68th Street Rehab (NIMBYism at its Finest)

[checkmatechamp13]

1) And what do I consider working class that's so different??? :confused:

 

2) Really?? Oh, it's fine that it's filthy and disgusting so long as it gets people around. Uh... no.

 

3) When did I say that I was fine walking around East Williamsburg??? I stayed in the area where the whites were and only walked from Morgan Avenue to the condo. Going back I refused to walk back to the station alone and had one of my friends drive me to the Morgan Ave station and see that I made it safe inside of the station where there were all whites and it was safe.

 

4) Who cares about NJ anyway? That comment was moreso for NYC.

 

5) What a lame excuse. So because it's NYC, that makes it okay for thugs to get on the SIR and travel to the South Shore to attack and rob innocent people?? That's preposterous. :mad:

 

6) When did I say anything about a rail line in point #7?????????? :confused:

 

7) What do you call blocks of nothing but weeds with no sidewalks? Certainly looks rural to me. Oh and those trailers or whatever they are in Mariners' Harbor certainly look rural to me.

 

8) Is that right? Interesting that you didn't list the stats...

 

9) Yeah well the masses are cheapskates like you so of course they don't want to pay anything. You push this idea of cutting service just so that the fares can be lower. If that's not ridiculous then I don't what is.

 

10) Well then where is the supposed to get money from? Oh, the poor people can't pay. Oh the poor people shouldn't pay fines for farebeating, but the working folks should keep paying higher fares and more taxes to support the ? Tell me how that's for the masses. That's transportation for a few. :mad: :tdown::tdown:

 

11) Yeah well being under 18 has NOTHING to do with the economy. That has to do with your age. Don't blame the economy on that.

 

12) I'm sorry but if transit is supposed to be for the masses as you say, then everyone should pay their fair share. You can claim that it's for the masses one minute and then claim that it's okay for a few to pay more than others.

 

13) Yeah, they can't afford it, but they've got money for designer clothes. Friggin' liars. They can't afford it, but they have money for cigarettes and such. Yeah right.

 

14) That's the problem with this friggin' city. Too many damn handouts. Oh it's okay. Let me break the law because he's poor. Talk about double standards. Meanwhile they stick to us working class folks and let the poor folks off of the hook.

 

And that's the problem. They shouldn't get a free pass. If they can't afford it then too bad. They have two feet. They can walk or stay home.

 

 

1) Working class people generally don't have college degrees. From the way you talk, businessmen, lawyers, and doctors are all working class when that isn't the case.

 

2) That wasn't the point I was trying to make. Spilling some juice or throwing chicken bones on the floor isn't going to require that the bus be replaced any sooner.

 

But yeah, it doesn't have to have the sterility of an operating room for it to be usable. When I use the subway, I don't find it to be extremely filthy. Yeah, it's a little bit dirty, but it's not intolerable.

 

3) And despite the higher white population in the area, I still think it's more dangerous than Mariners' Harbor.

 

4) You can't apply that comment to NYC because we don't have light rail. My point is that light rail isn't more expensive to ride than the subway and the demographics aren't different from any subway line.

 

If you're running the line through a poor, run-down area, it will be reflected in the demographics, whether it is heavy rail, light rail, or buses. Buses have a stigma against them as being used by "riff-raff", but on Madison Avenue, you describe them as being used by upper class people.

 

In LA, the Blue Line passes through some rough parts of Compton and Long Beach and I'm sure the demographics of the riders reflect that, even though it is light rail. I'm sure the same thing applies to the NJ light rails in certain areas.

 

5) I'm not saying it's OK. I'm just saying it's to be expected as part of city life. As suburban as you try to make SI out to be, it's still denser than most cities in the US and could qualify as a city in its own right.

 

St. Louis has a density of a little over 5,000 people per square mile, whereas SI's density is over 8,000 people per square mile.

 

6) The original discussion was how the North Shore Rail Line would revitalize the North Shore. My response (albeit delayed) was that rail doesn't always help to revitalize an area. But it does make it easier for the people living in the area to get around.

 

7) When did I say that rural automatically means run-down?

 

In the area west of South Avenue (since that's the only area that could really be described as "rural"), there was never anything there. In those Midwestern cities, there used to be buildings there that were abandoned and then demolished, giving a former city neighborhood a rural quality.

 

And blocks of weeds with no sidewalks are everywhere, even in the "affluent areas". See parts of the South Shore for examples.

 

8) When I have time I'll look them up. I remember a post on Second Avenue Sagas and I think I remember an MTA stat as well.

 

9) Then let's give the masses what they want. The masses want lower fares so lets keep the fares low.

 

10) There are plenty of poor people, so it's not transportation for a few.

 

In any case, the politicians never said they should pay nothing. You sure like to misinterpret what I say. Whenever the topic of a fare increase comes up, the politicians want to keep the base fare low for the people who can only pay a few dollars at a time.

 

11) If the economy was better, we'd be able to find positions easier. They'd say "Yeah, we can find a way to work around your schedule because we need the extra workers".

 

In any case, even teen-oriented jobs (like Summer Youth Employment) are getting harder to get because of all of the funding cuts.

 

12) But you're not paying more than others because you get a discount. The base fare is $5.50, but $50/10 = $5 per ride and that's just by commuting, not counting the rides you use when you aren't commuting (just going shopping or whatever)

 

13) Not every single person has designer clothing.

 

14) I'm just stating a fact.

 

Plus, if they can't afford the fine, then the city won't get the money from them anyway. And if they put them in jail, it costs the city extra money.

[MHV9218]

Please, watch the Nazi Banksters Crimes Ripple Effect at http://jforjustice.co.uk/banksters

[Via Garibaldi 8]

I'm not trying anything boss, I'm just telling you that I know what I said and I wasn't "complaining" there weren't enough blacks. I said that it was curious you thought the bus was so civilized once all the blacks were gone, and then we yelled at each other and I said that yes, diversity is actually a good thing and having a segregated route isn't so great.

 

Yeah, you were lamenting about all of the blacks getting off at 96 street coming from Uptown and I said that your account of the bus not having any blacks was not true and also that a lot of the areas that the Madison/5th Avenue buses go through are white, so it would make sense that it would be mainly white if that were the case. The thing is I see plenty of blacks on those buses below 96th street, I don't know where you're getting this segregated nonsense from. I took an M1 Limited last night from 43 and Madison up to 57th street and there were a few blacks riding. Yes the bus was majority white, but that's to be expected.

 

 

I have no problem with race, my problem is with the fact that you so frequently feel it necessary to point out the "nasty" or "dirty" man is Latino or black, yet for any other individual you leave out race. We don't all need to be defined by color, you know.

 

That is just ridiculous and you know it. I have talked about obnoxious whites in the past as well. It just so happens that the obnoxious folks that are out and about happen to be black. I have no control over that.

 

 

That's the problem. That we have plenty of jobs but Americans are just sticking their noses up at them? Right. In fact, if we have so many free jobs, you should give yours up and take one! Just to, y'know, prove it to us.

 

 

And why would I give my well paying job up to an incompetent? First off find me someone who speaks several languages such as myself and who can coordinate hundreds of projects a year without a hitch and then we can talk.

 

 

Oh and yeah, that is a problem. Plenty of Americans will not do certain jobs and you know it, so please. That's part of the reason so many jobs got shipped out because Americans didn't want to do them or wanted more money for them.

[checkmatechamp13]

1) Oh really? So you weren't the one that made that comment? Okay, now I'm going to find that thread and post it here ya big liar. I remember it clearly. You were complaining about how the bus empties out at 96 street and how they are no blacks on it as if there is something wrong with it. Don't even try it.

 

2) Uh excuse me, but there's a difference between things being rough and people making excuses. Let's not get it confused. Unemployment is above 9%... That's rough. People unwilling to work certain jobs because they feel that it's beneath them is indeed nonsense.

 

1) I remember that thread. He wasn't complaining that it was all white: He was complaining that it goes from all-Black to all-White at 86th Street.

 

2) And how do you know they're not working it because they think it's beneath them? How do you know they're not doing it because they want a job that pays more money?

 

It was absolutely unnecessary to bring race into the question, as you have done so many times. Does it have to be the "nasty black guy" or could it just have been "the guy taking up two seats?"

 

A realist? No, a realist looks at our world and says, man, things are rough. A realist doesn't call unemployment nonsense.

 

I've seen more Blacks taking up two seats, but I do see more White people (generally teenagers) putting their feet up on the seat.

 

Oh and yeah, that is a problem. Plenty of Americans will not do certain jobs and you know it, so please. That's part of the reason so many jobs got shipped out because Americans didn't want to do them or wanted more money for them.

 

There's a difference. If somebody doesn't do it because it doesn't pay enough, that's a valid reason.

[MHV9218]

Please, watch the Nazi Banksters Crimes Ripple Effect at http://jforjustice.co.uk/banksters

[Via Garibaldi 8]

You're omitting the crucial part, which is how you went on about how the 86th street down M2 was such a civilized bus, which is conveniently right when the bus goes all white. All I did was point out how curious it was you chose that point. It was ages ago but let's not forget both sides of the story. Now in terms of the actual demographics on the M1 M2 M3, depending on the hour it's gonna change but you just know it's a much, much different picture from 96th below and 96th down (M4's got the Cloisters so it's aside).

 

I don't see the big deal. The same thing happens at 86th and 96th street on the train and on the train. A large exodus of whites.

 

 

I don't even think you realize you're doing it, but the vast majority of the time if you have a negative character to b!tch about, s/he is a minority and you preface with his/her race, which is unnecessary and simplistic to be frank.

 

That's ridiculous. I have no control over the fact that the majority of the time they're black. Hell, I have bums hit me up all the time and the majority are white and black and occasionally a Latino, and the funny thing is, they all call me "brotha".

 

 

You know I was being facetious, but my point is basic: the job market isn't half as simple as you think, and blaming the unemployed for not taking jobs (which you seem to think exist, when they don't) is ludicrous, especially matched with your comments about "nonsense."

 

 

Don't even try it. My point is that even before the recession, many Americans refused to do certain jobs because they felt that they were beneath them.

[Fresh Pond]

Ummmmm, don't mean to sound like a tool, but wasn't the original topic of this runaway thread about 2 simple staircases?

 

I'm just saying...

[MHV9218]

Please, watch the Nazi Banksters Crimes Ripple Effect at http://jforjustice.co.uk/banksters

[Gorgor]

Which is great until you call the white section the 'civilized' part...

 

It's true though. Areas south of 96th Street tend to have more civilized bus rides than areas north of 96th.

 

Just because there might be a correlation between civility and race does not make him a racist at all. What I absolutely cannot stand is that whenever anyone makes a negative comment about a certain area or location that just so happens to mainly consist of people of a minority race, people go ahead and start calling them racists.

[MHV9218]

Please, watch the Nazi Banksters Crimes Ripple Effect at http://jforjustice.co.uk/banksters

[Princelex]

You are a racist and an elitist.

 

Get out of my head MHV9218 :tup:

[SubwayGuy]

No, if anything we need to go to $3. The MTA should start running the system as a business so that they actually profit in the end.

 

You are an absolute idiot if you think that.

 

I know this is going to confuse that addled little brain which has somehow gotten by in life thanks to mommy and daddy's riches, but here is a simple concept:

 

Public transit FAILED as a "business". That's why it was taken over publicly.

 

The transit system continues to be run at a loss because it is an enabler for the entire city's economy and therefore WORTH running at a loss. It allows congestion to be freed from the streets enough that goods can make it to market, and it provides an expedient way to allow workers to get to work. Without a transportation system, this is not possible and the city's economy would fail.

 

Transit is a PUBLIC BENEFIT for the people who live here as well as the businesses that transact here...it is not a business itself, and it exists for a reason other than (GASP!) to profiteer and make as much money as humanly possible so that it can hoard it among its executives and largest shareholders.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

No, the racist part is feeling indebted to society to point out every bum is either black or Latino, that's the racist part.

 

Oh really? Well I've been annoyed by two white bums in Bryant Park asking me for change, so there. I didn't mention it because it happened over a year ago and it was irrelevant to what I was discussing. Just stop it already with your accusations because it is nothing but rhetoric. I get asked for change by black, white and Latino bums. It's just a matter of when and of late the bums have been mainly black. We actually have an Asian lady on the corner of 45th and 5th that asks for change (I'm not sure if she's homeless really because I only see her during the week in the morning). I say "ask", but she simply holds up a sign asking for change or whatever, but doesn't bother anyone.

 

There's also a white lady who is homeless that hangs out over on the benches near Staples on 44th and 5th. Both the Asian lady and the white lady could be homeless but clearly both of them go somewhere and clean up a bit because they don't look dirty and such, hence why I don't call them bums per se. Another difference is probably that neither the Asian lady nor the white lady are menacing. The two black guys that I see however, walk around talking to themselves and their clothes (one of them barely has anything on) are dirty and they could very easily snap and hurt someone, as they clearly should be getting treatment for their hallucinations.

 

There was another black guy over by 41st and 5th who would beg for change and then become violent, as he would curse at onlookers and become rude because they didn't give him any money.

 

Yeah, so I guess I'm a racist for simply stating what I see. So be it then, but if I'm describing something, I am not going to leave out something just because some people are oversensitive, so if the bum is white, he's white and that's that. If the bum is black, he's black and that's that. Nothing to get all bent out of shape over.

[MHV9218]

Please, watch the Nazi Banksters Crimes Ripple Effect at http://jforjustice.co.uk/banksters

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Thanks that was basically the "I have gay friends so I'm cool with gays" argument, look I'm not going any further into this but your choices in the comments you've made on this forum have been at best questionable, and that's what myself and a few others have been responding to. I got no energy for any more about this, I gotta ball game to watch tonight.

 

Well you can believe what you want, but I'm not going to change what I say to please you. It would be one thing if I said something derogatory, but this is nothing of the sort. I'm sure if I mentioned folks being bums and they were white this wouldn't be an issue, just like you would be fine if the buses south of 96th street had majority black riders. It's only because they're black that you take such offense with it. You are just too oversensitive.

[Princelex]

Well you can believe what you want, but I'm not going to change what I say to please you. It would be one thing if I said something derogatory, but this is nothing of the sort. I'm sure if I mentioned folks being bums and they were white this wouldn't be an issue, just like you would be fine if the buses south of 96th street had majority black riders. It's only because they're black that you take such offense with it. You are just too oversensitive.

 

Why can't you just call these people bums and leave it at that? We don't need to know whether they are black, white, purple or polka dots. You brag about how educated you are, so you should know better than that seeing that you are on a public forum like this. C'mon now!

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Why can't you just call these people bums and leave it at that? We don't need to know whether they are black, white, purple or polka dots. You brag about how educated you are, so you should know better than that seeing that you are on a public forum like this. C'mon now!

 

I said my piece and I'm leaving it at that, as there is nothing wrong with what I said... Back to the topic at hand... Speaking of bums, I could certainly see an increase at the 68th street station. Talking about them just reminded me of how many have appeared since I first started working up here back in 2007. Before that I was on 18th between 5th & 6th and I could never recall walking down 5th Avenue and seeing so many homeless folks. What's more interesting is that sometimes you don't know that some of these folks are homeless because you don't really look good until you see them eating out of a garbage can or something, so who is to say that there isn't a big homeless problem there already?

 

There are plenty over at Grand Central and that's why I don't sit down thee to eat anymore. I either eat at a restaurant in Grand Central or get my food and go back to my office.

[SoSpectacular]

Eating out of trash cans? Another good reason to get rid of the cans in the stations!

[Via Garibaldi 8]

Eating out of trash cans? Another good reason to get rid of the cans in the stations!

 

Sit down in the Dining Concourse in Grand Central and try to eat and you'll see why I became so repulsed and now carry my food to go back to my office if I get anything from down there.

[Princelex]

Having worked the train this week and thinking about this thread, I think that the station could really use the extra staircase more now that I thought before. It's really hard to shut the doors down up front when the whole world wants to board. It can spread the crowd around a lot better and I would like to think that it would make closing the doors a little faster, if someone doesn't grab the doors first.

[SoSpectacular]

Sit down in the Dining Concourse in Grand Central and try to eat and you'll see why I became so repulsed and now carry my food to go back to my office if I get anything from down there.

 

I've seen people pluck uneaten sandwiches from the trash cans there

[qjtransitmaster]

Eating out of trash cans? Another good reason to get rid of the cans in the stations!

 

but that would only increase litter and make stations dirtier ya know. You solve one problem but then you create another in the process.

[Gorgor]

but that would only increase litter and make stations dirtier ya know. You solve one problem but then you create another in the process.

 

For once I agree with you 100%.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

I've seen people pluck uneaten sandwiches from the trash cans there

 

What grosses me is out is how random the folks are. You're sitting there eating as I have been with a co-worker and out of nowhere they act they're just walking around and then boom, next thing you know they're picking out of the garbage and I'm sitting there trying to eat my food while they're there just digging away.

[MHV9218]

Please, watch the Nazi Banksters Crimes Ripple Effect at http://jforjustice.co.uk/banksters