Department of Subways - Proposals/Ideas

[CenSin]

As I would do it, to 72nd/Broadway and the with provisions to go further up Amsterdam Avenue in the future.

 

The stops after 8th Avenue as I would do it (all would be designed for 600' trains as part of a long-term plan to have ALL stations on the Canarsie Line eventually be such):

 

23rd Street

31st-33rd Street

41st Street (transfer to if that station is ever built)

49th-50th Street

58th Street-Roosevelt Hospital

65th Street-Lincoln Center

72nd Street-Broadway.  

Too many stops and at non-standard streets.

 

• 23 Street
• 31–33 Streets → 34 Street
• 41 Street → 42 Street
• 49–50 Streets → 50 Street
• 58 Street → 59 Street
• 65 Street
• 72 Street

[Wallyhorse]

 

Too many stops and at non-standard streets.

 

• 23 Street
• 31–33 Streets → 34 Street
• 41 Street → 42 Street
• 49–50 Streets → 50 Street
• 58 Street → 59 Street
• 65 Street
• 72 Street

 

I did the stops that way for specific reasons:

 

31st-33rd is so it's a straight, two-block walk to Penn Station from either exit.

 

41st is because that's where the transfer to the would be if the station is also built

 

58th Street is because of that being where Roosevelt Hospital is and also because that is a straight walk to the Time Warner Center two blocks away.  

 

65th is because of Lincoln Center and High Schools in the area. 

[Around the Horn]

I did the stops that way for specific reasons:

 

31st-33rd is so it's a straight, two-block walk to Penn Station from either exit.

 

41st is because that's where the transfer to the would be if the station is also built

 

58th Street is because of that being where Roosevelt Hospital is and also because that is a straight walk to the Time Warner Center two blocks away.  

 

65th is because of Lincoln Center and High Schools in the area. 

Because stations are typically two blocks long (and the newest ones built three) this wouldn't be much of an issue...

The on 10th Avenue could look like this:

curve from 9th and 14th to 10th and 19th

crossover at 21st

23 Street: spans 23rd to 26th or 22nd to 25th

34 Street: spans 31st to 34th or 32nd to 35th

crossover at 37th

42 Street: spans 40th to 43rd or 41st to 44th

50 Street: spans 49th to 51st

59 Street: spans 58th to 61st

crossover midblock between 65th and 66th

72 Street: spans 69th to 72nd (with midblock exit to 73rd Street)

crossover midblock between 73rd and 74th; tail tracks up to 81st

 

Built like this there's no need for a 65 Street station, plus 65th Street would likely be where the crossover for 72nd Street would be.

 

I'll do it up in Google maps...

[CenSin]

I did the stops that way for specific reasons:

 

31st-33rd is so it's a straight, two-block walk to Penn Station from either exit.

 

41st is because that's where the transfer to the would be if the station is also built

 

58th Street is because of that being where Roosevelt Hospital is and also because that is a straight walk to the Time Warner Center two blocks away.  

 

65th is because of Lincoln Center and High Schools in the area. 

You do know that 34 Street–Herald Square () has a very convenient exit to 32 Street, right? It also has exits to 35 Street. Naming these stations for the other odd street is just defying the pattern.

[danielhg121]

Lol he's just shy of every major street.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using NYC Transit Forums mobile app

[Wallyhorse]

You do know that 34 Street–Herald Square ( ) has a very convenient exit to 32 Street, right? It also has exits to 35 Street. Naming these stations for the other odd street is just defying the pattern.

True, but you have 33rd Street on the original IRT and 77th Street on the Lexington Avenue line (which was built there instead of 79th specifically because of Lenox Hill Hospital I believe).  58th is I believe the main block on 10th Avenue because of Roosevelt Hospital being right there and the Time Warner Center's south entrance is also two blocks east on 58th (otherwise, I would have made that 57th Street, the station itself would run 57th-60th).  

Edited April 2, 2017 by Wallyhorse

[Around the Horn]

True, but you have 33rd Street on the original IRT and 77th Street on the Lexington Avenue line (which was built there instead of 79th specifically because of Lenox Hill Hospital I believe).  58th is I believe the main block on 10th Avenue because of Roosevelt Hospital being right there and the Time Warner Center's south entrance is also two blocks east on 58th (otherwise, I would have made that 57th Street, the station itself would run 57th-60th).  

 

There's a reason why only the original IRT had a 33rd Street station...

[StephenMikeRodriguez]

Hello. I have some expansion ideas that I would like to share. I've been holding onto them for a while now.

 

1. to 72nd Street, with connections to the (7)/<7> at 34th Street and the , , and trains at 72nd Street.

2. to Bay Parkway (West End Line), taking the place of the pre-2010 route.

3. and trains to Kings Plaza.

4. to 238 Street, where it will connect with the .

5. Last, but not least, restoration of service to Forest Hills during late nights and weekends. Weekday service continues to terminate at Court Square.

 

So what do you think? Drop in some opinions and I will get back to you whenever I can.

[pringle5095]

Hello. I have some expansion ideas that I would like to share. I've been holding onto them for a while now.

 

1. to 72nd Street, with connections to the (7)/<7> at 34th Street and the , , and trains at 72nd Street.

2. to Bay Parkway (West End Line), taking the place of the pre-2010 route.

3. and trains to Kings Plaza.

4. to 238 Street, where it will connect with the .

5. Last, but not least, restoration of service to Forest Hills during late nights and weekends. Weekday service continues to terminate at Court Square.

 

So what do you think? Drop in some opinions and I will get back to you whenever I can.

Here's how I would do it:

 

extension to Chelsea Piers

as rush hours West End Line express to CI with on the local

to Manhattan Beach via Nostrand Av

to Kings Plaza and Breezy Point via Flatbush Av

to 263 St in the Bronx

runs to 71 Av all times.

to Kings Plaza via Bushwick-Utica Av Line

 

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[richardye1]

True, but you have 33rd Street on the original IRT and 77th Street on the Lexington Avenue line (which was built there instead of 79th specifically because of Lenox Hill Hospital I believe).  58th is I believe the main block on 10th Avenue because of Roosevelt Hospital being right there and the Time Warner Center's south entrance is also two blocks east on 58th (otherwise, I would have made that 57th Street, the station itself would run 57th-60th).  

most tourists (that i know) think that penn station=34 st

just saying

[Caelestor]

The 10 Ave extension would only have stations at major destinations. Note that the stops roughly sync up with the SAS for comparison.

• 23 St: Chelsea Piers. Additional exit at 25/26 St.
• 34 St: Hudson Yards. 
• 41 St: PABT, Transfer to the . Additional exits at 42 and 44 Sts.
• 57 St: Additional exit at 60 St to access Lincoln Center.
• 72 St: Transfer to the .

A station at 50 St would probably be dropped in the planning phase because 44 and 57 Sts are only separated by 13 blocks.

Edited April 3, 2017 by Caelestor

[CenSin]

The 10 Ave extension would only have stations at major destinations. Note that the stops roughly sync up with the SAS for comparison.

• 23 St: Chelsea Piers. Additional exit at 25/26 St.
• 34 St: Hudson Yards. 
• 41 St: PABT, Transfer to the . Additional exits at 42 and 44 Sts.
• 57 St: Additional exit at 60 St to access Lincoln Center.
• 72 St: Transfer to the .

A station at 50 St would probably be dropped in the planning phase because 44 and 57 Sts are only separated by 13 blocks.

You have the same distance problem between 23 Street and 34 Street. If exits are at 32 Street, then the blocks in between number only 6. It’s the same between 34 Street (with exits at 35 Street) and 41 Street.

 

My more detailed proposal:

• 23 Street: 21~23 Streets to sort of cover for the lack of a 14 Street station at 10 Avenue
• 34 Street: 32~34 Streets
• 42 Street: 41~43 Streets
• 50 Street: 49~51 Streets
• 59 Street: 57~59 Streets
• 72 Street: 70~72 Streets

The ranges indicate platform footprints. If a station has escalators at the street level that reach 44 Street, but one end of the platform only reaches 43 Street, I still technically have to travel that extra block before I can board a train. You cannot simply “serve” a street by building entrances to it. Otherwise, what’s to stop the agency from building a long passageway from 43 Street to 50 Street and saying that a 50 Street station is pointless?

[Porter]

If the were to be extended up Tenth Avenue, the only thing I'd care about is a direct transfer to the at 34th Street–Hudson Yards. That connection is monumentally crucial for the area.

[Around the Horn]

If the were to be extended up Tenth Avenue, the only thing I'd care about is a direct transfer to the at 34th Street–Hudson Yards. That connection is monumentally crucial for the area.

 

Can't have a direct transfer one long block away... A better place to put it is 42 St.

Here's my map of a train via 10th Avenue...

Yellow is stations

Green is crossovers

Red is tail tracks

 

[Wallyhorse]

The 10 Ave extension would only have stations at major destinations. Note that the stops roughly sync up with the SAS for comparison.

• 23 St: Chelsea Piers. Additional exit at 25/26 St.
• 34 St: Hudson Yards. 
• 41 St: PABT, Transfer to the . Additional exits at 42 and 44 Sts.
• 57 St: Additional exit at 60 St to access Lincoln Center.
• 72 St: Transfer to the .

A station at 50 St would probably be dropped in the planning phase because 44 and 57 Sts are only separated by 13 blocks.

Mine would be this (revised a bit):

 

23rd Street-10th Avenue (exits and 20th and 23rd)

 

31st-33rd Street (exits at those streets to line them up with Penn Station plus 30th Street since there is a good chance a new MSG will be there from 28th-30th and 9th-10th Avenues by then with a large number of people wanting the old Penn Station fully rebuilt).

41st Street-PABT (exits at 40th, 41st and 42nd, transfer to if that station is built there).

 

58th Street-Roosevelt Hospital (exits at 55th, 57th and 58th Street, I use 58th for reasons already specifically noted).

 

65th Street-Lincoln Center (exits at 64th and 65th), again for reasons noted previously. 

72nd Street-Broadway (transfer to at 72nd with additional exits on Amsterdam Avenue at 74th and 75th-76th Street, station is as far north as possible to where the transfer to the Broadway Line trains can be accomplished so the north exit can be as far north as possible.  

[Porter]

You're Dr. Evil and you were just elected CEO of the after receiving 'one hundred billion dollars' in nuclear ransom money. You're only allowed to spend it on projects. What would you do and what would your priorities be (assuming everyone forgets about the whole evil mastermind thing)? How far could $100,000,000,000 really take the , in practice?

 

My priorities would include completely remodeling and rebuilding the Nassau Street Line with a new (brown) service introduced to Staten Island, building the entire Second Avenue Subway (plus an extension into the Bronx to 149th Street & Third Avenue and a crosstown 125th Street line to the line), an extension up Tenth Avenue to 72nd Street, a extension down West Street to South Ferry, a (turquoise) service to Jamaica via the SAS, a service to Red Hook, and I'm not sure what to do with the rest.

Edited April 3, 2017 by Skipper

[Around the Horn]

You're Dr. Evil and you were just elected CEO of the after receiving 'one hundred billion dollars' in nuclear ransom money. You're only allowed to spend it on projects. What would you do and what would your priorities be (assuming everyone forgets about the whole evil mastermind thing)? How far could $100,000,000,000 really take the , in practice?

 

My priorities would include completely remodeling and rebuilding the Nassau Street Line with a new (brown) service introduced to Staten Island, building the entire Second Avenue Subway (plus an extension into the Bronx to 149th Street & Third Avenue and a crosstown 125th Street line to the line), an extension up Tenth Avenue to 72nd Street, a extension down West Street to South Ferry, a (turquoise) service to Jamaica via the SAS, a service to Red Hook, and I'm not sure what to do with the rest.

 

For me?

-Complete buildout of the Second Avenue Subway     (this includes 3 Av line in the Bronx)

- teal   from Jamaica to Kings Plaza (Queens Blvd Bypass in Queens, Second Av line in Manhattan and Utica Av Line in Brooklyn)

-  to 4 Av-9 St via Battery Park City and Red Hook

-  to Laurelton 

-  to Springfield Blvd 

-  to 72nd Street

- TriboroRX 

[Union Tpke]

For me?

-Complete buildout of the Second Avenue Subway     (this includes 3 Av line in the Bronx)

- teal   from Jamaica to Kings Plaza (Queens Blvd Bypass in Queens, Second Av line in Manhattan and Utica Av Line in Brooklyn)

-  to 4 Av-9 St via Battery Park City and Red Hook

-  to Laurelton 

-  to Springfield Blvd 

-  to 72nd Street

- TriboroRX 

 

Why on earth would you have a line on the West Side and a line to Red Hook ahead of a takeover of the Port Washington Branch, subway service on the RBB, an extension of the Nostrand Avenue Line, a Pelham Parkway Line or Bruckner Expressway Line?

[Around the Horn]

Why on earth would you have a line on the West Side and a line to Red Hook ahead of a takeover of the Port Washington Branch, subway service on the RBB, an extension of the Nostrand Avenue Line, a Pelham Parkway Line or Bruckner Expressway Line?

 

My arguments for:

West Side Line: in 10-15 years and beyond, the population of the West Side is expected to skyrocket. Hudson Yards is one of at least three different projects under construction in this area, with at least three more in planning or proposal stages. One station at Hudson Yards will eventually not cut it. Also by building tail tracks up to 81st Street, you increase the effective capacity of the entire line, both in TPH and electrical capacity. (potential alternate to the crowded train)

 

Red Hook and Park Slope Line: Additional Manhattan bound capacity to one of the neighborhoods with the largest growth in Brooklyn and provide service to a transit desert. (also helps if the Culver Express becomes a reality and provides additional service along the in Manhattan)

 

My arguments either against or for postponement:

Port Washington line: That ship sailed once that second entrance opened at Main Street in the 1990s plus you'll run into a bunch of regulatory issues and NIMBYs. For one lump sum, there are better projects in mind. (Postponed at best, confined to the drawing board at worst)

 

Subway service on the RBB is a given, I forget to mention it honestly... (Included)

 

Nostrand Avenue: Partially covered by the Utica Avenue line, plus issues with the water table and NIMBY's. Once again for a lump sum, not a good idea. Fund it through the capital program instead...

 

Pelham Parkway Line: unnecessary... light rail instead (Partial buildout as a different transit mode)

 

Bruckner Expressway line: part of "complete buildout of SAS"

[Caelestor]

You have the same distance problem between 23 Street and 34 Street. If exits are at 32 Street, then the blocks in between number only 6. It’s the same between 34 Street (with exits at 35 Street) and 41 Street.

 

My more detailed proposal:

• 23 Street: 21~23 Streets to sort of cover for the lack of a 14 Street station at 10 Avenue
• 34 Street: 32~34 Streets
• 42 Street: 41~43 Streets
• 50 Street: 49~51 Streets
• 59 Street: 57~59 Streets
• 72 Street: 70~72 Streets

The ranges indicate platform footprints. If a station has escalators at the street level that reach 44 Street, but one end of the platform only reaches 43 Street, I still technically have to travel that extra block before I can board a train. You cannot simply “serve” a street by building entrances to it. Otherwise, what’s to stop the agency from building a long passageway from 43 Street to 50 Street and saying that a 50 Street station is pointless?

 

To be clear, I think a 50 St station should be built in preparation for a 50 St Crosstown Line to Queens, but I foresee budget overruns leading to this station to be cut. I also think a 34 St entrance at 32 St, and moving the 23 St entrance to 20 St makes more sense.

 

 

You're Dr. Evil and you were just elected CEO of the after receiving 'one hundred billion dollars' in nuclear ransom money. You're only allowed to spend it on projects. What would you do and what would your priorities be (assuming everyone forgets about the whole evil mastermind thing)? How far could $100,000,000,000 really take the , in practice?

 

My priorities would include completely remodeling and rebuilding the Nassau Street Line with a new (brown) service introduced to Staten Island, building the entire Second Avenue Subway (plus an extension into the Bronx to 149th Street & Third Avenue and a crosstown 125th Street line to the line), an extension up Tenth Avenue to 72nd Street, a extension down West Street to South Ferry, a (turquoise) service to Jamaica via the SAS, a service to Red Hook, and I'm not sure what to do with the rest.

 

In order:

• extension to 3 Ave - 149 St
• service to 14 St / Houston St / Grand St
• service from SAS to Jamaica - 179 St via Queens bypass line
• service to Hanover Sq
• extension to Sheepshead Bay to improve capacity
• SAS extension to Fordham Plaza
• extension down Utica Ave
• service connected to Fulton St local tracks. converted to full-time express service to Lefferts Blvd, runs to Rockaways only.
• New 50 St - Northern Blvd crosstown line
• extension along 10 Ave
• Rockaway Beach Branch reactivated
• Triboro RX as proposed, except the north part of the line runs along 125 St to Broadway
• SAS extension to Co-op City

[CenSin]

To be clear, I think a 50 St station should be built in preparation for a 50 St Crosstown Line to Queens, but I foresee budget overruns leading to this station to be cut. I also think a 34 St entrance at 32 St, and moving the 23 St entrance to 20 St makes more sense.

That’s very vague (not clear). Where would a 50 Street tunnel end up in Queens? There’s a very obvious case for 34 Street getting a crosstown line and tunnel to Queens. There were even plans for it at once point.

[bobtehpanda]

That’s very vague (not clear). Where would a 50 Street tunnel end up in Queens? There’s a very obvious case for 34 Street getting a crosstown line and tunnel to Queens. There were even plans for it at once point.

 

34 St is not actually that dense of a corridor.

 

This is neither here nor there, but I believe that the PATH should build a new Bergenline Av subway from Journal Square to where the HBLR turns west, and then turn east across 57 St. 57 St is central enough to reach Columbus Circle and Lex/59, and a station at 6th Av could connect to 7th Av.

[T to Dyre Avenue]

I like the idea of a new PATH line across Bergenline Ave and 57th St as a much better alternative to extending the train to Jersey.

[RR503]

Has a full on 10th avenue trunk line ever been considered? In theory, it could connect to Queens via a 76th ish st tunnel, and to Brooklyn via a connection either to the culver line, the LIRR Atlantic branch, or maybe a Utica Ave line.

 

This is given we have infinite cash, of course.

 

Thoughts?

34 St is not actually that dense of a corridor.

 

This is neither here nor there, but I believe that the PATH should build a new Bergenline Av subway from Journal Square to where the HBLR turns west, and then turn east across 57 St. 57 St is central enough to reach Columbus Circle and Lex/59, and a station at 6th Av could connect to 7th Av.

Much easier to extend north from 31st and 6th, IMHO. You could either squeeze the existing tracks below the 6th Ave exp, build a newer low level station, or use the provisions for an east side extension at 14th st (?) to get there.

[bobtehpanda]

Has a full on 10th avenue trunk line ever been considered? In theory, it could connect to Queens via a 76th ish st tunnel, and to Brooklyn via a connection either to the culver line, the LIRR Atlantic branch, or maybe a Utica Ave line.

 

This is given we have infinite cash, of course.

 

Thoughts?

 

Much easier to extend north from 31st and 6th, IMHO. You could either squeeze the existing tracks below the 6th Ave exp, build a newer low level station, or use the provisions for an east side extension at 14th st (?) to get there.

 

I really think that any new crosstown like that should be across 86th, which would get you to about Astoria Blvd in Queens, and from there just straight to Flushing. So like making the a boomerang shape. But this would require untold billions of money.

 

The reason I want a new cross-river tunnel is because PATH is essentially at capacity. Even with the new signalling system they will be at their absolute limit. The nice thing about 57 St is that it's way denser of a job corridor, plus if you really wanted to you could bundle a line to Secaucus in with it as well (so that we can finally kill the to Secaucus)