Next Stop for the Bee Line 4C: The Death Bed?

[Qns Blvd Dom]

When you click on the link, listen to the audio clip to understand!

 

http://www.1010wins.com/Layoffs-but-No-Tax-Hike-Coming-to-Westchester-Coun/6533535

 

So 1st was Loop G, then AirLink, now the 4C will be the next Bee Line route to die?

[Forest Glen]

4C ridership is low, but it's not low enough to warrant its elimination. It should at least run during rush hour. It serves a part of Westchester that is isolated from Metro-North

[LRG]

This would suck. I never even had a chance to ride the route yet.

[Shortline Bus]

When you click on the link, listen to the audio clip to understand!

 

http://www.1010wins.com/Layoffs-but-No-Tax-Hike-Coming-to-Westchester-Coun/6533535

 

So 1st was Loop G, then AirLink, now the 4C will be the next Bee Line route to die?

 

 

Not to mention Dom, the #12 route being shortned and ending weekdays at Armonk only instead of running to Jefferson Valley. The #12 should still have ran at least imo weekdays to Mt Kisco.

 

Sadly next on the chopping block could be imo the almost all of the Bee Line shuttle bus service between industial park/office hubs and MNRR train station. Also i would not be surprised if the #14 lost Sunday service to/from Peekskill/Cortlandt Town Center or aka not running north of Ossising and also the #15 Saturday service as well.

 

And Forest Glen i agree. At least run the BXM4c weekdays and Saturdays imo if possible but if it neccesary only Sunday 4c service should end imo.

[FamousNYLover]

Here is more info.

http://www2.westchestergov.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=49:astorino-outlines-a-deficit-of-166-million-for-2011&catid=1:news&Itemid=78

[Cait Sith]

4C ridership is low, but it's not low enough to warrant its elimination. It should at least run during rush hour. It serves a part of Westchester that is isolated from Metro-North

 

I disagree, I've seen a lot of packed buses until the 11:15pm run. Ridership isnt low, it fluctuates

[Shortline Bus]

I disagree, I've seen a lot of packed buses until the 11:15pm run. Ridership isnt low, it fluctuates

 

 

That why even in worse case scenrio, at least weekday 4c service will stay imo. However i do think weekend service is in jepoardy.

[GreatOne2k]

Bee Line could try this to slowly get rid of the 4C

 

Fall 2010 eliminate 4C Sunday evening service

Spring 2011 eliminate all 4C Sunday service

Summer 2011 eliminate 4C Saturday evening service

Fall 2011 eliminate all 4C Saturday service

Spring 2012 eliminate 4C weekday late evening service

Summer 2012 eliminate 4C weekday early evening service

Fall 2012 eliminate 4C midday service

Spring 2013 reduce 4C rush hour frequency

Summer 2013 eliminate 4C reverse peak rush hour service (4C becomes peak direction only)

Fall 2013 reduce 4C rush hour service span

Spring 2014 eliminate 4C all together

[Kingsbridge Bus]

Proxima parada, la cama de la muerte.

 

Wait, this isin't the spanish forum. Anyways, service cuts are stating to get a little out of hand

[Qns Blvd Dom]

Not to mention Dom, the #12 route being shortned and ending weekdays at Armonk only instead of running to Jefferson Valley. The #12 should still have ran at least imo weekdays to Mt Kisco.

 

Sadly next on the chopping block could be imo the almost all of the Bee Line shuttle bus service between industial park/office hubs and MNRR train station. Also i would not be surprised if the #14 lost Sunday service to/from Peekskill/Cortlandt Town Center or aka not running north of Ossising and also the #15 Saturday service as well.

 

And Forest Glen i agree. At least run the BXM4c weekdays and Saturdays imo if possible but if it neccesary only Sunday 4c service should end imo.

 

I was only saying about Bee Line routes gone all together, not getting cut short or anything like that!

 

The ridership has been falling a bit on the 4C due to people loosing jobs & some riders getting pay cuts @ their jobs. The way this economy is, it's going to take a hard hit on premium fare services like the 4C. As for why the 4C Wall St Service got canned, it's a combination of job loss & many jobs in lower manhattan has moved to other locations! Because of that, ridership on the 4C Wall St service has went far enough down to the point that it's not worth keeping around anymore.

The 4C should @ least be sold off to a private carrier all together worse comes to worse & let them decide on how to run the service! Personally the 4C should be left alone as it is. I don't find Metro North to be a good idea for a person to use from Central Ave. From the County Center, yes thats a good way to go as Metro North is only 1/2 a mile or less from the County Center. There are some parts of Central Ave that it's anywhere from a mile in a 1/2 up to 4 miles away from the closest Metro North station & some 4C riders do not have a car. In some cases, you may need to ride 2 buses to the closest Metro North station depending on where on Central Ave you coming from.

Using the 20 to the subway is a good idea to some extent however the 20 is quite a slow line & it's busy as it is, especially Cross County on down it's worse!

As far as weekend 4C ridership go's, I have been seeing many people use the 4C to/from Empire City & in some cases on some trips, majority of the riders are on/off by Empire City! I would have to say that having most, if not all the 4C end around Fort Hill Road on the northern edge of Yonkers would be a great idea, especially it would cut down on deadhead costs quite a bit!

[Grand Concourse]

4C, meet C4

 

lol, couldn't resist the pun.

[JohnQPine]

More Bee-Line cuts on the way. And the 4C will be killed.

http://www.westchestergov.com/jtransportation/pdfs/web_hearing_notice.pdf

 

Thank the ASSorino...he's apparently trying to impress fat man:confused:

[DOB2RTO]

4C ridership is low, but it's not low enough to warrant its elimination. It should at least run during rush hour. It serves a part of Westchester that is isolated from Metro-North

 

Central Ave, is a few blocks away from MNRR Harlem line. Bee-Line 20 to the route 66 or White Plains MNRR station. That route isn't needed, IMO. Most of us poor schmucks here take the local bus to the subway. We can't complain about a packed subway here, cause all Bee-line routes that connect with the subway, drop off at the beginning of the subway line. That route is just for the few that don't want to ride with the undesirable folks (I can't blame them though). Before MetroCard, the fare went to $7. They want that service, let them pay $7 for it at all times.........

 

Now saying that, what the hell did they bus all those f*cking buses for, then. Are they going to sell them, convert them, or what??????

[Shortline Bus]

Central Ave, is a few blocks away from MNRR Harlem line. Bee-Line 20 to the route 66 or White Plains MNRR station. That route isn't needed, IMO. Most of us poor schmucks here take the local bus to the subway. We can't complain about a packed subway here, cause all Bee-line routes that connect with the subway, drop off at the beginning of the subway line. That route is just for the few that don't want to ride with the undesirable folks (I can't blame them though). Before MetroCard, the fare went to $7. They want that service, let them pay $7 for it at all times.........

 

Now saying that, what the hell did they bus all those f*cking buses for, then. Are they going to sell them, convert them, or what??????

 

DOB2rto i disagree to your above statement. I rode the 4c during a rush hour on a Friday afternoon on a railfan trip from Midtown-White Plains back in September. While not SRO almost all of the seats on the MCI was filled. Not sure if you ever rode it but there enough ridership to run this at least weekdays. Unlike most parts of the recently shortned #12 in Northern Westchester, people do use the 4c.

 

It's the weekend 4c ridership particuarly Sundays that maybe should be looked into being cut. While driving on Central Ave on a Saturday and Sunday and i noticed most of the current 4c weekend riders get off either at Yonkers raceway/Empire City Casino and by Tuckhoe Rd.

Not to mention Empire City being at least 2 miles from either the Crestwood Harlem Valley Local MNRR or Yonkers-Getty Sq. stations on the Hudson line. There also a bunch of eldery riders who also use the 4c that live near Central Ave in Yonkers and Scardale as well.

 

On that one i agree with Mr. Wilson aka Forest Glen. At least keep weekday and maybe Saturday 4c service and cut Sunday service.

[DOB2RTO]

DOB2rto i disagree to your above statement. I rode the 4c during a rush hour on a Friday afternoon on a railfan trip from Midtown-White Plains back in September. While not SRO almost all of the seats on the MCI was filled. Not sure if you ever rode it but there enough ridership to run this at least weekdays. Unlike most parts of the recently shortned #12 in Northern Westchester, people do use the 4c.

 

It's the weekend 4c ridership particuarly Sundays that maybe should be looked into being cut. While driving on Central Ave on a Saturday and Sunday and i noticed most of the current 4c weekend riders get off either at Yonkers raceway/Empire City Casino and by Tuckhoe Rd.

Not to mention Empire City being at least 2 miles from either the Crestwood Harlem Valley Local MNRR or Yonkers-Getty Sq. stations on the Hudson line.

 

On that one i agree with Mr. Wilson aka Forest Glen. At least keep weekday and maybe Saturday 4c service and cut Sunday service.

 

 

I was born, drive, and live here. A bus with coach seats, looks more full than it actually is. Just that fact, our former County Executive, and now this one, from two different parties, have the numbers to realize it isn't needed. The Bee-Line 20 goes to the 4 train, which stops at Grand Central. I say kill the BxM4C, get more artics, and increase frequency and service along the 20 route, especially rush hours. Matter a fact more limited 20 buses. If people here really want that service, it should be rush hours only, weekdays only. Saturday and Sunday service should be canned, as the Bee-line 20 isn't that packed, and most who use that 4C bus, are Mon-Fri workers in Midtown (I read they already canned the Wall St. part).........

 

Let them foot the cost of the bus also. $7 fare once again.......

[Shortline Bus]

I was born, drive, and live here. A bus with coach seats, looks more full than it actually is. Just that fact, our former County Executive, and now this one, from two different parties, have the numbers to realize it isn't needed. The Bee-Line 20 goes to the 4 train, which stops at Grand Central. I say kill the BxM4C, get more artics, and increase frequency and service along the 20 route, especially rush hours. Matter a fact more limited 20 buses. If people here really want that service, it should be rush hours only, weekdays only. Saturday and Sunday service should be canned, as the Bee-line 20 isn't that packed, and most who use that 4C bus, are Mon-Fri workers in Midtown (I read they already canned the Wall St. part).........

 

Let them foot the cost of the bus also. $7 fare once again.......

 

At least we agree it should be a weekday rush hour only route and agree Sunday service should be canned. Saturday is debateable DOB2RTO imo. Also i agree on raising the 4c fare to $7 one-way and 1/2 half for Seniors/Disabled off peak in the pre metro card days from 2004-07.

 

Looking at the schedule i also agree and amazed how does the 4c run Midtown bound until around 10pm Monday-Saturdays and 8-9pm Sundays?

The last bus if it still has Monday-Friday service should be 8pm Midtown bound and around 11pm Westchester Bound.

 

Again the 4c gets more ridership than some of the bee line routes i been on though.

[B35 via Church]

I was only saying about Bee Line routes gone all together, not getting cut short or anything like that!

 

The ridership has been falling a bit on the 4C due to people loosing jobs & some riders getting pay cuts @ their jobs. The way this economy is, it's going to take a hard hit on premium fare services like the 4C. As for why the 4C Wall St Service got canned, it's a combination of job loss & many jobs in lower manhattan has moved to other locations! Because of that, ridership on the 4C Wall St service has went far enough down to the point that it's not worth keeping around anymore.

The 4C should @ least be sold off to a private carrier all together worse comes to worse & let them decide on how to run the service! Personally the 4C should be left alone as it is. I don't find Metro North to be a good idea for a person to use from Central Ave. From the County Center, yes thats a good way to go as Metro North is only 1/2 a mile or less from the County Center. There are some parts of Central Ave that it's anywhere from a mile in a 1/2 up to 4 miles away from the closest Metro North station & some 4C riders do not have a car. In some cases, you may need to ride 2 buses to the closest Metro North station depending on where on Central Ave you coming from.

Using the 20 to the subway is a good idea to some extent however the 20 is quite a slow line & it's busy as it is, especially Cross County on down it's worse!

As far as weekend 4C ridership go's, I have been seeing many people use the 4C to/from Empire City & in some cases on some trips, majority of the riders are on/off by Empire City! I would have to say that having most, if not all the 4C end around Fort Hill Road on the northern edge of Yonkers would be a great idea, especially it would cut down on deadhead costs quite a bit!

 

Accurate post.

 

Well said.... couldn't agree more.

 

 

Weekend 4c's do tank after it serves Empire city... short story...

I remember one time I rode that route (it was on a Saturday), I was surprised @ the number of people that boarded the bus, along w/ me over on 25th/madison; I assumed most of those ppl. were waiting for the bxm3 or the 4a/b.... in any event, almost every seat was filled by time we left manhattan.... but, by time we reached the raceway, about 20-25 people got off.... I was like, wtf... it wasn't something I was expecting....

 

Anyway, of course I was the only fool who rode it to the last stop (having to cross tarrytown/white plains rd is no picnic)... even the b/o gave me a look, like "you're still on the bus @ this point"...

[St Louis Car 09]

4C, meet C4

 

lol, couldn't resist the pun.

That C4 will be in the next speed Sequel "Speed 3. Bee there or Bee Squared"

[Shortline Bus]

Accurate post.

 

Well said.... couldn't agree more.

 

 

Weekend 4c's do tank after it serves Empire city... short story...

I remember one time I rode that route (it was on a Saturday), I was surprised @ the number of people that boarded the bus, along w/ me over on 25th/madison; I assumed most of those ppl. were waiting for the bxm3 or the 4a/b.... in any event, almost every seat was filled by time we left manhattan.... but, by time we reached the raceway, about 20-25 people got off.... I was like, wtf... it wasn't something I was expecting....

 

Anyway, of course I was the only fool who rode it to the last stop (having to cross tarrytown/white plains rd is no picnic)... even the b/o gave me a look, like "you're still on the bus @ this point"...

 

That why i propose that all off peak 4c's end/start around Tuckhoe Rd if it survives as a compromise.

[Shortline Bus]

And a question for DOB2RTO? You seem to dislike this BXM4c route why? This route gets more ridership than other NYC express bus lines the BM4 BXM4a/b BXM6 and X25 among others?

[B35 via Church]

Hey, Grand Concourse......

 

 

fixt it for ya :cool:

[DOB2RTO]

And a question for DOB2RTO? You seem to dislike this BXM4c route why? This route gets more ridership than other NYC express bus lines the BM4 BXM4a/b BXM6 and X25 among others?

 

It's not about ridership. It's about if there is an alternative. There is. MNRR and the frequent Bee-line 20 along with the train is that alternative. Does those ridership numbers on the BxM4C, pay for the driver (pay, healthcosts, pension, etc), fuel, brakes, tires, etc. In the course of a week, I bet it doesn't. A line that has low ridership numbers doesn't have to be gotten rid of, if there is no alternative mode of public transportation. The Brooklyn Manhattan routes do that. They are not like the 4C. I highly doubt to may elderly people on a budget, will use the 4C at $5, when they can get on a Bee-Line 20 for $1.25, and get a free transfer to the subway. I never used that line, and used the BxM3 once, cause it is cheaper to take the bus to the train. I know the income bracket of 4c riders, and that part of Yonkers, Scarsdale, Hartsdale, and White Plains. Their reasons for wanting an express bus isn't the same as lets say Staten Island. Those people ain't stupid, and neither am I. They know undesired folks don't have the monies to ride that bus route. That is one of the few bus routes in the NYC metro area, that is solely to cater to a certain class of people. That's not my opinion. I know Westchester very, very, well. They want their limo,let them have it, for a cost that they will pay for..........

 

To be honest, I an tired of commenting on express buses. Staten Island has little options, MNRR can run more train, Bee-line can run more 20 buses. Again unlike STI, BxM4C riders have options. I honestly don't ride them, and the only people who should be commenting and concerned are those who do use those routes frequently. Forest Glen, neither you ride that route, except on fan trips, or even live here. I don't ride that route at all, but do live here, and see that bus frequently, and at this point, I am tired of arguing over something that doesn't concern me. That route concerns the more affluent Westchester residents who want it. Again, they can have it, but if they have to pay more for it, let them pay for it. It's only fair they pay for it, instead of jacking up the local bus fares, which the lower - middle middle class use, and of course our seniors use. Local buses here in Westchester should not subsidize an express route with alternative modes of public transportation available.

 

 

I am done with this.........

[Shortline Bus]

Buddy if you dont want to talk about it anymore this 4c topic that fine. Point well taken and you make some good points on excessive service. However i think we have to agree to disagree DOB2RTO and i agree to a point your arguments to raising the base fare on the 4c to keep it running is fair and should be looked at. IMO there enough ridership on the 4c to at least run it weekdays all day. If ridership counts proves a need for weekend service as well maybe as 'compromise' the 4c on weekends/off peak be shortned the Northern Terminal to around Tuckhoe Rd area since off peak as B-35 said earlier in this thread ' ridership tanks' *North* of Yonkers Raceway/Cross County Mall area.

 

 

It's not about ridership. It's about if there is an alternative. There is. MNRR and the frequent Bee-line 20 along with the train is that alternative. Does those ridership numbers on the BxM4C, pay for the driver (pay, healthcosts, pension, etc), fuel, brakes, tires, etc. In the course of a week, I bet it doesn't. A line that has low ridership numbers doesn't have to be gotten rid of, if there is no alternative mode of public transportation. The Brooklyn Manhattan routes do that. They are not like the 4C. I highly doubt to may elderly people on a budget, will use the 4C at $5, when they can get on a Bee-Line 20 for $1.25, and get a free transfer to the subway. I never used that line, and used the BxM3 once, cause it is cheaper to take the bus to the train. I know the income bracket of 4c riders, and that part of Yonkers, Scarsdale, Hartsdale, and White Plains. Their reasons for wanting an express bus isn't the same as lets say Staten Island. Those people ain't stupid, and neither am I. They know undesired folks don't have the monies to ride that bus route. That is one of the few bus routes in the NYC metro area, that is solely to cater to a certain class of people. That's not my opinion. I know Westchester very, very, well. They want their limo,let them have it, for a cost that they will pay for..........

 

To be honest, I an tired of commenting on express buses. Staten Island has little options, MNRR can run more train, Bee-line can run more 20 buses. Again unlike STI, BxM4C riders have options. I honestly don't ride them, and the only people who should be commenting and concerned are those who do use those routes frequently. Forest Glen, neither you ride that route, except on fan trips, or even live here. I don't ride that route at all, but do live here, and see that bus frequently, and at this point, I am tired of arguing over something that doesn't concern me. That route concerns the more affluent Westchester residents who want it. Again, they can have it, but if they have to pay more for it, let them pay for it. It's only fair they pay for it, instead of jacking up the local bus fares, which the lower - middle middle class use, and of course our seniors use. Local buses here in Westchester should not subsidize an express route with alternative modes of public transportation available.

 

 

I am done with this.........

[rr4567]

Hey, Grand Concourse......

 

 

fixt it for ya :cool:

 

LOL

 

I never even rode the 4C.....time to ride it I see.

[FamousNYLover]

BxM4C needs to stay because I love this route.

Riders on BxM4C depends on this bus and this bus is cheap than Metro-North.

If they elimate BxM4C, W20 and W21 LTD are busy and crowded.

W20 and W21 is always late.

 

I think W12 Sunday Service should be extended to Westchester County Airport because only way to get to airport is by car or taxi.