Express lines...

[qjtransitmaster]

1) This wadn't no attempt at a flame war.... For the longest now I've been (easily) shutting down your points & watchin the various different ways you try to CYA after the fact..... At least this time, your commentary reflects that you actually decided to take something in, w/o some ridiculous retort like you normally tend to do....

 

2) You take things far too literal, and that's what gets you in trouble.... Stop lookin to jump to make red herring arguments where the opportunity sees fit... you do that a LOT.... That comment of 553's wasn't about how far, or how much those 2 routes parallel PATCO....

 

The GENERAL point 553Bridgeton was making w/ that 403/451 reference, was that, if the option b/w bus or train exists, leave it be.... You have those that want to take the bus, and you have those that want to take the train.... You don't try to force riders onto one mode of transportation where multiple options exist....

 

That was the point.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Not sure if those riders want/need lwr manhattan, that's a separate issue.... But the whole point of Anxious & I bringin up a combined qm21/x63 route (that Mysterious2 decided to illustrate pictorally for us) is to shave off minutes to Rosedale riders' commutes....

 

x63 on average takes that 1:40 somethin due to it's stint on Merrick blvd, and even though riders use it at times; those 2 stops along QB.... after current x63's pan down hook creek, you still see buses w/ about 20 ppl or more on em.... this tells you where the demand is at....

Bear in mind that folks make their way to merrick blvd when they just miss the qm21 (this is the argument I've seen on SC, and other places, that's made to support gettin rid of the 21 altogether)... The reverse to this scenario, is less likely to happen (missing the x63 & seeking/taking qm21's).....

 

Anyway, extending buses down to lwr manhattan would nullify w/e time savings that might be had, with the Queens routing of the combined route we're talkin about....

 

I am not trying to make a separate point I am simply adding to ur points as they are compatible with mine.

[qjtransitmaster]

I'm still trying to understand how the X64 can eliminated because of the LIRR

 

it can't beacause of it's direct residential routing and manhattan routing. But if LIRR pass worked on local buses and subway then that may change a bit sort of.

[KNIGHTRIDER3:16]

And since where are all express bus riders fat slobs and elderly folks?? LOL I thought that was esp. funny of him to say. I'm an express bus rider UNDER 30 and I am certainly not a fat slob, though I have seen a few fat slobs ride on the express buses I take. LOL Checkmate can confirm since he's seen me before on a few occasions in person. :cool:

 

So both of you was playing CHESS HUH hmmmm that's nice. Who got king'd or DId you use him as a PAWN.

 

I can't see why anybody would use that fat slob reference with Express riders

[checkmatechamp13]

 

Not sure if those riders want/need lwr manhattan, that's a separate issue.... But the whole point of Anxious & I bringin up a combined qm21/x63 route (that Mysterious2 decided to illustrate pictorally for us) is to shave off minutes to Rosedale riders' commutes....

 

x63 on average takes that 1:40 somethin due to it's stint on Merrick blvd, and even though riders use it at times; those 2 stops along QB.... after current x63's pan down hook creek, you still see buses w/ about 20 ppl or more on em.... this tells you where the demand is at....

Bear in mind that folks make their way to merrick blvd when they just miss the qm21 (this is the argument I've seen on SC, and other places, that's made to support gettin rid of the 21 altogether)... The reverse to this scenario, is less likely to happen (missing the x63 & seeking/taking qm21's).....

 

Anyway, extending buses down to lwr manhattan would nullify w/e time savings that might be had, with the Queens routing of the combined route we're talkin about....

 

So then what do you think of my routing in Manhattan (outside of sending it to Lower Manhattan)? If a lot of riders get off by Third Avenue, that should signify that there is demand for service to East Midtown (rather than have it go down 5th Avenue). And what do you think of the QB Bridge vs. the Queens-Midtown Tunnel?

 

So both of you was playing CHESS HUH hmmmm that's nice. Who got king'd or DId you use him as a PAWN.

 

I can't see why anybody would use that fat slob reference with Express riders

 

First of all, that's checkers where you get kinged and second of all, I'd probably beat him anyway.

[Cait Sith]

I would have the combined X63/QM21 travel via the following route:

 

Inbound:

Queensborough Bridge->2nd Avenue->23rd Street->FDR Drive->Water Street->State Street->Battery Place->West Street and end at the World Financial Center

 

Outbound:

West Street->Battery Place->State Street->Water Street->FDR Drive->23rd Street->3rd Avenue->57th Street->Queensborough Bridge.

 

In Queens, it would travel via Mysterious2Train's route.

 

That way, the LIRR serves West Midtown, while the express bus serves East Midtown (further east than it does now) and Lower Manhattan.

 

The question is, is there really such a demand for a downtown route for both those routes? To send that route from Downtown to the Queensboro Bridge is a pretty bad idea. Considering that this is a downtown created route, it would have to use the Queens/Midtown tunnel.

 

Using 2nd Avenue is also a pretty bad idea at that because its pretty far out from all the other express routes, which is why express routes are centralized within one-two corridors (BxMs, BMs, Xs along Madison & 5th Avenues, QMs & The BxM1 along 3rd and 6th Avenues)

 

It would make no sense for a Downtown based EXP Bus to be running along Midtown and serve 57th Street as well, it defeats the purpose of a Downtown based route. The route would essentially be choked after a while because of the high traffic volume along 3rd Avenue

 

If it WERE possible, I'd rather send this combination further South and have it terminate at 14th Street.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

So both of you was playing CHESS HUH hmmmm that's nice. Who got king'd or DId you use him as a PAWN.

 

I can't see why anybody would use that fat slob reference with Express riders

 

 

LOL... Not exactly. We happen to see each other at one of the hearings since we were both speaking to the board about Staten Island transportation.

 

 

I agree, though there is this one big dude that gets on. You can feel the bus shake when he gets on. He's so fat that he has to wobble sideways in order to get down the aisle. I crack up laughing just thinking about it, let along when I see him getting on. LOL It's so much effort for him just getting on the bus that he works up a sweat.

[qjtransitmaster]

:tup:

The question is, is there really such a demand for a downtown route for both those routes? To send that route from Downtown to the Queensboro Bridge is a pretty bad idea. Considering that this is a downtown created route, it would have to use the Queens/Midtown tunnel.

 

Using 2nd Avenue is also a pretty bad idea at that because its pretty far out from all the other express routes, which is why express routes are centralized within one-two corridors (BxMs, BMs, Xs along Madison & 5th Avenues, QMs & The BxM1 along 3rd and 6th Avenues)

 

It would make no sense for a Downtown based EXP Bus to be running along Midtown and serve 57th Street as well, it defeats the purpose of a Downtown based route. The route would essentially be choked after a while because of the high traffic volume along 3rd Avenue

 

If it WERE possible, I'd rather send this combination further South and have it terminate at 14th Street.

agreed and well said. O my fat slob reference only applies to select express rtes very few of em are loaded with fat slobs as with a few exceptions in queens most express routes are unique in their outerborough routings. Only dumb lines like QM3 and such can be eliminated outright. The QM3 there is just no excuse!!!! Now the E train well sometimes fails so QM18 will have a purpose but if ridership on that line dipps again then it will have to go

[KNIGHTRIDER3:16]

So then what do you think of my routing in Manhattan (outside of sending it to Lower Manhattan)? If a lot of riders get off by Third Avenue, that should signify that there is demand for service to East Midtown (rather than have it go down 5th Avenue). And what do you think of the QB Bridge vs. the Queens-Midtown Tunnel?

 

 

 

First of all, that's checkers where you get kinged and second of all, I'd probably beat him anyway.

 

Third of all, I know that's checkers numbnuts and fourth of all it just sounds like you 2 are close so 5 of all have a happy gay day hmmmm 6th I blv. That about you beating him also:p

[checkmatechamp13]

The question is, is there really such a demand for a downtown route for both those routes? To send that route from Downtown to the Queensboro Bridge is a pretty bad idea. Considering that this is a downtown created route, it would have to use the Queens/Midtown tunnel.

 

Using 2nd Avenue is also a pretty bad idea at that because its pretty far out from all the other express routes, which is why express routes are centralized within one-two corridors (BxMs, BMs, Xs along Madison & 5th Avenues, QMs & The BxM1 along 3rd and 6th Avenues)

 

It would make no sense for a Downtown based EXP Bus to be running along Midtown and serve 57th Street as well, it defeats the purpose of a Downtown based route. The route would essentially be choked after a while because of the high traffic volume along 3rd Avenue

 

If it WERE possible, I'd rather send this combination further South and have it terminate at 14th Street.

 

1) Both those routes wouldn't go downtown: The X63 and QM21 would be combined and that would be sent downtown.

 

2) The BxM1 and BxM2 are seperate from the rest of the express routes and they seem to work alright.

 

3) The SI routes serve both Downtown and Midtown and they seem to do alright, though.

 

Third of all, I know that's checkers numbnuts and fourth of all it just sounds like you 2 are close so 5 of all have a happy gay day hmmmm 6th I blv. That about you beating him also:p

 

If you know that's checkers, why'd you mention it as chess?

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Third of all, I know that's checkers numbnuts and fourth of all it just sounds like you 2 are close so 5 of all have a happy gay day hmmmm 6th I blv. That about you beating him also:p

 

Let me finish up the last 4... 7. Let's rewind... 8. Sounds like you're well seasoned on the subject. 9. You bring it up incessantly, Mr. McGreevy... 10. That's a wrap.

[Cait Sith]

1) Both those routes wouldn't go downtown: The X63 and QM21 would be combined and that would be sent downtown.

 

2) The BxM1 and BxM2 are seperate from the rest of the express routes and they seem to work alright.

 

Might wanna re-read what I said, I didnt say BOTH those routes would go Downtown, I was talking about the combination as a whole.

 

The BxM1 stops at East Midtown - 34th Street while the BxM2 stops at West Midtown - 34th Street and they both have different routings and purposes. The BxM2 stops directly across from Penn Station & Madison Square Garden while the BxM1 stops within the centralized shopping/business areas.

[Q101viaSteinway]

:tup:agreed and well said. O my fat slob reference only applies to select express rtes very few of em are loaded with fat slobs as with a few exceptions in queens most express routes are unique in their outerborough routings. Only dumb lines like QM3 and such can be eliminated outright. The QM3 there is just no excuse!!!! Now the E train well sometimes fails so QM18 will have a purpose but if ridership on that line dipps again then it will have to go

 

trains fail and LIRR only serves penn station so QM3 has a purpose

[Q101 E Midtown]

I agree, though there is this one big dude that gets on. You can feel the bus shake when he gets on. He's so fat that he has to wobble sideways in order to get down the aisle. I crack up laughing just thinking about it, let along when I see him getting on. LOL It's so much effort for him just getting on the bus that he works up a sweat.

 

That thought of that happening on an over-the-road coach bus makes me laugh.

[KNIGHTRIDER3:16]

Let me finish up the last 4... 7. Let's rewind... 8. Sounds like you're well seasoned on the subject. 9. You bring it up incessantly, Mr. McGreevy... 10. That's a wrap.

 

@Checkerhead It sounded better but I'm glad you liked to get King'd

 

@Jabroni 11.I got no prob with you calling me Gay(McGreevy) I mean some good friends of mine are gay and just like McGreevy ,They got the job done unlike you and checkerhead You lack the balls to do all that is necessary to defeat KR and his Team so go play

 

12.I might change your name to Yolanda

[checkmatechamp13]

Might wanna re-read what I said, I didnt say BOTH those routes would go Downtown, I was talking about the combination as a whole.

 

The BxM1 stops at East Midtown - 34th Street while the BxM2 stops at West Midtown - 34th Street and they both have different routings and purposes. The BxM2 stops directly across from Penn Station & Madison Square Garden while the BxM1 stops within the centralized shopping/business areas.

 

I was referring more to the fact that they are seperate from the rest of the routes along Madison/5th Avenue.

 

So the new combo route should pretty much take the X63 route (in Manhattan), then?

 

@Checkerhead It sounded better but I'm glad you liked to get King'd

 

@Jabroni 11.I got no prob with you calling me Gay(McGreevy) I mean some good friends of mine are gay and just like McGreevy ,They got the job done unlike you and checkerhead You lack the balls to do all that is necessary to defeat KR and his Team so go play

 

12.I might change your name to Yolanda

 

You mean they get the job done with you?

[Via Garibaldi 8]

@Checkerhead It sounded better but I'm glad you liked to get King'd

 

@Jabroni 11.I got no prob with you calling me Gay(McGreevy) I mean some good friends of mine are gay and just like McGreevy ,They got the job done unlike you and checkerhead You lack the balls to do all that is necessary to defeat KR and his Team so go play

 

12.I might change your name to Yolanda

 

Oooooo I get 13.... Gotta make this good. :cool:

 

So was that the new and improved you I saw on Hylan Blvd the other day?? Changing it up huh Shakeeda?? Or is your tranny name Shaniqua? :eek: LOL@they got the job done... I suppose they did.

[KNIGHTRIDER3:16]

Oooooo I get 13.... Gotta make this good. :cool:

 

So was that the new and improved you I saw on Hylan Blvd the other day?? Changing it up huh Shakeeda?? Or is your tranny name Shaniqua? :eek: LOL@they got the job done... I suppose they did.

 

I like to set people up but you and checkerhead. Have visited Hylan huh lol that's cool I wont tell, Your secret is safe with me and checkerhead

The truth shall set you free;)

[R68 Subway Car]

The MTA should get rid of express bus lines that run adjacent to a subway line. They are so unnecessary. They should run in areas that have limited transportation access like Staten Island.

[transit bx]

The MTA should get rid of express bus lines that run adjacent to a subway line. They are so unnecessary. They should run in areas that have limited transportation access like Staten Island.

 

Thats the purpose of express lines buddy, alot of ppl dont want to use the subways during rush hours becuase of the crowd and not having no seats and ect. Ppl would rather pay 550 to stay away from all that non sence, express lines are to help out the subway system basically train on wheels. I understand what your saying but ppl actually use the express lines like water all types of time of the days and nights.

[checkmatechamp13]

The MTA should get rid of express bus lines that run adjacent to a subway line. They are so unnecessary. They should run in areas that have limited transportation access like Staten Island.

 

Here we go again. :eek:

 

Thats the purpose of express lines buddy, alot of ppl dont want to use the subways during rush hours becuase of the crowd and not having no seats and ect. Ppl would rather pay 550 to stay away from all that non sence, express lines are to help out the subway system basically train on wheels. I understand what your saying but ppl actually use the express lines like water all types of time of the days and nights.

 

The point is to help out with long commutes in general, but usually ones that involve one or two transfers. It's a lot easier to sit on a bus for an hour than it is to spend 30 minutes on the subway and 30 minutes on the bus, and of course that should be taken into consideration along with factors such as cost and ridership.

 

In any case, this has been discussed to death.

[transit bx]

Here we go again. :eek:

 

 

 

The point is to help out with long commutes in general, but usually ones that involve one or two transfers. It's a lot easier to sit on a bus for an hour than it is to spend 30 minutes on the subway and 30 minutes on the bus, and of course that should be taken into consideration along with factors such as cost and ridership.

 

In any case, this has been discussed to death.

 

NUFF said BRO.:tup:

[Via Garibaldi 8]

The MTA should get rid of express bus lines that run adjacent to a subway line. They are so unnecessary. They should run in areas that have limited transportation access like Staten Island.

 

It's funny that you think only Staten Island has limited transportation... You should get out a little more... lol

 

I like to set people up but you and checkerhead. Have visited Hylan huh lol that's cool I wont tell, Your secret is safe with me and checkerhead

The truth shall set you free;)

 

LMAO... Good one McGreevey. I mean Shakeeda... B)

[qjtransitmaster]

trains fail and LIRR only serves penn station so QM3 has a purpose

You do realize most duplicate express bus routes are not in the top10 for ridership for a reason with a few exceptions QM3 ain't one of em again NO excuse just let LIRR pass work on subways and buses at rush hr then ppl won't be limited to penn station anymore. Even with the transfers it's STILL FASTER. The 7 train may fail but if LIE gets jammed then QM3 WILL FAIL HARDER!!!!!!! That cross honoring policy alone can kill the QM3 however I would monitor QM18 and try and extend it to JFK for increasing it's ridership sorry airport express screw off.

 

 

The only way to keep certain express buses is to make a busway network guaranteeing their speeds. I used QM15 once and got lucky as the ppl waiting for it were there for an hour due to LIE f**kup. I came just as the qm15 pulled in so I wasn't aware of the delays till others brought it up. Imagine that for a useless crap line like qm3!!!!!! yes it doesn't even use the highway for queens bound service!!!!!!!! that is pathetic ur literally better off walking to penn or using local bus or there is no excuse for that again the alternatives have too many adventages over QM3. However that is NOT the case with others like QM5/6/1 and lines like QM2 and QM16/17 where the alternatives are too inconvenient and slow. NOT the case with LIRR which is faster and doesn't require the normal bus subway multiple transfer commute!!! Like other places with express bus. While X14/13 was getting crippled into a slow crap line. useless trash like QM3 was allowed to remain unscathed is just plain WRONG especially where its alternatives are FASTER and less tedious!!!!!! X13 and X16 have weak alternatives. Parts of queens have little alternatives I mean where you can't get LIRR. QM21 is partial duplicate so it serves multiple purposes.

 

The MTA should get rid of express bus lines that run adjacent to a subway line. They are so unnecessary. They should run in areas that have limited transportation access like Staten Island.

 

I agree but only to a certain extent. Some lines perform well you can't cut what works sort of right.

 

The BXM6 is way faster than 6 train if traffic is good. But the QM3 there is just no excuse that's blatant laziness the line is SLOWER THAN LIRR!!!!!!. The only way I see the 4c making sense is merge with BXM4 and eliminate the unpopular grand concourse segment noone likes. Should ridership increase so be it it stays. If that's not enough owell bye bye. Merging the 4c with 4 will put 4 closer to it's depot and reduce travel time for current and future bxm4 users.

[Q101viaSteinway]

You do realize most duplicate express bus routes are not in the top10 for ridership for a reason with a few exceptions QM3 ain't one of em again NO excuse just let LIRR pass work on subways and buses at rush hr then ppl won't be limited to penn station anymore. Even with the transfers it's STILL FASTER. The 7 train may fail but if LIE gets jammed then QM3 WILL FAIL HARDER!!!!!!! That cross honoring policy alone can kill the QM3 however I would monitor QM18 and try and extend it to JFK for increasing it's ridership sorry airport express screw off.

 

 

The only way to keep certain express buses is to make a busway network guaranteeing their speeds. I used QM15 once and got lucky as the ppl waiting for it were there for an hour due to LIE f**kup. I came just as the qm15 pulled in so I wasn't aware of the delays till others brought it up. Imagine that for a useless crap line like qm3!!!!!! yes it doesn't even use the highway for queens bound service!!!!!!!! that is pathetic ur literally better off walking to penn or using local bus or there is no excuse for that again the alternatives have too many adventages over QM3. However that is NOT the case with others like QM5/6/1 and lines like QM2 and QM16/17 where the alternatives are too inconvenient and slow. NOT the case with LIRR which is faster and doesn't require the normal bus subway multiple transfer commute!!! Like other places with express bus. While X14/13 was getting crippled into a slow crap line. useless trash like QM3 was allowed to remain unscathed is just plain WRONG especially where its alternatives are FASTER and less tedious!!!!!! X13 and X16 have weak alternatives. Parts of queens have little alternatives I mean where you can't get LIRR. QM21 is partial duplicate so it serves multiple purposes.

 

 

 

I agree but only to a certain extent. Some lines perform well you can't cut what works sort of right.

 

The BXM6 is way faster than 6 train if traffic is good. But the QM3 there is just no excuse that's blatant laziness the line is SLOWER THAN LIRR!!!!!!. The only way I see the 4c making sense is merge with BXM4 and eliminate the unpopular grand concourse segment noone likes. Should ridership increase so be it it stays. If that's not enough owell bye bye. Merging the 4c with 4 will put 4 closer to it's depot and reduce travel time for current and future bxm4 users.

 

The QM3 has it niche and LIRR will not cross honor unless emergency. When was QM15 traffic going to Queens because going to Manhattan is not problem. BxM4C is bee line and BxM4 is MTA Bus. White Plain is farther from Yonker depot than the BxM4 and BxM4C travel time increase by having it go through McLean, Katonah, and 233 St

[Q43LTD]

You do realize most duplicate express bus routes are not in the top10 for ridership for a reason with a few exceptions QM3 ain't one of em again NO excuse just let LIRR pass work on subways and buses at rush hr then ppl won't be limited to penn station anymore. Even with the transfers it's STILL FASTER. The 7 train may fail but if LIE gets jammed then QM3 WILL FAIL HARDER!!!!!!! That cross honoring policy alone can kill the QM3 however I would monitor QM18 and try and extend it to JFK for increasing it's ridership sorry airport express screw off.

 

 

The only way to keep certain express buses is to make a busway network guaranteeing their speeds. I used QM15 once and got lucky as the ppl waiting for it were there for an hour due to LIE f**kup. I came just as the qm15 pulled in so I wasn't aware of the delays till others brought it up. Imagine that for a useless crap line like qm3!!!!!! yes it doesn't even use the highway for queens bound service!!!!!!!! that is pathetic ur literally better off walking to penn or using local bus or there is no excuse for that again the alternatives have too many adventages over QM3. However that is NOT the case with others like QM5/6/1 and lines like QM2 and QM16/17 where the alternatives are too inconvenient and slow. NOT the case with LIRR which is faster and doesn't require the normal bus subway multiple transfer commute!!! Like other places with express bus. While X14/13 was getting crippled into a slow crap line. useless trash like QM3 was allowed to remain unscathed is just plain WRONG especially where its alternatives are FASTER and less tedious!!!!!! X13 and X16 have weak alternatives. Parts of queens have little alternatives I mean where you can't get LIRR. QM21 is partial duplicate so it serves multiple purposes.

 

 

 

I agree but only to a certain extent. Some lines perform well you can't cut what works sort of right.

 

The BXM6 is way faster than 6 train if traffic is good. But the QM3 there is just no excuse that's blatant laziness the line is SLOWER THAN LIRR!!!!!!. The only way I see the 4c making sense is merge with BXM4 and eliminate the unpopular grand concourse segment noone likes. Should ridership increase so be it it stays. If that's not enough owell bye bye. Merging the 4c with 4 will put 4 closer to it's depot and reduce travel time for current and future bxm4 users.

Quick question, how can the BxM4 merge with the 4C when they're from 2 different bus companies? An express route terminating at an airport is a bad idea. The LIRR will not kill the QM3. Do you realize the distance between the Little Neck LIRR and Horace Harding Expwy? And the (Q79) was eliminated last summer?