Queens Bus Redesign Discussion Thread

[IAlam]

On 8/21/2023 at 8:29 PM, Q43LTD said:

Highly doubt that since the 25 is College Point and the 77 is Jamaica 

Well, there's a good chance routes will be shuffled between depots, especially since the proposal already has instances of combined MTAB and NYCT routes. 

On 8/22/2023 at 7:30 PM, Fire Mountain said:

I can honestly see them leaving the 9 and 10 alone, as for the 78 if you ask me, I think it may be a good idea to serve at least Bayside High School (I was class of 2018 there 🙌🏾) due to the fact MAD kids take the 31 and half of them get off on or near Bell Blvd. Maybe they’ll do short turns where some buses don’t run past northern and etc. when it’s not school hours or weekends? Idk, but I personally like the routing myself. Just don’t know if people would acknowledge the route and it becomes the next 79 (in terms of no one ever getting on that bus)

On 8/23/2023 at 1:53 AM, Fire Mountain said:

Hmm, I see what you saying about the southern portion of the 78, and I agree, it may attract more riders especially since for some it will be a one seat ride to Queens Village LIRR. About the northern portion, I used to work in bay terrace, and while it may be busy a lot, (at least where I was), there isn’t really any good spots except for where the 28 lays over to terminate, so it might just be a good idea to terminate the 78 at Bayside. I personally see that working IMO. Would say extend it fort totten, but that will just drag the route at that point. 

There's not much I can add to the 78 conversation that hasn't already been said, but the 78-serving Bayside LIRR will do a much better job connecting the community than the 31 does right now. I know people that will directly benefit from this change.

10 hours ago, B35 via Church said:

IDRC about the routing to LGA that this proposed Q50 takes, I simply don't see this attracting much of any Bronx riders to the proposed Q50 for service past Flushing.... It's a PITA to get to the Q50 for most Bronxites... It's akin to way back when the B13 was the only bus route that ran to Brooklyn's Gateway Mall... Getting to the B13 is a PITA for far too many Brooklynites.... Of course there are other reasons for it, but the floodgates opened when they finally extended the B83 there after all these years (dare I say decades).....

In any event, albeit being better than nothing, the Q50 proposal is a cheap way of replacing the current Flushing - LGA riderbase on the Q48 (which I personally think is a waste of money).... They'd be way better off running Bx15's (especially now that they scaled it back to the Hub, to have this M125 rolling around) or Bx41 SBS' to LGA if they were serious about attracting more Bronxites to LGA..... But nope, they're content with having Bronxites take 's, 's, 's, or 's, to 125th for the M60 - and the vast majority of Bronxites that need/want LGA will continue to do that....

They got these Q70's rolling around, but yet they're content with extending Q50's from Flushing to LGA.... If it's okay to have all these Bronxites descending down to Manhattan to catch the M60 for LGA access, then it's okay for Flushing area patrons to laterally take 's to 61st or 74th for the Q70 for LGA access.... When they came out with the Q70 ten years ago, is when they should've canned the Q48 & had the Q19's routing to Flushing altered, to where it'd run via 108th st & via Roosevelt av....

While I do agree the Q50 to LGA is going to be basically useless, mainly because of the poor frequency and reliability of the route. On a side note, the whole argument from the MTA of cutting the route to the north because of reliability concerns and then extending it to the south makes no sense to me. What I can't agree with is eliminating the Q48 for the Q70, people from the east are not interested in dragging bags up and down so many stairs just to get on another bus, which in the best case takes about the same time and in the worst case can take longer. The 48 might run like s*** but it's predictable and I see a lot of airline employees already using it, especially in the mornings. You don't make service "better" by cutting service and forcing people to take a more circuitous route. We all saw firsthand what happened with NICE after their cuts once they started fixing their mistakes and reinstating service those riders didn't really come back.  A bus-to-bus trip can already be annoying, but a bus-to-train and back-to-bus trip will basically kill any ridership from people who can afford to use other means. 

If there is one thing I've learned from my non transit-oriented friends is transfers are a burden. Each additional transfer you force someone to make for the sake of efficiency the less likely they are to use transit. Any rider that now has to pay a double fare regardless of due to this change or any other will less likely consider transit as an option.

But IMO I really hope they listen to the feedback and extend the Bx15 or Bx41 to LGA and instead of the Q50 just use another route already going down Roosevelt like the proposed Q13.

[Fire Mountain]

1 hour ago, IAlam said:

Well, there's a good chance routes will be shuffled between depots, especially since the proposal already has instances of combined MTAB and NYCT routes. 

There's not much I can add to the 78 conversation that hasn't already been said, but the 78-serving Bayside LIRR will do a much better job connecting the community than the 31 does right now. I know people that will directly benefit from this change.

While I do agree the Q50 to LGA is going to be basically useless, mainly because of the poor frequency and reliability of the route. On a side note, the whole argument from the MTA of cutting the route to the north because of reliability concerns and then extending it to the south makes no sense to me. What I can't agree with is eliminating the Q48 for the Q70, people from the east are not interested in dragging bags up and down so many stairs just to get on another bus, which in the best case takes about the same time and in the worst case can take longer. The 48 might run like s*** but it's predictable and I see a lot of airline employees already using it, especially in the mornings. You don't make service "better" by cutting service and forcing people to take a more circuitous route. We all saw firsthand what happened with NICE after their cuts once they started fixing their mistakes and reinstating service those riders didn't really come back.  A bus-to-bus trip can already be annoying, but a bus-to-train and back-to-bus trip will basically kill any ridership from people who can afford to use other means. 

If there is one thing I've learned from my non transit-oriented friends is transfers are a burden. Each additional transfer you force someone to make for the sake of efficiency the less likely they are to use transit. Any rider that now has to pay a double fare regardless of due to this change or any other will less likely consider transit as an option.

But IMO I really hope they listen to the feedback and extend the Bx15 or Bx41 to LGA and instead of the Q50 just use another route already going down Roosevelt like the proposed Q13.

Nooo, not the 13. Cause were they gonna send it? Citi field? Queens Center Mall? The 13 is good as it is but everything else I agree

[IAlam]

10 minutes ago, Fire Mountain said:

Nooo, not the 13. Cause were they gonna send it? Citi field? Queens Center Mall? The 13 is good as it is but everything else I agree

At the end of the day, I don't care what route does as long as it's logical, the Q50 is not the logical route for this.

[B35 via Church]

9 hours ago, NewFlyer 230 said:

He already mentioned how much of a pain it is to get to the Q50 which is true. The Q50 is only accessible from east Bronx and if you are someone carrying luggage you wouldn’t want to get off one bus to connect to another and then detour through Flushing. 

That is why the Bx15 and Bx41 would be better options for Bronx residents seeking LGA. They serve more of the Bronx and have more connections in general. I don’t necessarily see the Q50 doing any better than the Q48 in terms of airport ridership and I think the detour through Flushing will be the reason. 

I don't think Bronxites would care either way (if it detours through Flushing, or if they were to have it head straight to Terminal A from Lafayette av).... The proposed Q50's footprint/catchment area in The Bronx is way too narrow & as I said earlier, folks aint tryna get to the Q50 from most parts of The Bronx like that....

9 hours ago, Fire Mountain said:

I see what y’all are saying, and y’all both have good points but if they was to ever extend the Bx41 SBS or Bx15 to LGA, they’d have to run it via RFK onto Astoria Blvd, which currently has the M60 SBS running, so I figure that would be a waste right there. And to be real, I actually like the idea they are getting rid of the 48 and the 19 is partially replacing it via Roosevelt and 108th, I’ve rode the 48 a few times, and it’s a lame route that don’t even get many riders. But every time I see a 70, it’s packed, so I see what you’re saying in terms of people taking the 7 to the 70 for LGA @B35 via Church

True - However, there's nothing saying that multiple routes all have to use different methods to ultimately get to some destination.... Proof of that is this city's express bus network.... Never mind this city's highway infrastructure being as lackluster as it is....

For the hell of it, what I'd like to know is how many M60 riders (of those coming off some subway) are accessing it from points south of 125th - compared to that of from points north of 125th....

8 hours ago, Fire Mountain said:

Fair enough. If they do that, then maybe the Q19 can go elsewhere. Possibly Northern to help the Q66 (which gets crowded very often)? If they do that, then I wouldn’t mind the Bx15 and M60 SBS running together via Astoria since they’re both articulated buses. But all 3, yea don’t see that working. But the 41, yeah no. 2 SBS in Astoria when it’s not as busy as woodhaven? Don’t see that working.

One option would be to have either the Bx15 (since that's the example that was chosen here) or the M60 run nonstop along Astoria Blvd. after serving Astoria Blvd ... Another option would be to have both the Bx15 (again, in this case) & the M60 make current M60 stops in Queens.... But I wouldn't use the Bx15 to supplant the Q19 along Astoria Blvd, as there is a need to have something make local stops along Astoria Blvd.... Having the Q19 supplement the Q66 would leave Astoria Blvd with just the (proposed, extended) Q49 - which they have as one of those red routes, going no further than Astoria Blvd/108th st.....

8 hours ago, Fire Mountain said:

Question. Has anyone in here ever reached out to the MTA themselves about these ideas and they actually listen to them and make it happen or nah? 

I haven't.... Not wasting my time... They'll listen to the booger picking, short bus riding folks like the QJTtransitmaster's & the Frederick Wells' of the world, before they listen to accomplished planners like BrooklynBus, as well as those of us commuters that have anything resembling half a damn brain anyway....

2 hours ago, IAlam said:

While I do agree the Q50 to LGA is going to be basically useless, mainly because of the poor frequency and reliability of the route. On a side note, the whole argument from the MTA of cutting the route to the north because of reliability concerns and then extending it to the south makes no sense to me. What I can't agree with is eliminating the Q48 for the Q70, people from the east are not interested in dragging bags up and down so many stairs just to get on another bus, which in the best case takes about the same time and in the worst case can take longer. The 48 might run like s*** but it's predictable and I see a lot of airline employees already using it, especially in the mornings. You don't make service "better" by cutting service and forcing people to take a more circuitous route. We all saw firsthand what happened with NICE after their cuts once they started fixing their mistakes and reinstating service those riders didn't really come back.  A bus-to-bus trip can already be annoying, but a bus-to-train and back-to-bus trip will basically kill any ridership from people who can afford to use other means. 

If there is one thing I've learned from my non transit-oriented friends is transfers are a burden. Each additional transfer you force someone to make for the sake of efficiency the less likely they are to use transit. Any rider that now has to pay a double fare regardless of due to this change or any other will less likely consider transit as an option.

But IMO I really hope they listen to the feedback and extend the Bx15 or Bx41 to LGA and instead of the Q50 just use another route already going down Roosevelt like the proposed Q13.

Yeah, that aint had nothing to do with no reliability concerns, that was nothing more than a swap; cut the route back from Co-Op to have it serve LGA instead, b/c the Bx23 already exists to run b/w PBP & Co-op... Said swap is a losing proposition AFAIC; the current mileage spent running b/w PBP & Co-Op Section 5 is far more valuable than the proposed mileage to be spent running b/w the heart of Flushing & Terminal A (even with the exponential growth & demand for that terminal now, compared to years past)..... Not that I care to defend the Q48's airport usage from Flushing inparticular, but at least the current Q48 serves all the terminals..... That's as far as I'm going to go with any type of a defense of sorts; as their extending of the Q50 to LGA is more than I would've done...

Edited August 25, 2023 by B35 via Church

[IAlam]

23 minutes ago, B35 via Church said:

Yeah, that aint had nothing to do with no reliability concerns, that was nothing more than a swap; cut the route back from Co-Op to have it serve LGA instead, b/c the Bx23 already exists to run b/w PBP & Co-op... Said swap is a losing proposition AFAIC; the current mileage spent running b/w PBP & Co-Op Section 5 is far more valuable than the proposed mileage to be spent running b/w the heart of Flushing & Terminal A (even with the exponential growth & demand for that terminal now, compared to years past)..... Not that I care to defend the Q48's airport usage from Flushing inparticular, but at least the current Q48 serves all the terminals..... That's as far as I'm going to go with any type of a defense of sorts; as their extending of the Q50 to LGA is more than I would've done...

The compartmentalization that they did with the Coop City is just annoying shoving everyone into essentially one line, it reduces how well the area is connected. But even then it kind beings the need for free circulator routes. Honestly, instead of the free routes they proposed, creating free circulator routes would probably be a better use of resources. The Bx23 is a perfect example of a route that could benefit from being a free circulator. Heck if the MTA could create a Downtown Jamaica Circulator that would be a massive bandaid to most of the terminal issues. They could also finally get rid of a lot of those dumb 2 xfer policies they have in place there too. 

But going back to the Q50 yeah it's not the right route to be going to the airport. Even I'm a bit lost as to how to replace the 48, but it really should be an eastern Queens route with something else completing the M60 from the Bronx. But who knows, with all these delays in the next draft maybe they're actually making good changes.

[Fire Mountain]

5 hours ago, B35 via Church said:

One option would be to have either the Bx15 (since that's the example that was chosen here) or the M60 run nonstop along Astoria Blvd. after serving Astoria Blvd ... Another option would be to have both the Bx15 (again, in this case) & the M60 make current M60 stops in Queens.... But I wouldn't use the Bx15 to supplant the Q19 along Astoria Blvd, as there is a need to have something make local stops along Astoria Blvd.... Having the Q19 supplement the Q66 would leave Astoria Blvd with just the (proposed, extended) Q49 - which they have as one of those red routes, going no further than Astoria Blvd/108th st.....

 

That would be the valid option (having the 60 run like the 70 along Astoria Blvd in terms of running nonstop between LGA and 31st Street) and I do see what you saying, so maybe yea we can go with this idea of having the 60 run nonstop IF the Bx15 was to be added to LGA.

 

5 hours ago, B35 via Church said:

Yeah, that aint had nothing to do with no reliability concerns, that was nothing more than a swap; cut the route back from Co-Op to have it serve LGA instead, b/c the Bx23 already exists to run b/w PBP & Co-op... Said swap is a losing proposition AFAIC; the current mileage spent running b/w PBP & Co-Op Section 5 is far more valuable than the proposed mileage to be spent running b/w the heart of Flushing & Terminal A (even with the exponential growth & demand for that terminal now, compared to years past)..... Not that I care to defend the Q48's airport usage from Flushing inparticular, but at least the current Q48 serves all the terminals..... That's as far as I'm going to go with any type of a defense of sorts; as their extending of the Q50 to LGA is more than I would've done...

Yea ima be honest, I did find this kinda stupid considering the 50 was ALREADY limited along Co-Op City, and they scaled it back to Pelham except for off peak. Now looking back, the MTA should’ve from jump just rerouted the Bx15 to LGA from Manhattan TO BEGIN WITH. I wonder what made them think the 50 was ever gonna work….

 

5 hours ago, B35 via Church said:

I haven't.... Not wasting my time... They'll listen to the booger picking, short bus riding folks like the QJTtransitmaster's & the Frederick Wells' of the world, before they listen to accomplished planners like BrooklynBus, as well as those of us commuters that have anything resembling half a damn brain anyway....

That’s foul considering how most (if not some) people on here actually have good ideas for routing that could legitimately work. I was actually thinking at one point of extending the Q28 to Queens Center Mall, scrapping the idea for the Q98 along Horace, but after rethinking it, the 28 would’ve just became unreliable by that point since the route is valid as it is and the LIE traffic stays horrendous especially by the GCP crossover near the Flushing Meadows-Corona Park

[N6 Limited]

On 8/21/2023 at 8:29 PM, Q43LTD said:

Highly doubt that since the 25 is College Point and the 77 is Jamaica 

Also, Merrick just needs an inner route to allow the Rush service, like the QBL. Many riders are going to/from East of Springfield Blvd.

As for the 77, it needs to connect to at least Merrick Blvd for Green Acres connections, etc. They can do school trips to Springfield Gardens HS if necessary.

On 8/22/2023 at 8:20 PM, B35 via Church said:

Nah, that proposed Q78 wouldn't be as abysmal as the old Q79.... Not that this is saying much, but nothing being proposed in this plan would end up garnering a whopping 500-600 riders a whole day like the old Q79 did.... I'd say the proposed Q78 portion b/w JFK Depot & Jamaica av. alone would garner almost double that.... The limitation with the current Q27 is that it doesn't pan past 120th & hardly anyone bothers xferring b/w the Q27 & the Q77 for points south... The Q78 would eliminate that & IMO, would attract more riders along Springfield in SE Queens....

 

I agree. The Q77 doesn’t run frequently enough to bother transferring there most of the time.

On 8/23/2023 at 1:53 AM, Fire Mountain said:

Hmm, I see what you saying about the southern portion of the 78, and I agree, it may attract more riders especially since for some it will be a one seat ride to Queens Village LIRR. 

One seat ride to Queens Village, Bayside (and Laurelton) LIRR. It should be a useful route. 
———

I like the Q78’s southern end because it connects to many routes, which should allow easier trips,(though remnants of the first draft indicates there were plans to send it to Green Acres, how do you all think that would have fared?

[NewFlyer 230]

I believe Q78 usage from Green Arces would be alright because it would give Springfield Blvd and the immediate areas direct service to the mall. I don’t see ridership from the mall being higher than the Q5, and Q85 but the route will definitely take a few people off those routes and attract a few of its own. 

In my opinion I think the mall is a better place to terminate the Q78 rather than on Farmers Blvd in front of JFK depot but I could see the MTA’s planned route routing being beneficial to airport workers primarily.  
What I like about their existing plan is that the Q78 offers more transfers and fixes the issue of the Q27 and Q77 not doing enough for riders. 
 

Just something I realized but the MTA pretty much got away with cutting the Q77 to South Conduit & Springfield. It does not serve the stop on Springfield & 145rd in front of the school like it says on its map. Instead its first stop is with the Q85 in Springfield & North Conduit. It’s not a huge cut and I don’t think too many people care. 
 

Edited August 25, 2023 by NewFlyer 230

[B35 via Church]

13 hours ago, IAlam said:

The compartmentalization that they did with the Coop City is just annoying shoving everyone into essentially one line, it reduces how well the area is connected. But even then it kind beings the need for free circulator routes. Honestly, instead of the free routes they proposed, creating free circulator routes would probably be a better use of resources. The Bx23 is a perfect example of a route that could benefit from being a free circulator. Heck if the MTA could create a Downtown Jamaica Circulator that would be a massive bandaid to most of the terminal issues. They could also finally get rid of a lot of those dumb 2 xfer policies they have in place there too. 

But going back to the Q50 yeah it's not the right route to be going to the airport. Even I'm a bit lost as to how to replace the 48, but it really should be an eastern Queens route with something else completing the M60 from the Bronx. But who knows, with all these delays in the next draft maybe they're actually making good changes.

I'm not fond of downtown circulators as part of an urban bus network... I find them to be too theoretical more than they are practical for their intended purpose; tending to deter daily commuters.... Although not part of the MTA network, that Downtown CoNNection circulator in Lower Manhattan does alright for itself, I suppose - Although it's structured more like a shuttle for Battery Park City patrons... Its routing is very similar to the Lower Manhattan portion of the old x90....

7 hours ago, Fire Mountain said:

Yea ima be honest, I did find this kinda stupid considering the 50 was ALREADY limited along Co-Op City, and they scaled it back to Pelham except for off peak. Now looking back, the MTA should’ve from jump just rerouted the Bx15 to LGA from Manhattan TO BEGIN WITH. I wonder what made them think the 50 was ever gonna work….

The issue lies in the fact that they're infinitely less interested in benefiting riders & far more interested in saving a buck..... Anyone that actually cared about bettering the system that knew the system (which is another problem; the MTA brass is rather tone deaf when it comes to these matters) would know that you're not going to force a route like the Q50 on Bronxites that want/need LGA & have them flock to it (like say, the booting of the Q33 from LGA upon the Q70's inception for Queens patrons)... I mean, it isn't like Bronx patrons in anything resembling noticeable numbers that are currently taking Q44's or Q50's to Flushing for Q48's to LGA.....

Mere theorists & data plotters that could give a f*** about the city, aren't going to have our bus network{s} succeed.... We need at least someone that knows the city, that cares about NYC.

1 minute ago, NewFlyer 230 said:

I believe Q78 usage from Green Arces would be alright because it would give Springfield Blvd and the immediate areas direct service to the mall. I don’t see ridership from the mall being higher than the Q5, and Q85 but the route will definitely take a few people off those routes and attract a few of its own. 

In my opinion I think the mall is a better place to terminate the Q78 rather than on Farmers Blvd in front of JFK depot but I could see the MTA’s planned route routing being beneficial to airport workers primarily.  
What I like about their existing plan is that the Q78 offers more transfers and fixes the issue of the Q27 and Q77 not doing enough for riders. 
 

Just something I realized but the MTA pretty much got away with cutting the Q77 to South Conduit & Springfield. It does not serve the stop on Springfield & 145rd in front of the school like it says on its map. Instead its first stop is with the Q85 in Springfield & North Conduit. It’s not a huge cut and I don’t think too many people care.

What's funny about this is that you actually had a couple ppl. back in the day suggesting running Q27's to Green Acres..... Anyway, while potentially becoming "the" Springfield route, while it does make some sense to run it to Green Acres, I'd still leave it ending down around JFK Depot.... Yeah, it'll be a bit of a benefit to airport workers, but it'll also benefit those workers in those freight forwarding facilities & shipping services down around the DMV as well....

[TDL]

There should be a bus via the Throgs Neck Br. It would run from Westchester Square to UBS Arena via. Bell Blvd/Springfield Blvd/Hempstead Avenue

 

There should also be a Rockaway Pk-Sheepshead Bay bus

[limitednyc]

2 minutes ago, TDL said:

There should be a bus via the Throgs Neck Br. It would run from Westchester Square to UBS Arena via. Bell Blvd/Springfield Blvd/Hempstead Avenue

 

There should also be a Rockaway Pk-Sheepshead Bay bus

What makes u think there is a market for either route. 

[Fire Mountain]

2 hours ago, TDL said:

There should be a bus via the Throgs Neck Br. It would run from Westchester Square to UBS Arena via. Bell Blvd/Springfield Blvd/Hempstead Avenue

 

There should also be a Rockaway Pk-Sheepshead Bay bus

The Weschester to Belmont Park route seems too unreliable and also, I don’t think that will benefit many riders anyways

 

And a route between Rockaway Park and Sheepshead Bay might work, but you got a reason?

[TheNextGen2009]

Speaking of unreliable and not benefitting riders, and sorry if I'm going off topic, but is there any reason why the Q55 should be extended to Jamaica? That just rubs me the wrong way. Like, sure, the 56 is terrible in terms of frequency (next to the 54), but I highly doubt Ridgewood and Glendale riders need a one seat ride to Jamaica. At least, that's what I think.

[B35 via Church]

1 minute ago, TheNextGen2009 said:

Speaking of unreliable and not benefitting riders, and sorry if I'm going off topic, but is there any reason why the Q55 should be extended to Jamaica? That just rubs me the wrong way. Like, sure, the 56 is terrible in terms of frequency (next to the 54), but I highly doubt Ridgewood and Glendale riders need a one seat ride to Jamaica. At least, that's what I think.

Agreed.... The Q55 has no business running to Jamaica... It slogs along just getting out of Ridgewood & the demand from Ridgewood & Glendale to Jamaica is quite low....

[BrooklynBus]

20 hours ago, Fire Mountain said:

And a route between Rockaway Park and Sheepshead Bay might work, but you got a reason?

It is a 20 minute car ride but a 90 minute to two hour bus trip requiring three buses and two fares for most. In the 1960s, there was a ferry for 25 cents that made the trip. There definitely is demand. If it operated along the Belt Parkway shoulders as I suggested to Sheepshead Bay Station with free parking in Riis Park, it would serve a dual purpose, for commuters and for recreation. 

[limitednyc]

9 minutes ago, BrooklynBus said:

It is a 20 minute car ride but a 90 minute to two hour bus trip requiring three buses and two fares for most. In the 1960s, there was a ferry for 25 cents that made the trip. There definitely is demand. If it operated along the Belt Parkway shoulders as I suggested to Sheepshead Bay Station with free parking in Riis Park, it would serve a dual purpose, for commuters and for recreation. 

So why don't you lobby the mayor's office  for direct ferry service.  U would have better off.

 

[TDL]

20 hours ago, Fire Mountain said:

The Weschester to Belmont Park route seems too unreliable and also, I don’t think that will benefit many riders anyways

 

And a route between Rockaway Park and Sheepshead Bay might work, but you got a reason?

How would you then route a bus via Throgs Neck Bridge? That’s a crossing that is not used by mass transit that could be used for network connectivity.

 

[MysteriousBtrain]

6 minutes ago, TDL said:

How would you then route a bus via Throgs Neck Bridge? That’s a crossing that is not used by mass transit that could be used for network connectivity.

 

Most I see as a market is a bronx-QCC connector via Throgs neck and even that market is a bit iffy if not done properly 

[BrooklynBus]

1 hour ago, limitednyc said:

So why don't you lobby the mayor's office  for direct ferry service.  U would have better off.

Because ferry service does nothing for Rockaway subway commuters since the ferry would not stop near the Sheepshead Bay Station and Rockaway already has ferry service. I also believe the Sheepshead Bay community opposes ferry service to Manhattan. I am not sure about service to the Rockaways where there only would only be  demand on summer weekends. 

[BM5 via Woodhaven]

Not for the purposes of having a route via the Throgs Neck Bridge, but what I would potentially consider is having the Q78 operate to/from Westchester Square via Tremont Ave.

This would link NE Queens with the medical facilities to the north, whole also providing direct service and connections between SE Queens and the West & NE Bronx (via the Bx8, Bx31). It would make it easier overall to get to/from the Bronx from eastern Queens (primarily SE Queens). In turn, it would also help alleviate some of the burden of the Q44 and Q27/proposed Q26 routes. 

In The Bronx I would have the Q78 run limited-stop similar to the current Q35. So there would be stops at Tremont & Bruckner, Tremont & Randall, and perhaps one at Lawton Avenue just before getting on the Throgs Neck Bridge. 

The one concern would probably route length, despite that it doesn't hit as much traffic and as many choke points as some of the other routes of similar length. In that case maybe you could swap the Q77 and Q78 terminals (so the Q78 ends at Merrick, and the Q77 near JFK).

Edited August 27, 2023 by BM5 via Woodhaven

[Q43LTD]

So, I'm hoping that idiotic Q1/6 combo is off the table in the final proposal. Which means, the Q1 will do Jamaica-Bellerose with no branch to Queens Village LIRR. The Q6 will more than likely go to JFK Cargo replacing the Q7 which is supposed to be the through Rockaway Blvd route. Still think Cedarhurst-Inwood is a stub though. Ditto with the Q10/64 combo. I was hoping the Q9 could stay south of Rockaway, but it seems the Q10 130 St branch will stay. I guess the reasoning with the Q55 to Jamaica is to negate taking the Q56 to the  or taking the  to Myrtle for the  or Broadway Junction for the . I suppose with this Queens redesign, they want to connect the dots and eliminate backtracking to Jamaica or Flushing. If the  can define those terms

[B35 via Church]

18 hours ago, BM5 via Woodhaven said:

Not for the purposes of having a route via the Throgs Neck Bridge, but what I would potentially consider is having the Q78 operate to/from Westchester Square via Tremont Ave.

This would link NE Queens with the medical facilities to the north, whole also providing direct service and connections between SE Queens and the West & NE Bronx (via the Bx8, Bx31). It would make it easier overall to get to/from the Bronx from eastern Queens (primarily SE Queens). In turn, it would also help alleviate some of the burden of the Q44 and Q27/proposed Q26 routes. 

In The Bronx I would have the Q78 run limited-stop similar to the current Q35. So there would be stops at Tremont & Bruckner, Tremont & Randall, and perhaps one at Lawton Avenue just before getting on the Throgs Neck Bridge. 

The one concern would probably route length, despite that it doesn't hit as much traffic and as many choke points as some of the other routes of similar length. In that case maybe you could swap the Q77 and Q78 terminals (so the Q78 ends at Merrick, and the Q77 near JFK).

What you're speaking of (regarding getting to/from those medical facilities) is one reason why I always thought that a part-time branch of the Q50 should run up to Westchester Sq.... To a certain extent, I have noticed ppl. w/ scrubs & what not getting off at Tremont & xferring over for Bx40's/42's.....

17 hours ago, Q43LTD said:

So, I'm hoping that idiotic Q1/6 combo is off the table in the final proposal. Which means, the Q1 will do Jamaica-Bellerose with no branch to Queens Village LIRR. The Q6 will more than likely go to JFK Cargo replacing the Q7 which is supposed to be the through Rockaway Blvd route. Still think Cedarhurst-Inwood is a stub though. Ditto with the Q10/64 combo. I was hoping the Q9 could stay south of Rockaway, but it seems the Q10 130 St branch will stay. I guess the reasoning with the Q55 to Jamaica is to negate taking the Q56 to the  or taking the  to Myrtle for the  or Broadway Junction for the . I suppose with this Queens redesign, they want to connect the dots and eliminate backtracking to Jamaica or Flushing. If the  can define those terms

I think they merely want to do away with the current turnaround scenario.

[IAlam]

On 8/25/2023 at 12:51 PM, B35 via Church said:

I'm not fond of downtown circulators as part of an urban bus network... I find them to be too theoretical more than they are practical for their intended purpose; tending to deter daily commuters.... Although not part of the MTA network, that Downtown CoNNection circulator in Lower Manhattan does alright for itself, I suppose - Although it's structured more like a shuttle for Battery Park City patrons... Its routing is very similar to the Lower Manhattan portion of the old x90....

The issue lies in the fact that they're infinitely less interested in benefiting riders & far more interested in saving a buck..... Anyone that actually cared about bettering the system that knew the system (which is another problem; the MTA brass is rather tone deaf when it comes to these matters) would know that you're not going to force a route like the Q50 on Bronxites that want/need LGA & have them flock to it (like say, the booting of the Q33 from LGA upon the Q70's inception for Queens patrons)... I mean, it isn't like Bronx patrons in anything resembling noticeable numbers that are currently taking Q44's or Q50's to Flushing for Q48's to LGA.....

Mere theorists & data plotters that could give a f*** about the city, aren't going to have our bus network{s} succeed.... We need at least someone that knows the city, that cares about NYC.

What's funny about this is that you actually had a couple ppl. back in the day suggesting running Q27's to Green Acres..... Anyway, while potentially becoming "the" Springfield route, while it does make some sense to run it to Green Acres, I'd still leave it ending down around JFK Depot.... Yeah, it'll be a bit of a benefit to airport workers, but it'll also benefit those workers in those freight forwarding facilities & shipping services down around the DMV as well....

I think Jamaica is just too big for itself and the major hubs are too far spread apart. You have 179th St., the bus terminal, Jamaica Center, and the LIRR station. While it's possible to get from any one of those points to any of those other points in our current network it requires the knowledge of what route goes where. Then you have routes like the Q43 which feels like it's doing double duty. Having some sort of circulator/downtown connection for Jamaica makes it, so the route can just focus on serving people going in and out of Jamaica. Passengers needing to go to different parts of Jamaica could just use the circulator instead and aren't worrying about what route goes where.  

There was a day I'd be excited about the idea of a Q27 going to Green Acres but now I can't and imagine how poorly that would run. But what I do think is a massive improvement is the fact with the Q78 you won't need to 3 buses to get from Springfield to Green Acres anymore. That was just a massive flaw in local connectivity in the area and now being able to do it in 1 ride is a pretty big win for the area. While I would enjoy the Q78 going to Green Acres for personal reasons, I think having it connect with JFK and routes to Far Rockaway do far more for its connectivity in the area.

On 8/25/2023 at 9:30 PM, TDL said:

There should be a bus via the Throgs Neck Br. It would run from Westchester Square to UBS Arena via. Bell Blvd/Springfield Blvd/Hempstead Avenue

 

There should also be a Rockaway Pk-Sheepshead Bay bus

For Rockaway to Sheepshead, I really hope they do add that to the redesigns because it feels like something that should exist today. 

As for the Throgs Neck Bridge, anyone who finds themselves needing to drive over that bridge most likely doesn't have a good public transit option for their trip. But instead of a Q78 extension or a route that mirrors it down Springfield, I'd rather see a route connecting the Bronx with Great Neck. A route going from the Bronx could start somewhere along the  line and after going over the bridge cutting through Bayside and connecting with the Q78 around Northern and Bell before continuing over to Great Neck for people to connect with all the NICE buses over there. A route like that opens up connections and destinations that just aren't possible now without a car. 

[Fire Mountain]

So from what I’m seeing, most of y’all are fine with the sheepshead to rockaway route, I don’t see the MTA doing that however. Haven’t heard many people talk about such route til now. It might work? And answer this, does the Belt Pkwy have traffic like the LIE do? If so, then they should think somewhere else to run the route along. As for throngs neck, it could work, but I hope y’all know there’s no exit from that bridge heading into Queens, so it will have to get off at 26th Avenue if anything. I think it could work IMO, having it run between Westchester Square and maybe Green Acres. Could open some opportunity doors. However, as a rush route
 

23 hours ago, IAlam said:

But instead of a Q78 extension or a route that mirrors it down Springfield, I'd rather see a route connecting the Bronx with Great Neck. A route going from the Bronx could start somewhere along the  line and after going over the bridge cutting through Bayside and connecting with the Q78 around Northern and Bell before continuing over to Great Neck for people to connect with all the NICE buses over there. A route like that opens up connections and destinations that just aren't possible now without a car. 

However, I do NOT see the MTA doing this right here. Bronx to Great Neck. They wouldn’t even think that deep and that’s their issue. I do like how you’re thinking tho. I just don’t think it will become reality

[Fire Mountain]

 

15 minutes ago, Fire Mountain said:

As for throngs neck, it could work, but I hope y’all know there’s no exit from that bridge heading into Queens, so it will have to get off at 26th Avenue if anything. I think it could work IMO, having it run between Westchester Square and maybe Green Acres. Could open some opportunity doors. However, as a rush route

You know what, I take back what I said about it being a rush route and ima just ask this. What’s y’all opinion on the Q51 SBS (or crosstown) heading from Gateway to Cambria? I personally don’t care, but what y’all think? Maybe that 78 could Become one of those routes between Westchester and Green Acres