(M)/(V) combo maybe happening in the future?

[Eric B]

The R32 set at Fresh Pond Yard is not being used for revenue service. It is being used to break crews in on the secion of track between Broadway- Laffeyete and Essex Street. So it looks like the chances of this happening are high.

 

Yup, Someone Told me that there was an R32 in the Fresh Pond Yard for that reason.

 

How in the world can they be doing this when they haven't even had the hearing yet (let alone it being approved)?

[INDman]

How in the world can they be doing this when the yaven't even had the hearing yet (let alone it being approved)?

 

Don't know, but this is what I have been told. The info was told to me at an ERA meeting last friday and was back up by several others who do work for transit.

[Eric B]

And they must have just moved those cars there, because they weren't there Thurs. and Fri.

[INDman]

And they must have just moved those cars there, because they weren't there Thurs. and Fri.

 

I'm only going by what I was told by a very reputable source. I had heard that there was an R32 set at Fresh Pond for a while though.

[Far Rock Depot]

How in the world can they be doing this when they haven't even had the hearing yet (let alone it being approved)?

 

from what ive learned over the years, public hearings are only a formality.

[2 Train Master]

I'm not sure if any said this but since the will get the (M)'s 160's and possibly some 32's wouldn't the 46's from the go to the or since the is getting 160's.Then also if the (V)'s 46's go2 the \ the will become full length b\c its like swapping 8car (Budd)s to the so the & will have all mixed sets consisting of R32's,44's & 46's.That's how I think it'll go if not some of the (Z)'s 160's will go2 the brown for extra cars if not that then the 46's will make the 6 or 8cars,so idk.

[Grand Concourse]

First, yes it's been said the V will use the M's cars. The length of the M to Bay Pkwy should be enough to cover the V, but the V runs more frequently and will need more trains.

I don't think it'll be that rash where you need to take too many R32 cars from the C. And Jamaica yard still has a few R32 sets left.

 

The V runs via 6th Av and is staying orange. The Z is not going anywhere and not giving up trains.

[Ridgewoodian]

What do you think is a reasonable headway for the line to run? I think it should run more frequently than the current M train (about 6 trains per hour), but less than the current V train (about 9 trains per hour). I always thought that the headways were overkill, considering that there is a 77% chance of finding a seat during rush hour. Even cutting the length of the train would reduce it to only about a 60% chance- higher than many lines. I think maybe 8 trains per hour would be good-the M's ridership would increase, as it would be the only connection to Midtown, especially from Williamsburg, where riders are currently forced to transfer to the F from the J/M/Z.

 

I was at a Queens Community Board 5 Transportation Committee meeting tonight in Ridgewood. There were a couple of guys there from the MTA to explain the all-but-certain changes. According to them they're NOT going to change the M headways, which was something of a surprise to most of us. They said the M runs about 7 trains per hour now during rush hour - which seems a little generous (I'd say more like 6). How this is going to work in conjunction with the Queens Blvd line and given the fact that the new V is certain to become more crowded in the Metropolitan - Marcy portion of its run, I don't know. Eight trains per hour would seem the bare minimum, ten would probably be better. The MTA guys held out the hope that headways could be decreased if ridership warrented.

 

I asked about what might happen when the financial situation of the MTA improves - that happy day that none of us are likely ever to see - and whether it would be possible to get the new V to run 24/7 (since it'll be very different from the J). The MTA guys said they thought it might be worth looking into, and might help out along the Queens Blvd line.

[Ridgewoodian]

heard it from a supt they have the headway already

 

Did they say what it's going to be?

[Grand Concourse]

If they are not goint to change the headways on the M, then that would mean they would still need to turn back the extra Vs [likely at 2nd Av] because the V runs more frequently than the M does.

[asidrane]

If they are not goint to change the headways on the M, then that would mean they would still need to turn back the extra Vs [likely at 2nd Av] because the V runs more frequently than the M does.

 

I would guess the fewer number of trains is going to be part of the service cut.

[Ridgewoodian]

If they are not goint to change the headways on the M, then that would mean they would still need to turn back the extra Vs [likely at 2nd Av] because the V runs more frequently than the M does.

 

My impression was that the new V is not going to run as frequntly as the current V.

[Eric B]

So both a car reduction, and reduced frequency.

They must be putting more trans on the .

[Y2Julio]

So both a car reduction, and reduced frequency.

They must be putting more trans on the .

 

yay for me! :cool:

[INDman]

Remember, the to Metropolitan is a SEVICE CUT.

[Joe]

Remember, the to Metropolitan is a SEVICE CUT.

 

It's just a service cut with less negative impact than the typical round of service cuts.

 

"We mustn't lose sight of what's important here."

[asidrane]

Remember, the to Metropolitan is a SEVICE CUT.

 

It is a service cut, but we can hope that if there are future service enhancements, the V to metropolitan Ave would remain, along with increased trains per hour on the line as well as the return of the Naussau line going to south Brooklyn, no?

[INDman]

It is a service cut, but we can hope that if there are future service enhancements, the V to metropolitan Ave would remain, along with increased trains per hour on the line as well as the return of the Naussau line going to south Brooklyn, no?

 

It's a nice thought, better service at a later time but it is a non issue at this point. Transit is doing this to save money and that is their only motivation for doing this. The big saves in this come from the abandonment of crew and cleaning facilities at 2nd Av. I think there is also a tower or at least a dispatcher who would not need to be there. If the TA came into money at a later date, I think the current service pattern would be restored. We have to see how the new line works out in order to see if and where it could be improved if more money because available.

[asidrane]

It's a nice thought, better service at a later time but it is a non issue at this point. Transit is doing this to save money and that is their only motivation for doing this. The big saves in this come from the abandonment of crew and cleaning facilities at 2nd Av. I think there is also a tower or at least a dispatcher who would not need to be there. If the TA came into money at a later date, I think the current service pattern would be restored. We have to see how the new line works out in order to see if and where it could be improved if more money because available.

 

Since a large part of the savings comes from removing 2nd ave as a terminal, wouldn't the service pattern I suggested above be more cost effective than the current one? Of course it is all based off the assumption that the V running to Metropolitan Ave is as good an idea as many seem to think.

[Zman]

I was at a Queens Community Board 5 Transportation Committee meeting tonight in Ridgewood. There were a couple of guys there from the MTA to explain the all-but-certain changes.

 

Ok, I have to ask this: How many people at the board meeting were against the service "cut" with the replacing the ?

[Zman]

I don't know if they are going to send all Qs to Queens or just enough to cover the loss of the W. But if they are going to terminate select Qs in Queens, I would think they would switch the Q at 34th.

 

All service from 6am to 11pm Mon-Fri will terminate in Astoria. At all other times, (Q)'s will end at 57 St.

[fishmech]

It's just a service cut with less negative impact than the typical round of service cuts.

 

"We mustn't lose sight of what's important here."

 

It's also a service cut that happens to provide a new service beneficial to more than half of the people who ride the current , that is, direct to midtown service from the Myrtle branch and the western segment of the Jamaica El.

[checkmatechamp13]

It's also a service cut that happens to provide a new service beneficial to more than half of the people who ride the current , that is, direct to midtown service from the Myrtle branch and the western segment of the Jamaica El.

 

Plus, the J can go back to Southern Brooklyn later on because the MTA would still save money by not having to operate an extra line between Essex and Broad Streets, and by removing 2nd Avenue as a terminal.

 

If the current M runs 6 trains per hour and the current V runs 9, then 3 trains per hour would be short-turned at 2nd Avenue. The cost savings of turning an extra 3 trains per hour at 2nd Avenue could be offset by the fact that there still has to be a dispatcher and tower operator at 2nd Avenue to watch train movements. Plus, frequency isn't an issue since the F runs very 4 minutes at the peak of rush hour, so the riders would have to wait about 45 seconds extra at the station.

 

If the MTA runs all train the full route, they can figure out a headway that suits both ends. Honestly, I think the MTA might be realizing that a train every 6-7 minutes is overkill for a line that has seats for 77% of its passengers, but they don't want to raise it from 7 minutes to 10 because the people will protest. They figure that if they wait for the extension, they could run it maybe every 8-9 minutes because the M section would be getting more riders as a result of serving Midtown, and cut V service down to 8-9 minute headways (or 10 minute headways if the MTA really doesn't want to boost service on the Brooklyn end).

 

In short, turning oddball trains for no reason (like capacity issues further down the line) really doesn't make much sense.

[Grand Concourse]

So both a car reduction, and reduced frequency.

They must be putting more trans on the .

One can only hope so. No Ms on 4th Av would require more Rs as well.

Actually that would make sense and would solve the problem about what to do with leftover R46s from the V.

[R32 3838]

One can only hope so. No Ms on 4th Av would require more Rs as well.

Actually that would make sense and would solve the problem about what to do with leftover R46s from the V.

 

The Leftover R46's are going to the Or (©maybe) To Replace whatever they are Replacing, The Leftover Trains would Have to Come From CI, R160's, CI is not going to need the R160's from the No More, The Only Needs about 6-8 More Trainsets, The rest would Go to Jamaica (R160 Alstoms A/;), The A-A R46's are going BACK to Jamaica for Service, The On the Other Hand is going to be Covered with R160A-1's and a few R32's.