Via Garibaldi 8 Posted February 12, 2015 Share #1 Posted February 12, 2015 Why are the Central Park West stations so deep and why hasn't the made them accessible for disabled people (i.e. escalator or elevator)? The amount of stairs that one has to climb if you get off heading South is just insane. I get off along 72nd or 81st and the amount of stairs is taxing even for me. I can't imagine how elderly folks would do it with no escalator or elevator. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MysteriousBtrain Posted February 12, 2015 Share #2 Posted February 12, 2015 Central park is a national park. It might be illegal to turn part of it into a transit plaza. Is's similar to why the WPR line rerouted from Boston road when it reaches Bronx Park. Think of it, if the CPW line was to be constructed as one level and four tracks in the central park area, you would have to take some of the park down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eric B Posted February 12, 2015 Share #3 Posted February 12, 2015 It's double decked, with one on top of the other, so the lower level will be deep. IIRC, the upper level is right below the street; so it's just the lower level. The question then is why they double decked it. It seems they wanted the platforms and exits to not be on the park side, so they put both sides of the stations on the same side, one above the other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trainfan22 Posted February 12, 2015 Share #4 Posted February 12, 2015 its only built like that because of Central Park, North of the park its built like a regular subway line for the most part, and the northern most station (110th Street?) has an exit on the park side, IDK if it was there since the line was brand new though. I visit Central Park often and used that station once. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobtehpanda Posted February 12, 2015 Share #5 Posted February 12, 2015 Why are the Central Park West stations so deep and why hasn't the made them accessible for disabled people (i.e. escalator or elevator)? The amount of stairs that one has to climb if you get off heading South is just insane. I get off along 72nd or 81st and the amount of stairs is taxing even for me. I can't imagine how elderly folks would do it with no escalator or elevator. Like most problems at the MTA, it always comes down to $$$. Every station would need two elevators - one outside fare control to the street, and one inside fare control to platforms, or one to each side platform. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BronxBombers Posted February 12, 2015 Share #6 Posted February 12, 2015 I don't think it's deep.. it seems fine to me. From the downtown platform to the street isn't that bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Garibaldi 8 Posted February 12, 2015 Author Share #7 Posted February 12, 2015 It's double decked, with one on top of the other, so the lower level will be deep. IIRC, the upper level is right below the street; so it's just the lower level. The question then is why they double decked it. It seems they wanted the platforms and exits to not be on the park side, so they put both sides of the stations on the same side, one above the other. Very strange... What would be the "disadvantage" of having it built normally, with one exit on the side of the park? I don't think it's deep.. it seems fine to me. From the downtown platform to the street isn't that bad. After a 8 - 12 hr day it sure is pretty bad, and in my case, I got off near the 79th street exit, which for some reason is slanted uphill. It's just amazing that they would have the museum right there with no elevator or escalator to speak of. Plus the 81st street station is one of the very few stations along Central Park West above 59th street that is recently renovated, so that makes it even more mind boggling that there would be no escalator or elevator. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobtehpanda Posted February 12, 2015 Share #8 Posted February 12, 2015 Very strange... What would be the "disadvantage" of having it built normally, with one exit on the side of the park? After a 8 - 12 hr day it sure is pretty bad, and in my case, I got off near the 79th street exit, which for some reason is slanted uphill. It's just amazing that they would have the museum right there with no elevator or escalator to speak of. Plus the 81st street station is one of the very few stations along Central Park West above 59th street that is recently renovated, so that makes it even more mind boggling that there would be no escalator or elevator. You would essentially have to do construction that would impact the park. Damaging a park is probably the fastest way to get a sizable amount of NIMBY opposition to a project. In the case of 81st-AMNH, an elevator would require construction both within and outside fare control for an elevator. It'd be very tricky, and even more so considering that the station is almost under the front steps of the AMNH. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fresh Pond Posted February 12, 2015 Share #9 Posted February 12, 2015 The park predates the subway by 75 years. The layout with the stations (including Nostrand, Kingston, & Utica Avs on the ) was to make trains coming AWAY from the city would be on the upper level so people coming from work would have less stairs to walk up, compared to trains on the lower level for people going TO work. That, and to keep the natural beauty of Central Park. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Garibaldi 8 Posted February 12, 2015 Author Share #10 Posted February 12, 2015 You would essentially have to do construction that would impact the park. Damaging a park is probably the fastest way to get a sizable amount of NIMBY opposition to a project. In the case of 81st-AMNH, an elevator would require construction both within and outside fare control for an elevator. It'd be very tricky, and even more so considering that the station is almost under the front steps of the AMNH. Kind of strange that they have done massive escalator and elevator improvements at the Columbus Circle station, but can't do it along the Central Park West stations. The park predates the subway by 75 years. The layout with the stations (including Nostrand, Kingston, & Utica Avs on the ) was to make trains coming AWAY from the city would be on the upper level so people coming from work would have less stairs to walk up, compared to trains on the lower level for people going TO work. That, and to keep the natural beauty of Central Park. Now that makes sense, but wouldn't they be required to make the station complaint to disability standards whenever another renovation is done? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fresh Pond Posted February 12, 2015 Share #11 Posted February 12, 2015 Now that makes sense, but wouldn't they be required to make the station complaint to disability standards whenever another renovation is done? Not necessarily. Since the station opened long before ADA laws were required, you don't have to install them. It would be good if they did, but its not mandated. I'm assuming they did Columbus Circle since its a major transfer point between lines. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Garibaldi 8 Posted February 12, 2015 Author Share #12 Posted February 12, 2015 Not necessarily. Since the station opened long before ADA laws were required, you don't have to install them. It would be good if they did, but its not mandated. I'm assuming they did Columbus Circle since its a major transfer point between lines. Interesting and disturbing... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fresh Pond Posted February 12, 2015 Share #13 Posted February 12, 2015 You gotta remember, the ADA law came into effect for all NEW vehicles, stations, station amenities, etc. built on or after 1990 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Garibaldi 8 Posted February 12, 2015 Author Share #14 Posted February 12, 2015 You gotta remember, the ADA law came into effect for all NEW vehicles, stations, station amenities, etc. built on or after 1990 Gotcha... Forgot about that little rule... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cait Sith Posted February 12, 2015 Share #15 Posted February 12, 2015 Not necessarily. Since the station opened long before ADA laws were required, you don't have to install them. It would be good if they did, but its not mandated. I'm assuming they did Columbus Circle since its a major transfer point between lines. This, and the M10 is right above the CPW line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Garibaldi 8 Posted February 12, 2015 Author Share #16 Posted February 12, 2015 This, and the M10 is right above the CPW line. Yeah but the M10 is painfully slow, unreliable and the waits are long. Trust me, I know because I've tried it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BronxBombers Posted February 12, 2015 Share #17 Posted February 12, 2015 Yeah but the M10 is painfully slow, unreliable and the waits are long. Trust me, I know because I've tried it. Most of the buses in Manhattan are.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Garibaldi 8 Posted February 12, 2015 Author Share #18 Posted February 12, 2015 Most of the buses in Manhattan are.. lol... This is true to an extent, but the M10 is even worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RollOver Posted February 12, 2015 Share #19 Posted February 12, 2015 Yeah but the M10 is painfully slow, unreliable and the waits are long. Trust me, I know because I've tried it. Well then they should improve it with more service or something. Those Central Park West local stations on the have relatively lower ridership (aside from 81 Street-Museum of Natural History) anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Garibaldi 8 Posted February 12, 2015 Author Share #20 Posted February 12, 2015 Well then they should improve it with more service or something. Those Central Park West local stations on the have relatively lower ridership (aside from 81 Street-Museum of Natural History) anyway. That used to be the case, but even along Central Park West, ridership (south of 96th street seems to be increasing). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cait Sith Posted February 12, 2015 Share #21 Posted February 12, 2015 Yeah but the M10 is painfully slow, unreliable and the waits are long. Trust me, I know because I've tried it. So have I especially when the CPW line is down....and I never had to wait longer than 10 minutes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tokkemon Posted February 12, 2015 Share #22 Posted February 12, 2015 Ridership simply doesn't warrent it. And they're not *that* deep compared to some others like 181 St or even Whitehall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel The Cool Posted February 12, 2015 Share #23 Posted February 12, 2015 The M10 is reliable. Take it from someone who lived there for years and rode that for a long time. Hell I ride that bus a lot when I don't want to deal with the subway Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CenSin Posted February 12, 2015 Share #24 Posted February 12, 2015 If you thought Central Park West northbound stations were bad, wait 'til you try Lexington Avenue/63 Street. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Via Garibaldi 8 Posted February 12, 2015 Author Share #25 Posted February 12, 2015 Ridership simply doesn't warrent it. And they're not *that* deep compared to some others like 181 St or even Whitehall. If you thought Central Park West northbound stations were bad, wait 'til you try Lexington Avenue/63 Street. The stations you both mentioned are quite deep, but they have escalators or elevators, which the stations along Central Park West lack, and that's the point. @Tokkemon, how do you know that ridership doesn't warrant it? Based on what? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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