Quill Depot Posted July 4, 2014 Share #1 Posted July 4, 2014 I was wondering if there was anyway to prevent bus bunching reasonably. I came up with a short term solution for when it happens. It's basically a skip stop, the bus in front does not allow entry at the first stop, meanwhile the bus in the back does not at the second stop and so forth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYSubwayBuff Posted July 4, 2014 Share #2 Posted July 4, 2014 This is already going on unofficially, TA forces the bus driver in front page to pick up until he is full then he could skip stops but I have been on plenty of buses where the leader would stop at one major transfer point and the follower would pass and get the next transfer point or a leader would skip a point to get to the next stops while followers would pikc up the rest. I don't know if this is allowed by the TA as per the B/O I talked to about this but that is a good plan to do something like this because it balances loading and with short headways all buses would be on time Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BM5 via Woodhaven Posted July 4, 2014 Share #3 Posted July 4, 2014 Sometimes, if there are like 5 million buses bunching together, they'll make one short-turn (usually done from the beginning of the route). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lennyj17 Posted July 4, 2014 Share #4 Posted July 4, 2014 They could teach the driver that it's ok if people actually walk to the bus, if it can be done safely..... One thing that really waste time is drivers trying to fit perfectly into Bus Stops before opening doors... 2 - If NO ONE RINGS the F*CKING Bell, and you don't see anyone at the stop.... KEEP DRIVING..... This really Pisses Me Off .... Drivers Pulling over to the stop opening doors, when clearly no-one is waiting nor anyone wants to get off. This happens in the City more than any of the Boroughs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fan Railer Posted July 4, 2014 Share #5 Posted July 4, 2014 Two words: congestion pricing.... oh wait, I forgot that failed =P Shame it did too... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gotham Bus Co. Posted July 4, 2014 Share #6 Posted July 4, 2014 I was wondering if there was anyway to prevent bus bunching reasonably. I came up with a short term solution for when it happens. It's basically a skip stop, the bus in front does not allow entry at the first stop, meanwhile the bus in the back does not at the second stop and so forth. I don't know about "reasonable," but the only realistic way to stop bus bunching is to actually stop running buses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Acela Express Posted July 4, 2014 Share #7 Posted July 4, 2014 They could teach the driver that it's ok if people actually walk to the bus, if it can be done safely..... One thing that really waste time is drivers trying to fit perfectly into Bus Stops before opening doors... 2 - If NO ONE RINGS the F*CKING Bell, and you don't see anyone at the stop.... KEEP DRIVING..... This really Pisses Me Off .... Drivers Pulling over to the stop opening doors, when clearly no-one is waiting nor anyone wants to get off. This happens in the City more than any of the Boroughs. They could teach the driver that it's ok if people actually walk to the bus, if it can be done safely..... One thing that really waste time is drivers trying to fit perfectly into Bus Stops before opening doors... 2 - If NO ONE RINGS the F*CKING Bell, and you don't see anyone at the stop.... KEEP DRIVING..... This really Pisses Me Off .... Drivers Pulling over to the stop opening doors, when clearly no-one is waiting nor anyone wants to get off. This happens in the City more than any of the Boroughs. I have to reply to this. You have a one-tracked brain. The MTA is not concerned with what's suitable for passengers by picking up people safely outside of bus stops. Number one - buses are not cabs, so take your ass to the bus stop. What's so hard about this concept? And we sometime go into bus stops unoccupied because we are trying to kill time and not run ahead of schedule, which we are held accountable. Think outside the box sometime. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewFlyer 230 Posted July 5, 2014 Share #8 Posted July 5, 2014 There isn't anything that can be done to stop buses from bunching and showing up late. I take the Q17, Q25, and Q88 almost all the time. I can literally wait for the Q25 for about 20 minutes during the rush hour and you see about 4 or 5 buses bunched up one also being the Q34. On Saturdays pretty much the same thing all the time. The bus runs every 10 minutes but still bunches in 2 or 3 and traffic isn't the issue. I wait for the Q17 or Q88, the 17 is not as bad but the Q88 I've waited 30-60 minutes during the PM rush hour and the sad part is sometimes only one bus shows up but you see nothing bus buses on the other side. Ok so I take back that nothing can be done but a lot of the times I think its the bus drivers fault that buses bunch up especially with 3 or more buses together. I can't blame traffic all the time if other routes show up on time then why cant all them do that. The most obvious way that it's operators fault is if it happens all the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Garibaldi 8 Posted July 5, 2014 Share #9 Posted July 5, 2014 Bus bunching can't be stopped but could be improved. The main issue is that everyone is on their "own schedule" instead of the schedule listed at the stops. Some B/O's are right on time because they have the route down. Others want to take it "slow" and make sure they're not hot so they leave late and stay late, and then you have the ones that are speed demons and run hot. Now with BusTime, more guys are late more than anything. The is most certainly to blame because they need to do a better job with run time. Some parts of the route may have way too much time to kill and others don't have enough. What annoys me is times given that are basically unrealistic. If a bus ends up 20 minutes late during off-peak hours when there isn't much traffic, then in my mind those schedules need to be revised and more run time should be given, OR you find guys that are going to be able to meet that schedule. Some trips are meant to be with B/O's that haul @ss and don't leave late and drive like 10 mph and those are the guys that basically never catch up and run late almost the entire day because they don't know how to work the schedule. They also should go back to having the run sheets have more time points listed so that it's easier for the B/O's to know how much time they have from one stop to the next. That's one reason some B/O's run hot because they just focus on getting from one time point to the next since they have nothing else to go by, but some of them actually will find out what the schedule is for each stop thus they're always right on time, but that's a rarity from what I've seen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FamousNYLover Posted July 5, 2014 Share #10 Posted July 5, 2014 Bus bunches I experience on MTA-NICE-Bee: B44 SBS, Bx12 SBS, Bx15, Bx19, M1, M2, M3, M4, M5, M7, M11, M14A/D, M15 SBS, M23, M79, M86, M96, M100, Q44, n4, n6, n20, n21, n22, n24, W7, Battery Park City Shuttle Bus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lennyj17 Posted July 5, 2014 Share #11 Posted July 5, 2014 I have to reply to this. You have a one-tracked brain. The MTA is not concerned with what's suitable for passengers by picking up people safely outside of bus stops. Number one - buses are not cabs, so take your ass to the bus stop. What's so hard about this concept? And we sometime go into bus stops unoccupied because we are trying to kill time and not run ahead of schedule, which we are held accountable. Think outside the box sometime. 1 - I'm already at the Bus Stop, Captain Obvious, how about learning how to read before calling someone out..... I'm talking about the bus trying to fit perfectly into the stop before opening the doors.... The bus can stop short if need be and people at the stop can walk 5 feet to the bus... It doesn't need to be right at the stop marker.... Again if its perfectly safe for the passenger. 2 - There are drivers that are late and will still service stops that no-one is requesting..... Keep Driving, You already LATE! This ALL slows down service and causes BUNCHING, the title of the thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Garibaldi 8 Posted July 5, 2014 Share #12 Posted July 5, 2014 1 - I'm already at the Bus Stop, Captain Obvious, how about learning how to read before calling someone out..... I'm talking about the bus trying to fit perfectly into the stop before opening the doors.... The bus can stop short if need be and people at the stop can walk 5 feet to the bus... It doesn't need to be right at the stop marker.... Again if its perfectly safe for the passenger. 2 - There are drivers that are late and will still service stops that no-one is requesting..... Keep Driving, You already LATE! This ALL slows down service and causes BUNCHING, the title of the thread. 1. Actually that's a catch 22... B/O's are told (and I personally prefer esp. on express buses) that they do make every effort to PULL IN. I along with several other passengers were almost run over at 61st and 3rd a few years ago by some jerk that was on a motorcycle and came flying around the BxM1 bus. The guy didn't fully pull into the stop (partially due to the M101/102/103 buses at the local stop) and left just enough room for the motorcycle to come around. Of course none of us expected that because we were focusing on walking to the bus in the street and getting on, so we barely had enough time to jump back onto the sidewalk. I was annoyed to say the least at both the B/O and the jerk on the motorcycle. The only way that the bus should pick up in the street is if it is totally safe in that there are no other cars, bikes or motorcycles that can cause a problem while people are trying to board. I'm not sure however if you're referring to the BxM7 (you do use that right?) or local bus service... 2. As for the second one I can agree with that. A part of me wants to argue that some B/O's don't want to run hot and another part of me says that they don't mind it since they are paid just the same. There should be some incentive for B/O's to make every effort to remain on time and get back on time when running late. In other words if a guy can't help running late due to traffic or a unrealistic schedule fine, but if a guy is leaving the terminal late (on purpose) and making no effort to hold the schedule then they should be held accountable for dragging the line. Too much emphasis is put on running hot and not on staying on time. In my mind if you arrive late (not due to traffic but because you drag the line) then you shouldn't get another friggin' brake. I had a guy do that on the BxM2 a while ago. I track him going Northbound. There's no traffic along the Henry Hudson Parkway. He finishes Northbound, and then goes for a friggin' 20 minute break. Dude, you're already late and on the BxM2 and BxM1, they are given more than enough break time each trip, especially on weekends, which was the case here. I don't normally write in if a B/O is late unless it's clear that they are breaking balls and trying to drag the line on purpose. I mean listen people have places to go. You're at work already, and even on weekends, I don't want a 45 minute commute to turn into a 1 hour and a 1/2 commute because some guy wants to drag the line and try to collect overtime. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobtehpanda Posted July 5, 2014 Share #13 Posted July 5, 2014 They could teach the driver that it's ok if people actually walk to the bus, if it can be done safely..... One thing that really waste time is drivers trying to fit perfectly into Bus Stops before opening doors... The MTA already loses millions in lawsuits every year, and this would just open them to even more lawsuits because people are stupid. You can minimize bunching but it's almost impossible to get rid of on routes that don't have perfectly balanced loads at every stop. Things like bus bulb-outs can reduce dwell time, and separating buses from traffic makes things flow a bit better, but a well-used bus line will always bunch. Which does the MTA focus more on when it comes to bus lines, schedule adherence or headway maintenance? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B35 via Church Posted July 5, 2014 Share #14 Posted July 5, 2014 Which does the MTA focus more on when it comes to bus lines, schedule adherence or headway maintenance? Scheduling, AINEC.... The notion of "You better arrive on time" trumps "You better be 'x' minutes behind the trip before yours & ' x' minutes in front of the trip after yours"...... ('x' = headway) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CPBO Posted July 6, 2014 Share #15 Posted July 6, 2014 In the future the bus will be automated and bus bunching will be a thing of the past! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Garibaldi 8 Posted July 6, 2014 Share #16 Posted July 6, 2014 In the future the bus will be automated and bus bunching will be a thing of the past! Ha! very cute... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aemoreira81 Posted July 7, 2014 Share #17 Posted July 7, 2014 They could teach the driver that it's ok if people actually walk to the bus, if it can be done safely..... One thing that really waste time is drivers trying to fit perfectly into Bus Stops before opening doors... 2 - If NO ONE RINGS the F*CKING Bell, and you don't see anyone at the stop.... KEEP DRIVING..... This really Pisses Me Off .... Drivers Pulling over to the stop opening doors, when clearly no-one is waiting nor anyone wants to get off. This happens in the City more than any of the Boroughs. Sometimes, this is necessary to maintain the schedule. Keep in mind that dispatchers can generally see every bus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Garibaldi 8 Posted July 7, 2014 Share #18 Posted July 7, 2014 Sometimes, this is necessary to maintain the schedule. Keep in mind that dispatchers can generally see every bus. I would disagree. It's less annoying to stop and wait at one stop then to keep stopping and waiting at several stops. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R188 7857 Posted July 7, 2014 Share #19 Posted July 7, 2014 The only reason why operators stop and wait with the door open is to maintain schedule. Not maintaining schedule will make the bus catch up to the next one, being ahead of schedule. That means a longer wait, since the bus they were supposed to catch is early, and the next bus will probably be full, due to the people facing the same situation. And to prevent them from stopping perfectly, what will 5 seconds each stop do anything? The driver can always make it up by going a bit faster. That's nothing to blame. You know the people, they complain about minor things. Next thing you know, the has to pay for their complaints and service cuts will happen. Prevent bus bunching? There is no possible way I can think of to prevent that. Making the buses come more often won't work. It depends, some days more people will ride some days less people will ride. But, it's a big risk to take and if that is excess service, that is also a waste of money and time. As much as traffic takes a toll sometimes, the operators also take a toll on the bunching. I see them talking with others, and then I walk over to the bus stop to see the longest line ever.. and only to know that the bus is late. Also, a lot of the time they have an urge to drive at the slowest speeds ever, crawling around the route. But there's always those operators who make them things go fast as hell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lennyj17 Posted July 7, 2014 Share #20 Posted July 7, 2014 Sometimes, this is necessary to maintain the schedule. Keep in mind that dispatchers can generally see every bus. I would disagree. It's less annoying to stop and wait at one stop then to keep stopping and waiting at several stops. A lot times the Driver is NOT running HOT..... No One Rings the Bell, No-Ones waiting at the stop. Yet he pulls over Opens Both Doors, sees no movement, closes both doors and Pull off.... Total waste of time...A lot of times his Follower is right on his Ass. I agree with VG8 - if running HOT, I would rather pull over at one stop and wait for time to catch up, rather than needlessly pulling over at each stop along the route, regardless of anyone requesting or waiting at said stops. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Garibaldi 8 Posted July 7, 2014 Share #21 Posted July 7, 2014 A lot times the Driver is NOT running HOT..... No One Rings the Bell, No-Ones waiting at the stop. Yet he pulls over Opens Both Doors, sees no movement, closes both doors and Pull off.... Total waste of time...A lot of times his Follower is right on his Ass. I agree with VG8 - if running HOT, I would rather pull over at one stop and wait for time to catch up, rather than needlessly pulling over at each stop along the route, regardless of anyone requesting or waiting at said stops. I think some of them worry too much about doing anything that would get them fired, and if they're on probation, you can forget it. Don't ever get a bus with a driver still being trained. That trip will take two or three times what the standard trip takes no matter how fast it is supposed to be. That's the other issue here. The says that the rookie drivers and the younger drivers these days just don't cut it, and as the older drivers retire, the younger B/O's are coming in. Some of them just can't drive or are too afraid. Coordination skills lack... Can't keep up with the schedule, drive at a nice speed AND be safe.... There are some that can. Unfortunately they're a rarity these days. I had an old-timer this morning on the BxM1 (he's not old per se (middle aged Latino guy), but he knows how to move and drive safely). Saved me a good 20 minutes. I usually have him on the BxM2, so we were both shocked to see each other. lol Saturday night I also had a Latino guy... Young looking Dominican dude that I've had before, but he did the BxM2. Got me over by Lincoln Center in about 30 minutes from Riverdale. I guess we'll have to give them some time to become veterans. There are several young guys out of Yonkers that are good. Stop safely, pull to the curb, kneel the bus where necessary, speak and are courteous, which is certainly a change of pace. Makes for a much more pleasant commute from the old grumpy, nasty types we had for a while. The question is whether or not they'll stick around long enough to not do something stupid that gets them fired, which seems to be the case most of the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PrevostLove Posted August 18, 2014 Share #22 Posted August 18, 2014 Hi I'm a pprobie from Ulmar Park Depot, I totally understand your point of view , I know I have a lot to learn, but as far as I concern right now, I will do whatever I can to operate my bus in a safe and proper speed, I will not get comfortable until my probation is over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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