Why do politicians insist upon making asinine ideas for subway routes?

[CDTA]

Seriously. Just this month we've had the Super Express idea, and the (X) idea. Why don't these politicians learn about the , so that they know that the ( IMO) idea won't work because of service patterns, and the (X) is just.... Not going to happen. In addition, where do they think this funding is going to come from?

[Kamen Rider]

because a politican's main job is to tell the people he or she represents excactly what they want to hear. It doesn't matter how stupid it sounds. A few months ago, a city councilwoman gave the Novas on the M15SBS a bad grade for handycap accesabilty, because of the raised back section of the bus. never mind the engine, fuel tank, transmission, drive train and every other important bit has to go somewhere....

[Fan Railer]

politicians will be politicians. 90% of the crap they spew will never happen anyway.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

because a politican's main job is to tell the people he or she represents excactly what they want to hear. It doesn't matter how stupid it sounds. A few months ago, a city councilwoman gave the Novas on the M15SBS a bad grade for handycap accesabilty, because of the raised back section of the bus. never mind the engine, fuel tank, transmission, drive train and every other important bit has to go somewhere....

 

 

Well for what they spend on those buses (a cool 500k) perhaps she has a point. Yeah the engine, fuel tank, transmission, etc. have to go somewhere and it has to be raised, but perhaps they could change the configuration of the back of the bus and not have stairs to make it more accessible. Many elderly folks avoid going back there because of the stairs, which causes crowding in the front of the bus, so if you ask me I agree. The configuration of some of these newer buses is just bad.

[Roadcruiser1]

Easiest answer. They want your vote. Obviously most people these days care about mass transit including the Middle Class, but these damn politicians are the Upper and the Super-rich Class. They want your votes to make things better for themselves not for you. Sort of like how corporations don't care about you. They care about money. That is what I hate about this nation. It's no longer a democracy, but an oligarchy.

[Grand Concourse]

Well for what they spend on those buses (a cool 500k) perhaps she has a point. Yeah the engine, fuel tank, transmission, etc. have to go somewhere and it has to be raised, but perhaps they could change the configuration of the back of the bus and not have stairs to make it more accessible. Many elderly folks avoid going back there because of the stairs, which causes crowding in the front of the bus, so if you ask me I agree. The configuration of some of these newer buses is just bad.

 

I don't see it as that big a deal, even the HF buses, the elderly rarely goes to the back anyway because they don't want to open the back door themselves. If it's so much about crowding at the front, then they should make everything single seats only and let more people stand at the front while having the back section mostly 2x2 front facing seats. People don't want to move to the back? Fine, have more seats there and let those sick of standing take a seat back there.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

I don't see it as that big a deal, even the HF buses, the elderly rarely goes to the back anyway because they don't want to open the back door themselves. If it's so much about crowding at the front, then they should make everything single seats only and let more people stand at the front while having the back section mostly 2x2 front facing seats. People don't want to move to the back? Fine, have more seats there and let those sick of standing take a seat back there.

 

 

Well a lot of non-transit folks hate the new buses. I like the fact that they're new which means that they're cleaner, but my understanding is that they have fewer seats, yet the room to stand seems to be almost non-existent. I just think the layout on some of these new buses is terrible.

[Grand Concourse]

I think everyone is making too big a deal about the lack of standing space. Yes, having the rear section higher than the lower means less space to stand [unless people were standing on the steps], but it's more about people being stubborn about moving to the back section. Most people with bad knees, elderly, w/c riders would probably like the lf buses because they don't have to climb stairs to get on the bus and the ramp is much simpler and effective than the lift of a hf bus. I see there being more upsides for lf buses than hf buses. It's no surprise that recently local bus orders has been lf only.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

I think everyone is making too big a deal about the lack of standing space. Yes, having the rear section higher than the lower means less space to stand [unless people were standing on the steps], but it's more about people being stubborn about moving to the back section. Most people with bad knees, elderly, w/c riders would probably like the lf buses because they don't have to climb stairs to get on the bus and the ramp is much simpler and effective than the lift of a hf bus. I see there being more upsides for lf buses than hf buses. It's no surprise that recently local bus orders has been lf only.

 

 

Well I personally prefer the newer buses too, I just think they can configure the layout better for standing though, even if it means fewer seats. I was a LFSA today on the M14 and those buses are terrible for standing. The NOVAs though are decent for standing which is strange...

[Grand Concourse]

The Nova artics have a very odd seating set up. It just seems like random seats are interior facing and others forward facing. Much as I like them, I can't really say I like the layout of those buses.

 

I still believe the back section should have more seats as people are less inclined to stand there, so you have a motivation for people to move to the back. If people wants to stand at the front, they can and in the process, have all seats either interior facing or 1x1.

[Via Garibaldi 8]

The Nova artics have a very odd seating set up. It just seems like random seats are interior facing and others forward facing. Much as I like them, I can't really say I like the layout of those buses.

 

I still believe the back section should have more seats as people are less inclined to stand there, so you have a motivation for people to move to the back. If people wants to stand at the front, they can and in the process, have all seats either interior facing or 1x1.

 

I agree with you there... The layout of the front area of those buses (which I should've clarified) is what I do like. I don't even bother going to the back of those buses because the layout in the back is horrible and there is really a lack of AC back there. I agree with your layout in the back. It should be like the 3Gs or whatever they call them. It allows for more standing room too.

[Eric B]

Well for what they spend on those buses (a cool 500k) perhaps she has a point. Yeah the engine, fuel tank, transmission, etc. have to go somewhere and it has to be raised, but perhaps they could change the configuration of the back of the bus and not have stairs to make it more accessible. Many elderly folks avoid going back there because of the stairs, which causes crowding in the front of the bus, so if you ask me I agree. The configuration of some of these newer buses is just bad.

The Orion VI managed to have a non-raised back (it was like a slight slope).

[Grand Concourse]

But weren't they plagued with problems? I dunno if it was because it was truly lf, but no buses have a gradual slope and opting for a split level bus. I also didn't really like the layout of the bus, the 'compartment' took up space in the back and it has the conversation seats the Nova Lfs has.

[Far Rock Depot]

the Orion VI, and the original NovaBus LFS were true 100% low floor. But sacrifices in the design were made making them a maintenance nightmare. Each wheel had its own independant drive. the engine block was placed vertically in the rear left corner. VERTICALLY. The feul tank was stretched along one of the sides creating a bench seating layout for about 8 seats. The manufacturers, wanting to provide a product that would be in demand, designed the "split level" Standard size fuel tank, standard placement of engine block, and most important, a standard T-drive.

 

As far as the seating arraingment, the "conversation seating" provides a slightly higher seating capacity.

 

Now i fully agree with the OP. These politicians have no idea about transit. They dont even use it. I stated this in the thread about the "super A express"

 

@VG8 Im sorry but you post about when you were on the LFSA, you stated that and the Novas as 2 different buses. The LFSAs are Novas. If i read wrong, please dont mind me.

 

 

as far as the seatings on low floors, i know why the seating is arrainged where and why. I can clarify on equipment placing if anyone wonts. Ive studied those designs since the 90s (former engineering major).

[Shortline Bus]

Guys let please return to CDTA's oringal topic on the politicans i.e Manhattan boro President Scott Stringer "X" train idea.(which i agree 100% w/ CDTA it's a dumb and unrealstic proposals)

 

Feel free to create in the NYC Bus thread the issue of bus wheelchair access from that bus designer. Thanks

 

 

Seriously. Just this month we've had the Super Express idea, and the (X) idea. Why don't these politicians learn about the , so that they know that the ( IMO) idea won't work because of service patterns, and the (X) is just.... Not going to happen. In addition, where do they think this funding is going to come from?

 

[Far Rock Depot]

my whole point is as with the point of the OP, and not just the X or the super A. its the overall assinine ideas these vote chasers come up with before doing any research on it. If your gonna PUBLICALLY support an idea or opinion, they need to do their frakin homeowk instead of

A) making themselves look stupid

B)making the MTA look lazy

C) looking like a "person of the people" putting pressure on the MTA to do these rediculous ideas that even if they may be on to something, would probably never happen in our lifetime.

 

Personally, if a polotician wants my vote when it comes to transit related issues, dont just say "Hey, were gonna have the MTA add service here, here and here, and build these lines there, there and there" cause someone will one day actually ask "OK mr politician, whats your plan on implementing this?" and their gonna have one of two responces

A) well we will discuss this with the MTA(which will probably wont happen cause its IMPOSSIBLE)

B) *crickets*

[Grand Concourse]

Totally agreed. :would've clicked like button:

[Via Garibaldi 8]

the Orion VI, and the original NovaBus LFS were true 100% low floor. But sacrifices in the design were made making them a maintenance nightmare. Each wheel had its own independant drive. the engine block was placed vertically in the rear left corner. VERTICALLY. The feul tank was stretched along one of the sides creating a bench seating layout for about 8 seats. The manufacturers, wanting to provide a product that would be in demand, designed the "split level" Standard size fuel tank, standard placement of engine block, and most important, a standard T-drive.

 

As far as the seating arraingment, the "conversation seating" provides a slightly higher seating capacity.

 

Now i fully agree with the OP. These politicians have no idea about transit. They dont even use it. I stated this in the thread about the "super A express"

 

@VG8 Im sorry but you post about when you were on the LFSA, you stated that and the Novas as 2 different buses. The LFSAs are Novas. If i read wrong, please dont mind me.

 

 

as far as the seatings on low floors, i know why the seating is arrainged where and why. I can clarify on equipment placing if anyone wonts. Ive studied those designs since the 90s (former engineering major).

 

 

Well they are slightly different even if they're made by the same company... I was talking about the artics vs the standard bus...

[TwoTimer]

I always felt buses should have similar configuration to trains seating-wise...just bench seats that go the length of the bus, especially on the busier routes. Subway folks seem fine with that...

[error46146]

I believe they did that with the fishbowls

[B35 via Church]

To pretend like they care, full knowing they don't use public transportation....

 

That's why.

[Interested Rider]

Why do politicians come up with asinine ideas for our transportation system? The reason is that they know that they will always get a hearing on the subject as the MTA is responsive to politicians and not us. The media will give credence to the idea and that means free publicity for the politician who can now say "look what I am doing for you" (Really?) On another thread that was posted today, we see the reason as the MTA is dominated by politicians, appointed by politicians who serve at the pleasure of politicians.

 

Until the public comes out in force and appear at meetings on a regular basis where the politicians are held accountable for telling us one thing and say another thing when they are away from us, it will never change. (Don't bet on it!)

[Roadcruiser1]

Or if we can get more middle class people into politics instead of the rich.

[CDTA]

Now see, I would rather vote for someone who says "Express buses to Hunts Point" V.S. "Subway to Hunts Point", because we all know which one is going to happen.

[Brighton Express]

Now see, I would rather vote for someone who says "Express buses to Hunts Point" V.S. "Subway to Hunts Point", because we all know which one is going to happen.

 

 

I have to agree with this statement. It is much easier to buy some more buses, change some signs, and put them into service.

 

Constructing an EL, drilling a tunnel, connecting it to a yard, signalling it, electrifying it, placing relay tracks, stations, signs, maps, databases, yard info, all that stuff takes plenty more time.