B35 via Church Posted November 20, 2011 Share #226 Posted November 20, 2011 You aint gonna get people around here willing to walk between no Rogers & no NY av.... That is a fallacy I refuse to believe... I'm w/ Mysterious2train on this one.... It's either goin be ppl. abandoning SBS' for locals, or ppl. enduring a 2-seat ride via. the B8 & B35 in this area b/c locals won't come often enough.... Hmmm, I don't really like this proposal as much anymore. I didn't like it to begin with.... I have to walk so like everybody else WALK Get back to me when you're 30-40 years older.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mysterious2train Posted November 20, 2011 Share #227 Posted November 20, 2011 The only crosstown buses I can see people taking the SBS up to to get over to NY Av is the B35 and maybe the B12. The 35 is really the only one that runs frequently enough all day every day to make such a commute worthwhile for most people. As for people heading East of NY Av on the 8/12/35/43/45, I don't think they'll really be affected as much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B35 via Church Posted November 20, 2011 Share #228 Posted November 20, 2011 The only crosstown buses I can see people taking the SBS up to to get over to NY Av is the B35 and maybe the B12. The 35 is really the only one that runs frequently enough all day every day to make such a commute worthwhile for most people. As for people heading East of NY Av on the 8/12/35/43/45, I don't think they'll really be affected as much. They won't take the 12.... It'll either be the 8 or the 35. That's where the concentration of folks that use the B44 along NY av are at. You know that & I know that. those folks you see waiting for 12's on the corner of NY av/clarkson are mainly hospital workers/visitors/patients.... b/w flatbush av & NY av (not inclusive), the 12 doesn't get many pax.... it wont happen on 45's b/c there are more riders seeking 46's over 44's.... it wont happen on 43's due to the fact that most that get off on empire, live around empire.... those that get on at empire in the other direction, are heading to the subway (prospect park)..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
'89 Liberty MCI Posted November 20, 2011 Share #229 Posted November 20, 2011 The and trains? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B35 via Church Posted November 20, 2011 Share #230 Posted November 20, 2011 The and trains? What about em? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
'89 Liberty MCI Posted November 20, 2011 Share #231 Posted November 20, 2011 They are on Nostrand, therefore closer to NY Av than the SBS on Rogers. Agreed that taking the bus off NY Av creates an inconvenience when it takes people directly to their destination, as Mysterious2train said, but at least there are viable alternatives. Somebody that wants to go far (like to Fulton Street) can take the SBS at Rogers, or take the or to the Franklin shuttle if they feel that is faster. Somebody that wants to go to St. John's Place and points below can take the or as far as President Street and take a walk. A lot of people do the same thing in Hamilton Heights where the train is on Broadway with the M100/M101 and M11 on Amsterdam Avenue. M100/M101 north of 125 St, M11 south of 125 St. And that includes walking up/down a big hill between Amsterdam and Broadway. In this case the with the walks is generally faster than the buses, especially if one needs to get past 125 St in this area. To go from 145 St to 116 St for example, you have to take a M100/M101 to 125 St and transfer to the M11. Of course this is generally hit or miss. What I am trying to say is that even though the elimination of service along NY Av creates an inconvenience, it seems like there are still viable alternatives. Do the subways not get you to these places faster than or almost as quickly as the B44 limited, even with the extra walking? It seems like the only people that really need the B44 on NY Av are those traveling from places like Avenue D to Kings County, or Empire Blvd or St. John's Pl to Fulton Street. Also at Empire Blvd they have the B43 as well as the B44. If one is at Empire Bl/NY Av and a B44 is spotted first, take the B44 to Fulton Street (I assume this is the major destination). If a B43 is spotted first, take the B43 and then the B25 or the train. This could also be done, except it costs money, the ridership had better be stable, and it had better be a good local bus that keeps its damn schedule 90% of the time so that the ridership does not go away: Just the B32, not the B40, as you (Church Avenue) and I had a PM exchange a while back in which you said the B32 is the one to keep rather than the B40. What if they just took the B49 off Rogers and sent it up NY Av with the B44 local? Think people along Rogers would blow a gasket about this? They have a subway on Nostrand making more station stops than the limited/SBS, just like the people along NY Av. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B35 via Church Posted November 20, 2011 Share #232 Posted November 20, 2011 yeah, I remember that graphic/drawing you sent me..... and I still feel that way. ppl. in this section of brooklyn would benefit more from having buses on brooklyn av (your "B32"), than schenectady (your "B40").... it'd eliminate a (longer) walk for B8 riders heading towards the subway..... schenectady is too close to the 46, and they wont abandon that, for that 40 of yours... What if they just took the B49 off Rogers and sent it up NY Av with the B44 local? Think people along Rogers would blow a gasket about this? In this section of brooklyn I'm at... what people along rogers.... lol.... ridership on the NB 49 b/w flatbush av & church av (again, not inclusive) is weak... B49 riders in crown heights might complain though... to what extent, I'm not sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
'89 Liberty MCI Posted November 20, 2011 Share #233 Posted November 20, 2011 What I notice about the B44 local/B44 limited (NY Av, east side of Nostrand) vs. the B49 local/B44 SBS (Rogers Av, west side of Nostrand), is that from Farragut Road to Church Avenue, the population density on the east side is greater than that on the west side. From Church Avenue to Empire Blvd, the population density is greater on the west side. Those blocks between Church and Clarkson are extremely dense. In this section there is little housing on the east side because Kings County and SUNY Downstate occupy that area. Right around Empire it is pretty even. As you go north from Empire it gets denser in the west than in the east. Also you have that new apartment building being constructed at 958 Nostrand (Sullivan Pl), which will obviously increase the population density and overall population in the west. Eastern Pkwy seems to be a draw between east side and west side, but I think the west is slightly denser here. Then up by St. John's Pl and Bergen St, the east side is the winner, but at that point it is less of an issue because those people are right between two subways and have the B43 working with the B44 and B49 as the north-south buses in the area. Since the population density is greatest between Church and Clarkson (west of Nostrand), and given the fact that these streets are so close together and there is only one local bus stop at Linden Blvd, I think there is little to speak of. The other issue is the section between Empire and St. John's Pl, but that should not matter either given the fact that they can take the SBS at either Empire or St. John's or take the subway on Nostrand at President, which is pretty much right in the middle of Empire and St. John's Pl. If the only option, for now, is to work with what is there, then perhaps a campaign to re-route the B49 local to NY Av is in order. It would actually be great since it would improve connectivity: -Junction to NY Av (B44 local) -Junction to Rogers Av (B44 SBS) -Ocean Av, Foster Av to NY Av (B49 local) Two locals coming from two different areas to serve NY Av (and connecting NY Av to the Fulton Street shopping district), and a SBS coming from the junction (and points south, but those are less relevant to this statement) to serve Rogers Av. Sounds good to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
checkmatechamp13 Posted November 20, 2011 Share #234 Posted November 20, 2011 Just the B32, not the B40, as you (Church Avenue) and I had a PM exchange a while back in which you said the B32 is the one to keep rather than the B40. What if they just took the B49 off Rogers and sent it up NY Av with the B44 local? Think people along Rogers would blow a gasket about this? They have a subway on Nostrand making more station stops than the limited/SBS, just like the people along NY Av. Yeah, I'd say the B32 would be the more useful of the two. Like B35 said, Schenectady Avenue is closer to the B46, which is very frequent. As I've said before, I think that'd be a good opportunity to serve the area along Avenue J between Nostrand Avenue and Ralph Avenue (and possibly send it down Ralph Avenue to give riders around Avenue U easier access to The Junction) But if Rogers Avenue isn't that dense, I can definitely see how rerouting the B49 over there would help out (and it would be cheaper than creating a new route, which we all know is something the MTA cares about) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
'89 Liberty MCI Posted November 20, 2011 Share #235 Posted November 20, 2011 To be specific, Rogers is pretty sparse below Church Avenue, and falls down even harder when compared to NY Av below Church Av, as the Flatbush Gardens are very dense and are basically located between Farragut and Foster and east of Nostrand. Between Church and Clarkson, Rogers is very dense. Then it trails off until you hit Empire, and again you have very dense housing near and just north of Empire. In this area the density on the west side of Nostrand is either greater than or equal to that on the east side of Nostrand. The further north you go from Empire (remaining south of Eastern Pkwy), the further you are from the SBS stop, but at the same time the and at President Street are very easy to get to. This, in addition to the infrequency of the B49, likely means that little would be lost if the B49 were re-routed. Additionally, the elimination of the local stops on Rogers would free up additional parking spaces in these dense areas where parking is very hard to find. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qjtransitmaster Posted November 21, 2011 Share #236 Posted November 21, 2011 You aint gonna get people around here willing to walk between no Rogers & no NY av.... That is a fallacy I refuse to believe... I'm w/ Mysterious2train on this one.... It's either goin be ppl. abandoning SBS' for locals, or ppl. enduring a 2-seat ride via. the B8 & B35 in this area b/c locals won't come often enough.... I didn't like it to begin with.... Get back to me when you're 30-40 years older.... Dude you act as if people are that old and cripple and unfit that a 10 min walk or less is impossible cmon you are being a bit extreme Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrooklynBus Posted November 21, 2011 Share #237 Posted November 21, 2011 Dude you act as if people are that old and cripple and unfit that a 10 min walk or less is impossible cmon you are being a bit extreme A lot are who are going to the hospital. As far the workers, the only way they will take the SBS is if it comes every 5 minutes, and they have to wait 15 or 20, for the local. They will see they are going to be late for work or school and will reluctantly take the SBS but they won't like it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B35 via Church Posted November 21, 2011 Share #238 Posted November 21, 2011 Dude you act as if people are that old and cripple and unfit that a 10 min walk or less is impossible cmon you are being a bit extreme I'm not acting like shit..... You on the other hand are being unrealistic.... I don't know or care how old you are, but you sound immature as all hell... A 10 min. walk for younger healthier folks aint the same as it is for someone in their 40's, 50's, etc. that doesn't have those same stamina levels & are less healthy.... The notion that everyone should walk because you have to, is just flat out f'n stupid.... Like B35 said, Schenectady Avenue is closer to the B46, which is very frequent. Yep... and also, like I told 89 Liberty way back when he sent me a PM regarding these ideas, riders aren't gonna wanna backtrack from here, to catch the IRT @ Newkirk... If that were the case, there'd be less riders than what you see on current B35's, and more riders than what you see on current B8's.... As far the workers, the only way they will take the SBS is if it comes every 5 minutes, and they have to wait 15 or 20, for the local. Exactly.... the difference in service levels b/w the local B44's & the SBS B44's are gonna have to be drastic enough for enough former B44 LTD folks to migrate over to the SBS' on Rogers..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qjtransitmaster Posted November 21, 2011 Share #239 Posted November 21, 2011 I'm not acting like shit..... You on the other hand are being unrealistic.... I don't know or care how old you are, but you sound immature as all hell... A 10 min. walk for younger healthier folks aint the same as it is for someone in their 40's, 50's, etc. that doesn't have those same stamina levels & are less healthy.... The notion that everyone should walk because you have to, is just flat out f'n stupid.... Yep... and also, like I told 89 Liberty way back when he sent me a PM regarding these ideas, riders aren't gonna wanna backtrack from here, to catch the IRT @ Newkirk... If that were the case, there'd be less riders than what you see on current B35's, and more riders than what you see on current B8's.... Exactly.... the difference in service levels b/w the local B44's & the SBS B44's are gonna have to be drastic enough for enough former B44 LTD folks to migrate over to the SBS' on Rogers..... Not what I am tring to say I am just saying not everybody is unable to do it. Like brooklynbus said the SBS has to be superior in service level I have a feeling MTA might do just that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B35 via Church Posted November 21, 2011 Share #240 Posted November 21, 2011 Not what I am tring to say I am just saying not everybody is unable to do it. Like brooklynbus said the SBS has to be superior in service level I have a feeling MTA might do just that That's exactly what you're implying.... especially when you sit there & tell me I'm being too "extreme" with the point I made.... "I have to walk so like everybody else WALK" ...were your words; I didn't pick that statement out of the sky. What else could you have possibly tried to convey with a statement like that? You double-talk when someone comes up with somethin you can't refute..... and lol @ your attempt at damage control.... Don't use what BrooklynBus said as a talking point against me..... Come up with some'n ya'self. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qjtransitmaster Posted November 21, 2011 Share #241 Posted November 21, 2011 That's exactly what you're implying.... especially when you sit there & tell me I'm being too "extreme" with the point I made.... "I have to walk so like everybody else WALK" ...were your words; I didn't pick that statement out of the sky. What else could you have possibly tried to convey with a statement like that? You double-talk when someone comes up with somethin you can't refute..... and lol @ your attempt at damage control.... Don't use what BrooklynBus said as a talking point against me..... Come up with some'n ya'self. You are soo blowing this out of proportion I could care less about damage control. To tell you the truth I no longer care about what anybody says anymore. I no longer take insults toward me seriously as I no longer care. The only thing I care about is data I am a bit selfish and don't care about what anybody says about me. You are taking this way too seriously the fact is MTA has did what they did what will you do about it buddy? At the end of the day MTA will do what they want with SBS all you can do is talk with them if the issue is that serious take your anger out on them not me. I wasn't the one who moved B44 SBS to rogers so if you and others got screwed then try and convince the MTA otherwise then. Too much energy man chill out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B35 via Church Posted November 21, 2011 Share #242 Posted November 21, 2011 You are soo blowing this out of proportion I could care less about damage control. To tell you the truth I no longer care about what anybody says anymore. I no longer take insults toward me seriously as I no longer care. The only thing I care about is data I am a bit selfish and don't care about what anybody says about me. You are taking this way too seriously the fact is MTA has did what they did what will you do about it buddy? At the end of the day MTA will do what they want with SBS all you can do is talk with them if the issue is that serious take your anger out on them not me. I wasn't the one who moved B44 SBS to rogers so if you and others got screwed then try and convince the MTA otherwise then. Too much energy man chill out "Too much energy man chill out" = I have no real counter argument, I concede, don't you see my attempt to weasel my way out of this man, chill out.... Blame shifting is a classic example of weakness by the way..... I'm directing my post at YOU, not the MTA. LMFAO at telling me to direct my "anger" at the MTA because you have nothin to defend yourself with after I called you out on that silly stance of indirectly telling those affected riders to walk because you have to..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qjtransitmaster Posted November 21, 2011 Share #243 Posted November 21, 2011 "Too much energy man chill out" = I have no real counter argument, I concede, don't you see my attempt to weasel my way out of this man, chill out.... Blame shifting is a classic example of weakness by the way..... I'm directing my post at YOU, not the MTA. LMFAO at telling me to direct my "anger" at the MTA because you have nothin to defend yourself with after I called you out on that silly stance of indirectly telling those affected riders to walk because you have to..... dude do I care? seriously so what if you are directing the post at me it accomplishes nothing. again I don't give a rats ass. I don't need to concede I know you are right about old ppl but again IF YOU DON'T LIKE IT DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT. MTA does what they please and so do I big friggin deal call me out whenever you want it will change nothing. All it does is make you feel special show me your victory dance. I don't defend what isn't perfect. I have no stance on B44 SBS cause It doesn't concern me take it up with someone who actually has influence. I got routes to ride this week. Is there any forum focused on NJ?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Acela Express Posted November 21, 2011 Share #244 Posted November 21, 2011 With almost 50 Nova LFSAs coming to Flatbush, I can see some of those buses operating on the 41 & 46, mostly on the weekends when there's less runs for B44SBS, therefore spilling some of those LFSAs onto other routes. It'll happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qjtransitmaster Posted November 21, 2011 Share #245 Posted November 21, 2011 With almost 50 Nova LFSAs coming to Flatbush, I can see some of those buses operating on the 41 & 46, mostly on the weekends when there's less runs for B44SBS, therefore spilling some of those LFSAs onto other routes. It'll happen. good point B46 needs those badly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B35 via Church Posted November 21, 2011 Share #246 Posted November 21, 2011 dude do I care? seriously so what if you are directing the post at me it accomplishes nothing. again I don't give a rats ass. I don't need to concede I know you are right about old ppl but again IF YOU DON'T LIKE IT DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT. MTA does what they please and so do I big friggin deal call me out whenever you want it will change nothing. All it does is make you feel special show me your victory dance. I don't defend what isn't perfect. I have no stance on B44 SBS cause It doesn't concern me take it up with someone who actually has influence. I got routes to ride this week. Is there any forum focused on NJ?? You keep replying, so it is what it is... As long as you continue to be on BS directing your posts at me, I'll continue to expose you for the weak little SOB that you are... Regardless on how repeatedly you say you claim to not care.... If you have no stance on the B44 SBS, then wtf you speakin on shit here for.... Keep ya slick lil comments tellin ppl. to walk to yourself.... or continue to be subjected to what you wanna call "bashing" on here.... Your choice.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qjtransitmaster Posted November 21, 2011 Share #247 Posted November 21, 2011 You keep replying, so it is what it is...As long as you continue to be on BS directing your posts at me, I'll continue to expose you for the weak little SOB that you are... Regardless on how repeatedly you say you claim to not care.... If you have no stance on the B44 SBS, then wtf you speakin on shit here for.... Keep ya slick lil comments tellin ppl. to walk to yourself.... or continue to be subjected to what you wanna call "bashing" on here.... Your choice.... o well I am directing nothing at you specifically I am tired going to sleep night. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Acela Express Posted November 21, 2011 Share #248 Posted November 21, 2011 good point B46 needs those badly Definitely, but it seems to hold up with the amount of buses we have on there (about 132 runs, that's including the additional help from B41 runs throughout the day, aka interline). The B41 is my major concern for SBS, as the corridor is entirely congested, mostly north of Avenue H, aka the Junction. *smh* Eh, just venting; didn't mean to deviate the topic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LTA1992 Posted November 21, 2011 Share #249 Posted November 21, 2011 So, all this arguing over the 6 short block aka 2 long block shift from NY to Rogers which can be completed in 4-7 minutes depending on walk speed. I dont see the problem here. It looks to me that people are just lazy and dont wanna walk that measly distance. As my sig basically says if you've read it, "To obtain better, faster, and more frequent service, you must give up the current service pattern you see now." And alittle daily excersize should'nt hurt. Things change, you just gotta deal. I'm looking forward to the +B44. And I completely agree with the shift since 40 footers can barely make the turn from Nostrand to Gwood. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Garibaldi 8 Posted November 21, 2011 Share #250 Posted November 21, 2011 So, all this arguing over the 6 short block aka 2 long block shift from NY to Rogers which can be completed in 4-7 minutes depending on walk speed. I dont see the problem here. It looks to me that people are just lazy and dont wanna walk that measly distance. As my sig basically says if you've read it, "To obtain better, faster, and more frequent service, you must give up the current service pattern you see now." And alittle daily excersize should'nt hurt. Things change, you just gotta deal. I'm looking forward to the +B44. And I completely agree with the shift since 40 footers can barely make the turn from Nostrand to Gwood. Yeah and you're 18... Try telling that to an elderly person that who can't walk well or someone is who is disabled. For them those few extra blocks are a big deal and it is not because they are lazy. :tdown: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.