reduced , normal  service, no , and  service every 8 minutes between Metropolitan Av and 47-50 Sts, and alternating trans to 57 St-6 Av and to 71 Av (each on a 15 minute headway during rush hours), and the current setup all other times.

You plan would not have worked any differently  and Jamaica is not giving up 10 car CBTC equipment, even at gunpoint.

[darkstar8983]

3 minutes ago, Kamen Rider said:

You plan would not have worked any differently  and Jamaica is not giving up 10 car CBTC equipment, even at gunpoint.

Ohh right, since in that case, any potential gains in R160 10-car units would have been offset by losses on available 8-car R160s. Quite a conundrum when you have partial CBTC installation which restricts which cars can go where, and a car shortage that cannot be corrected until the entire R211 order is here 

[FLX9304]

6 hours ago, darkstar8983 said:

Ohh right, since in that case, any potential gains in R160 10-car units would have been offset by losses on available 8-car R160s. Quite a conundrum when you have partial CBTC installation which restricts which cars can go where, and a car shortage that cannot be corrected until the entire R211 order is here 

Even if the entire order of R211s are complete, it’s not gonna solve any kinds of issues. 

[R32 3838]

45 minutes ago, FLX9304 said:

Even if the entire order of R211s are complete, it’s not gonna solve any kinds of issues. 

It will solve the car shortage issue. Option order 2 is for fleet expansion. Those cars won't replace anything. Even with the base order and option order 1, It'll temperately solve the car shortage issue (until Phase II of 2nd ave opens) since they'll have about a 60 car surplus since the first 100 base order cars is fulling the void of the retired R32s that weren't replaced by the R179s and the rest are R46 replacements. 

 

7 hours ago, Kamen Rider said:

1: they didn’t get scrap happy with the 32s we still have plenty squrrled away… the problem is they stopped training new employees on them.

2: they would not have fixed the problem because, like it or not, they were 60 years old and just as if not more inclined to break down. 

 

They have a 2nd scrap contract, so i would assume the remaining cars are goners unless they keep a small amount for work service and etc. They already scarpped about 90+ cars already ( half of the fleet was going to get scrapped regardless until they made the decsion to retire the whole fleet). in general gets scrap happy when it comes to it's fleet instead of keeping a small chunk for reserve. The issue is that at the time thought There was no point training new hires on them and keeping them in service because they expected the R211s to be in service in the summer of 2022. Plus at the time ridership was still low and they had (i know they still do) a crew shortage. But now there has been numerous issues with the R211s and the R46 fleet is being pushed to it's limits due to the lack of spares. They took a gamble and is now somewhat paying for it. All i know is they better fix these issues before the spring because if they don't it's going to be issues in April 2024 when congestion pricing starts.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited December 6, 2023 by R32 3838

[Ale188]

Alright, at this point, I just hope all the sets are in service by the time I go to the city. If they're not, 160 time.

[subwaycommuter1983]

14 hours ago, Lawrence St said:

Yes, actually. Had they not been so scrap happy with them, it would have saved the day. Again.

Really??

Who's going to operate them??

Do I need to remind you that train crews refuse to operate the r32's due to COVID??

Let's not forget that COVID still exists.

[MJHmarc]

1 hour ago, R32 3838 said:

It will solve the car shortage issue. Option order 2 is for fleet expansion. Those cars won't replace anything. Even with the base order and option order 1, It'll temperately solve the car shortage issue (until Phase II of 2nd ave opens) since they'll have about a 60 car surplus since the first 100 base order cars is fulling the void of the retired R32s that weren't replaced by the R179s and the rest are R46 replacements. 

 

 

They have a 2nd scrap contract, so i would assume the remaining cars are goners unless they keep a small amount for work service and etc. They already scarpped about 90+ cars already ( half of the fleet was going to get scrapped regardless until they made the decsion to retire the whole fleet). in general gets scrap happy when it comes to it's fleet instead of keeping a small chunk for reserve. The issue is that at the time thought There was no point training new hires on them and keeping them in service because they expected the R211s to be in service in the summer of 2022. Plus at the time ridership was still low and they had (i know they still do) a crew shortage. But now there has been numerous issues with the R211s and the R46 fleet is being pushed to it's limits due to the lack of spares. They took a gamble and is now somewhat paying for it. All i know is they better fix these issues before the spring because if they don't it's going to be issues in April 2024 when congestion pricing starts.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The MTA president is still saying as of this week that there’s too much service/ too much room on the trains and buses so no changes are needed. Honestly most people who drive into the city will still keep driving in.  

[NBTA]

The 32s are the saving grace for every subway car incident..

At this point, let’s find all the scrapped parts and rebuild all the 32s so we can have 60+ year old subway cars running on several subway lines. 

Hopefully the 211s come back stronger than before, can’t be having these issues.

[subwaycommuter1983]

23 minutes ago, NBTA said:

The 32s are the saving grace for every subway car incident..

At this point, let’s find all the scrapped parts and rebuild all the 32s so we can have 60+ year old subway cars running on several subway lines. 

Hopefully the 211s come back stronger than before, can’t be having these issues.

Sarcasm. Lol!!!

[R32 3838]

1 hour ago, MJHmarc said:

The MTA president is still saying as of this week that there’s too much service/ too much room on the trains and buses so no changes are needed. Honestly most people who drive into the city will still keep driving in.  

If you believe that, I have a bridge to sell you. is covering their asses.

 

You have 5 car trains running that are already crowded. I took the yesterday and it was packed like it was pre pandemic. They need to expand on services in order to meet the demand.

Edited December 6, 2023 by R32 3838

[Ale188]

28 minutes ago, R32 3838 said:

If you believe that, I have a bridge to sell you. is covering their asses.

 

You have 5 car trains running that are already crowded. I took the yesterday and it was packed like it was pre pandemic. They need to expand on services in order to meet the demand.

They took '2017 ain't over yet' to the next level.

They also took 'There's mad space in there' to the next level.

Edited December 6, 2023 by Ale188

[Ale188]

31 minutes ago, R32 3838 said:

If you believe that, I have a bridge to sell you. is covering their asses.

 

You have 5 car trains running that are already crowded. I took the yesterday and it was packed like it was pre pandemic. They need to expand on services in order to meet the demand.

Also, 'Hey, bozo, come on, I'm walkin here!'

[ThatSubwayFan980]

1 hour ago, Ale188 said:

Also, 'Hey, bozo, come on, I'm walkin here!'

  !

1 hour ago, R32 3838 said:

If you believe that, I have a bridge to sell you. is covering their asses.

 

You have 5 car trains running that are already crowded. I took the yesterday and it was packed like it was pre pandemic. They need to expand on services in order to meet the demand.

 

What do you mean when the  need to expand on services in order to meet the demand?

It is just the system we have to blame for!

[Fan Railer]

There were two sets running around mid-day yesterday; seems like the T/Os are getting more comfortable running them. They sound great running fast!

 

[Kamen Rider]

7 hours ago, R32 3838 said:

But now there has been numerous issues with the R211s and the R46 fleet is being pushed to it's limits due to the lack of spares. They took a gamble and is now somewhat paying for it.

And you want them to take a different gamble on out of date, inefficient, broken down buckets of bolts…

Like… there is a small shopping list of items I need at arms length at all times. I carry them in my backpack. 
 

with the R32s, if I were trained on them, I would have to carry that every time I switched sides because I would not be able to leave it behind in one cab, because people are breaking into the cabs and stealing our tools.

that is and of itself is grounds for them never being used again.

 

there is a pile of reasons you never consider when making your argument.

removing the R32s kinda shortened B Division Schoolcar. It got my class on the road faster.

 

[Lawrence St]

1 hour ago, Kamen Rider said:

And you want them to take a different gamble on out of date, inefficient, broken down buckets of bolts…

Like… there is a small shopping list of items I need at arms length at all times. I carry them in my backpack. 
 

with the R32s, if I were trained on them, I would have to carry that every time I switched sides because I would not be able to leave it behind in one cab, because people are breaking into the cabs and stealing our tools.

that is and of itself is grounds for them never being used again.

 

there is a pile of reasons you never consider when making your argument.

removing the R32s kinda shortened B Division Schoolcar. It got my class on the road faster.

 

I'm sorry, but I have to disagree with you.

The R32's have single handily saved RTO multiple times since the R179's came onto property. The TA should have learned that scrapping cars early before all the replacements were in was a BAD idea. Let's not forget the R44 fiasco.

I do understand what your saying, I truly do, but keeping at least 50 ten car trains of R32's on strictly reserve status until all the R211's came in would make sure that passengers aren't getting affected from missing trains and longer headways. If the  wasn't suspended on QBL right now it would've been even worse with the car shortage.

They managed to run them with switching cabs for 50+ years. They can do it for another 9-10 months, or however long until all the R211's are delivered.

[FLX9304]

3 hours ago, Kamen Rider said:

And you want them to take a different gamble on out of date, inefficient, broken down buckets of bolts…

Like… there is a small shopping list of items I need at arms length at all times. I carry them in my backpack. 
 

with the R32s, if I were trained on them, I would have to carry that every time I switched sides because I would not be able to leave it behind in one cab, because people are breaking into the cabs and stealing our tools.

that is and of itself is grounds for them never being used again.

 

there is a pile of reasons you never consider when making your argument.

removing the R32s kinda shortened B Division Schoolcar. It got my class on the road faster.

 

The TA tools to these people are money they get for scrap. Something the  should do is  all tools, just so that all scrap metal places get the alert that the tools that are being stolen from 🚇 car cabs are offensive lead crime and those attempting to sell as scrap, are subject to 6 months to a year in jail and a fine of $1,500. 

[Kamen Rider]

5 hours ago, Lawrence St said:

I'm sorry, but I have to disagree with you.

You’re free to be wrong.

[Ale188]

9 hours ago, Fan Railer said:

There were two sets running around mid-day yesterday; seems like the T/Os are getting more comfortable running them. They sound great running fast!

 

Looks like 2 things

 4130-34 and 4135-39 switched sides.

Flags look somewhat refurbished on both sets, so it won't look musty so musty like the pilot.

Edited December 7, 2023 by Ale188

[Lawrence St]

4 hours ago, Kamen Rider said:

You’re free to be wrong.

It's not being wrong, it's being logical.

If you didn't work for the TA, and you missed a job interview while waiting for the  and later find out it's because the MTA refuses to use old train cars, you wouldn't be upset?

[RandomRider0101]

10 hours ago, Lawrence St said:

I'm sorry, but I have to disagree with you.

The R32's have single handily saved RTO multiple times since the R179's came onto property. The TA should have learned that scrapping cars early before all the replacements were in was a BAD idea. Let's not forget the R44 fiasco.

I do understand what your saying, I truly do, but keeping at least 50 ten car trains of R32's on strictly reserve status until all the R211's came in would make sure that passengers aren't getting affected from missing trains and longer headways. If the  wasn't suspended on QBL right now it would've been even worse with the car shortage.

They managed to run them with switching cabs for 50+ years. They can do it for another 9-10 months, or however long until all the R211's are delivered.

50 ten car trains = 500 cars. I'm assuming you meant 5 ten car trains, which would be 50 cars.

Edited December 7, 2023 by RandomRider0101

[Lawrence St]

2 minutes ago, RandomRider0101 said:

50 ten car trains = 500 cars. I'm assuming you meant 5 ten car trains, which would be 50 cars.

Yes, I meant 5 ten car trains.

[Cait Sith]

44 minutes ago, Lawrence St said:

It's not being wrong, it's being logical.

If you didn't work for the TA, and you missed a job interview while waiting for the  and later find out it's because the MTA refuses to use old train cars, you wouldn't be upset?

Assuming that.

A. something will show up.

B. It won't have issues(the R32s had the worst MDBF prior to retirement with multiple brake and door problems, R42s were not far off)

C. The riding public would even know what the hell is going on.

 

I'd just leave earlier. That question is one hell of a reach.

[RandomRider0101]

2 minutes ago, Lawrence St said:

Yes, I meant 5 ten car trains.

Got it.

Now here's the thing : even if they kept the last 100 R32s in service today & the 63rd st. G.O. never took place at this time, MTA would still be in the same position they're in now. Except with R32s instead of R160s (the ones from ENY).

I rode an R46 Q train once last year, and it was a less than pleasant ride. I could see why ppl were complaining about them so much & saying they're the worst batch of cars. However, I've recently started riding them daily to work (save a couple R68As), and overall they actually weren't that bad (from a passenger's perspective). I'm guessing Coney shop forces have somewhat gotten used to these cars.

Of course the R46s are obviously not great cars, but ultimately they get the job done and will continue to do so until the R211 order is complete. I definitely feel for employees like @Kamen Rider who may or may not have to deal with this equipment on a daily basis. The rest of us will survive until these cars are all gone.

 

[Jchambers2120]

19 hours ago, subwaycommuter1983 said:

Really??

Who's going to operate them??

Do I need to remind you that train crews refuse to operate the r32's due to COVID??

Let's not forget that COVID still exists.

Where are you getting this information from? I don’t think some of you understand how things work here & how heavy handed this agency is in regards to disciplining its employees, but that comment is laughable at best. I vividly remember yellow chains that acted as a barrier that kept the passengers away from us I worked them on the J in 2020.

Anyway to get this back onto topic it appears that train crews who work on the lines that serve the Queens district are being called to get qualified on the R211.